Not sure about US, but in my country, the police have a very strict code of measures to be taken depending on how the criminal is acting, for example, you only use violence if the criminal is acting in a threatening manner, and police can get into serious trouble for violation of such rules, I think that the police at UC Davis were using force unreasonably, and people even got injured to the point of coughing out blood. Also, pepper spraying by itself is already harmful and inhumane, and more so when used on peaceful protestors, as from reddit, "When students covered their eyes with clothing, police forced open their mouths and pepper-sprayed down their throats.", which is an extremely dangerous thing to do. In my country, cops don't use pepper spray but they use tasers against violent criminals, and the law dictates that after tasing a criminal, the police are obliged to instantly send him/her to a hospital for a checkup. While the students at US Davis may have been wrong in the method of their protest, the police were definitely wrong in the manner they handled the arrest of the students.
Perhaps police in US are lacking regulation in the form of both rules to govern their conduct, as well as stringent criteria for recruiting police officers.
Edit: Would just like to add that holding the Chancellor responsible and asking her to resign is unfair. The Chancellor was justified in using the police to remove the protestors. The real fault for the incident lies with the police, who chose the methods used to disperse the protestors, and has nothing to do with the Chancellor. But I guess that since those people don't have the power to make any changes in the police force, they use the Chancellor as a scapegoat to unleash their mob vengeance upon.
On November 21 2011 15:59 ObliviousNA wrote: I go to UCD, and I had class about 30 yards from the quad on the day in question. At about 1pm, ~200 people came screaming through Wellman hall chanting "WE ARE THE 99%". They opened every door on the floor, banging and yelling all the way through. As a paying student (who wasn't paying much attention to database class, but thats not the point) I was very annoyed at the lot of them. What do they think they're accomplishing by alienating the student base?
Anyway, just wanted to throw my two cents in for why they were asked to disperse. Apart from inadequate restroom facilities to house the campers, they were disturbing a lot of paying students. They were asked (multiple times the day before and the day of) to pack their stuff up, but they refused. The cops were called in, and the rest is history. Pepper spray seems like the easiest method honestly. If the cops tried to pull them apart forcefully, limbs could have easily been broken in the scuffle.
It was an unfortunate ending to the situation, but the protesters were definitely just out for their 15 minutes of fame to bring attention to their cause.
Except there were no scuffle, at least from what i've red. If there were any kind of scuffle, macing the protester would totally be acceptable. Second, I am pretty sure no one is disputing that the officer don't have to right to arrest the student. We mainly argue that the macing was over the top, even if it is the easiest and cause less harm than other more extreme method.
I do agree that running into halls and yelling is not what the protesters should be doing.
However, first of all from what I've heard Chancellor Katehi actually allowed the protesters to stay the first day by waiving a code that prevented encampments on campus. Also, I don't believe pepper spray was nearly the best option, especially in the manner that they did it (basically point blank range, also reaching up into student's clothes to make sure they got hit with the spray). They didn't even attempt to arrest the protesters first - who knows, the protesters may not have even resisted and willingly been arrested by letting go of the chain. You never know unless you try - so pepper spraying was definitely uncalled for.
On November 21 2011 14:02 Kuja wrote: What did these children think would happen? Im so glad they got what was coming to them. Obviously Steve Jobs/Bill Gates didn't make their fortune circle jerking on the campus. If the kids could do 1/100 of what our rich do for us they would all be loaded; But they cant, they're to stupid. They don't have to work do they? People should work for them and they should get the money right? But in all honestly, i haven't had as good a laugh in a long time as these videos gave me, Thanks. EDIT: Also it was MACE, not pepper spray, which makes it even funnier.
Are you kidding me??? I don't even know where to begin here. Since you are making massive generalizations, I feel I can in response too. People don't get rich from working harder than everyone else. Working hard helps, but getting lucky is what matters. I'm not trying to belittle the efforts of the rich, but really its not as simple as "work hard and get rich herp derp". There are people who work their ass off their whole life and die poor. I just don't get it, are you saying because these students are protesting that they're dumb and unproductive? This is just fucking silly.
On November 21 2011 15:59 ObliviousNA wrote: I go to UCD, and I had class about 30 yards from the quad on the day in question. At about 1pm, ~200 people came screaming through Wellman hall chanting "WE ARE THE 99%". They opened every door on the floor, banging and yelling all the way through. As a paying student (who wasn't paying much attention to database class, but thats not the point) I was very annoyed at the lot of them. What do they think they're accomplishing by alienating the student base?
Anyway, just wanted to throw my two cents in for why they were asked to disperse. Apart from inadequate restroom facilities to house the campers, they were disturbing a lot of paying students. They were asked (multiple times the day before and the day of) to pack their stuff up, but they refused. The cops were called in, and the rest is history. Pepper spray seems like the easiest method honestly. If the cops tried to pull them apart forcefully, limbs could have easily been broken in the scuffle.
It was an unfortunate ending to the situation, but the protesters were definitely just out for their 15 minutes of fame to bring attention to their cause.
Except there were no scuffle, at least from what i've red. If there were any kind of scuffle, macing the protester would totally be acceptable. Second, I am pretty sure no one is disputing that the officer don't have to right to arrest the student. We mainly argue that the macing was over the top, even if it is the easiest and cause less harm than other more extreme method.
If A) the officers have "the right to arrest the student" and B) "it is the easiest and cause less harm than other more extreme method" ... how do you propose they proceed then? cops can't negotiate with protesters, they're clearly not in a position to talk about tuition hikes. they were informed of a group of people breaking the law, they went to intervene and 20 people refused arrest while hundreds of supporters were surrounding and screaming. ANY broken bone or forcible arrest would have resulted in MUCH more bad press than this. Or worse, a riot.
I just think there's a logical chain of events that led up to the "brutal" video (with 100s of cameras watching them, you don't think the police did EVERYTHING by the book?) and we shouldn't jump to demonize the cops that did it. I don't think there's any point where the cops decided to be amoral, but many people seem to be quick to call police brutality.
Oh man, my heart wrenched seeing that kind of image. I didn't have the gut to click on the video because seeing the picture was already too much for me
While I feel for the police, having to follow protocol and what not (I'm not a cop so I'm not gonna pretend I know what protocol is), I honestly think peacefully removing the students (handcuffs, physically carry them off site) would be a much better course of action.
I think everyone was just victims of the circumstance, and people should be more lenient with their views on these people (police or students alike). It's very very easy to get outrage over something that you deem unacceptable, but it's much harder to view things objectively and understand why it happens and find it in your heart to forgive any mistake that may have been made.
I think it is ultimately futile for us observers to judge the actions of the police. Police are hopefully trained and hopefully have some sort of experience in these situations. I think there was a very probable and significant threat of actual physical injury should the police attempt to physically break up the students. Therefore, the police made a judgment at that point that the best course of action is the pepper spray. While we all may judge these actions, our opinions have no basis in experience or facts. Instead they are knee-jerk reactions that allow for easy dismissal of the other point of view.
I think another factor is that the students were intentionally provoking the police. While they were "non-violent" they were purposely refusing to follow the police's orders as well as chanting and surrounding the police. It seems silly to provoke someone and then act surprised that they actually retaliate. In the end, the only difference between the supposed safe method of removal is some hurt feelings and discomfort, what did the protestors expect?
On November 21 2011 15:59 ObliviousNA wrote: I go to UCD, and I had class about 30 yards from the quad on the day in question. At about 1pm, ~200 people came screaming through Wellman hall chanting "WE ARE THE 99%". They opened every door on the floor, banging and yelling all the way through. As a paying student (who wasn't paying much attention to database class, but thats not the point) I was very annoyed at the lot of them. What do they think they're accomplishing by alienating the student base?
Anyway, just wanted to throw my two cents in for why they were asked to disperse. Apart from inadequate restroom facilities to house the campers, they were disturbing a lot of paying students. They were asked (multiple times the day before and the day of) to pack their stuff up, but they refused. The cops were called in, and the rest is history. Pepper spray seems like the easiest method honestly. If the cops tried to pull them apart forcefully, limbs could have easily been broken in the scuffle.
It was an unfortunate ending to the situation, but the protesters were definitely just out for their 15 minutes of fame to bring attention to their cause.
Except there were no scuffle, at least from what i've red. If there were any kind of scuffle, macing the protester would totally be acceptable. Second, I am pretty sure no one is disputing that the officer don't have to right to arrest the student. We mainly argue that the macing was over the top, even if it is the easiest and cause less harm than other more extreme method.
If A) the officers have "the right to arrest the student" and B) "it is the easiest and cause less harm than other more extreme method" ... how do you propose they proceed then? cops can't negotiate with protesters, they're clearly not in a position to talk about tuition hikes. they were informed of a group of people breaking the law, they went to intervene and 20 people refused arrest while hundreds of supporters were surrounding and screaming. ANY broken bone or forcible arrest would have resulted in MUCH more bad press than this. Or worse, a riot.
I just think there's a logical chain of events that led up to the "brutal" video (with 100s of cameras watching them, you don't think the police did EVERYTHING by the book?) and we shouldn't jump to demonize the cops that did it. I don't think there's any point where the cops decided to be amoral, but many people seem to be quick to call police brutality.
My argument is that while is it the easiest method and cause less harm than more extreme but equally easy method out there, there are other more tedious method that would of cause much less harm to the protester. The police should of either continue to make arrest one at a time like they were doing before they draw a huge crowd or back off. My argument is that the protester wasn't kicking, failing or really doing anything other than being a dead weight that would cause them or the officer any harm when they do get arrested. Sure they were making the officer job a whole lot harder (which is exactly the point), but no one wasn't in immediate danger of getting hurt. Since there were no immediate danger toward the protester or the officer, macing was totally unnecessary.
Further, if what the police officer did was truly "by the book", I would then argue that "the book" need to be rewritten.
I go to UC Davis. I didn't take part in the protest, but here's some more stuff that may be of interest:
2 emails the chancellor sent out after Friday (when the students were maced) + Show Spoiler [First] +
Dear Member of the UC Davis Community,
Yesterday was not a day that would make anyone on our campus proud; indeed the events of the day need to guide us forward as we try to make our campus a better place of inquiry, debate, and even dissent. As I described in my previous letter to the community, this past week our campus was a site of week-long peaceful demonstrations during which students were able to express their concerns about many issues facing higher education, the University of California, our campus, our nation, and the world as a whole. Those events involved multiple rallies in the Quad and an occupation of Mrak Hall which ended peacefully a day later.
However, the events on Friday were a major deviation from that trend. In the aftermath of the troubling events we experienced, I will attempt to provide a summary of the incident with the information now available to me.
After a week of peaceful exchange and debate, on Thursday a group of protestors including UC Davis students and other non-UC Davis affiliated individuals established an encampment of about 25 tents on the Quad. The group was reminded that while the university provides an environment for students to participate in rallies and express their concerns and frustrations through different forums, university policy does not allow such encampments on university grounds.
On Thursday, the group stayed overnight despite repeated reminders by university staff that their encampment violated university policies and they were requested to disperse. On Friday morning, the protestors were provided with a letter explaining university policies and reminding them of the opportunities the university provides for expression. Driven by our concern for the safety and health of the students involved in the protest, as well as other students on our campus, I made the decision not to allow encampments on the Quad during the weekend, when the general campus facilities are locked and the university staff is not widely available to provide support.
During the early afternoon hours and because of the request to take down the tents, many students decided to dismantle their tents, a decision for which we are very thankful. However, a group of students and non-campus affiliates decided to stay. The university police then came to dismantle the encampment. The events of this intervention have been videotaped and widely distributed. As indicated in various videos, the police used pepper spray against the students who were blocking the way. The use of pepper spray as shown on the video is chilling to us all and raises many questions about how best to handle situations like this.
To this effect, I am forming a task force made of faculty, students and staff to review the events and provide to me a thorough report within 90 days. As part of this, a process will be designed that allows members of the community to express their views on this matter. This report will help inform our policies and processes within the university administration and the Police Department to help us avoid similar outcomes in the future. While the university is trying to ensure the safety and health of all members of our community, we must ensure our strategies to gain compliance are fair and reasonable and do not lead to mistreatment.
Furthermore, I am asking the office of Administrative and Resource Management and the office of Student Affairs to review our policies in relation to encampments of this nature and consider whether our existing policies reflect the needs of the students at this point in time. If our policies do not allow our students enough flexibility to express themselves, then we need to find a way to improve these policies and make them more effective and appropriate.
Our campus is committed to providing a safe environment for all to learn freely and practice their civil rights of freedom of speech and expression. At the same time, our campus has the responsibility to ensure the safety of all others who use the same spaces and rely on the same facilities, tools, environments and processes to practice their freedoms to work and study. While the university has the responsibility to develop the appropriate environments that ensure the practice of these freedoms, by no means should we allow a repeated violation of these rules as an expression of personal freedom.
Through this letter, I express my sadness for the events of past Friday and my commitment to redouble our efforts to improve our campus and the environment for our students.
I am writing to tell you about events that occurred Friday afternoon at UC Davis relating to a group of protestors who chose to set up an encampment on the quad Thursday as part of a week of peaceful demonstrations on our campus that coincided with many other occupy movements at universities throughout the country.
The group did not respond to requests from administration and campus police to comply with campus rules that exist to protect the health and safety of our campus community. The group was informed in writing this morning that the encampment violated regulations designed to protect the health and safety of students, staff and faculty. The group was further informed that if they did not dismantle the encampment, it would have to be removed.
Following our requests, several of the group chose to dismantle their tents this afternoon and we are grateful for their actions. However a number of protestors refused our warning, offering us no option but to ask the police to assist in their removal. We are saddened to report that during this activity, 10 protestors were arrested and pepper spray was used. We will be reviewing the details of the incident.
We appreciate and strongly defend the rights of all our students, faculty and staff to robust and respectful dialogue as a fundamental tenet of our great academic institution. At the same time, we have a responsibility to our entire campus community, including the parents who have entrusted their students to us, to ensure that all can live, learn and work in a safe and secure environment. We were aware that some of those involved in the recent demonstrations on campus were not members of the UC Davis community and this required us to be even more vigilant about the safety of our students, faculty and staff. We take this responsibility very seriously.
While we have appreciated the peaceful and respectful tone of the demonstrations during the week, the encampment raised serious health and safety concerns, and the resources required to supervise this encampment could not be sustained, especially in these very tight economic times when our resources must support our core academic mission.
We deeply regret that many of the protestors today chose not to work with our campus staff and police to remove the encampment as requested. We are even more saddened by the events that subsequently transpired to facilitate their removal.
We appreciate the substantive dialogue the students have begun here on campus as part of this week.s activities, and we want to offer appropriate opportunities to express opinions, advance the discussion and suggest solutions as part of the time-honored university tradition. We invite our entire campus community to consider the topics related to the occupy movement you would like to discuss and we pledge to work with you to develop a series of discussion forums throughout our campus.
I ask all members of the campus community for their support in ensuring a safe environment for all members of our campus community. We hope you will actively support us in accomplishing this objective.
Linda P.B. Katehi
Honestly, the emails did nothing but piss students off more (at least the ones I know).
Anyways, the chancellor also called an emergency press conference - short notice to try to avoid protestors. Instead, students got a whiff of it and it spread like wildfire on social media. 600+ protestors showed up to the building where the conference was being held. They essentially kept the chancellor hostage - she couldn't get out of the building for several hours...
Here's a video of when she finally got out. To show that the protesters were indeed nonviolent, every single one of them was COMPLETELY silent. You can see a ton of kids just lined up looking at her in silence - some idiot reporters broke it and were promptly told to shut up (shown in the video)
On November 21 2011 16:29 affinity wrote: I go to UC Davis. I didn't take part in the protest, but here's some more stuff that may be of interest:
2 emails the chancellor sent out after Friday (when the students were maced) + Show Spoiler [First] +
To the UC Davis Community:
Many of you might have already read or heard about a recent incident on our campus that is now being investigated as a possible hate incident.
On Sunday, November 13, during the UC systemwide Student of Color Conference, an unknown individual vandalized one of the Veterans Day yellow ribbons tied around a tree on the quad, writing on it, "USE ME AS A NOOSE." As one of our students rightly noted, the historical background related to the use of nooses and their racist implications are well known.
We do not know if the person who scrawled this offensive graffiti knew about the three-day conference on our campus. But it is particularly disturbing that such an act of intolerance should occur at a time when the campus community is working to create a safe and inviting space for all our students. In fact, this was just the latest in a recent series of distressing incidents of hate and bias on our campus since the start of the fall quarter.
We know these are very stressful times for our students and for the entire UC Davis community. Especially during these difficult times, we believe it is important to remember that while written and spoken words might challenge our beliefs and perspectives, words and actions that seek to promote hatred or to degrade any particular individual or group is an affront to all in our community.
Indeed, our "Principles of Community" constitute one of the most distinctive features of UC Davis. They represent the ideals of expression and interaction that we as university citizens seek to uphold. They can be read at: http://occr.ucdavis.edu/poc/
Expressions of hate, intolerance and incivility have no place in a university community that prides itself on educating the brightest minds and future leaders of tomorrow. Such behavior is not only inconsistent with the goals of our Principles of Community, but in many instances is criminal, as well. We strongly encourage all members of our community to engage in dialogue rather than confrontation, to exchange ideas rather than shout slogans and slurs, and to be respectful and inclusive of others.
While much has already been accomplished, clearly there is much more work that needs to be done. A civil and respectful community necessitates the support and commitment of each and every one of us. While these are turbulent economic times, as a campus community, we must all be committed to a safe, welcoming environment that advances our efforts to diversity and excellence at UC Davis.
Yesterday was not a day that would make anyone on our campus proud; indeed the events of the day need to guide us forward as we try to make our campus a better place of inquiry, debate, and even dissent. As I described in my previous letter to the community, this past week our campus was a site of week-long peaceful demonstrations during which students were able to express their concerns about many issues facing higher education, the University of California, our campus, our nation, and the world as a whole. Those events involved multiple rallies in the Quad and an occupation of Mrak Hall which ended peacefully a day later.
However, the events on Friday were a major deviation from that trend. In the aftermath of the troubling events we experienced, I will attempt to provide a summary of the incident with the information now available to me.
After a week of peaceful exchange and debate, on Thursday a group of protestors including UC Davis students and other non-UC Davis affiliated individuals established an encampment of about 25 tents on the Quad. The group was reminded that while the university provides an environment for students to participate in rallies and express their concerns and frustrations through different forums, university policy does not allow such encampments on university grounds.
On Thursday, the group stayed overnight despite repeated reminders by university staff that their encampment violated university policies and they were requested to disperse. On Friday morning, the protestors were provided with a letter explaining university policies and reminding them of the opportunities the university provides for expression. Driven by our concern for the safety and health of the students involved in the protest, as well as other students on our campus, I made the decision not to allow encampments on the Quad during the weekend, when the general campus facilities are locked and the university staff is not widely available to provide support.
During the early afternoon hours and because of the request to take down the tents, many students decided to dismantle their tents, a decision for which we are very thankful. However, a group of students and non-campus affiliates decided to stay. The university police then came to dismantle the encampment. The events of this intervention have been videotaped and widely distributed. As indicated in various videos, the police used pepper spray against the students who were blocking the way. The use of pepper spray as shown on the video is chilling to us all and raises many questions about how best to handle situations like this.
To this effect, I am forming a task force made of faculty, students and staff to review the events and provide to me a thorough report within 90 days. As part of this, a process will be designed that allows members of the community to express their views on this matter. This report will help inform our policies and processes within the university administration and the Police Department to help us avoid similar outcomes in the future. While the university is trying to ensure the safety and health of all members of our community, we must ensure our strategies to gain compliance are fair and reasonable and do not lead to mistreatment.
Furthermore, I am asking the office of Administrative and Resource Management and the office of Student Affairs to review our policies in relation to encampments of this nature and consider whether our existing policies reflect the needs of the students at this point in time. If our policies do not allow our students enough flexibility to express themselves, then we need to find a way to improve these policies and make them more effective and appropriate.
Our campus is committed to providing a safe environment for all to learn freely and practice their civil rights of freedom of speech and expression. At the same time, our campus has the responsibility to ensure the safety of all others who use the same spaces and rely on the same facilities, tools, environments and processes to practice their freedoms to work and study. While the university has the responsibility to develop the appropriate environments that ensure the practice of these freedoms, by no means should we allow a repeated violation of these rules as an expression of personal freedom.
Through this letter, I express my sadness for the events of past Friday and my commitment to redouble our efforts to improve our campus and the environment for our students.
Sincerely,
Linda P.B. Katehi
Honestly, the emails did nothing but piss students off more (at least the ones I know).
Anyways, the chancellor also called an emergency press conference - short notice to try to avoid protestors. Instead, students got a whiff of it and it spread like wildfire on social media. 600+ protestors showed up to the building where the conference was being held. They essentially kept the chancellor hostage - she couldn't get out of the building for several hours...
Here's a video of when she finally got out. To show that the protesters were indeed nonviolent, every single one of them was COMPLETELY silent. You can see a ton of kids just lined up looking at her in silence - some idiot reporters broke it and were promptly told to shut up (shown in the video)
I'd just like to point out that the Chancellor claimed to be 'held hostage,' and the crowd subsequently made a path for her to leave and chanted 'Just go home," to show that she was not, in fact, in any danger.
"What was clear to me was that once again, the students’ willingness to show restraint kept us from spiraling into a cycle of violence upon violence. There was no credible threat to the Chancellor, only a perceived one. The situation was not hostile."
Honestly i think they got whats coming to them, it kinda breaks my heart to see ppl protesting anti capitalism... some just need to be thought a history lesson of "why fascism/communism/de-facto monarchy was a bad thing". That said the police obviously did not care for what they were protesting they were called to do there job, so ignoring my option on there causes i believe the only reason they paper sprayed is : 1) If they tried to just "grab" the students they might have fought back resulting in them having to use physical force => other legal problem or simply 2) Paper spray won't get you, the policeman, into any trouble but if they would have used physical force to "remove" the protester that might have... That said i do not know the legislation but i think they had a reason for using paper spray instead of just "grabbing" the students and arresting them that way.
On November 21 2011 16:29 affinity wrote: I go to UC Davis. I didn't take part in the protest, but here's some more stuff that may be of interest:
2 emails the chancellor sent out after Friday (when the students were maced) + Show Spoiler [First] +
To the UC Davis Community:
Many of you might have already read or heard about a recent incident on our campus that is now being investigated as a possible hate incident.
On Sunday, November 13, during the UC systemwide Student of Color Conference, an unknown individual vandalized one of the Veterans Day yellow ribbons tied around a tree on the quad, writing on it, "USE ME AS A NOOSE." As one of our students rightly noted, the historical background related to the use of nooses and their racist implications are well known.
We do not know if the person who scrawled this offensive graffiti knew about the three-day conference on our campus. But it is particularly disturbing that such an act of intolerance should occur at a time when the campus community is working to create a safe and inviting space for all our students. In fact, this was just the latest in a recent series of distressing incidents of hate and bias on our campus since the start of the fall quarter.
We know these are very stressful times for our students and for the entire UC Davis community. Especially during these difficult times, we believe it is important to remember that while written and spoken words might challenge our beliefs and perspectives, words and actions that seek to promote hatred or to degrade any particular individual or group is an affront to all in our community.
Indeed, our "Principles of Community" constitute one of the most distinctive features of UC Davis. They represent the ideals of expression and interaction that we as university citizens seek to uphold. They can be read at: http://occr.ucdavis.edu/poc/
Expressions of hate, intolerance and incivility have no place in a university community that prides itself on educating the brightest minds and future leaders of tomorrow. Such behavior is not only inconsistent with the goals of our Principles of Community, but in many instances is criminal, as well. We strongly encourage all members of our community to engage in dialogue rather than confrontation, to exchange ideas rather than shout slogans and slurs, and to be respectful and inclusive of others.
While much has already been accomplished, clearly there is much more work that needs to be done. A civil and respectful community necessitates the support and commitment of each and every one of us. While these are turbulent economic times, as a campus community, we must all be committed to a safe, welcoming environment that advances our efforts to diversity and excellence at UC Davis.
Yesterday was not a day that would make anyone on our campus proud; indeed the events of the day need to guide us forward as we try to make our campus a better place of inquiry, debate, and even dissent. As I described in my previous letter to the community, this past week our campus was a site of week-long peaceful demonstrations during which students were able to express their concerns about many issues facing higher education, the University of California, our campus, our nation, and the world as a whole. Those events involved multiple rallies in the Quad and an occupation of Mrak Hall which ended peacefully a day later.
However, the events on Friday were a major deviation from that trend. In the aftermath of the troubling events we experienced, I will attempt to provide a summary of the incident with the information now available to me.
After a week of peaceful exchange and debate, on Thursday a group of protestors including UC Davis students and other non-UC Davis affiliated individuals established an encampment of about 25 tents on the Quad. The group was reminded that while the university provides an environment for students to participate in rallies and express their concerns and frustrations through different forums, university policy does not allow such encampments on university grounds.
On Thursday, the group stayed overnight despite repeated reminders by university staff that their encampment violated university policies and they were requested to disperse. On Friday morning, the protestors were provided with a letter explaining university policies and reminding them of the opportunities the university provides for expression. Driven by our concern for the safety and health of the students involved in the protest, as well as other students on our campus, I made the decision not to allow encampments on the Quad during the weekend, when the general campus facilities are locked and the university staff is not widely available to provide support.
During the early afternoon hours and because of the request to take down the tents, many students decided to dismantle their tents, a decision for which we are very thankful. However, a group of students and non-campus affiliates decided to stay. The university police then came to dismantle the encampment. The events of this intervention have been videotaped and widely distributed. As indicated in various videos, the police used pepper spray against the students who were blocking the way. The use of pepper spray as shown on the video is chilling to us all and raises many questions about how best to handle situations like this.
To this effect, I am forming a task force made of faculty, students and staff to review the events and provide to me a thorough report within 90 days. As part of this, a process will be designed that allows members of the community to express their views on this matter. This report will help inform our policies and processes within the university administration and the Police Department to help us avoid similar outcomes in the future. While the university is trying to ensure the safety and health of all members of our community, we must ensure our strategies to gain compliance are fair and reasonable and do not lead to mistreatment.
Furthermore, I am asking the office of Administrative and Resource Management and the office of Student Affairs to review our policies in relation to encampments of this nature and consider whether our existing policies reflect the needs of the students at this point in time. If our policies do not allow our students enough flexibility to express themselves, then we need to find a way to improve these policies and make them more effective and appropriate.
Our campus is committed to providing a safe environment for all to learn freely and practice their civil rights of freedom of speech and expression. At the same time, our campus has the responsibility to ensure the safety of all others who use the same spaces and rely on the same facilities, tools, environments and processes to practice their freedoms to work and study. While the university has the responsibility to develop the appropriate environments that ensure the practice of these freedoms, by no means should we allow a repeated violation of these rules as an expression of personal freedom.
Through this letter, I express my sadness for the events of past Friday and my commitment to redouble our efforts to improve our campus and the environment for our students.
Sincerely,
Linda P.B. Katehi
Honestly, the emails did nothing but piss students off more (at least the ones I know).
Anyways, the chancellor also called an emergency press conference - short notice to try to avoid protestors. Instead, students got a whiff of it and it spread like wildfire on social media. 600+ protestors showed up to the building where the conference was being held. They essentially kept the chancellor hostage - she couldn't get out of the building for several hours...
Here's a video of when she finally got out. To show that the protesters were indeed nonviolent, every single one of them was COMPLETELY silent. You can see a ton of kids just lined up looking at her in silence - some idiot reporters broke it and were promptly told to shut up (shown in the video)
I'd just like to point out that the Chancellor claimed to be 'held hostage,' and the crowd subsequently made a path for her to leave and chanted 'Just go home," to show that she was not, in fact, in any danger.
On November 21 2011 17:41 Aterons_toss wrote: Honestly i think they got whats coming to them, it kinda breaks my heart to see ppl protesting anti capitalism... some just need to be thought a history lesson of "why fascism/communism/de-facto monarchy was a bad thing". That said the police obviously did not care for what they were protesting they were called to do there job, so ignoring my option on there causes i believe the only reason they paper sprayed is : 1) If they tried to just "grab" the students they might have fought back resulting in them having to use physical force => other legal problem or simply 2) Paper spray won't get you, the policeman, into any trouble but if they would have used physical force to "remove" the protester that might have... That said i do not know the legislation but i think they had a reason for using paper spray instead of just "grabbing" the students and arresting them that way.
I don't see how protesting a 81% increase in tuition is considered anti-capitalism. It's a very sharp increase in cost for anyone midstream.
The problem with your first point which is similar to what some others have argued is this is giving license for police to enforce according to how they think people might act. Possible actions and actual actions are two very different things. Police respond with force based on the scale of resistance they encounter (protocol). It's why you generally don't get tasered when you are pulled for speeding. The resistance they encounter doesn't warrant it.
Whatever the protocol was, the amount of resistance offered by the ten or so students on the ground was minimal. There as not even an opportunity to resist arrest. Nor was it a matter of police getting surrounded and needing to create space. In that case, the students arriving upon the scene would be the likely targets. Washington Post called it casual, almost showman like spraying of the students and I rather agree. If they were flopping on the ground, flailing arms while police are trying to handcuff them, sure taser them or something (although maybe not in Canada).
The main thing is the escalation of force occurs after, not before; when it is warranted not before there is any indication it is warranted.There is an element of pre-emptiveness that is warranted as preventative measure, but there was nothing preventative about this. Pepper spray is crowd control, but the crowd didn't need controlling anymore than they needed firehoses, riot horses, rubber bullets or any number of possible options.
On November 21 2011 15:59 ObliviousNA wrote: I go to UCD, and I had class about 30 yards from the quad on the day in question. At about 1pm, ~200 people came screaming through Wellman hall chanting "WE ARE THE 99%". They opened every door on the floor, banging and yelling all the way through. As a paying student (who wasn't paying much attention to database class, but thats not the point) I was very annoyed at the lot of them. What do they think they're accomplishing by alienating the student base?
Anyway, just wanted to throw my two cents in for why they were asked to disperse. Apart from inadequate restroom facilities to house the campers, they were disturbing a lot of paying students. They were asked (multiple times the day before and the day of) to pack their stuff up, but they refused. The cops were called in, and the rest is history. Pepper spray seems like the easiest method honestly. If the cops tried to pull them apart forcefully, limbs could have easily been broken in the scuffle.
It was an unfortunate ending to the situation, but the protesters were definitely just out for their 15 minutes of fame to bring attention to their cause.
Except there were no scuffle, at least from what i've red. If there were any kind of scuffle, macing the protester would totally be acceptable. Second, I am pretty sure no one is disputing that the officer don't have to right to arrest the student. We mainly argue that the macing was over the top, even if it is the easiest and cause less harm than other more extreme method.
If A) the officers have "the right to arrest the student" and B) "it is the easiest and cause less harm than other more extreme method" ... how do you propose they proceed then? cops can't negotiate with protesters, they're clearly not in a position to talk about tuition hikes. they were informed of a group of people breaking the law, they went to intervene and 20 people refused arrest while hundreds of supporters were surrounding and screaming. ANY broken bone or forcible arrest would have resulted in MUCH more bad press than this. Or worse, a riot.
I just think there's a logical chain of events that led up to the "brutal" video (with 100s of cameras watching them, you don't think the police did EVERYTHING by the book?) and we shouldn't jump to demonize the cops that did it. I don't think there's any point where the cops decided to be amoral, but many people seem to be quick to call police brutality.
My argument is that while is it the easiest method and cause less harm than more extreme but equally easy method out there, there are other more tedious method that would of cause much less harm to the protester. The police should of either continue to make arrest one at a time like they were doing before they draw a huge crowd or back off. My argument is that the protester wasn't kicking, failing or really doing anything other than being a dead weight that would cause them or the officer any harm when they do get arrested. Sure they were making the officer job a whole lot harder (which is exactly the point), but no one wasn't in immediate danger of getting hurt. Since there were no immediate danger toward the protester or the officer, macing was totally unnecessary.
Further, if what the police officer did was truly "by the book", I would then argue that "the book" need to be rewritten.
Your view of this situation is terribly one-sided. You really need to live a day in a cops world.... your statements are completely ignorant to their predicament. I get that you feel bad and don't like "the book", but it's really written that way for a reason -- cops want to live at the end of the day. It's much safer to take drastic measures first to quash resistance than to risk escalating powder-keg situations like this. The book is this way for a reason. This isn't a "police brutality" situation. The students should have known that the likely reaction of refusing riot police would be A.) Tasers, B.) Tear Gas, or C.) Pepper Spray. You claim that a lack of "immediate danger" means they should not take preventative measures... I bet the kids of those cops would be unhappy with that as the working protocol. You exponentially increase the chance for something to happen to the cops when you don't allow them to take preventative measures as they deem neccessarry. If they feel threatened by the situation (remember, there were hundreds of hostile students there, not just these 20 or so), they should be allowed to take the steps they deem necessary to keep the situation safe, particularly if it involves non-lethal, non-damaging methods.
The questionable judgment in my mind is the chancellor feeling the need to evict them. But once they were asked to leave, they should have complied. They knew what the risks were; any American knows what police in riot gear means.... stay away. By staying in the vicinity, you risk things such as being doused in tear gas or pepper spray or similar things, even if it is not you being the disruptive individual.
Let's just be thankful this didn't devolve into a riot or worse. And for better or worse, the actions taken by the police prevented it from escalating.
EPT
