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On November 02 2015 15:52 CxWiLL wrote:
According to sgamers,
Burning have a tradition of downgrading his mid player.
It starts with super on DK 2012-2013, super used to be DK's counter-part of 430 and Mu, and considered as the most talented of the three.
Then Mushi in DK 2014, turning the almighty M-god in TI3 into, well, what he is right now.
And 430 in IG this year, you can clearly find that 430 can no longer dominate the mid as much as he was.
Now super has to be burning's mid player for the second time, you can expect what is happening to him.
Sgamers and their memes..a more retarded version of reddit where school kids spam some random things and hate towards certain player...and it's not like 430 cant dominate his lanes..it's just that times changed and other new generation mids are surpassing the likes of dendi,430 and super
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Bosnia-Herzegovina983 Posts
well if meta shifted to playmaking heroes again dendi , 430 and super would be relevant.
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..and it's not like 430 cant dominate his lanes..it's just that times changed and other new generation mids are surpassing the likes of dendi,430 and super
That Sgamer shit is just funny chinese superstition memes. Correlation =/= causation yadda yadda, but its still funny at how stupid it is.
What are the OG mids suppose to do when they can't get on the same level as the new prodigies. You kind of contradicted yourself with that statement. Honestly I have no idea what I'm talking about anymore. The mid role has evolved and is different for every team. You have mids that get ganked 4 times then take over mid game anyways because of stacks and kills. Then you have mids that tilt and just feed away their lead even with support ganks. VG tried to shut down the tiny, but he got rekted by the bh and slardar rotations later on anyways then never recovered. Is it the supports fault or Super's for not being able to have the game sense.
Just goes to show how an individual's fault are magnified when the whole team is fucking up. So bottom line is the whole of VG has problem's, but the individual mistakes definitely make them look worse. Works the opposite way too, hence all the EE and w33 praise.
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i like to flame super a lot but the last game wasnt his fault, he was only slightly out of position and his teammates never hovered around mid enough to make a dent on all the ganks on him. its not VG's typical playstyle to protect their mid hard but fy fenrir absolutely had to do something about pieliedie absolutely destroying all of their laning
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On November 02 2015 14:40 Kamisamanachi wrote:
pretty ridiculous to see people are trying to scapegoat by saying burning doesnt fit..i mean no carry player fits any team .it's just that how whole team synergizes with each other and adapt according..and so far,it is more of burning adapting to VG style rather than VG adapting to him..about 80% of the games at NYC ,burning came to fight early to set the tempo of the game when super lost his lanes.and at 20% of the games VG were so far behind that noone could carry them to victory like that DP game where he tried to carry the game but a single core slark can't do much against a monster farmed am..
the hate/blame certainly feels like another scapegoating attempt for super getting outdrafted in atleast 3 games of grand finals..and yeah,Yj would have also done same thing at burning's place..what do u expect when ur rest of the team has soo far behind?jump into 5 heroes mindlessly?stop saying aggressive word if u thing aggressive means jumping like retard under enemy towers
But... I feel Burning is just like chinese-speaking Black.
And in this meta, looks like "jumping like retard under enemy towers" carry is more useful than a farming carry.
We had at least 3 out of total 5 loses against secret literally because Team Secret's "jumping like retard under enemy towers" carry. When u have 4 people put a constant pressure a whole game, u should join them and died with the result of winning teamfight.
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VG's major problems: they often have awful drafts and their supports simply don't dedicate enough time to laning well. When they make it past laning with a decent draft they're fine.
There are some criticisms to throw on all of them in individual games, but the only player who stood out as playing consistently badly was Icex3, but I think that's still on how the team works as a whole: offlaners almost always look trash when they're not helped (e.g. Misery recently, only exception I can think of might be Universe). Really, it's just the way the team functions and drafts rather than any individual being the main problem. Super maybe isn't incredible, but he's not awful - he's good enough to force respect bans, at any rate.
Anyway, VG cemented themselves as a top 5 team. That's pretty good, no?
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On November 02 2015 19:10 honeylover wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2015 14:40 Kamisamanachi wrote:
pretty ridiculous to see people are trying to scapegoat by saying burning doesnt fit..i mean no carry player fits any team .it's just that how whole team synergizes with each other and adapt according..and so far,it is more of burning adapting to VG style rather than VG adapting to him..about 80% of the games at NYC ,burning came to fight early to set the tempo of the game when super lost his lanes.and at 20% of the games VG were so far behind that noone could carry them to victory like that DP game where he tried to carry the game but a single core slark can't do much against a monster farmed am..
the hate/blame certainly feels like another scapegoating attempt for super getting outdrafted in atleast 3 games of grand finals..and yeah,Yj would have also done same thing at burning's place..what do u expect when ur rest of the team has soo far behind?jump into 5 heroes mindlessly?stop saying aggressive word if u thing aggressive means jumping like retard under enemy towers But... I feel Burning is just like chinese-speaking Black. And in this meta, looks like "jumping like retard under enemy towers" carry is more useful than a farming carry. We had at least 3 out of total 5 loses against secret literally because Team Secret's "jumping like retard under enemy towers" carry. When u have 4 people put a constant pressure a whole game, u should join them and died with the result of winning teamfight.
and in 2 out of the 5 losses ee played am vs them....a farming carry.
i would agree with fuzzyjam here. vgs drafts are questionable at times and the only player that really underperformed in some of the important games was ice
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Think they did fine. Normaly Ice3 does a lot but this tournament it felt like he played pretty damn bad especially in the finals here. If Ice3 gets his shit together they might just beat Secret since it felt like he was a complete non factor in the games i saw.
Definately my favorite chinese team this and has been for a while, just stabilize the drafts and have Ice3 actually have an impact and they golden.
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Well iceiceice often wins games solo when he is given a good lane or a 1v1 lane. But when he gets starved, he is usually unable to make much of an impact. Usually then he adapts by playing the role of pld. He draws the enemy to him, to create space for his mid, carry and fy. Generally suicidal plays.
I kinda think that's what makes him not as good as say universe in this regard. Iceiceice simply doesn't play well the moment he gets shut down. But when he gets a good lane, he is the undisputed best offlaner.
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@ that sgamer post... was super even a lane dominator like ever?!!lol
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super DELIVERS last game vs VP
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On November 18 2015 09:11 evanthebouncy! wrote:
super DELIVERS last game vs VP
Yeah, was super beat down.
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aside from the dieback (which was started by a stupid iceiceice attempt to ward), super played pretty well in game 3 and also in game 1.
game 2 was a pretty bad mess from super since fy/fenrir love to sack him and G got way too large that game. VG draft and use of NS was utterly pointless
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God, why do they keep drafting QoP for Burning, he's so mediocre on that hero.
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burning is okay on qop. It's just secret drafted really well. Meepo is one of the best qop counters
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Burning played QoP a bit better than Super, and a lot of time it works just fine. Just not this time.
Their decision making, team fight coordination & skills are definitely up there, I just think their draft is a bit subpar vs Puppey's and ppd's atm.
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i've yet to see vg lose a game if the drafts are equal. draft is their only problem, that's why I kept wanting to see LanM on the team ugh
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^ The guy said it perfectly..the skill can't even be the problem with this team .the drafting has been a rough road for them in their losses..their hero pools are universe wide,but a lot of time they draft themselves into the corner.and rest of the losses comes from them playing in opponents hands in drafting stage..let's hope super gets his mojo back and drafts better against ehome/LGD
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On November 19 2015 08:15 evanthebouncy! wrote:
burning is okay on qop. It's just secret drafted really well. Meepo is one of the best qop counters
I'm not saying he's terrible or anything, but compared to a lot of his other heroes he just doesn't seem comfortable on QoP at all. They're not out yet, so I hope they re-evaluate their drafting, other than that the team is fine. Burning looked really good on Lina yesterday.
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On November 19 2015 13:11 scicurious wrote:Show nested quote +On November 19 2015 08:15 evanthebouncy! wrote:
burning is okay on qop. It's just secret drafted really well. Meepo is one of the best qop counters I'm not saying he's terrible or anything, but compared to a lot of his other heroes he just doesn't seem comfortable on QoP at all. They're not out yet, so I hope they re-evaluate their drafting, other than that the team is fine. Burning looked really good on Lina yesterday.
he is performing really good on almost all the heroes..and it always comes down to the drafting stage if they pick late game carry for him or not..he can play aggressively but it the security of the lategame u get when u give burning a late game carry which super hasn't been doing..VG's early game is pretty weak and they rely on their teamfights for mid game .so giving him a farming carry and let him farm as secret does with envy will do no harm ..atleast it is better than random lycan mid and safelane qop against doom, ember ,shaman
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EPT
