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On December 16 2012 00:46 jnd wrote:Mr. Bitter partially saved the cast, he at least knew some of the players from BW days so he could say a bit about them. Show nested quote +On December 16 2012 00:13 creamyturtle wrote:
I watched the stream last night with TB and MrB... it was pretty decent I guess. It felt like an online tournament honestly, because of the weird ghetto camera shots and the less-than-stellar microphone used by Bitter. Yeah, I had similar feeling but there's nothing wrong with headset mic or webcams. It sounds like TB tried to prepare from Liquipedia but Proleague deserves more. Don't get me wrong, both of them aren't bad casters, it just needs someone who is familiar with Proleague/OSL and now GSL too, their players and their history. For years we've been listening to amateurs restreaming and casting from their bedroom but the key thing was those guys knew even the less known players by face, they remembered how well they played in previous season or just in general. They knew the stories, even outside the games, they could guess their chances, they knew the maps and special builds (not so aplicable here since this is SC2 and new maps but it will be more and more important as the seasons goes). Casting Proleague isn't easy job because it's not just another team league, it's league with long history and high prestige, which requires close following and a lot of dedication, I hope casters will be selected according to that. There might even be some combination like pro-caster + knowledgeable community figure. In fact, that would be the best bet, at least for start of the season.
this.
User was warned for this post
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Sounds like a very temporary solution to a problem that goes deeper than just having an english stream.
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Rofl this was basically just thrown together last minute, and you are complaining as if you paid $1000 to watch. If you find one of the casters not knowing Check a deal breaker for you, then watch something else. You can give criticism like "Hey TB, I think it would improve the cast if you familiarize yourself with the players before the matches". That is something constructive. All you are doing is shitting on them, and unfairly at that. Sorry one of the casters didn't know who your precious Check was.
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Awesome stuff! Can't wait to watch sundays matches 
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On December 16 2012 01:14 Sawamura wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2012 23:55 Doodsmack wrote:On December 15 2012 22:21 itsdaniel wrote:I was shocked about the quality of the eng cast today... .) Just because  Action is a KT player, he gets instantly compared to  Flash ??? I think I heard it like 5 times tonight... "Yeah he may not be as good as *insertpowerhousename* but still *insertlowerrankedname* is still a good player!!" .) Most of the time the introduction of newer players or even oldschool BW pros starts kinda like "There's just not enough info about that player in SC2" . .) Pocari being called a "korean drink". .) Woongjin being mispronounced all the time... .) No stories, no real background, just TLPD stats... I will choose the korean stream... You're "shocked" just because of those things? Overdramatic much? Well if you compared to Sayle he would bring up history hype and good commentary . I would be shock too if I wasn't treated to the same standards that previous commentators have been able to establish themselves before TB and Mr bitter.
Then blame TL-EG for picking them to do it, not the casters themselves. You can't expect TB or Bitter to (still) have in depth knowledge on proleague players when they've been quite dedicated to SC2, and pretty much every single proleague player is still a massive unknown in SC2.
I have no problem with the casters chosen, but using a 'heavy rotation of casters' is bad for proleague overall. You need a few dedicated casters that cast most of the matches to create the overlapping storylines, and like this it just won't happen because casters won't know what happened in the games before them. If TL/EG + Kespa are serious about attracting a big foreign audience for proleague, this isn't the way to do it.
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On December 16 2012 00:59 Twisting wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2012 00:44 Proseat wrote:On December 16 2012 00:35 Twisting wrote:Is http://www.twitch.tv/sc2proleague/ the only source for the english vods? Because i can not hear totalbiscuit and mr bitter because of the very loud game sounds! Should improve in the later games. They had some sound problems at the start of the cast I think. Yeah i found them, but i would like to have the entire broadcast. Now it are just sepperate sets with no studio sound, it makes me bind with the games alot less! Just feels like a video with voiceovers, no hype etc.
I know, I would have prefered the entire stream recording in full as well. I hope they will keep them in the future.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=17246296
IEG_Vincent, please read your PMs here on TL.net!
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On December 16 2012 01:02 Talin wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2012 00:08 itsdaniel wrote:On December 15 2012 22:35 oOOoOphidian wrote:On December 15 2012 22:23 Holdinga wrote:Me, too, will choose the korean stream. You guys, I think the OP should include a casual poll which asks which streams will the viewers watch - the korean , or the english with these casters That's really not constructive at all. Watch what you want and give them something to improve on, but they're trying to do something special and you're giving the most obnoxious feedback possible. I'm sorry to quote but I think Holdinga was just enforcing what I said....I mean what was wrong about my points? Check is about to play his game... He was a powerhouse amateur during BW times, even well known online in korea and I remember lots of his replays and TotalBiscuit is referring to him as "this guy right here" ... I mean its just rude....and its obvious that there's no knowledge about the scene at all.... There isn't a single English caster who would know who he is, and really none of them that would know anything about the amateur scene. It's absurd to expect that level of familiarity with the player that has never played a single pro game in his life prior to last week, powerhouse amateur or not.
I'd like to see more stats/background information roles turn up in the scene to be honest because we've seen this a number of times. It's not just a problem for the English casters. Oh no. Last night the Korean team accidentally mistaken SoO. lol
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On December 15 2012 23:55 Doodsmack wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2012 22:21 itsdaniel wrote:I was shocked about the quality of the eng cast today... .) Just because Action is a KT player, he gets instantly compared to Flash ??? I think I heard it like 5 times tonight... "Yeah he may not be as good as *insertpowerhousename* but still *insertlowerrankedname* is still a good player!!" .) Most of the time the introduction of newer players or even oldschool BW pros starts kinda like "There's just not enough info about that player in SC2" . .) Pocari being called a "korean drink". .) Woongjin being mispronounced all the time... .) No stories, no real background, just TLPD stats... I will choose the korean stream... You're "shocked" just because of those things? Overdramatic much?
I am shocked. This sort of "preparation" wouldn't fly in Champions League, which PL is basically on level with.
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On December 16 2012 01:30 Jek wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2012 23:55 Doodsmack wrote:On December 15 2012 22:21 itsdaniel wrote:I was shocked about the quality of the eng cast today... .) Just because Action is a KT player, he gets instantly compared to Flash ??? I think I heard it like 5 times tonight... "Yeah he may not be as good as *insertpowerhousename* but still *insertlowerrankedname* is still a good player!!" .) Most of the time the introduction of newer players or even oldschool BW pros starts kinda like "There's just not enough info about that player in SC2" . .) Pocari being called a "korean drink". .) Woongjin being mispronounced all the time... .) No stories, no real background, just TLPD stats... I will choose the korean stream... You're "shocked" just because of those things? Overdramatic much? I am shocked. This sort of "preparation" wouldn't fly in Champions League, which PL is basically on level with.
This was put together pretty much last minute. What did you expect?
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On December 16 2012 01:36 Serinox wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2012 01:30 Jek wrote:On December 15 2012 23:55 Doodsmack wrote:On December 15 2012 22:21 itsdaniel wrote:I was shocked about the quality of the eng cast today... .) Just because Action is a KT player, he gets instantly compared to Flash ??? I think I heard it like 5 times tonight... "Yeah he may not be as good as *insertpowerhousename* but still *insertlowerrankedname* is still a good player!!" .) Most of the time the introduction of newer players or even oldschool BW pros starts kinda like "There's just not enough info about that player in SC2" . .) Pocari being called a "korean drink". .) Woongjin being mispronounced all the time... .) No stories, no real background, just TLPD stats... I will choose the korean stream... You're "shocked" just because of those things? Overdramatic much? I am shocked. This sort of "preparation" wouldn't fly in Champions League, which PL is basically on level with. This was put together pretty much last minute. What did you expect?
A professional cast.
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On December 16 2012 01:30 Jek wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2012 23:55 Doodsmack wrote:On December 15 2012 22:21 itsdaniel wrote:I was shocked about the quality of the eng cast today... .) Just because Action is a KT player, he gets instantly compared to Flash ??? I think I heard it like 5 times tonight... "Yeah he may not be as good as *insertpowerhousename* but still *insertlowerrankedname* is still a good player!!" .) Most of the time the introduction of newer players or even oldschool BW pros starts kinda like "There's just not enough info about that player in SC2" . .) Pocari being called a "korean drink". .) Woongjin being mispronounced all the time... .) No stories, no real background, just TLPD stats... I will choose the korean stream... You're "shocked" just because of those things? Overdramatic much? I am shocked. This sort of "preparation" wouldn't fly in Champions League, which PL is basically on level with.
Well, it depends on the commentator, usually that's pretty terrible at champions league (at least what I am watching).
I like it better if casters focus more on the game and not the players backstory and other unrelated stuff.
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On December 16 2012 01:05 itsdaniel wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2012 01:02 Talin wrote:On December 16 2012 00:08 itsdaniel wrote:On December 15 2012 22:35 oOOoOphidian wrote:On December 15 2012 22:23 Holdinga wrote:Me, too, will choose the korean stream. You guys, I think the OP should include a casual poll which asks which streams will the viewers watch - the korean , or the english with these casters That's really not constructive at all. Watch what you want and give them something to improve on, but they're trying to do something special and you're giving the most obnoxious feedback possible. I'm sorry to quote but I think Holdinga was just enforcing what I said....I mean what was wrong about my points? Check is about to play his game... He was a powerhouse amateur during BW times, even well known online in korea and I remember lots of his replays and TotalBiscuit is referring to him as "this guy right here" ... I mean its just rude....and its obvious that there's no knowledge about the scene at all.... There isn't a single English caster who would know who he is, and really none of them that would know anything about the amateur scene. It's absurd to expect that level of familiarity with the player that has never played a single pro game in his life prior to last week, powerhouse amateur or not. He already played Proleague...Do you even know what you're saying?
Oh right, I was looking at the games won. Well fine, he played and lost 4 games. Point still stands tbh.
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United States5162 Posts
On December 16 2012 01:36 Serinox wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2012 01:30 Jek wrote:On December 15 2012 23:55 Doodsmack wrote:On December 15 2012 22:21 itsdaniel wrote:I was shocked about the quality of the eng cast today... .) Just because Action is a KT player, he gets instantly compared to Flash ??? I think I heard it like 5 times tonight... "Yeah he may not be as good as *insertpowerhousename* but still *insertlowerrankedname* is still a good player!!" .) Most of the time the introduction of newer players or even oldschool BW pros starts kinda like "There's just not enough info about that player in SC2" . .) Pocari being called a "korean drink". .) Woongjin being mispronounced all the time... .) No stories, no real background, just TLPD stats... I will choose the korean stream... You're "shocked" just because of those things? Overdramatic much? I am shocked. This sort of "preparation" wouldn't fly in Champions League, which PL is basically on level with. This was put together pretty much last minute. What did you expect?
They, and I too, expect top notch broadcasting for the most premiere Esport league(maybe you could argue OSL) in the world. Last night's casting wasn't bad, but it certainly wasn't up to par of what I expect. It feels like any other online tournament with passable production and caster quality. The fact that they put this on last minute is irrelevant, and imo, actually a strike against them because this should have never been a last minute thing. I blame KESPA/proleague more than TL-EG, but they're partners in this so both share the blame.
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I'm actually liking MrBitter the more I see him casting, can't say anything negative about him really. Should get him and RotterdaM to cast to complete their duo though!
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I already asked this but what's the story about Doa and OGN?
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On December 16 2012 01:40 CrazyBirdman wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2012 01:30 Jek wrote:On December 15 2012 23:55 Doodsmack wrote:On December 15 2012 22:21 itsdaniel wrote:I was shocked about the quality of the eng cast today... .) Just because Action is a KT player, he gets instantly compared to Flash ??? I think I heard it like 5 times tonight... "Yeah he may not be as good as *insertpowerhousename* but still *insertlowerrankedname* is still a good player!!" .) Most of the time the introduction of newer players or even oldschool BW pros starts kinda like "There's just not enough info about that player in SC2" . .) Pocari being called a "korean drink". .) Woongjin being mispronounced all the time... .) No stories, no real background, just TLPD stats... I will choose the korean stream... You're "shocked" just because of those things? Overdramatic much? I am shocked. This sort of "preparation" wouldn't fly in Champions League, which PL is basically on level with. Well, it depends on the commentator, usually that's pretty terrible at champions league (at least what I am watching). I like it better if casters focus more on the game and not the players backstory and other unrelated stuff.
I prefer when commentators are capable of doing both. :-P
But maybe I'm just spoiled by our football commentators in Denmark who are usually ex-players or coaches, which obviously know everything about the sport and players. :-)
EDIT: With experience and more time to "study", they will most likely be better with time. But I was far from impressed, looking forward to watch TLO and Adebisi.
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On December 16 2012 01:47 Jek wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2012 01:40 CrazyBirdman wrote:On December 16 2012 01:30 Jek wrote:On December 15 2012 23:55 Doodsmack wrote:On December 15 2012 22:21 itsdaniel wrote:I was shocked about the quality of the eng cast today... .) Just because Action is a KT player, he gets instantly compared to Flash ??? I think I heard it like 5 times tonight... "Yeah he may not be as good as *insertpowerhousename* but still *insertlowerrankedname* is still a good player!!" .) Most of the time the introduction of newer players or even oldschool BW pros starts kinda like "There's just not enough info about that player in SC2" . .) Pocari being called a "korean drink". .) Woongjin being mispronounced all the time... .) No stories, no real background, just TLPD stats... I will choose the korean stream... You're "shocked" just because of those things? Overdramatic much? I am shocked. This sort of "preparation" wouldn't fly in Champions League, which PL is basically on level with. Well, it depends on the commentator, usually that's pretty terrible at champions league (at least what I am watching). I like it better if casters focus more on the game and not the players backstory and other unrelated stuff. I prefer when commentators are capable of doing both. :-P But maybe I'm just spoiled by our football commentators in Denmark who are usually ex-players or coaches, which obviously know everything about the sport and players. :-) EDIT: With experience and more time to "study", they will most likely be better with time. But I was far from impressed, looking forward to watch TLO and Adebisi.
Yes, let's compare football tv production to a video game competition.
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Hey guys what about Jason Lee? Isn't he BW-"educated" ? Does anybody know what he is doing now ?
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On December 16 2012 01:41 Talin wrote:Show nested quote +On December 16 2012 01:05 itsdaniel wrote:On December 16 2012 01:02 Talin wrote:On December 16 2012 00:08 itsdaniel wrote:On December 15 2012 22:35 oOOoOphidian wrote:On December 15 2012 22:23 Holdinga wrote:Me, too, will choose the korean stream. You guys, I think the OP should include a casual poll which asks which streams will the viewers watch - the korean , or the english with these casters That's really not constructive at all. Watch what you want and give them something to improve on, but they're trying to do something special and you're giving the most obnoxious feedback possible. I'm sorry to quote but I think Holdinga was just enforcing what I said....I mean what was wrong about my points? Check is about to play his game... He was a powerhouse amateur during BW times, even well known online in korea and I remember lots of his replays and TotalBiscuit is referring to him as "this guy right here" ... I mean its just rude....and its obvious that there's no knowledge about the scene at all.... There isn't a single English caster who would know who he is, and really none of them that would know anything about the amateur scene. It's absurd to expect that level of familiarity with the player that has never played a single pro game in his life prior to last week, powerhouse amateur or not. He already played Proleague...Do you even know what you're saying? Oh right, I was looking at the games won. Well fine, he played and lost 4 games. Point still stands tbh.
Thats ur point? Saying that he never played a single pro game in his life? So what should he have done? Winning an OSL at least?
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This was obviously thrown together at the last minute. It's free (or $5 for HD, I think). You're not getting full-time casters devoted just to this league. It's not GSL. I know the history of proleague makes everyone want a real top-notch production, but it's just there yet. Take what you can get. Mr. Bitter and (especially) TotalBiscuit aren't my favorite casters, but they did a solid job. They picked SC2 casters rather than BW people because they valued good understanding of gameplay over detailed historical knowledge of the players. That seems totally realistic to me. I agree that Sayle would be great, and I am definitely looking forward to TLO-Adebisi (that's going to be an amazingly good pair), but stop with the constant criticism.
On more productive matters: Can we get a spoiler-free way to watch vods? (Just twitch vods embedded in a liquipedia page would be fine.) Also, the caster audio, especially on the last vod, seems to be very out of sync with the game. Not sure if that happened during the broadcast or just on the vod, though.
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EPT
