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Critical Thinking and Skepticism - Page 3

Forum Index > General Forum
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rei
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
United States3594 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-02 03:20:38
May 02 2010 01:57 GMT
#41
I'm a skeptic of all that is considered to be facts! For example, I once question whether gravity is a fact. So I test it by dropping large quantity of rocks off a cliff to see if one of them would defy gravity and not get pull toward earth. I failed miserably on my attempt to disprove gravity, so I have to accept gravity as a fact that is reproducible under the same testing condition.
GET OUT OF MY BASE CHILL
Lixler
Profile Joined March 2010
United States265 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-02 01:58:06
May 02 2010 01:57 GMT
#42
On May 02 2010 10:32 Ghostcom wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 02 2010 10:24 Lixler wrote:
On May 02 2010 10:21 Ghostcom wrote:
On May 02 2010 10:12 Lixler wrote:
On May 02 2010 10:09 Ghostcom wrote:
On May 02 2010 10:05 Lixler wrote:
On May 02 2010 10:04 Ghostcom wrote:
On May 02 2010 09:53 Lixler wrote:
On May 02 2010 09:40 zulu_nation8 wrote:
On May 02 2010 09:35 Lixler wrote:
[quote]
In the age of nihilism, they certainly are. Especially people whose religion has any kind of metaphysical assertions.


I don't understand, who said we're in an age of nihilism and which religions don't make any metaphysical assertions.


It should be pretty evident that the current age is nihilistic at root. Take any political controversy as evidence.

Buddhism doesn't make metaphysical assertions of the nature that are relevant to logic.


What is reincarnation?

Seriously, why can't the 2 groups not just leave each other alone? Calling each other "idiots, retards, emotionally retarded, inhumane" doesn't really do any good for either side, does it?

Either side which doesn't see the degradation and extermination of its ideological opponents as good is probably going to be without value.


A) That is a pretty idiotic statement.
B) Science and religion aren't ideological opponents


A) Why do you say that?
B) You're right, but they certainly should be.
On May 02 2010 10:10 Mindcrime wrote:
On May 02 2010 10:05 Lixler wrote:
On May 02 2010 10:04 Ghostcom wrote:
On May 02 2010 09:53 Lixler wrote:
On May 02 2010 09:40 zulu_nation8 wrote:
On May 02 2010 09:35 Lixler wrote:
[quote]
In the age of nihilism, they certainly are. Especially people whose religion has any kind of metaphysical assertions.


I don't understand, who said we're in an age of nihilism and which religions don't make any metaphysical assertions.


It should be pretty evident that the current age is nihilistic at root. Take any political controversy as evidence.

Buddhism doesn't make metaphysical assertions of the nature that are relevant to logic.


What is reincarnation?

Seriously, why can't the 2 groups not just leave each other alone? Calling each other "idiots, retards, emotionally retarded, inhumane" doesn't really do any good for either side, does it?

Either side which doesn't see the degradation and extermination of its ideological opponents as good is probably going to be without value.


That's nonsense.

Dissent is good regardless of the truth of its claims.


It is, but nobody should consider dissent from what they think positive.


I said that mainly due to B... And no, they shouldn't, perhaps you think so, but that is your personal opinion and not a fact, stop stating stuff like facts.


Why shouldn't a person consider his opinions as facts? Wouldn't he be a terribly drab person, always self-contradicting?


Because facts are something objective which a subjective thing can never become? And you just describe the best scientist


Nothing is truly objective, and nothing is truly subjective. The subject and object are both fictions.
rei
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
United States3594 Posts
May 02 2010 02:00 GMT
#43
On May 02 2010 10:57 Lixler wrote:
Nothing is truly objective, and nothing is truly subjective. The subject and object are both fictions.


If real is what you can feel, smell, taste and see, then 'real' is simply electrical signals interpreted by your brain ????

GET OUT OF MY BASE CHILL
Lixler
Profile Joined March 2010
United States265 Posts
May 02 2010 02:00 GMT
#44
On May 02 2010 11:00 rei wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 02 2010 10:57 Lixler wrote:
Nothing is truly objective, and nothing is truly subjective. The subject and object are both fictions.


If real is what you can feel, smell, taste and see, then 'real' is simply electrical signals interpreted by your brain ????



Are the senses infallible?
rei
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
United States3594 Posts
May 02 2010 02:03 GMT
#45
On May 02 2010 11:00 Lixler wrote:
Are the senses infallible?


There is a difference between knowing the path and walking the path
GET OUT OF MY BASE CHILL
Deviation
Profile Joined November 2009
United States134 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-02 04:29:12
May 02 2010 04:27 GMT
#46
You can always play the "reality could simply be an illusion/the matrix/a dream/ etc..." card; the point stands that nothing is truly completely 'knowable' or 'fact'. However, from a practical standpoint that viewpoint is futile outside of reminding us that we shouldn't close our minds.
Saturnize
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United States2473 Posts
May 02 2010 04:39 GMT
#47
Ahhh the beginnings of an epic thread.
"Time to put the mustard on the hotdog. -_-"
o[twist]
Profile Joined May 2008
United States4903 Posts
May 02 2010 04:46 GMT
#48
rei you're doing great work in this thread
Aelfric
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
Turkey1496 Posts
May 02 2010 06:49 GMT
#49
On May 02 2010 09:33 zulu_nation8 wrote:
critical thinking is nice but i don't like the examples he uses. I only went through one video but he seems to want to make religious people look like idiots.

With using proper arguments you can actually claim that someone is wrong. He doesn't bash anyone he just explains things intellectually if you think he is wrong then you need to write your arguments here. And he also says in faith video that most of religious people know that they can't prove their religion and they live for thyself which he has no problem with. Watch the video again.
Tomorrow never comes until its too late...
Saturnize
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United States2473 Posts
May 02 2010 06:54 GMT
#50
On May 02 2010 09:33 zulu_nation8 wrote:
critical thinking is nice but i don't like the examples he uses. I only went through one video but he seems to want to make religious people look like idiots.


What other examples could he of used? Would using examples of scientoligists be less offensive o.o
"Time to put the mustard on the hotdog. -_-"
tinman
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States287 Posts
May 02 2010 07:13 GMT
#51
dude is a blowhard, but the marketable part of the videos is that it gives people who desperately need it the sensation that they, too, are one of the select few critical thinkers with the intellectual wherewithal to see through the bullshit that everyone else cherishes so dearly in their unregenerate state.

oldest fucking racket in the book.

"if you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you. but if you really make them think; they'll hate you." -- Don Marquis (1878-1937)
"Politics is an extravagance, an extravagance about grievances. And poetry is an extravagance about grief. And grievances are something that can be remedied, and griefs are irremediable."
GGTeMpLaR
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United States7226 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-02 07:24:04
May 02 2010 07:22 GMT
#52
On May 02 2010 08:57 Lixler wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 02 2010 08:53 zulu_nation8 wrote:
This is a dangerous road to scientism

What's wrong with that?


Scientism uses about as much critical thinking as the religious fundies it mocks

There's a fine line between Science and Scientism.
Saturnize
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United States2473 Posts
May 02 2010 07:24 GMT
#53
On May 02 2010 16:13 tinman wrote:
dude is a blowhard, but the marketable part of the videos is that it gives people who desperately need it the sensation that they, too, are one of the select few critical thinkers with the intellectual wherewithal to see through the bullshit that everyone else cherishes so dearly in their unregenerate state.

oldest fucking racket in the book.

"if you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you. but if you really make them think; they'll hate you." -- Don Marquis (1878-1937)


"Quotes don't make arguments"

-Mark Twain
"Time to put the mustard on the hotdog. -_-"
tinman
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States287 Posts
May 02 2010 07:25 GMT
#54
did you miss the argument? because I could type it slower next time.
"Politics is an extravagance, an extravagance about grievances. And poetry is an extravagance about grief. And grievances are something that can be remedied, and griefs are irremediable."
e.soul[gm]
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
Sierra Leone254 Posts
May 02 2010 07:31 GMT
#55
On May 02 2010 16:24 Saturnize wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 02 2010 16:13 tinman wrote:
dude is a blowhard, but the marketable part of the videos is that it gives people who desperately need it the sensation that they, too, are one of the select few critical thinkers with the intellectual wherewithal to see through the bullshit that everyone else cherishes so dearly in their unregenerate state.

oldest fucking racket in the book.

"if you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you. but if you really make them think; they'll hate you." -- Don Marquis (1878-1937)


"Quotes don't make arguments"

-Mark Twain

i dont think that quote is meant to be refuting
http://www.last.fm/user/jesuspopk
Aelfric
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
Turkey1496 Posts
May 02 2010 07:33 GMT
#56
On May 02 2010 16:13 tinman wrote:
dude is a blowhard, but the marketable part of the videos is that it gives people who desperately need it the sensation that they, too, are one of the select few critical thinkers with the intellectual wherewithal to see through the bullshit that everyone else cherishes so dearly in their unregenerate state.

oldest fucking racket in the book.

"if you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you. but if you really make them think; they'll hate you." -- Don Marquis (1878-1937)

Don't make ad hominem here please. No one becomes critical thinker with watching few videos on it, whoever thinks like that basically wrong but you can actually discuss on some of his arguments instead of labeling him as a blowhard.
Gaining critical thinking is a progress and needs time because of its development in mind claims that you could have done wrong and still behaving wrong about so many things. Scepticism doesn't care about what you feel on believes or ideologies it only deals with facts.
Tomorrow never comes until its too late...
piratekaybear
Profile Joined June 2008
United States50 Posts
May 02 2010 07:38 GMT
#57
On May 02 2010 16:31 e.soul[gm] wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 02 2010 16:24 Saturnize wrote:
On May 02 2010 16:13 tinman wrote:
dude is a blowhard, but the marketable part of the videos is that it gives people who desperately need it the sensation that they, too, are one of the select few critical thinkers with the intellectual wherewithal to see through the bullshit that everyone else cherishes so dearly in their unregenerate state.

oldest fucking racket in the book.

"if you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you. but if you really make them think; they'll hate you." -- Don Marquis (1878-1937)


"Quotes don't make arguments"

-Mark Twain

i dont think that quote is meant to be refuting


lol, yeah that's the joke..
e.soul[gm]
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
Sierra Leone254 Posts
May 02 2010 07:39 GMT
#58
On May 02 2010 16:38 piratekaybear wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 02 2010 16:31 e.soul[gm] wrote:
On May 02 2010 16:24 Saturnize wrote:
On May 02 2010 16:13 tinman wrote:
dude is a blowhard, but the marketable part of the videos is that it gives people who desperately need it the sensation that they, too, are one of the select few critical thinkers with the intellectual wherewithal to see through the bullshit that everyone else cherishes so dearly in their unregenerate state.

oldest fucking racket in the book.

"if you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you. but if you really make them think; they'll hate you." -- Don Marquis (1878-1937)


"Quotes don't make arguments"

-Mark Twain

i dont think that quote is meant to be refuting


lol, yeah that's the joke..

oh i thought he was being retarded, im going to the high thread now where i belong.
http://www.last.fm/user/jesuspopk
tinman
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States287 Posts
May 02 2010 07:52 GMT
#59
On May 02 2010 16:33 Aelfric wrote:
Don't make ad hominem here please. No one becomes critical thinker with watching few videos on it, whoever thinks like that basically wrong but you can actually discuss on some of his arguments instead of labeling him as a blowhard.
Gaining critical thinking is a progress and needs time because of its development in mind claims that you could have done wrong and still behaving wrong about so many things. Scepticism doesn't care about what you feel on believes or ideologies it only deals with facts.


to be honest man i really can't make sense of most of your post there. not trying to be all ad hominem, but that english doesn't exactly pan out. anyway here is mypoint:

you have a notion that this magical thing called skepticism allows you to transcend such intellectual confines as feelings, beliefs, & ideologies and "only deal with facts." but you're wrong. for many reasons but the one that's coming to mind here is that the idea of a fact is part of an ideology. likewise the blowhard that made that youtube video has this notion that "critical thinking" consists of eschewing biases of culture and upbringing. that notion is demonstrably a bias of culture and upbringing.

the thing is that all of these arguments have been had out before by brilliant individuals and at great length. you're going to find them in books, though, not on youtube. hate to be the one who had to break it to you.
"Politics is an extravagance, an extravagance about grievances. And poetry is an extravagance about grief. And grievances are something that can be remedied, and griefs are irremediable."
Aesop
Profile Joined October 2007
Hungary11305 Posts
May 02 2010 08:03 GMT
#60
I'm with tinman on this one. The youtube author is basically beating a horse that's been dead for ~ 900 years.
ModeratorNon veritas sed auctoritas facit legem. | Liquipedia: Don't ask me, I'm retired.
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