Korean Music Discussion - Page 3052

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dbg

Colombia264 Posts

July 01 2012 23:03 GMT

#61021

now your calling them MC's

are you serious

DystopiaX

United States16236 Posts

July 01 2012 23:06 GMT

#61022

On July 02 2012 08:01 DemigodcelpH wrote:

Show nested quote +

On July 02 2012 07:46 DystopiaX wrote:

On July 02 2012 07:38 DemigodcelpH wrote:

On July 02 2012 07:28 DystopiaX wrote:

On July 02 2012 06:56 DemigodcelpH wrote:

And the girls who sing likely can't rap without practice. Talentless girls don't get parts in the songs, so the existence of them there implies talent. The point is that most kpop groups have major hiphop influence, so this is good supporting evidence. Additionally the beautiful rapper girls don't have to be there, but they are. Why? I don't know, but it's pretty much one of the definitive aspects of modern kpop/khiphop, and it's awesome. They're intentionally added in whether you like it or not, so don't disregard them as "backups" out of ignorance. That's disrepectful to kpop, and the groups.

And none of this even touches on the major influences in the way they dance, and the way they often sing (R&B style).

This part tells me you don't know much about kpop/how groups are formed if you think that every member has something musical to add to the table, or anything at all. Most groups above 4 members have at least 1 member who can't sing, dance, or rap, and are there because they're funny for TV shows, really pretty, can act, etc. But since idol groups are primarily supposed to be musicians every member has to do something to keep up appearances (and prevent fans of a certain member from complaining that they get no lines) and it's easy to get a talentless girl to "rap" (several have admitted they don't know what they're doing so they just say the lyrics really fast in a cadence taught to them by a producer) so that they have lines. This isn't every idol "rapper" in the business but it is a lot of them, and implying that they were added to the group because they have rapping talent is laughable.

Just to respond to the third bolded part (not including you "have" bolded) in some cases the "rapping" position isn't added in because they can rap, but because they're a pretty face and might do well in variety but can't sing, so they "rap" instead.

edit- as for the backups thing, many groups actually have "backup" in several of the girls' titles. As in backup dance/backup singer, etc. So it's not insulting at all, that's actually the company line.

Entirely wrong. Korean girls with pretty faces are a dime-a-dozen. Groups lose and recruit members all the time. If they needed another member who could sing they would simply get one. The reason kpop groups have rapper girls is because it's a niche, and an integral part of modern kpop. Why do you think many of the songs have hiphop beats, and all of the other hiphop influences (dancing, attire, tone of singing) that I mentioned? It's because it's the style that they love. Modern kpop is unique fusion which is why I love it, though some songs are more traditional. Also the idea that any girl can rap is truly laughable. Have you seen Epik High? Taktak36? Dok2? Psy? We're discussing kpop here, but please don't insult khiphop which is a cultural phenemonen there.

I think you said you only dabble in kpop, so let me clarify things for you. All the artists you mentioned are not considered kpop or kidols, but instead artists/musicians that happen to be popular. I'm not saying rap is shoved into kpop to give the girls something to do, only that the parts are assigned to the girls that don't have a lot of singing parts because they can't carry a tune.

And yes I have heard all those artists. Although I don't like Dok2 and I think Psy is less of a brilliant lyricist and more of a great stage performer. Catchy shit though.

My previous statement was directed at kpop in idol groups, not all korean hip hop or rap.

@purpl3- I know you weren't kidding lol

Of course. Responding to the bolded part here. If they didn't need an MC girl she would be kicked out of the group. That's business, and members of these groups cost money. MC girls are put in intentionally. It's something they experiemnted with, and it's something that works. There's no shortage of valuable talent that could potentially increase sales, and they know this, so girls aren't given song parts just because. They'd either be cut or filled.

As we've all seen girls are dropped and added all of the time. Like it or not the MCs in these girl groups are considered assets to the niche, and as I've said many times hiphop influence in kpop far deeper embedded than the lyricists in the form of kpop girl attire, dancing, and style of singing.

No you're missing the point. The girl would be there anyway, because she's good at acting or funny on variety shows or ridiculously hot (see YoonA, etc. for ridiculously hot but musically useless) and so to get her involved musically they give her the rap parts.

They're not there because they can rap, they rap because they'd be there anyway.

Look, this isn't even my opinion, plenty of IDOL RAPPERS say that they didn't know how to rap at all, and the first experience they had with it was when they were distributing the parts for their first song and the producer or company president or whoever told them to rap, so they did.

The 2nd part is irrelevant to anything I'm saying. Hip hop is prominent in kpop because kpop apes whatever is on the American top 40 charts and if you've noticed even the poppy tracks have hip hop influences in them as well.

edit- as to the part you edited in after I responded, Pitbull is popular and a "cultural phenomenon" too, but that doesn't mean he's good. Popular != good.

Vorgrim

Korea (North)1601 Posts

July 01 2012 23:06 GMT

#61023

On July 02 2012 07:53 REDBLUEGREEN wrote:
So it just so happens I kinda aquired myself a korean girlfriend and think about seriously learning some korean. I dabbled in it before a little bit but what always hold me back from spending more time with korean was that I didn't particularly like the way it sounded.
Almost all experience with listening to korean comes from hearing dudes shouting REABA REABA REABA over each other or some kpop (which I don't enjoy, don't stone me please) though.
So I just stumbled across this:
+ Show Spoiler +

wow it is amazing

So since this thread is technically not limited to kpop only, I am just looking for some similar recommendations to show me the language can indeed sound beautiful and give me some motivation to study -.-

The vocal technique she is using is also used in the popular genre known as trot. It's fallen out of favour recently but you can check out 장윤정 (Jang Yoon Jung) on youtube for a more modern version of it, though you may have to fight your way through her more pop style stuff to find the more traditional ones.

For example
+ Show Spoiler +

DemigodcelpH

1138 Posts

July 01 2012 23:08 GMT

#61024

On July 02 2012 08:03 dbg wrote:
now your calling them MC's

are you serious

Do you know the definition of MC? Gilme (popular female korean rapper) is an MC, just as the rappers in popular kpop groups are.

On July 02 2012 08:06 DystopiaX wrote:
They're not there because they can rap, they rap because they'd be there anyway.

No you're missing the point. This is false. If any of that were true then many female korean MCs would not go solo.

On July 02 2012 08:03 dbg wrote:Pitbull is popular and a "cultural phenomenon" too, but that doesn't mean he's good. Popular != good.

Popular also =! bad.

With that said I value the opinion of S. Korea more than yours. <3

dbg

Colombia264 Posts

July 01 2012 23:14 GMT

#61025

is justin bieber an mc?

DystopiaX

United States16236 Posts

July 01 2012 23:16 GMT

#61026

On July 02 2012 08:08 DemigodcelpH wrote:

Show nested quote +

Do you know the definition of MC? Gilme (popular female korean rapper) is an MC, just as the rappers in popular kpop groups are.

Show nested quote +

No you're missing the point. This is false. If any of that were true then many female korean MCs would not go solo.

Show nested quote +

Popular also =! bad.

With that said I value the opinion of S. Korea more than you. <3

The fuck? Which idol rapper has gone solo?

klogg

Sweden800 Posts

July 01 2012 23:17 GMT

#61027

This might come to a shock to DemigodcelpH, but the vast majority of k-pop groups have little to no say in anything regarding the management of their group. They are merely a manufactured product by their entertainment company. The same company expects a return on their investment in training and producing the groups, this will never happen if you only have "talented" members. You need to have members that are visually appealing and entertaining, capable of promoting their group through different mediums like variety shows, advertisements and dramas.

You are suggesting all members contribute the same amount musically as the other members and that is just straight up wrong. There are plenty of useless members in k-pop groups that drag the group down musically but contribute greater in terms of promoting the group.

DystopiaX

United States16236 Posts

July 01 2012 23:19 GMT

#61028

On July 02 2012 08:17 klogg wrote:
This might come to a shock to DemigodcelpH, but the vast majority of k-pop groups have little to no say in anything regarding the management of their group. They are merely a manufactured product by their entertainment company. The same company expects a return on their investment in training and producing the groups, this will never happen if you only have "talented" members. You need to have members that are visually appealing and entertaining, capable of promoting their groups through different mediums like variety shows, advertisements and dramas.

You are suggesting all members contribute the same amount musically as the other members and that is just straight up wrong.

From what I can tell he lacks reading comprehension, doesn't realize that artists like Epik High and Leessang and idol groups are different, and then ignores the arguments that he does understand.

Can't tell if he's trolling or not at this point.

DemigodcelpH

1138 Posts

July 01 2012 23:19 GMT

#61029

On July 02 2012 08:16 DystopiaX wrote:

Show nested quote +

The fuck? Which idol rapper has gone solo?

Lee Chae-rin rapped a lot in 2NE1 and has had many solo projects now.

DystopiaX

United States16236 Posts

July 01 2012 23:22 GMT

#61030

On July 02 2012 08:19 DemigodcelpH wrote:

Show nested quote +

Lee Chae-rin rapped a lot in 2NE1 and has had many solo projects now.

That's 1. out of how many?

HyunA's gotten a solo as well but I wouldn't say she has talent.

Look, it's not the people with the most talent that get solos all the time but the most popular. CL got a solo because YG knew she was popular and so gave her a solo. Not to mention that YG is known to be an exception in the industry by recruiting those with talent as well as looks (see GD doing the same thing)

Also she didn't go solo, more like she did a side project in between downtime because her agency ordered her to. and they ordered her to because every member of every idol group is always working on something always, otherwise you're just losing money.

DemigodcelpH

1138 Posts

July 01 2012 23:25 GMT

#61031

On July 02 2012 08:22 DystopiaX wrote:

Show nested quote +

Lee Chae-rin
Ha Joo Yeon
Miryo
Zinger (free-styled rapped BEFORE she even joined any kpop group)
Bekah

Are all female rappers from popular kpop groups that have had solo projects. And that's just off the top of my head.

Any questions? Discredit all you want, but hiphop's influence in modern kpop is here to stay, amazing, and what defines it (coincidentally when this all started showing up kpop started getting extremely popular). And even despite any female rappers in kpop groups modern kpop is still influenced by hiphop (or R&B) in many other ways such as attire, singing style, and dancing.

LosingID8

CA10830 Posts

July 01 2012 23:28 GMT

#61032

my head hurts from this "debate"

DystopiaX

United States16236 Posts

July 01 2012 23:32 GMT

#61033

On July 02 2012 08:25 DemigodcelpH wrote:

Show nested quote +

Yookyung/Hayoung/Chorong whoever they have rap in Apink
Whoever has the rapper position in T-ara at the moment
Woori (much as I like her)
Bora (much as I like her as well).
Nicole
Taecyeon
etc etc
I never said it was a hard and fast rule, just that most are like this. There are exceptions, such as the ones you pointed out, but they're EXCEPTIONS.

Again the 2nd paragraph is irrelevant to what i'm saying. I'm not denying there's a hip hop influence in kpop at all, and if you think I think that way you have serious problems comprehending what I'm saying. rap is there because it's popular, the members are not there because they can rap.

DemigodcelpH

1138 Posts

July 01 2012 23:40 GMT

#61034

On July 02 2012 08:32 DystopiaX wrote:

Show nested quote +

Of course. It was in the 2nd paragraph because it was another point. It was relevant because it's the original thing I posted about which this all stems from. For whatever reason people (usually non koreans outside of their culture) like to feveriously deny modern kpop's major association (and coinciently the most popular singles usually have the strongest association) with hiphop out of some sort of odd passive aggression. It's very very prominent and amazing.

Purpl3

United States1067 Posts

July 01 2012 23:41 GMT

#61035

Let's have some One Way into here cause too much text is bad:

+ Show Spoiler +

Lokk

Canada635 Posts

July 01 2012 23:44 GMT

#61036

On July 02 2012 07:22 TuElite wrote:
Hey ̶D̶e̶m̶i̶g̶o̶d̶ Lokk, who do you like the most in females idols "rappers" ?

WOORIES~
+ Show Spoiler +

DemigodcelpH

1138 Posts

July 01 2012 23:58 GMT

#61037

On July 02 2012 08:41 Purpl3 wrote:
cause too much text is bad:

Agreed.

NicksonReyes

Philippines4431 Posts

July 01 2012 23:59 GMT

#61038

Dayum, this talk reminds me of how Dal shabet is rising in my ranks. I kinda liked Viki but removing her guarantees less "rap" breaks. The Subin-Serri-Newbie combo is so strong. I'm starting to like the new member more than Serri.
+ Show Spoiler +

best song in their album imo

As for the hiphop guy, for some reason, you decided to pop up and post something random and then argued with people who didn't agree with your opinion and then

On July 02 2012 07:10 DemigodcelpH wrote:

Show nested quote +

Please don't talk about subjects you aren't educated about.

Idol "rap" exists just to give the visuals/dancers some lines because not all can sing but anyone can talk monotone. If you're a KMD lurker, then you should know you'll never win here with that attitude especially if you don't have anyone on your side+ Show Spoiler +

or some reading comprehension

. I find the Suzy vs LMJ debate more amusing.

Edit: I like flashback. Is that weird?

DystopiaX

United States16236 Posts

July 02 2012 00:02 GMT

#61039

Sum more cape A Pink

[image loading]

+ Show Spoiler +

Na Eun
+ Show Spoiler +

Bomi
+ Show Spoiler +

Eunji
+ Show Spoiler +

edit- @Nickson- for some reason I really like the rap at the beginning of Flashback, the rest of the song is mehish to me.

Although I like the lives cause new blond lizzy is hot.

Requizen

United States33802 Posts

July 02 2012 00:03 GMT

#61040

On July 02 2012 08:59 NicksonReyes wrote:

Edit: I like flashback. Is that weird?

Nah, it's grown on me. Probably just because of the MV, confusing as it is. It's one of those songs that shows up on my playlist sometimes and I'm like "oh, that's a good one".

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