EPTBtw. it's totally ridiculous that some people seriously think Germans can't/shouldn't be proud of their country because of something that happened 60-70 years ago. Every single nation has dark parts in their history. Germany is in many respects one of the best countries in the world imho.
Patriotism and Racism - Page 13
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Ermac
336 Posts
Btw. it's totally ridiculous that some people seriously think Germans can't/shouldn't be proud of their country because of something that happened 60-70 years ago. Every single nation has dark parts in their history. Germany is in many respects one of the best countries in the world imho. | ||
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Kpyolysis32
553 Posts
On November 25 2011 03:14 bonedriven wrote: Are you glad that you were born white, not black? [...] If I lived in a place where conditions were significantly different worse for black people than white people I sure as hell would be. | ||
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BerserKr
Chile101 Posts
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Streltsy
Canada98 Posts
On November 25 2011 06:33 Ermac wrote: It is one thing to love your country and be proud of it. Thinking the people from your country are superior to those from other countries is a completely different story. Btw. it's totally ridiculous that some people seriously think Germans can't/shouldn't be proud of their country because of something that happened 60-70 years ago. Every single nation has dark parts in their history. Germany is in many respects one of the best countries in the world imho. What if I replaced pride with "ashamed" in that sentence? You say that just about every country has things for which it should be massively ashamed, why aren't they? Why is it, that for some reason, people only take on the accomplishments of the nation and not the failures? Patriotism/Nationalism is not even internally consistent. The truth is one shouldn't be ashamed or proud of what others in your country have done, only in what you have done. Frankly, I find it hard to even say I'm proud of my family member's accomplishments. Not because they weren't great, they were, but because I had no/little hand in them. I can only feel happy for them, not proud. I suppose this might change if I was a parent, but to back to nationalism, most have little/no hand in their countries development and shouldn't really feel proud/ashamed of it. The following is a just a hunch really, but I also feel as though the "great contributors to humanity" were, for the most part, able to do the things they did in-spite of, not because, of their nation. And that even the best of nations, merely tolerated these people instead of facilitating them. | ||
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Defacer
Canada5052 Posts
On November 24 2011 01:01 WTFZerg wrote: "Sure, I've been called a xenophobe, but the truth is I'm not. I honestly just feel that America's the best country and all the other countries aren't as good. That used to be called patriotism." Can't remember what the hell this quote is from but a friend of mine linked it to me not too long ago and I thought it was pretty neat. You can be proud of things like your country, your job, your family and yourself even if they're not "the best". There's a difference between being proud and being arrogant. It's why so many people outside of North American look at American's with such chagrin. It's not enough for American's to be 'proud'. The average American is so insecure they have to convince themselves everything else sucks. Not trying to bust your chops WTFZerg, that quote just struck me as odd. | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22634 Posts
And then tell me he is racist. The two have nothing in common. It's like associating hard work with greed. Edit: watch it, it's one of the most inspirational speeches of our time. | ||
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Xenocryst
United States521 Posts
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Ryalnos
United States1946 Posts
On November 25 2011 06:24 nArAnjO wrote: Is saddens me a little that I was born in this time and age, we are living in an era that will probably be known as the dark ages or primitive/violent era where the world was so divided and there were wars constantly between nations, until whatever year probably 10 000 or so, after which humanity will be much more united, this will be achieved only by the advancement of technology ofc, so keep it up good scientist men! we all rely on you. This is more than a little naive, lol. Tbh, I equate the idea of patriotism as being similar in sense to the pride you feel for your family. | ||
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J2tehJ
United Kingdom41 Posts
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drcatellino
Canada346 Posts
You didn't choose your parents yet you probably love them. Same thing with your country. But there is a huge difference between loving / being proud of your country and irrationnaly pretending it is the best place ever and thinking that's it's citizens are superiors to those from other places. It's when I went abroad for 1 year that I realized I loved my country and that I'm tied to it (Quebec in this case, as Canada is a fake-country). In no way I think it is a superior place, but that's just where I am from and there is no wrong in having a mild "patriotism". | ||
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Danglars
United States12133 Posts
On November 24 2011 23:28 Kater wrote: so you want the US to be better than other countries, or healthier, or better living conditions than other countries? (: patriotism is not necessarily racism. it's identifying and often ignorance to those who you dont identify with which leads to racism. Really, dude, if you're not gonna respect the context to how that was uttered, I have very little reason to respond to you intelligently. If you need even this shortened down, I will say [...] reread my argument and learn that nothing you said disagrees with what I said or even believe [...]. | ||
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D10
Brazil3409 Posts
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MeriaDoKk
Chile1726 Posts
And imo patriotism does more bad than good. It's just a really bad and stupid idea that is based on a nonsensical argument. | ||
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Treemonkeys
United States2082 Posts
On November 25 2011 07:06 Defacer wrote: It's not enough for American's to be 'proud'. The average American is so insecure they have to convince themselves everything else sucks. Can't even tell you how many times I've been talking about all the horrible things the US government is doing and people here will say there is literally no better place to live on earth. | ||
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WerderBremen
Germany1070 Posts
On my own I would say that i'm very proud of my country, but i wouldn't call it patriotism. I'm just proud of our social life, soceity and freedom/equity. Me and the majority of german people wouldn't raise a flag in the garden or somewhere else. When someone speaks with too much patriotism or raises the flag with no further reason there is always some kind of a strange feeling because german people associate it with our horrible past. Only when it comes to football (like world cup, especially since 2006) germans show their flags and don't instantly associate it with bad things in their thoughts. | ||
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sjperera
Canada349 Posts
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Nacl(Draq)
United States302 Posts
Another example. I worked with a French chef for six months he wasn't a very patriotic chef but anytime anything "American" was brought to his attention he went on a rant of how France/Europe is better. "Why do Americans play football with their hands? I'm from Europe, we play football with our feet. Europeans are better. Why are your Americans so fat? In Europe we don't have this obesity problem." He once complimented me by saying I'm not like most Americans. Now I'm sure there is a bit more racism than patriotism when it is like that. But most of the French I've dealt with have the same idea that they are better just because they are French and Americans are less because they're Americans. So I think Patriotism leads to racism and encourages it. The idea of someone being better by heritage is a form of racism. "My grandaddy came from a white community and so I have the right to put that person beneath me and tell him what to do." "I'm an American and so I have the right to say that these immigrants (illegal or legal) are all horrible people and are taking our jobs. I want them out of here." "I'm an actual Malay so I deserve special privilege over these Chinese bums." | ||
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