On August 19 2011 19:08 Tobberoth wrote: The funny thing isn't that all of those politicians are stupid. The funniest thing is that America seriously has a party which people generally consider to be mainly creationist and non-believers of global warming.
A party like that. In the US. In the year 2011. It's fricking hilarious, the most powerful country in the world has two political parties, of which one is actually seriously a joke. Literally.
They're not only a joke, they're hypocrites. For a party that is supposedly "Christian", they aren't very Christlike. Jesus was the biggest liberal of his time. Did Jesus say don't pay taxes? No, he said "give unto Caesar what is Caesar's". Did he say screw the poor and the needy? No, I'm pretty sure he spent his whole life helping the poor and the needy. Did he ever say everyone should carry guns and shoot shit? No I'm pretty sure he said that those who "live by the sword will die by the sword." Instead, Republicans decide that issues like evolution and the age of the world are better indicators of how "Christian" they are. A joke indeed.
I'm Christian myself, but the whole conservative, evangelical Christian movement in the US scares me.
On August 19 2011 17:52 Torpedo.Vegas wrote: It seems to me, that Ron Paul as a lot of popular general ideas, but not a whole lot in the way of practical execution. At least none that would not be extremely messy or inflate the issue. If he could actually talk about his ideas with the depth and insight needed to further them, perhaps he would be voted for, but as it is now, it seems like he is just a bundle of popular and hopeful ideas that react well with the disillusioned population. But not necessarily effective or good ideas on the whole.
On August 19 2011 18:15 Netolip wrote: I see alot of people here thinking Ron Paul is a reasonable guy. He isn't.
Ron Paul doesn't believe in seperation of chuch and state, he is a creationist and doesn't believe in womens rights or gay rights. With him as a president you will lose all social progress made and fall behind the rest of the world.
Wow, this is news to me. Where are you getting your information?
Last I checked, Ron Paul's opinion of Gay Marriage (Gay rights) was that the State should have absolutely NOTHING to do with marriage and that it is a decision between the Church and the couple getting married. The Federal Government should have no say (either for or against) concerning marriage. He thinks it is ridiculous to require a marriage license. He can be quoted as saying "Why does anyone need the government's permission to get married?" If that isn't a clear separation of Church and State, then what is?
I have also NEVER seen or heard or read anything about Ron Paul's opposition of Women's Rights, where did you get this info? Are you referring to the abortion issue? If that's the case, I highly suggest you read up on Ron Paul from a source other than foreign newspapers and TL forums.
On August 19 2011 19:08 Tobberoth wrote: The funny thing isn't that all of those politicians are stupid. The funniest thing is that America seriously has a party which people generally consider to be mainly creationist and non-believers of global warming.
A party like that. In the US. In the year 2011. It's fricking hilarious, the most powerful country in the world has two political parties, of which one is actually seriously a joke. Literally.
They're not only a joke, they're hypocrites. For a party that is supposedly "Christian", they aren't very Christlike. Jesus was the biggest liberal of his time. Did Jesus say don't pay taxes? No, he said "give unto Caesar what is Caesar's". Did he say screw the poor and the needy? No, I'm pretty sure he spent his whole life helping the poor and the needy. Did he ever say everyone should carry guns and shoot shit? No I'm pretty sure he said that those who "live by the sword will die by the sword." Instead, Republicans decide that issues like evolution and the age of the world are better indicators of how "Christian" they are. A joke indeed.
I'm Christian myself, but the whole conservative, evangelical Christian movement in the US scares me.
As a Christian yourself, don't forget other gems of wisdom by Jesus such as pluck out your eyeballs for viewing porn, cutting off your penis for masturbating, and hating your father and mother. Furthermore, if you are a Democrat then you are watering down Jesus' message about the poor by not giving away ALL your money. And don't forget about letting people who commit assault go free, furthermore allowing them to attack their victims a second time. And also not allowing divorce unless there's adultery. Attending funerals is also wrong according to Jesus. Also the poor will always be with you, so expensive luxuries are OK if they are dedicated to Jesus.
If you do something wrong with your eye or hand, cut/pluck it off (Matthew 5:29-30, in a sexual context). Marrying a divorced woman is adultery. (Matthew 5:32) Don't plan for the future. (Matthew 6:34) Don't save money. (Matthew 6:19-20) Don't become wealthy. (Mark 10:21-25) Sell everything and give it to the poor. (Luke 12:33) Don't work to obtain food. (John 6:27) Don't have sexual urges. (Matthew 5:28) Make people want to persecute you. (Matthew 5:11) Let everyone know you are better than the rest. (Matthew 5:13-16) Take money from those who have no savings and give it to rich investors. (Luke 19:23-26) If someone steals from you, don't try to get it back. (Luke 6:30) If someone hits you, invite them to do it again. (Matthew 5:39) If you lose a lawsuit, give more than the judgment. (Matthew 5:40) If someone forces you to walk a mile, walk two miles. (Matthew 5:41) If anyone asks you for anything, give it to them without question. (Matthew 5:42)
I think Huntsman's a nice enough candidate. He's got solid ideas, and to be honest, he's done a great job in Utah. He even used a flat tax, something that many conservatives might liked implemented.
But he has almost no name recognition, he was horrible in the Iowa straw polls, and he's related to Obama.
On August 19 2011 23:36 Thorakh wrote: How do people like Bachman exist in the 21th century in a nonbackwater, educated country!?
God, I hope she gets pitted against Obama so that the whole world can laugh at her stupidity...
Your only hope is that democrats/independents vote for her in open primary states. The ACTUAL GOP base thinks she's nuts. Her only supporters are from TPers.
You know, I'd actually vote for a GOP candidate if they had any hint of willingness to compromise about them, but the way GOP has acted in the government for the past ~3 years leaves a sour taste.
On August 19 2011 17:59 Theovide wrote: Huh? Why does having a different opinion than you=ignorant? Frankly you are not giving any argument for your sake at all in your post, instead you're just bashing someone who thinks differently than you do, and tell him that he knows nothing and is whining.
Even if I would have a similar political opinion to that one you seem to have, I wouldn't have approved of your post.
Also freedom is percieved differently for different people. You could for example think that freedom is to not have to worry about getting sick/hurt when you are unemployed, and not have enough money to see a doctor.
Really I'm not interested in going into any kind of political debate, but it just frustrates me with people who seemingly thinks that everyone who disagrees with them are ignorant fools who doesn't know what they are talking about.
More than anything I think getting your opinion from a Swedish newspaper is rather ignorant, that is nothing personal against that person but I would consider that ignorant. I can respects other people opinion if they actually base them on something, if he were to read on the subject thoroughly and then make up his opinion then and only then can I respect his opinion on the subject. People have the right to disagree with me and quite frankly in would be boring if nobody ever did, however people have to be able to make their own opinion on subject and not base your opinion that you read in a newspaper. Freedom is indeed perceived differently but there is a limit to what you can say and define it as freedom, something many people in Sweden can't comprehend. I might have gotten a bit to harsh regarding what I called him and for that I apologize.
Look at it this way: By reading the newspaper he's already one up on a former VP candidate (Sarah Palin).
If it's good enough for American politics, it should be good enough for Swedish layman, I think.
And on freedom: Well, no, not really. Being free to say what you want regardless of what it is is in fact a pretty standard definition of freedom. The truth is that freedom doesn't work as an absolute in a society based on consensus, because different people don't want to see other sorts of people acting with absolute freedom.
I've always found it funny that people don't get that. You CAN'T have total freedom in a society like ours. It's the old having your cake and eating it thing. By being in a society you have to accept norms and standards of behaviour that - at least in some cases - you'd probably not follow if you weren't in society.
So it really comes down to how MUCH freedom you can safely get away with. Too much and you have anarchy, too little and you have totalitarianism.
On August 16 2011 22:50 Candadar wrote: I don't know how anyone can vote for Bachmann. That bitch is crazy as hell.
Swine Flu also came up in the 70's under Carter -- a Democrat and came back up in 2010 under Obama. I'm not saying it's directly related, but coincidence?
I can give 500 more of these comedic gold quotes from her. Ranging from her saying the Revolution started in New Hampshire to her saying that Evolutionists are trying to overthrow the world to make a one-nation government to control us all.
I'm fine with Republicans, and even Republicans winning -- but fucking Christ not THIS one. I'd rather have Palin than this person.
So...when are you going to make the "bachman quotes" website? PLEASE!
Really though, I think Perry is going to edge her out anyway. He'll raise way more money, and I hear he has much better political infrastructure.
that video... Wow. Heres the thing, ron paul is obviously getting boycotted by fox, there is no way hes going to win. Of all republicans i prefer him but i still hope obama is winning, so if bachman wins... :D
Huntsman has the kiss of death by working with Obama. The Republican party is so anti-Obama that if he wiped his ass with his right hand, they'd complain he should wipe with his left.
On top of that, any Republican candidate that acknowledges global warming or evolution is automatically disqualified.
So yea, he's dead. This is a three person race right now; Perry, Romney and Bachmann. None of them can beat Obama in a real election once their views hit the mainstream. They are extreme in their views, especially Perry and Bachmann. Romney is a Mormon, which automatically turns him off to the evangelical base of the Republicans. He won't survive the primaries.
On August 19 2011 07:58 Krehlmar wrote: I read the Swedish newspaper regarding the republican candidates, and frankly Paul doesn't seem like the biggest asshole ever although most republicans have sold out their souls to capitalism and bullshit ideals to get power ("god", "constitution" and "liberty" are warningsigns here, anyone who uses them more than once in every speech is a loony true and whole.)
He has some ok idea's, like changing taxes to pre-bush era, raising them. I don't agree on removing the education ministry aswell as healthcare etc. because that's fucking retarded and anyone who says differently should just rework their thought by exchanging the word "remove" with "improve/change": It's ok to change the education ministry or healthcare, but removing them? Christ Texas spends 100 000 on public libraries, a state with 26+ million people, you really want to make people even dumber than that? Also this is not ment as an insult, but people do get dumber if you don't educate them and then fill them with fear, prejudice and stupid dogmas.
Sigh I sound like an anti-american but really I'm not, I really wish they'd pull themselves togheter, the Tea Party is a bullshit populist move, the idea is right; Power to the people, the execution is wrong because rightwing in the US is always founded and governed by extremely capitalist and monetary-gain interests that don't give two shit about wealth distribution.
Your just as ignorant as all other Swedish people if met regarding politics, I am born and raised in Sweden and here we have no concept of what liberalism really is. We are not thought properly about in school and there are no parties with more than a few thousand at most voters for any parties that are even remotely libertarian. I have since long forgotten my dream of a future Sweden were people have their own freedom and can make their own decisions about there life. Try to study the politics and try not to base opinions on what your read in Swedish newspaper regarding American politics because they are most of the time dead wrong. I've followed Ron Paul since his campaign in 2008 and I would have voted for him if I could, but I hope that those who can does this world could use a major power were libertarian principles are followed.
There's a reason only a few thousand vote for those parties though.
I mean by American standards our entire political spectrum is borderline communist.
And by Swedish standards American politics is entirely made up of crazy right-wingers
Our countries are simply polar opposites so those kind of parties are about as popular in Sweden as the communist party is in the U.S.
However we're both democracies and the people decide so I wouldn't judge either society as hard as you just judged Sweden.
And you don't have to read 10 books on libertarianism to disagree with those ideas without being "ignorant about politics".
This just makes me sad. How can someone so stupid even come into question of presidency? I bet they'll put up a monkey for the republican election next time, because it's quickly spiraling down hill. Even Bush should be considered a genius standing next to Bachman.. She's talking about carbon dioxide like it was the first time she'd heard about it. It's the fucking bubbles in soda!
Edit: Considering the lineup I highly doubt the US will make it out of the economic crisis. It's really sad that so much of the world economy is based there. Ah well, go Germany. One of the last western countries with a super strong economy and production that seems impossible to stop. That's where I'm moving my money
On August 19 2011 19:08 Tobberoth wrote: The funny thing isn't that all of those politicians are stupid. The funniest thing is that America seriously has a party which people generally consider to be mainly creationist and non-believers of global warming.
A party like that. In the US. In the year 2011. It's fricking hilarious, the most powerful country in the world has two political parties, of which one is actually seriously a joke. Literally.
They're not only a joke, they're hypocrites. For a party that is supposedly "Christian", they aren't very Christlike. Jesus was the biggest liberal of his time. Did Jesus say don't pay taxes? No, he said "give unto Caesar what is Caesar's". Did he say screw the poor and the needy? No, I'm pretty sure he spent his whole life helping the poor and the needy. Did he ever say everyone should carry guns and shoot shit? No I'm pretty sure he said that those who "live by the sword will die by the sword." Instead, Republicans decide that issues like evolution and the age of the world are better indicators of how "Christian" they are. A joke indeed.
I'm Christian myself, but the whole conservative, evangelical Christian movement in the US scares me.
As a Christian yourself, don't forget other gems of wisdom by Jesus such as pluck out your eyeballs for viewing porn, cutting off your penis for masturbating, and hating your father and mother. Furthermore, if you are a Democrat then you are watering down Jesus' message about the poor by not giving away ALL your money. And don't forget about letting people who commit assault go free, furthermore allowing them to attack their victims a second time. And also not allowing divorce unless there's adultery. Attending funerals is also wrong according to Jesus. Also the poor will always be with you, so expensive luxuries are OK if they are dedicated to Jesus.
If you do something wrong with your eye or hand, cut/pluck it off (Matthew 5:29-30, in a sexual context). Marrying a divorced woman is adultery. (Matthew 5:32) Don't plan for the future. (Matthew 6:34) Don't save money. (Matthew 6:19-20) Don't become wealthy. (Mark 10:21-25) Sell everything and give it to the poor. (Luke 12:33) Don't work to obtain food. (John 6:27) Don't have sexual urges. (Matthew 5:28) Make people want to persecute you. (Matthew 5:11) Let everyone know you are better than the rest. (Matthew 5:13-16) Take money from those who have no savings and give it to rich investors. (Luke 19:23-26) If someone steals from you, don't try to get it back. (Luke 6:30) If someone hits you, invite them to do it again. (Matthew 5:39) If you lose a lawsuit, give more than the judgment. (Matthew 5:40) If someone forces you to walk a mile, walk two miles. (Matthew 5:41) If anyone asks you for anything, give it to them without question. (Matthew 5:42)
Which is why I believe in the separation of the Church from the State. And which is why I said that Republicans are hypocrites, because they put out the image that they are doing what Christ would want them to do, when in actual fact their policies are not based off any Christian teachings. Believing in creationism and hating gays does NOT make you more Christian, and as a Christian myself it irritates me that people like Bachmann and Perry dare to mix their bullshit politics with God.
On August 19 2011 15:17 liepzig wrote: Im not the most informed person out here, so can someone please explain why everyone is hating on Obama? It seems to me like the only reason why his presidency has been so ineffective is because the Republicans have been shitting on him from day one. What is he supposed to do, get rid of the House and declare himself a dictator?
The main things I can think of are 1) the "failed" economic stimulus and 2) Obamacare. I'm not sure you can really consider economic stimulus to have "failed", as no one can tell whether the situation would have been worse without Government intervention. Most experts believe that the stimulus was a necessary evil to prevent the country from entering a new Great Depression.
As for Obamacare, I don't understand why people are screaming as if the world has ended. For goodnesses sake, the only groups that should be upset are the insurance companies and private hospitals. Having lived in America for the past 3 years, I must say that I have a horrible opinion of the American healthcare system. It needed to be changed. Give the new system some time before passing judgement on whether it is a bad or good thing.
In any case, if you think he's a bad president, you should definitely vote for someone else. Bachmann would be great. The number of spoof and memes she would inspire could be unparalleled. And I don't know about you but I love laughing at American presidents (well, so far only Bush).
The hospitals and private insurance companies aren't exactly working furiously to revoke the legislation for the very reason it benefits them a lot. 1) people are now forced to buy healthcare insurance 2) there are more subsidies for people that can't afford to buy health insurance The obvious result is they make more money than ever, since the government has essentially guaranteed them a lot of customers.
Now if there were only meaningful cost controls in 'Obamacare' it wouldn't be so bad, but Obama made sure there was no government alternative that could keep costs low, since having that would actually be detrimental for the private industry. see hereand here
Foreign policy and civil liberties are areas where the the administration can act pretty much no matter what congress thinks, and in those cases the Obama administration was essentially a straight continuation of the Bush administration, albeit rhetorically nicer.
I would also not be so glum to see the American presidency as something to laugh about. Having Bush in the White House proved to be destructive on a global scale. Make fun of his mannerisms all you want, but don't forget he had actual power he used quite badly. The same might go for Michelle Bachmann, I don't know, but at least take the danger they represent seriously.
This is a good post and it describes many of our frustrations with the President. The GOP has been fanatically obstructionist from day 1, reinforcing my view that the filibuster should not exist, and I sympathize with him in that regard, but he hasn't fought very hard for real change. The "reform" bills just papered over our financial and health care systems with some sprinkles of nice things here and there but overall those industries remain broken and fully capable of robbing us. The lobbyists controlled those debates from the start, we (Americans) never stood a chance.
It's pretty clear that he isn't willing to fight for real change. It's also pretty clear that the GOP will do anything to stop real change. We need something different. Whoever asked if we like the two party system, I can say that I've never met a single person that likes it. The founding fathers didn't even want political parties if you believe the text books.
Rick Perry despite what the media may say is not well liked by Republican insiders due to the fact that he is very outspoken and is considered to be even more conservative than Bush is/was.
EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/3jPm9.jpg)
