EPTOn June 13 2010 09:13 Ghostcom wrote:
ITT: a lot of people who didn't attend their history classes...
ITT: a lot of people who didn't attend their history classes...
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Saudi Arabia gives Israel clear skies to attack Iran - Pag…
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Zoler
Sweden6339 Posts
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FraCuS
United States1072 Posts
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ArKaDo
France121 Posts
On June 13 2010 08:50 On_Slaught wrote: Pretty much everything you said was wrong. Both Hiroshima and Nagasaki were major military industrial cities and while this topic shouldn't devolve into a debate on this, there are clearly reasonable and "responsible" reasons for having used them when they were used. The US and Russia just took apart hundreds upon hundreds of nukes in an attempt to be the leader. England recently revealed new information on their arms and how many they have. America, as well as other nuclear powers, have, and continue to, take steps towards lowering nuke numbers significantly. The reason I trust Iran less than Israel is that Israel hasn't dedicated itself to the destruction of a race or state. The mere existance of Jihad is enough to make me want to keep nukes out of the hands of every Islamic state that we can. I agree with what someone said in the gaza ship thread which somewhat relates. "If you disarm the Palestines you will have peace in Israel and there will be a Palestinian state. If you disarm Israel there will be genocide." That's simply the way the dichotomy is set up atm. What you say is based on nothing. Just some representation of the area you have made watching too much occidental television. "If you disarm the palestines you will have peace in Israel and there will be a Palestinian state. If you disarm Israel there will be a genocide": it's not the subject of the topic and it's not true. All the arabic nation killed less than israel + US, saying they are dedicated to the destruction of are race is untrue. First: it's a tribal zone, (except iran, i m talking for pakistan, syria, jordan, afghanistan) where tribes a really important (more than the state) in some country: religion is NOT and should NOT be considered as the only thing that move those people. It is merely a way of justifying their action, but not the real cause of there action (i would have been way more clear in french sorry). The recent developpement of religion is to be linked with the disparition of all the communist faction (thx to the action of the occidentals). Saying all arabic want blood is considering that there is a unity in the arabic world (while it is a tribal world) and it is also thinking that they are all extremist. No. You should really stop putting words in my mouth. It's not nice and it makes me see constructive posts as useless. I said I consider Iran unlikely to use nukes. I said I don't want them to have nukes because it would destabilize the area even further. And because sometimes wars end up happening although neither side wants them to happen. In other words, although I believe nukes aren't completely a bad thing, the more we have nukes. Or rather, the more factions that have nukes, the more likely it is that they are used. I'd rather no faction get nukes anymore and that the factions with existing nukes would get rid of theirs. Or at least the majority of their nukes. To put it simply, I don't want Iran to get nukes because I don't see anything good coming out of it. I thought you said Iran was not a "reponsible" country. That's almost the same as saying evil, it's a moral jugement. But maybe it wasn't you so my bad. It's difficult to see anything bad coming out of Iran having a bomb, except giving a security to Iran and maybe stopping Israel to attack it's neighbour as the pleased. | ||
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On_Slaught
United States12190 Posts
The fact that you agree with this when you basically just said that those who listen to what their history classes teach them are brainwashed and/or stupid doesn't make much sense. Tho I assume that the text books say something quite different over there which might teach something different. We should accept that Sweden can provide a better account eh? | ||
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hypercube
Hungary2735 Posts
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Zoler
Sweden6339 Posts
On June 13 2010 09:17 On_Slaught wrote: The fact that you agree with this when you basically just said that those who listen to what their history classes teach them are brainwashed and/or stupid doesn't make much sense. Tho I assume that the text books say something quite different over there which might teach something different. We should accept that Sweden can provide a better account eh? Or maybe we just did some research and didn't listen to our teachers / books and then said "hey, that's how it's gotta be". I know that some things are wrong in our history books about Swedish history, like how we stole the northern land areas from the native population and also it says we conquered Finland, when Finland actually wanted to join Sweden and did it peacefully. I also know it's the same in USA regarding a lot of facts. Every country does this, it's called propaganda. USA isn't the country with the most freedom of press and freedom overall if that's what you think. USA at #41, regarding to freedom of press (I do realize this is not a question about freedom of press but I just felt like adding it): + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://data.fuskbugg.se/skalman01/-1269642571943.png) | ||
Jibba
United States22883 Posts
On June 13 2010 08:54 On_Slaught wrote: Conventional weapons sales are largely unmonitored right now, so it's difficult to know all of the deals that go on. We know Israel sold weapons to Iran, as Russia and China do, and to most governments around the Middle East, as well as the Burmese government. The US also sells weapons to 5+ Arab stats, including Saudi Arabia, and we were also selling to both sides of the Iran-Iraq war. Ukranians sold weapons to Iran, an Italian group did, I believe Syria has arms deals with both countries.Iran doesn't continue to arm Hamas for fun you know. Basically, everyone sells to everyone at some point. If you could trace every single death to its weapon and find that weapon's home country, most would probably be Russia, US, Israel, UK in that order. Makes you feel safe knowing that there's more AK-47s in the world than people, huh? | ||
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Hazard
Norway594 Posts
On June 13 2010 09:38 Jibba wrote: Basically, everyone sells to everyone at some point. If you could trace every single death to its weapon and find that weapon's home country, most would probably be Russia, US, Israel, UK in that order. Makes you feel safe knowing that there's more AK-47s in the world than people, huh? True but many if not most of AK-47's aren't "Made in Russia". AK-47 is like Nike or Coca-Cola product and almost any weapon producer have em on their menu  List of AK (ex) producers officially includes ~24 countries + Russia. | ||
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PobTheCad
Australia893 Posts
On June 13 2010 02:08 Monst3r wrote: "If America has nukes, EVERYONE GETS NUKES"????? You are either a teenager that doesn't understand world politics, or else a , god i can't say it without it getting deleted. What you are suggesting is the equivalent of giving a DOOMSDAY DEVICE to someone like a highschool bully. WHILE HE IS STILL IN HIGHSCHOOL! LOL America IS the high school bully of the world.... Israel and USA are far more a threat to world peace than Iran or Iraq ever were. | ||
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eMbrace
United States1300 Posts
On June 13 2010 10:13 PobTheCad wrote: LOL America IS the high school bully of the world.... Israel and USA are far more a threat to world peace than Iran or Iraq ever were. Exactly. I'd feel much more comfortable if the situation was switched and Iran and Iraq held all the power. The USA is just so mean..  | ||
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Captain Calamity
United Kingdom38 Posts
But its probably the single most probable cause of a nuclear war that is around today.. That's probably a very bad thing | ||
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AncienTs
Japan227 Posts
On June 13 2010 02:36 Monst3r wrote: America doesn't need to say it because it actually does it. Okay, so just because America was the first country to make a nuclear weapon, that means no other country should get it? Cause that's what your implying. I'll edit this post more when I'm done eating hey douchebag if you have such a problem with america stop posting on a community forum where the majority of us are american User was temp banned for this post. | ||
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never_Nal
Costa Rica676 Posts
On June 13 2010 02:22 Monst3r wrote: If America has nukes, every single country in the world deserves nukes too. User was temp banned for this post. as you can see people don't like countries having nukes, if USA said the will nuke everyone In a matter of few hours 10+ countries would declare war and pwn USA, and NO ONE deserves to have Nukes. | ||
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neohero9
United States595 Posts
hey douchebag if you have such a problem with america stop posting on a community forum where the majority of us are american Your statement would make more sense if you had recommended he stop reading the forum. Perhaps as much as my next statement: hey douchebag if you have such a problem with people voicing their problems with america stop reading the internet. | ||
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hifriend
China7935 Posts
On June 13 2010 10:59 AncienTs wrote: + Show Spoiler + On June 13 2010 02:36 Monst3r wrote: America doesn't need to say it because it actually does it. Okay, so just because America was the first country to make a nuclear weapon, that means no other country should get it? Cause that's what your implying. I'll edit this post more when I'm done eating hey douchebag if you have such a problem with america stop posting on a community forum where the majority of us are american It's probably true that americans are in the majority here on tl, but why should that mean that forum members (be they american or not) can't criticize your country just like we would regarding any other country in certain discussions? Also I love it how whenever someone points out any flaws in U.S. foreign policy over the last half decade some americans will always be like "Omg we single-handedly saved your asses in WW2 just be quiet and thankful." | ||
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Mykill
Canada3402 Posts
Learning something everyday! Nukes imba!!! So Iran vs. Israel will be pretty fucked up.... >< I hope not too many countries go in and start a huge war | ||
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Hidden_MotiveS
Canada2562 Posts
On June 13 2010 11:06 hifriend wrote: It's probably true that americans are in the majority here on tl, but why should that mean that forum members (be they american or not) can't criticize your country just like we would regarding any other country in certain discussions? Also I love it how whenever someone points out any flaws in U.S. foreign policy over the last half decade some americans will always be like "Omg we single-handedly saved your asses in WW2 just be quiet and thankful." I thought TL was pretty international with the whole "you must use English thing". In fact, look up, you'll see that while there are more people from the states than other countries individually, there are more people from other countries combined than there are people from the US. | ||
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LegendaryZ
United States1583 Posts
On June 13 2010 11:15 Hidden_MotiveS wrote: I thought TL was pretty international with the whole "you must use English thing". In fact, look up, you'll see that while there are more people from the states than other countries individually, there are more people from other countries combined than there are people from the US. Well if you're going to compare the number of people one country has on a site to the combined number of people of the rest of the world, I don't think that's really a fair comparison. | ||
riptide
5673 Posts
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Mascherano
Argentina1726 Posts
Many years ago when Iran and USA were allied, the USA and Europe decided to help out Iran by building nuclear power plants there ( for a very heft sum). They were happy Iran had nuclear power as long as they payed a shit ton for it. Then Iran had a revolution and a change of leadership and 'shit happened' ( who was at fault here? well depends who you ask) that created bad blood between iran and usa. Mix in religion, culture, history, oil, and neighbours and this is not just about 'nukes' From the article in the OP: "The four main targets for any raid on Iran would be the uranium enrichment facilities at Natanz and Qom, the gas storage development at Isfahan and the heavy-water reactor at Arak. Secondary targets include the lightwater reactor at Bushehr, which could produce weapons-grade plutonium when complete." Why not just bomb schools which could educate future engineers/scientists/etc. Or better yet, just bomb the shit out of every house and hospital, there could be terrorists being born there! | ||
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