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On June 15 2011 08:57 -swordguy wrote:Show nested quote +On June 15 2011 08:53 spidey1991 wrote:On June 15 2011 08:37 gunman103 wrote:On June 15 2011 08:11 Endymion wrote:
Yeah, they're definitely getting ready to start a war with China right... If I was in the Chinese military, I would be really scared right about now. What? China is a superpower and Vietnam is a third world country that spends what little they have on military. China will win in a few days to a week if it comes to war (and it probably will). Are you an idiot? Vietnam was a 3rd world country when America tried to go to war with it....they still won. The u.s. said something along the lines of "it'll take us a couple weeks to win" too. And it took 2 years for us to realize we couldn't. The Vietnam war was fought guerrilla style not total war. America could of killed everyone in Vietnam and just been done. China may take it a bit further. The big question here is: will this affect Korea? If the GSL finals get cancelled then shits going to hit the fan.
Wars are no longer fought this way, and haven't been since WW2. The reason why is television. People see the horrors of war on TV and they'll quickly turn against any country doing it and the country doing it effectively isolates itself from the rest of the world.
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There are only 2 facts.
1. A war between China vs Vietnam would be settled brutally and one sidedly within days.
2. China has already officially announced that they will NOT USE FORCE.
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Look up Vietnam's history and see what superpowers have been beaten trying to take this country, (the mongols, the chinese, the french, and the US to name a few).
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On June 15 2011 08:37 gunman103 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 15 2011 08:11 Endymion wrote:
Yeah, they're definitely getting ready to start a war with China right... If I was in the Chinese military, I would be really scared right about now. What? China is a superpower and Vietnam is a third world country that spends what little they have on military. China will win in a few days to a week if it comes to war (and it probably will).
.... It's called SOLDIERS DIE during wars.
Soldiers die due to wars, so if I was soldier, I would be scared.
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On June 15 2011 08:37 gunman103 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 15 2011 08:11 Endymion wrote:
Yeah, they're definitely getting ready to start a war with China right... If I was in the Chinese military, I would be really scared right about now. What? China is a superpower and Vietnam is a third world country that spends what little they have on military. China will win in a few days to a week if it comes to war (and it probably will).
Militarily China is far from a superpower. Their navy is complete shit and is hardly functional, they have a huge chain of command issue from lack of officers, and despite buying technology from other countries or stealing from others like the US, they're boned. In fact, right now, if China tried to stake a claim on any waters and actually fought for it, they'd be toast. China essentially has no real navy. They have one shitty rust bucket of a carrier and poorly maintained and built submarines.
Gotta remember nowadays its rarely a scenario of country A vs country B nowadays.
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The more powerful China gets I'm sure we'll see a ton more tension but I don't see that breaking into armed conflict unless it was small exchanges out in the sea. At the end of the day China is a monster compared to Vietnam and to retain there composure in view of the world I don't think the Chinese would take it to far. After all there rising and still existent superpowers like the US so they won't take it to far (I would hope). Wish they'd just all chill out with all the bullshit drama from small ass events as if the Vietnamese were openly defying them, need more peace these days, wish world leaders showed they cared more about that and actually showed it.
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So the US is bringing the USS Geogre Washington carrier to the disputed sea from Japan. This is getting a bit scary.
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How can so many people in this thread misjudge and underestimate the strengh of the vietnamese defense and force of will to win a defensive war? Did you forget about the french, did you forget about the americans AND chinese? What did Apocalypse now tell you? You can occupy vietnam for a while but you cant WIN a war. And if China threatens to OBLITERATE Vietnam, hence kill all the Vietnamese and delete their history and country with Nuclear missiles or so, the inofficial opponent for world dominance, the U.S.A. , would have a word in that topic for sure. It will come to an agent's war supported by the U.S. and the West against China, which will end in a disaster for chinas economy and thus a disaster for chinas strive to be a global super power. Imagine Guerilla forces backed up by Lockheed and co. , thrilled for chinese blood, ships and tanks. Stop foolishness , even if were all SC players, macro (amount of weapons and soldiers) is not everything. Moral, subject, and efficiency is also important. Get real...
The horror...the horror
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Let's not forget the fact that Vietnam literally spanked china's ass during the Sino-Vietnam War.
Vietnam is force to be reckoned with. China is just big, but so what? All they have is a number. We have seen plenty of "BIG" countries trying to invade other "small" countries and end up getting literally embarrassed in front of the world.
Same thing can be applied to modern day.
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Our navy will snap necks if China gets out of line and wants to go full retard.
User was warned for this post
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Its news all over here too. Dispute over claims of Spratly's (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spratly_Islands) seems to be the cause of the said "drill".
"Scary" is actualy an understatement as the US already warned about this "bullying" of china.
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I was actually being sarcastic, sorry for the people quoting me and defending me, I think this will be a joke if China actually decides to fight because I can't see their military being as soft-heeled as the US was forced to be because of the domestic "war on war" that was going on during the first Vietnam war
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On June 15 2011 08:20 Rebornlife wrote:
They are both communist no? Hence nothing will come of this
Vietnam has been in war with China more than with everyone else. Communism has nothing to do with this. They just hate each other.
Fun fact: The reason Vietnam became a communist country because back when it was colonized by France, it asked US for help but was refused because US and France were allied, that's why it turned to Soviet.
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On June 15 2011 09:27 kaisen wrote:
Let's not forget the fact that Vietnam literally spanked china's ass during the Sino-Vietnam War.
Vietnam is force to be reckoned with. China is just big, but so what? All they have is a number. We have seen plenty of "BIG" countries trying to invade other "small" countries and end up getting literally embarrassed in front of the world.
Same thing can be applied to modern day.
u guys need get your heads out of the sand. china is not stupid. china would just bombard the shit out of vietnam and reduce it to rubble INSTEAD of marching in and trying to occupy it. This is IF they go to war, and I highly highly doubt that it would occur. so we need to stop being hysterical 
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On June 15 2011 08:41 MozzarellaL wrote:Show nested quote +On June 15 2011 08:28 Antisocialmunky wrote:
Well Vietnam won the last China-Viet War so its like 2-1 Vietnam so far. You missed the part where Vietnam was a vassal state to the Chinese Empire for centuries. It's more like 500-2.
The Viet should get bonus points for USA and France tho.
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On June 15 2011 09:46 Golgotha wrote:Show nested quote +On June 15 2011 09:27 kaisen wrote:
Let's not forget the fact that Vietnam literally spanked china's ass during the Sino-Vietnam War.
Vietnam is force to be reckoned with. China is just big, but so what? All they have is a number. We have seen plenty of "BIG" countries trying to invade other "small" countries and end up getting literally embarrassed in front of the world.
Same thing can be applied to modern day.
u guys need get your heads out of the sand. china is not stupid. china would just bombard the shit out of vietnam and reduce it to rubble INSTEAD of marching in and trying to occupy it. This is IF they go to war, and I highly highly doubt that it would occur. so we need to stop being hysterical
US dropped 7.8 millions tons of bomb into Vietnam during Vietnam war, around serveral hundred pounds per person population (only 2mil tons of bombs were dropped in WW2) and still couldn't do jack. How many tons of bombs you expect China to drop to turn it to rubble?
But yeah, it's highly impossible that they would go to war. The era we are living is much better than before, a country would be sanctioned so bad by the world if they try to go to war without a reasonable reason.
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Even though I consider the time of war between states to be pretty much over, China might be in a position to still wage one.
The industrial nations economies are too severely interdependend with China as that they'ld really want to crush the relations, and I think most governments think that their people would never agree on a war against China to defend another nation.
Further, China has a lot of relations to countries that don't bother about reputation and morals anyways, and is nuclear armed.
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And how exactly is China justifying such a huge claim?
An enormous military. That's how.
Militarily China is far from a superpower. Their navy is complete shit and is hardly functional, they have a huge chain of command issue from lack of officers, and despite buying technology from other countries or stealing from others like the US, they're boned.
China has 82 active surface combat ships, consisting of 26 destroyers and 56 cruisers. All constructed between 1972 and present. 42 constructed between 1990 and present. All in serviceable condition, with technology somewhere in the middle between NATO and Russia. They are classified as a green water navy, meaning they are not capable of a global projection of naval force, but are capable of regional dominance. They are quite lacking in the carrier department, but that would be irrelevant in the case of a conflict with Vietnam, it is easily within strike fighter range, and China's air force is serviceable. As a frame of reference for the type of naval technology they have: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_054A_frigate
Their submarines are hardly "rusting hulks", they have three nuclear strike submarines, dating from 2009-current production. They have four nuclear attack submarines dating from 2002-current production. They have 29 conventional attack submarines that are less then ten years old. In addition to these they have a number of cold war era submarines that are not really in active service.
In comparison: Vietnam has 5 Vietnam war era Soviet patrol vessels, and 2 modern Russian built patrol vessels, and 6 modern diesel submarines.
Its nowhere near the scale of the US navy, but China's navy is not "complete shit" by any stretch of the word.
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Vietnam will take China down with their tunnel technologies. Even now they have tunneled under the 50 most populous countries in China. I know it to be true, because.. how could it not be?
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You can't do a guerrilla war on sea.
Hopefully we can stop this trend of military strong countries forcing other countries to also waste cash and resources on military power so that they can project their power. We need to get rid of this. Just not the US is probably on the decline we have China and Russia that also wants to get back into the game.
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EPT
