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EffOrt returns to Brood War - Page 9

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Please stop discussing BW vs. SC2. Discussions after page 10 will be actioned.
Kau *
Profile Joined March 2007
Canada3502 Posts
January 06 2015 18:02 GMT
#161
On January 06 2015 19:56 Cele wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 06 2015 02:40 Kau wrote:
On January 05 2015 18:50 PharaphobiaSC2 wrote:
On January 05 2015 18:19 zeo wrote:
On January 05 2015 09:32 Masheyoon wrote:
Amusingly, what happened three years ago appears to be happening now, only it's SC2 that's fading and BW emerging.

The bitterness people feel towards Blizzard is understandable. What Mike Morhaime said directly after the final OSL was appalling (Paraphrased: "Brood War's departure is a good thing and will help pave way for SC2."). Instead of appearing impressive in the eyes of many by having a video game that has stood the test of time, Blizzard now appears greedy, selfish and entirely dumb in the eyes of everyone for killing it off in trying to make SC2 as successful as possible. They could have, you know, continued to support both games.


You made me remember that Morhaime speech

I can't believe people actually think that the Savior fiasco 'killed' BW, yeah it hurt the scene but it come nowhere close to Blizzard actively trying to shut down and hijack the BW esports scene so 'esports' could be used as a marketing tool for SC2.

Edit: On the topic of Effort, I always liked him more than Jaedong.


Can you provide some sources for this? I mena any official annoucments etc. I would love to thorw this in blizzard face


What does this even mean? Throw in Blizzard's face? Don't stir up shit please. Everyone just stop posting about Blizzard and SC2 in this thread.


i think we're eligible to express our opinions on the Blizzard-Kespa-Sc2 themecomplex here, right? It isn't exactly the topic, but of course people discuss how to "interpret" player switches in the light of past events. That "throwing into Blizzards Face remark is out of line i agree, but will there be consequences if people just have a... civil discussion about the subject?
I don't want to annoy you, i would like to clarify for myself, what your position on this subject is.


I don't mind a civil discussion. It's just when posts start getting needlessly antagonistic that I get annoyed. If I read the SC2 forums, I would not want to see posts calling BW an outdated and dead game. Along the same lines, I imagine SC2 regulars that come here do not want to see posts calling SC2 a failure or a dead game.

As for posts regarding Blizzard and Kespa and their contribution to the decline of professional BW, I guess I just feel like that horse has been beaten to death. I thought this thread would have more "remember when EffOrt almost lost to Flash" rather than "remember when Blizzard almost killed off BW".

So yes, feel free to express your opinions, just don't lace it with negativity and aggression.
Moderator
Cele
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Germany4016 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-01-06 18:09:12
January 06 2015 18:08 GMT
#162
On January 07 2015 03:02 Kau wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 06 2015 19:56 Cele wrote:
On January 06 2015 02:40 Kau wrote:
On January 05 2015 18:50 PharaphobiaSC2 wrote:
On January 05 2015 18:19 zeo wrote:
On January 05 2015 09:32 Masheyoon wrote:
Amusingly, what happened three years ago appears to be happening now, only it's SC2 that's fading and BW emerging.

The bitterness people feel towards Blizzard is understandable. What Mike Morhaime said directly after the final OSL was appalling (Paraphrased: "Brood War's departure is a good thing and will help pave way for SC2."). Instead of appearing impressive in the eyes of many by having a video game that has stood the test of time, Blizzard now appears greedy, selfish and entirely dumb in the eyes of everyone for killing it off in trying to make SC2 as successful as possible. They could have, you know, continued to support both games.


You made me remember that Morhaime speech

I can't believe people actually think that the Savior fiasco 'killed' BW, yeah it hurt the scene but it come nowhere close to Blizzard actively trying to shut down and hijack the BW esports scene so 'esports' could be used as a marketing tool for SC2.

Edit: On the topic of Effort, I always liked him more than Jaedong.


Can you provide some sources for this? I mena any official annoucments etc. I would love to thorw this in blizzard face


What does this even mean? Throw in Blizzard's face? Don't stir up shit please. Everyone just stop posting about Blizzard and SC2 in this thread.


i think we're eligible to express our opinions on the Blizzard-Kespa-Sc2 themecomplex here, right? It isn't exactly the topic, but of course people discuss how to "interpret" player switches in the light of past events. That "throwing into Blizzards Face remark is out of line i agree, but will there be consequences if people just have a... civil discussion about the subject?
I don't want to annoy you, i would like to clarify for myself, what your position on this subject is.


I don't mind a civil discussion. It's just when posts start getting needlessly antagonistic that I get annoyed. If I read the SC2 forums, I would not want to see posts calling BW an outdated and dead game. Along the same lines, I imagine SC2 regulars that come here do not want to see posts calling SC2 a failure or a dead game.

As for posts regarding Blizzard and Kespa and their contribution to the decline of professional BW, I guess I just feel like that horse has been beaten to death. I thought this thread would have more "remember when EffOrt almost lost to Flash" rather than "remember when Blizzard almost killed off BW".

So yes, feel free to express your opinions, just don't lace it with negativity and aggression.


fair enough. I agree the topic is rather stone cold and i dunno either why it has to come up like every time someone switches back or if it is a similar topic.
Broodwar for life!
Carnivorous Sheep
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Baa?21245 Posts
January 06 2015 18:26 GMT
#163
On January 07 2015 03:08 Cele wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 07 2015 03:02 Kau wrote:
On January 06 2015 19:56 Cele wrote:
On January 06 2015 02:40 Kau wrote:
On January 05 2015 18:50 PharaphobiaSC2 wrote:
On January 05 2015 18:19 zeo wrote:
On January 05 2015 09:32 Masheyoon wrote:
Amusingly, what happened three years ago appears to be happening now, only it's SC2 that's fading and BW emerging.

The bitterness people feel towards Blizzard is understandable. What Mike Morhaime said directly after the final OSL was appalling (Paraphrased: "Brood War's departure is a good thing and will help pave way for SC2."). Instead of appearing impressive in the eyes of many by having a video game that has stood the test of time, Blizzard now appears greedy, selfish and entirely dumb in the eyes of everyone for killing it off in trying to make SC2 as successful as possible. They could have, you know, continued to support both games.


You made me remember that Morhaime speech

I can't believe people actually think that the Savior fiasco 'killed' BW, yeah it hurt the scene but it come nowhere close to Blizzard actively trying to shut down and hijack the BW esports scene so 'esports' could be used as a marketing tool for SC2.

Edit: On the topic of Effort, I always liked him more than Jaedong.


Can you provide some sources for this? I mena any official annoucments etc. I would love to thorw this in blizzard face


What does this even mean? Throw in Blizzard's face? Don't stir up shit please. Everyone just stop posting about Blizzard and SC2 in this thread.


i think we're eligible to express our opinions on the Blizzard-Kespa-Sc2 themecomplex here, right? It isn't exactly the topic, but of course people discuss how to "interpret" player switches in the light of past events. That "throwing into Blizzards Face remark is out of line i agree, but will there be consequences if people just have a... civil discussion about the subject?
I don't want to annoy you, i would like to clarify for myself, what your position on this subject is.


I don't mind a civil discussion. It's just when posts start getting needlessly antagonistic that I get annoyed. If I read the SC2 forums, I would not want to see posts calling BW an outdated and dead game. Along the same lines, I imagine SC2 regulars that come here do not want to see posts calling SC2 a failure or a dead game.

As for posts regarding Blizzard and Kespa and their contribution to the decline of professional BW, I guess I just feel like that horse has been beaten to death. I thought this thread would have more "remember when EffOrt almost lost to Flash" rather than "remember when Blizzard almost killed off BW".

So yes, feel free to express your opinions, just don't lace it with negativity and aggression.


fair enough. I agree the topic is rather stone cold and i dunno either why it has to come up like every time someone switches back or if it is a similar topic.


Well that probably means for a lot of people that topic isn't really "stone cold" :|
TranslatorBaa!
parkufarku
Profile Blog Joined March 2014
882 Posts
January 06 2015 18:30 GMT
#164
Wasn't Effort one of the very few Zergs, if not only, that was a favorite vs. Flash? Even Jaedong seemed like 50/50 against Flash at their peaks (power outage was actually analyzed as a winning game for JD), but I would give the bet to Flash in that scenario because it's top class Zerg vs. top class Terran, and T's always have a huge advantage in that matchup

I love Effort's mass early ling style, it's definitely a changeup from JD's reliance on early mutas or expansion type of game.
Carnivorous Sheep
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Baa?21245 Posts
January 06 2015 18:36 GMT
#165
On January 07 2015 03:30 parkufarku wrote:
Wasn't Effort one of the very few Zergs, if not only, that was a favorite vs. Flash? Even Jaedong seemed like 50/50 against Flash at their peaks (power outage was actually analyzed as a winning game for JD), but I would give the bet to Flash in that scenario because it's top class Zerg vs. top class Terran, and T's always have a huge advantage in that matchup

I love Effort's mass early ling style, it's definitely a changeup from JD's reliance on early mutas or expansion type of game.


I don't think Effort can be reliably considered a favorite vs. Flash. His lifetime record vs. Flash is only 6-9, which isn't a huge sample of games. Arbitrarily using 2010 as a cut off, Effort is 5-3 vs. Flash in "modern" Starcraft, with a grand total of one BoX series in the OSL finals.

Compared to other S class players, Effort didn't even really get to face other top pros enough to really draw any meaningful conclusions about how well he fared.
TranslatorBaa!
SnowFantasy
Profile Blog Joined September 2006
4173 Posts
January 06 2015 20:06 GMT
#166
Why does how well he did vs not-flash players have anything to do with how well he did vs Flash?
MrMotionPicture
Profile Joined May 2010
United States4327 Posts
January 06 2015 20:13 GMT
#167
Gogo Effort!
"Elvis Presley" | Ret was looking at my post in the GSL video by Artosis. | MMA told me I look like Juanfran while we shared an elevator with Scarlett
Maks
Profile Joined December 2010
Ukraine193 Posts
January 06 2015 20:23 GMT
#168
Holy cow, that's awesome!
BisuDagger
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Bisutopia19368 Posts
January 07 2015 02:46 GMT
#169
The last time someone was considered a favorite against Flash, he lost his horribly in his ace match. His name was BeSt.
ModeratorFormer Afreeca Starleague Caster: http://afreeca.tv/ASL2ENG2
amazingxkcd
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
GRAND OLD AMERICA16375 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-01-07 07:29:59
January 07 2015 02:55 GMT
#170
On January 07 2015 11:46 BisuDagger wrote:
The last time someone was considered a favorite against Flash, he lost his horribly in his ace match. His name was BeSt.


best also lost to Hoejja who only used zerglings and queens.

Now that was hilarious to watch


Edit: ok, i was a bit wrong on my memory, it was vs Hoejja on Neo EC who was using this dope Queen ensnare strat and just use cracklings to backstab everywhere while stalling with lurks defense. I just remember it being hilarious cause Best lost like that during SPL finals to add to the humiliation


The world is burning and you rather be on this terrible website discussing video games and your shallow feelings
]343[
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
United States10328 Posts
January 07 2015 02:58 GMT
#171
alien zerg!!
Writer
Assault_1
Profile Joined April 2009
Canada1950 Posts
January 07 2015 03:07 GMT
#172
effort's an alien that's why hes so good

[image loading]
BisuDagger
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Bisutopia19368 Posts
January 07 2015 03:36 GMT
#173
On January 07 2015 11:55 amazingxkcd wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 07 2015 11:46 BisuDagger wrote:
The last time someone was considered a favorite against Flash, he lost his horribly in his ace match. His name was BeSt.


best also lost to zero who only used zerglings and queens.

Now that was hilarious to watch

I don't remember that one. Best is either out of this world good or hilariously bad.
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GlfO33YkTfw
ModeratorFormer Afreeca Starleague Caster: http://afreeca.tv/ASL2ENG2
duke91
Profile Joined April 2014
Germany1458 Posts
January 07 2015 04:32 GMT
#174
On January 07 2015 12:36 BisuDagger wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 07 2015 11:55 amazingxkcd wrote:
On January 07 2015 11:46 BisuDagger wrote:
The last time someone was considered a favorite against Flash, he lost his horribly in his ace match. His name was BeSt.


best also lost to zero who only used zerglings and queens.

Now that was hilarious to watch

I don't remember that one. Best is either out of this world good or hilariously bad.
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GlfO33YkTfw


Oh god how much I want Julyzerg to return. SSL needs some super aggressive swagger zerg. Kwanro is super aggressive, but IMO not swagger enough.
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)STYLE START SBENU( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
outscar
Profile Joined September 2014
2832 Posts
January 07 2015 07:19 GMT
#175
Ongamenet did a horrible thing by transferring themselves into SCII and forgetting these players. They thought that BW will forgive them? Now, where is that channel, who watches it?

I wonder when Stork will show himself up.
sunbeams are never made like me...
TelecoM
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States10785 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-01-07 07:32:49
January 07 2015 07:31 GMT
#176
On January 07 2015 13:32 duke91 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 07 2015 12:36 BisuDagger wrote:
On January 07 2015 11:55 amazingxkcd wrote:
On January 07 2015 11:46 BisuDagger wrote:
The last time someone was considered a favorite against Flash, he lost his horribly in his ace match. His name was BeSt.


best also lost to zero who only used zerglings and queens.

Now that was hilarious to watch

I don't remember that one. Best is either out of this world good or hilariously bad.
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GlfO33YkTfw


Oh god how much I want Julyzerg to return. SSL needs some super aggressive swagger zerg. Kwanro is super aggressive, but IMO not swagger enough.


If JulyZerg came back to BW, I would immediatly only be playing BW again....I LOVE JulyZerg man, I actually had the privilege to MEET JulyZerg IN PERSON at MLG years ago, I got his autograph , and even SHOOK HIS HAND !! The second I shook JulyZerg's hand my APM went up 100 and I was suddently able to Micro Mutalisks at an incredible level...

EDIT : Sorry I didn't mean to bring up SC2 in here , but it was at the SC2 MLG event that JulyZerg was playing in, but Man the BroodWar Ora was just all around him...my entire interaction with him, I wasn't even thinking about SC2, just how godly this man was in BW.
AKA: TelecoM[WHITE] Protoss fighting
BisuDagger
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Bisutopia19368 Posts
January 07 2015 15:51 GMT
#177
On January 07 2015 16:31 GGzerG wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 07 2015 13:32 duke91 wrote:
On January 07 2015 12:36 BisuDagger wrote:
On January 07 2015 11:55 amazingxkcd wrote:
On January 07 2015 11:46 BisuDagger wrote:
The last time someone was considered a favorite against Flash, he lost his horribly in his ace match. His name was BeSt.


best also lost to zero who only used zerglings and queens.

Now that was hilarious to watch

I don't remember that one. Best is either out of this world good or hilariously bad.
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GlfO33YkTfw


Oh god how much I want Julyzerg to return. SSL needs some super aggressive swagger zerg. Kwanro is super aggressive, but IMO not swagger enough.


If JulyZerg came back to BW, I would immediatly only be playing BW again....I LOVE JulyZerg man, I actually had the privilege to MEET JulyZerg IN PERSON at MLG years ago, I got his autograph , and even SHOOK HIS HAND !! The second I shook JulyZerg's hand my APM went up 100 and I was suddently able to Micro Mutalisks at an incredible level...

EDIT : Sorry I didn't mean to bring up SC2 in here , but it was at the SC2 MLG event that JulyZerg was playing in, but Man the BroodWar Ora was just all around him...my entire interaction with him, I wasn't even thinking about SC2, just how godly this man was in BW.

Which MLG? I met him at the Orlando one.

On January 07 2015 16:19 outscar wrote:
Ongamenet did a horrible thing by transferring themselves into SCII and forgetting these players. They thought that BW will forgive them? Now, where is that channel, who watches it?

I wonder when Stork will show himself up.

OGN stuck with SC1 while MBC went to KPOP. Who's the worst one here?
ModeratorFormer Afreeca Starleague Caster: http://afreeca.tv/ASL2ENG2
BLinD-RawR
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
ALLEYCAT BLUES51099 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-01-07 16:18:50
January 07 2015 16:14 GMT
#178
On January 07 2015 16:19 outscar wrote:
Ongamenet did a horrible thing by transferring themselves into SCII and forgetting these players. They thought that BW will forgive them? Now, where is that channel, who watches it?

I wonder when Stork will show himself up.


plenty of people watch OGN, it shows LoL and its pretty popular in korea.

BW is all forgiving.
Brood War EICWoo Jung Ho, never forget.| Twitter: @BLinDRawR
[F_]aths
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Germany3947 Posts
January 07 2015 21:56 GMT
#179
On January 05 2015 03:10 PharaphobiaSC2 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 05 2015 02:55 [F_]aths wrote:
On January 04 2015 18:13 PharaphobiaSC2 wrote:
Perfect expample, that Blizzard did terrible job with StarCraft 2! :E but, glad this guy is still around !

A handful of guys who couldn't made a successful transition now proves that new game is terrible?

Can't we get along? Most of us prefer one or the other, but does it follow that the one we don't prefer over the other is terrible?


It's not like that it's becayse SC2 could be completly different game, but when Blizzard completly ignores community (f.e making weird clueless balance patches, making new maps 2 days before new mappool should be released, constantly lying to all the communies on reddit/twiiter etc.) it's what piss most ppl off . Next is that StarCraft development offices are empty for sure since there are still annoying bugs which could be easly fixed. I just dont get it.. they had ton of feedback from BW game made in 1998 and their provided amateurish engine full of bugs which "cannot be fixed because of engine itself". Well than shut down SC2 and make BW remake compatible for Windows 7/8 etc and everyone should be happy

At the end Im just jealous that some peeps have so much effort to make content for sc2 and alot of them are broke or done know because ppl just loosing interest..

If you don't understand the reason for a balance change, it does not mean that is actually clueless. It could be that you know the game not as well as you think.

If you don't do what you said you do you earlier is not necessarily lying. It could be you intended to do it, but changed your mind later because of gameplay considerations or new information.

If you think a bug is easy to fix, it does not mean that it is actually so. I am with a company which develops software and learnt that some things which are looks to be easily fixed are in fact not easy to fix.

If you remake BW, you make the guys happy who like BW but you sold already a game to them. It is maybe wiser to develop a new game.

Overall, you seem to overestimate your level of information and understanding of the new game.
You don't choose to play zerg. The zerg choose you.
[F_]aths
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Germany3947 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-01-07 22:20:06
January 07 2015 22:06 GMT
#180
On January 07 2015 03:02 Kau wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 06 2015 19:56 Cele wrote:
On January 06 2015 02:40 Kau wrote:
On January 05 2015 18:50 PharaphobiaSC2 wrote:
On January 05 2015 18:19 zeo wrote:
On January 05 2015 09:32 Masheyoon wrote:
Amusingly, what happened three years ago appears to be happening now, only it's SC2 that's fading and BW emerging.

The bitterness people feel towards Blizzard is understandable. What Mike Morhaime said directly after the final OSL was appalling (Paraphrased: "Brood War's departure is a good thing and will help pave way for SC2."). Instead of appearing impressive in the eyes of many by having a video game that has stood the test of time, Blizzard now appears greedy, selfish and entirely dumb in the eyes of everyone for killing it off in trying to make SC2 as successful as possible. They could have, you know, continued to support both games.


You made me remember that Morhaime speech

I can't believe people actually think that the Savior fiasco 'killed' BW, yeah it hurt the scene but it come nowhere close to Blizzard actively trying to shut down and hijack the BW esports scene so 'esports' could be used as a marketing tool for SC2.

Edit: On the topic of Effort, I always liked him more than Jaedong.


Can you provide some sources for this? I mena any official annoucments etc. I would love to thorw this in blizzard face


What does this even mean? Throw in Blizzard's face? Don't stir up shit please. Everyone just stop posting about Blizzard and SC2 in this thread.


i think we're eligible to express our opinions on the Blizzard-Kespa-Sc2 themecomplex here, right? It isn't exactly the topic, but of course people discuss how to "interpret" player switches in the light of past events. That "throwing into Blizzards Face remark is out of line i agree, but will there be consequences if people just have a... civil discussion about the subject?
I don't want to annoy you, i would like to clarify for myself, what your position on this subject is.


I don't mind a civil discussion. It's just when posts start getting needlessly antagonistic that I get annoyed. If I read the SC2 forums, I would not want to see posts calling BW an outdated and dead game. Along the same lines, I imagine SC2 regulars that come here do not want to see posts calling SC2 a failure or a dead game.
Yes!

I still cannot really understand the condescending attitude of some. Both incarnations have their value, which is incredible in their own right.

SC2 could simply not exist if BW wouldn't be there. I think one does not need to be a Starcraft fan to admit that Broodwar is one of the best games ever made. And guys like EffOrt brought the game to shine. He even beat Flash.

While BW was the right game for the right time, it is preceded in global popularity by SC2 by now. To attain this, you have do to something right. The mass appeal of SC2 takes nothing away from BW's greatness, it only adds to it.
You don't choose to play zerg. The zerg choose you.
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