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Off topic discussion and argumentative back and forth will not be tolerated. |
The world would have loved the previous one to overthink.
Yeah well the "world" thinks the current one is pretty good so that raises some serious questions about the "world's" judgment. The man is an empty suit. And I don't say that just because I'm a Republican, I rather like his more low-key style of foreign policy, if he would just do SOMETHING, SOMETIMES. He does nothing, ever. He just talks and talks and talks and discussions are held and nothing ever happens, I'm not just talking about Libya and the Middle East, I mean at Copenhagen too, Cancun was a bust (on the global warming front), free trade with Colombia, the situation in Mexico, his biggest accomplishment outside the US was winning the Nobel Prize for being elected president (I guess, he sure hasn't advanced world peace).
but what you're telling me in your second paragraph doesn`t make any sense.. so all the asian countries wanna trade oil only in dollars and therefore buy and save huge amounts of it while bernanke is printing like a madman.. how can that make sense to you, how?
Countries want to trade oil in the currency which:
1. Is the most stable.
2. Is the most valuable.
Those two things interact, and currently, the stability of the United States outweighs the value of the Euro. People do not think that the US is going to default on its debt or anything like that. There are concerns about the future of the European economic union, as a more comprehensive political union is seemingly endlessly stalled, and the financial crisis has exposed the economic strains between member countries too. Turns out Germany and to a lesser degree France don't like the idea of dominating a "United States of Europe" when they have to foot the bill for the union's weaker economies.
Bernanke is printing like a madman and there will be a reckoning for it some day, but that doesn't change the fact that the remnibi is held artificially low and would be an unsuitable reserve currency anyway because the Chinese economy is like a super over-heated steam engine that is going to blow sooner or later this century, Europe is shaky, America is still pretty much going to be the only game in town.
There's been a lot of talk about the demise of the dollar, but not much action. There's a reason for that. Talking doesn't cost money.
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Empire - Right to intervene?
Interesting discussion of the whole "to intervene or not to intervene" debate. About twenty five minutes long.
I'm still not sure entirely what I think of a no fly zone. Part of me turns on the news and thinks "Oh, we need to help." Another part of me thinks, "we should just use sanctions to politically and economically isolate Gaddafi". Tend to be leaning towards the second one lately, but still really unsure still.
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On March 14 2011 05:06 DeepElemBlues wrote:Bernanke is printing like a madman and there will be a reckoning for it some day, but that doesn't change the fact that the remnibi is held artificially low and would be an unsuitable reserve currency anyway because the Chinese economy is like a super over-heated steam engine that is going to blow sooner or later this century, Europe is shaky, America is still pretty much going to be the only game in town. There's been a lot of talk about the demise of the dollar, but not much action. There's a reason for that. Talking doesn't cost money.
You talk with broad and dubious strokes.
The future of China's economy is practically impossible for anyone to predict accurately. That you speak so definitively reflects badly on your judgement.
Do you understand the principle of QE? The US central bank isn't 'printing money'. It is crediting its own accounts to buy up all the bad debt on the market in order to try and dissolve the 'liquidity trap' that has formed in the wake of the recession.
/off-topic sorry
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On March 14 2011 05:20 Consolidate wrote:Show nested quote +On March 14 2011 05:06 DeepElemBlues wrote:The world would have loved the previous one to overthink. Bernanke is printing like a madman and there will be a reckoning for it some day, but that doesn't change the fact that the remnibi is held artificially low and would be an unsuitable reserve currency anyway because the Chinese economy is like a super over-heated steam engine that is going to blow sooner or later this century, Europe is shaky, America is still pretty much going to be the only game in town. There's been a lot of talk about the demise of the dollar, but not much action. There's a reason for that. Talking doesn't cost money. You talk with broad and dubious strokes. The future of China's economy is practically impossible for anyone to predict accurately. That you speak so definitively reflects badly on your judgement. Do you understand the principle of QE? The US central bank isn't 'printing money'. It is crediting its own accounts to buy up all the bad debt on the market in order to try and dissolve the 'liquidity trap' that has formed in the wake of the recession. /off-topic sorry
That explanation is accurate but "printing money" isn't necessarily wrong either. "Money" is being created, not physically of course, but in principle.
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You really think the US is hesitant because of oil?
Not two weeks ago the rebels were directly opposed to the idea of any foreign intervention.
You really think that it would be wise for the US to unilaterally intervene without properly assessing the situation?
No, that's the point. Or that the U.S. is Hesitant because of lack of oil incentive, they're already figuratively "sitting" on all there oil, which mostly comes from Saudi Arabia anyway, so they have no reason to make any action on the rest of the problems in the middle East.
If I'm interpreting that Political cartoon right that is. TBH political cartoons are generally craptarded lol.
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On March 14 2011 06:38 Half wrote:Show nested quote +You really think the US is hesitant because of oil?
Not two weeks ago the rebels were directly opposed to the idea of any foreign intervention.
You really think that it would be wise for the US to unilaterally intervene without properly assessing the situation? No, that's the point. Or that the U.S. is Hesitant because of lack of oil incentive, they're already figuratively "sitting" on all there oil, which mostly comes from Saudi Arabia anyway, so they have no reason to make any action on the rest of the problems in the middle East. If I'm interpreting that Political cartoon right that is. TBH political cartoons are generally craptarded lol.
I'm interpreting it the same way, I just disagree with the implication.
I'm saying the reasons which discourage the US from invading Libya are more significant than the lack of an oil incentive.
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On March 14 2011 03:54 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
It's sad that we went into Iraq for no justified reason yet by doing so we seem to be hesitant on doing something that actually has a form of international support.
Haha, you just the nail on the head.
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On March 14 2011 06:07 slyboogie wrote:Show nested quote +On March 14 2011 05:20 Consolidate wrote:On March 14 2011 05:06 DeepElemBlues wrote:The world would have loved the previous one to overthink. Bernanke is printing like a madman and there will be a reckoning for it some day, but that doesn't change the fact that the remnibi is held artificially low and would be an unsuitable reserve currency anyway because the Chinese economy is like a super over-heated steam engine that is going to blow sooner or later this century, Europe is shaky, America is still pretty much going to be the only game in town. There's been a lot of talk about the demise of the dollar, but not much action. There's a reason for that. Talking doesn't cost money. You talk with broad and dubious strokes. The future of China's economy is practically impossible for anyone to predict accurately. That you speak so definitively reflects badly on your judgement. Do you understand the principle of QE? The US central bank isn't 'printing money'. It is crediting its own accounts to buy up all the bad debt on the market in order to try and dissolve the 'liquidity trap' that has formed in the wake of the recession. /off-topic sorry That explanation is accurate but "printing money" isn't necessarily wrong either. "Money" is being created, not physically of course, but in principle.
The effects are different. With QE, money + debt is being created, printing money just devalues everything.
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You talk with broad and dubious strokes.
But then you come up with this:
The future of China's economy is practically impossible for anyone to predict accurately. That you speak so definitively reflects badly on your judgement.
If I've ever seen anything more true and useless than the first sentence, I've forgotten it. You can't keep your currency low to keep exports high and dump the cash into useless construction projects forever, and Beijing has probably already spent way too much capital doing that. Then there's the issue of the prevalent and sometimes very deep corruption in the CCP, the huge gap between the coast and the interior, environmental concerns, economic competition from India, etc. Maybe China's numbers are so big and impressive they've dazzled you, but they have a lot of work to do I don't think the CCP is capable of doing to make what they've built last.
Do you understand the principle of QE? The US central bank isn't 'printing money'. It is crediting its own accounts to buy up all the bad debt on the market in order to try and dissolve the 'liquidity trap' that has formed in the wake of the recession.
It's called turn of phrase, get over yourself before you stumble down some stairs or something.
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On March 14 2011 07:06 DeepElemBlues wrote:But then you come up with this: Show nested quote +The future of China's economy is practically impossible for anyone to predict accurately. That you speak so definitively reflects badly on your judgement. If I've ever seen anything more true and useless than the first sentence, I've forgotten it. You can't keep your currency low to keep exports high and dump the cash into useless construction projects forever, and Beijing has probably already spent way too much capital doing that. Then there's the issue of the prevalent and sometimes very deep corruption in the CCP, the huge gap between the coast and the interior, environmental concerns, economic competition from India, etc. Maybe China's numbers are so big and impressive they've dazzled you, but they have a lot of work to do I don't think the CCP is capable of doing to make what they've built last. Show nested quote +Do you understand the principle of QE? The US central bank isn't 'printing money'. It is crediting its own accounts to buy up all the bad debt on the market in order to try and dissolve the 'liquidity trap' that has formed in the wake of the recession. It's called turn of phrase, get over yourself before you stumble down some stairs or something.
Easy partner, no need to get hostile.
Since when are infrastructure projects useless? People like you said the same thing about the interstate highway in America.Look at the most recent numbers along with the recently released five year plan. China's imports are rising and exports falling. They are realizing with greater urgency the need to spur domestic consumption and decouple from the US economy.
In the wake of the Middle East protests, surely you can see the benefit of a low exchange rate? Want me to spell it out for you?
Low exchange rate = competitive exports = more manufacturing jobs = low unemployment = social stability.
Like I said before, China's economy is in the midst of a huge transitional period right now, they are already targeting a lower growth rate for the next decade. Time will tell if how they cope with these changes.
To say that China's economy will 'definitely' overheat and collapse is complete intellectual hubris. 'Printing money' is an awfully cumbersome turn of phrase for someone who appears to be making an honest effort at debate.
/sorry off-topic; felt the need to respond; will keep to PMs in the future etc.
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On March 14 2011 05:06 DeepElemBlues wrote:Yeah well the "world" thinks the current one is pretty good so that raises some serious questions about the "world's" judgment. The man is an empty suit. And I don't say that just because I'm a Republican, I rather like his more low-key style of foreign policy, if he would just do SOMETHING, SOMETIMES. He does nothing, ever. He just talks and talks and talks and discussions are held and nothing ever happens, I'm not just talking about Libya and the Middle East, I mean at Copenhagen too, Cancun was a bust (on the global warming front), free trade with Colombia, the situation in Mexico, his biggest accomplishment outside the US was winning the Nobel Prize for being elected president (I guess, he sure hasn't advanced world peace).
Obama is to Bush what Kant is to Glenn Beck. He can be criticized but in terms of international politics he is wisdom made flesh compared to the nightmare Bush has been.
If doing something means go and create havoc in Middle East with illegal wars, acting like America is the cop of the world and know better than the whole planet what is good and bad, and send troops everywhere without having a clue of what happens in the invaded countries, I really support your new passive president.
You see, I wish America did a bit more nothing sometimes. Not always (thanks for WW2 etc), but often.
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With the army taking back city after city and the rebels left with basically only Benghazi, it looks like the revolution is about to die. If a no-fly zone were to be enforced, I think it would be too late now. A no-fly zone would have helped while the rebels held many cities and were bombed into oblivion. Now that the rebels are driven off to only a few remaining cities, they don't possess the means to take on a well-equipped army on the ground, with or without bombardment from above.
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Well a no-fly zone would go along with the US supplying the rebels with new weapons, most likely.
Also, they still hold a great part of Libya and count on their own heavy equipment (even though it's probably much less than what Ghadaffi has).
However, if the statu quo remains for too long, Ghadaffi will regroup his forces and head to the western front. If the rebels had foreign support he would have to leave many troops in the east, too many to roll over Benghazi... it's not over yet.
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Its not suprising at all that the rebels are getting pushed back, many of them are random people of the streets with one or two days training tops.
The countrys in europe that are for some kind of intervetion is the countrys that has the dirtiest history with Libya, like France and UK. The planes that are bombing comes from France and it was the UK that was one of the major driving forces behind getting Libya on good terms with the west again.
China and Russia are very hessitant for any kind of intervetion becuase of their domestic situation, Chechenia and Tibet, and other economic reasons.
US middle eastern politics have been turned up side down so its not suprising that the US acts slowly and with caution. US has lost one of its main allys when Mubarak in Egypt got pushed away from his spot at the top. But at the same time now when the movement is so strong it has to do something else it would be bad for the image.
Its a complex issue and not easily solved. I fear that it is going to be to late before any kind of broadly acceptable solution is found. Im myself is kinda against a military intervention espially from the US becuase of the history with the two countrys, bombings and what not, and it would feed straight into his propaganda aswell. Europe could maybe do it, but what countrys? England is really far up shit creek river that I have a hard time seeing the public supporting a new war when the state cuts severly into the public services. France more likly, dont really see Germany or the scandinavian countrys doing it. And the rest is in the same spot as the UK, huge econmic problems.
The no fly zone would certainly help but I dont think it will be enough. The rebels are lacking in cordination and leadership right now, not suprisingly considering how the conflict started.
Lastly I would like to bring up the topic of the earthquake here aswell because it will most likely affect the way west will act here. For most countrys I believe getting Japan back on its feet and get it stable again will take priority, and alot of medias has turned away from Libya aswell which is really unfortunate for the rebels. Japans economy is vital to the west and Libyas not.
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Interactive Timeline of Libya's Revolt
Definitely worth checking out. I was unaware that that many towns had fallen so quickly to the revolution, mainly due to the big news stories only covering, at the time, the bigger towns. I'm curious how accurate this is. Not that I particularly distrust the NYTimes or anything, just curious.
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It seems that this is pretty accurate.
And I'd like to point out that what the rebels lack the most is not trained forces (since it seems that the mercenaries don't have a lot of experience or discipline neither) but some sort of heavy support, whether it's armored vehicles or artillery (and then they would need trained troops to manoeuvre those).
As long as the fight was a guerilla, they did fine. The problem is that they can't use kalachnikovs against tanks.
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"The best revolutions are organic." - Obama
What the fuck is wrong with Americans and this scintillating display of ignorance? The American revolution wasn't won by the colonists alone. There were French ships floating off Yorktown in the American revolution, German funds for Lenin, Soviet arms for Mao, and if I'm not wrong, William III of the revolution in England was a Dutchman!
Go fuck yourself, Obama. Revolutions aren't a fucking product from fucking Whole Foods where you feel better about yourself just because you didn't let some chicken die painfully. If you don't want to help Libya, just say so.
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Ajdabiya just fell into the hands of pro-Ghadaffi forces. Heavy bombing and artillery quickly drove off any resistance. Benghazi, the key city of the rebellion, is now exposed.
French minister in charge of the G8 meetings said that a no-fly zone is probably out of the question now (probably implying that members didn't find an agreement).
Source (Al-Jazeera + French newspaper Le Monde)
This is just... disgusting.
Edit: I just wanted to add that the UN is again losing all credibility, still threatening Ghadaffi with economical measures. A joke. Don't kill that man otherwise I won't give you candy!
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EPT
