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In the UK sports are very politicised, though mainly around class. I don't see why it would be different in America.
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On September 26 2017 04:23 Simberto wrote:Show nested quote +On September 26 2017 04:16 xDaunt wrote:
@GH -- Of course I'm not going to stop using that argument. I know it's right and, judging by the muted responses that I get from people around here, effective. People (Or at least me) have just gotten really tired of you. How can you say that people don't want to link sports and politics if you have that gigantic nationalistic flag and hymn thing at the start of your sports? If that isn't politics, i don't know what would be. I guess the trick is to simply define everything you want as "not politic", which means it is fine to put into basically anything, and everything other people want that conflicts with that as "politic", which means that they are only allowed to voice that opinion in the exact way that you prefer, but which you also refuse to actually state, so any time someone voices their problems with something that you do not agree with, you can simply deflect on the way that they are voicing that opinion in, and thus avoid having to talk about the actual underlying issues. Putting a shroud over statues is just too horrible. Kneeling during an anthem? OMG how dare they!!!
Since when are nationalism and patriotism divisive political issues on the order of race relations? And y'all on the left wonder why we on the right question your patriotism....
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I don't consider the entire Right in this country to be composed of racists. A lot of people hold a right-leaning ideology for racist reasons, but that isn't a projection onto everyone who considers themselves of the Right. It's difficult to never do or say a racist thing in your life, it's very easy to not know better about a subject and it slips out, but it could also be more malicious. Point is, it's not some tar on your permanent record, that haunts you wherever you go, it's something you simply need to be able to acknowledge and improve when it happens. And being able to have the conversation includes being able to call out when something is actually racist, or has racist undertones.
Telling the NFL players who protested to get back in their lane and entertain their audience has racist undertones, because they're baring their soul and identity to protest racial injustice(not the flag, Trump). And the moment they were told that they absolutely must salute the flag in the proper way, or they should be fired, it was made political. The fight was started by the people who got upset with the protest to begin with.
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Edit: actually, let's not. Thread's going bad enough as is.
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yep, agree that the silence is more indicative of those who choose not to waste time with your thoughts on the matter.
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On September 26 2017 04:25 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On September 26 2017 04:23 Simberto wrote:On September 26 2017 04:16 xDaunt wrote:
@GH -- Of course I'm not going to stop using that argument. I know it's right and, judging by the muted responses that I get from people around here, effective. People (Or at least me) have just gotten really tired of you. How can you say that people don't want to link sports and politics if you have that gigantic nationalistic flag and hymn thing at the start of your sports? If that isn't politics, i don't know what would be. I guess the trick is to simply define everything you want as "not politic", which means it is fine to put into basically anything, and everything other people want that conflicts with that as "politic", which means that they are only allowed to voice that opinion in the exact way that you prefer, but which you also refuse to actually state, so any time someone voices their problems with something that you do not agree with, you can simply deflect on the way that they are voicing that opinion in, and thus avoid having to talk about the actual underlying issues. Putting a shroud over statues is just too horrible. Kneeling during an anthem? OMG how dare they!!! Since when are nationalism and patriotism divisive political issues on the order of race relations? And y'all on the left wonder why we on the right question your patriotism....
This is why we need white history week....
ALWAYS xDaunt (haha), ALWAYS!
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On September 26 2017 04:16 xDaunt wrote:
@GH -- Of course I'm not going to stop using that argument. I know it's right and, judging by the muted responses that I get from people around here, effective.
You see people not reacting to your umpteenth time saying you can't accept terms of discourse that hurt your feelings as them condoning it?
It's just very apparent that unless you're in a black person's skin for a whole you'll never understand the position gh and others are coming from.
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On September 26 2017 04:14 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On September 26 2017 04:11 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 04:09 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 26 2017 02:54 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 02:52 Emnjay808 wrote:
I was wondering why the NFL thread hardly had any political talk, but it was all here lol. Now I got something to distract me from studying o/ Like I said last night, people generally don't want to mix sports and politics. And this is one of the reasons why the NFL is going to be the big loser in all of this. STOP SPREADING THIS LIE! It's ridiculous and obnoxious, and at this point I know you know it's not true but you keep repeating it anyway. Stop! You should go comfort all of the NFL owners who are shitting themselves over this political mess that they have gotten themselves into. Fine, if you stop repeating this trash lie. Show nested quote +On September 26 2017 03:37 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 03:35 Artisreal wrote:On September 26 2017 03:32 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 03:30 kollin wrote:On September 26 2017 03:23 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 03:18 kollin wrote:On September 26 2017 03:09 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 03:04 Mohdoo wrote:On September 26 2017 02:54 xDaunt wrote:
[quote]
Like I said last night, people generally don't want to mix sports and politics. And this is one of the reasons why the NFL is going to be the big loser in all of this. Viewers don't want to be confronted with these ethics issues while watching sports. But the athletes themselves have identities and personalities and have shown a willingness to express their beliefs. No matter what job someone is doing, they are still a human and should not be silenced or discouraged from speaking out. It keeps feeling like some people see sports like the military or something. Like these guys are expected to be stoic or something. There are a few things at work here. First, people don't want to be bombarded with politics in their entertainment unless they're actively seeking politics out. Second, the message at issue here is a particularly toxic one that people really don't want to be beaten over the head with. Average Joe Whitey doesn't want to hear people tell him that his country is racist, which necessarily implies that he is racist. Third, Average Joe Whitey really doesn't want to hear this message from a bunch of patently privileged sports athletes who earn millions of dollars per year and, for all intents and purposes, live in fantasy land. The problem to me is that people see an accusation of racism as an irremovable stain on their character, rather than something that also isn't really their fault, just something that they should acknowledge and try to improve. If a black person says they feel discriminated against, there is no reason - not even wealth - to disbelieve them. Of course people see it as a stain on their character rather than just another adjective. Look at how the Left uses the term for its political purposes. Look at how Leftist posters use the term around here. The intent is clearly defamatory, and the response from anyone to whom the Left tries to attach this label rightfully will be somewhere between "fuck you" and "I hope you get run over by a bus." Where 'the Left' (possibly the worst of the all-encompassing generalisation made) call someone racist, it is fairly often because they are. Sometimes they are not racist, and 'the Left' (whatever this means) is mistaken, but that's OK because if no one is allowed to call anyone racist, which is surely the alternative, then racism will never get called out. If 'the Left' (in this case the people kneeling) protest structural racism, then they have called the system racist which we can, with some thought, establish as a nuanced criticism of both our institutions and individuals within society. Its not an insult to anyone, just an observation. Just because Joe Whitey is too sensitive to accept that observation doesn't mean it isn't true. Do you think that 40%+ of the country is racist? That's the argument that is being advanced by the Left and many posters here. That is a very clear overuse of the term. It's very clear that your usage of racism is very apologetic towards perpetrators so feel free to accept differing opinions on that one. Of course I'm going to be apologetic towards the "racists" when the entire republican party and all conservatives/right-wingers are being labeled "racists." It's a patently absurd use of the term. And I find it very telling that y'all won't concede either that this is an overuse of the term or that this use of the term has a negative impact on discourse. This is such trash I'm pretty sick of seeing it. The racism has a negative impact on the discourse, the term just upsets too many on the right's white fragility.
Sorry dude, you're definitely reaching by trying to paint with a broad brush and labeling far too many of the "others" as racist. Not at all productive and while I do think you believe what you say, I hope you realize how absurd this "all the bad people are just racist" crusade is. You grind the term down into meaninglessness.
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On September 26 2017 04:30 LegalLord wrote:Show nested quote +On September 26 2017 04:14 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 26 2017 04:11 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 04:09 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 26 2017 02:54 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 02:52 Emnjay808 wrote:
I was wondering why the NFL thread hardly had any political talk, but it was all here lol. Now I got something to distract me from studying o/ Like I said last night, people generally don't want to mix sports and politics. And this is one of the reasons why the NFL is going to be the big loser in all of this. STOP SPREADING THIS LIE! It's ridiculous and obnoxious, and at this point I know you know it's not true but you keep repeating it anyway. Stop! You should go comfort all of the NFL owners who are shitting themselves over this political mess that they have gotten themselves into. Fine, if you stop repeating this trash lie. On September 26 2017 03:37 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 03:35 Artisreal wrote:On September 26 2017 03:32 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 03:30 kollin wrote:On September 26 2017 03:23 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 03:18 kollin wrote:On September 26 2017 03:09 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 03:04 Mohdoo wrote:
[quote]
Viewers don't want to be confronted with these ethics issues while watching sports. But the athletes themselves have identities and personalities and have shown a willingness to express their beliefs. No matter what job someone is doing, they are still a human and should not be silenced or discouraged from speaking out.
It keeps feeling like some people see sports like the military or something. Like these guys are expected to be stoic or something. There are a few things at work here. First, people don't want to be bombarded with politics in their entertainment unless they're actively seeking politics out. Second, the message at issue here is a particularly toxic one that people really don't want to be beaten over the head with. Average Joe Whitey doesn't want to hear people tell him that his country is racist, which necessarily implies that he is racist. Third, Average Joe Whitey really doesn't want to hear this message from a bunch of patently privileged sports athletes who earn millions of dollars per year and, for all intents and purposes, live in fantasy land. The problem to me is that people see an accusation of racism as an irremovable stain on their character, rather than something that also isn't really their fault, just something that they should acknowledge and try to improve. If a black person says they feel discriminated against, there is no reason - not even wealth - to disbelieve them. Of course people see it as a stain on their character rather than just another adjective. Look at how the Left uses the term for its political purposes. Look at how Leftist posters use the term around here. The intent is clearly defamatory, and the response from anyone to whom the Left tries to attach this label rightfully will be somewhere between "fuck you" and "I hope you get run over by a bus." Where 'the Left' (possibly the worst of the all-encompassing generalisation made) call someone racist, it is fairly often because they are. Sometimes they are not racist, and 'the Left' (whatever this means) is mistaken, but that's OK because if no one is allowed to call anyone racist, which is surely the alternative, then racism will never get called out. If 'the Left' (in this case the people kneeling) protest structural racism, then they have called the system racist which we can, with some thought, establish as a nuanced criticism of both our institutions and individuals within society. Its not an insult to anyone, just an observation. Just because Joe Whitey is too sensitive to accept that observation doesn't mean it isn't true. Do you think that 40%+ of the country is racist? That's the argument that is being advanced by the Left and many posters here. That is a very clear overuse of the term. It's very clear that your usage of racism is very apologetic towards perpetrators so feel free to accept differing opinions on that one. Of course I'm going to be apologetic towards the "racists" when the entire republican party and all conservatives/right-wingers are being labeled "racists." It's a patently absurd use of the term. And I find it very telling that y'all won't concede either that this is an overuse of the term or that this use of the term has a negative impact on discourse. This is such trash I'm pretty sick of seeing it. The racism has a negative impact on the discourse, the term just upsets too many on the right's white fragility. Sorry dude, you're definitely reaching by trying to paint with a broad brush and labeling far too many of the "others" as racist. Not at all productive and while I do think you believe what you say, I hope you realize how absurd this "all the bad people are just racist" crusade is. You grind the term down into meaninglessness.
Oh my god that so clearly isn't what he's saying or doing this debate is actually unbearable.
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On September 26 2017 04:10 brian wrote:Show nested quote +On September 26 2017 04:07 LegalLord wrote:On September 26 2017 04:05 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
You go LeBron! Power to the people! did you see Trumps clap back at the GSW with ‘The penguins have been invited and they’re coming!’ you got em good man. the 100% white team in the whitest sport in america didn’t have their invitation revoked and that really gets your point across about how it’s not about race. like even if i wanted to take his word for it that it’s not about race for him, and i’ll admit i don’t, how could I?
Really, it's the hyperbole that bothers me. Trump may be a dumbass with no sense of tact but LeBron is ever so slightly reaching with what is essentially a ever so subtle call for revolution. So why not just say it outright?
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On September 26 2017 04:30 LegalLord wrote:Show nested quote +On September 26 2017 04:14 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 26 2017 04:11 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 04:09 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 26 2017 02:54 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 02:52 Emnjay808 wrote:
I was wondering why the NFL thread hardly had any political talk, but it was all here lol. Now I got something to distract me from studying o/ Like I said last night, people generally don't want to mix sports and politics. And this is one of the reasons why the NFL is going to be the big loser in all of this. STOP SPREADING THIS LIE! It's ridiculous and obnoxious, and at this point I know you know it's not true but you keep repeating it anyway. Stop! You should go comfort all of the NFL owners who are shitting themselves over this political mess that they have gotten themselves into. Fine, if you stop repeating this trash lie. On September 26 2017 03:37 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 03:35 Artisreal wrote:On September 26 2017 03:32 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 03:30 kollin wrote:On September 26 2017 03:23 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 03:18 kollin wrote:On September 26 2017 03:09 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 03:04 Mohdoo wrote:
[quote]
Viewers don't want to be confronted with these ethics issues while watching sports. But the athletes themselves have identities and personalities and have shown a willingness to express their beliefs. No matter what job someone is doing, they are still a human and should not be silenced or discouraged from speaking out.
It keeps feeling like some people see sports like the military or something. Like these guys are expected to be stoic or something. There are a few things at work here. First, people don't want to be bombarded with politics in their entertainment unless they're actively seeking politics out. Second, the message at issue here is a particularly toxic one that people really don't want to be beaten over the head with. Average Joe Whitey doesn't want to hear people tell him that his country is racist, which necessarily implies that he is racist. Third, Average Joe Whitey really doesn't want to hear this message from a bunch of patently privileged sports athletes who earn millions of dollars per year and, for all intents and purposes, live in fantasy land. The problem to me is that people see an accusation of racism as an irremovable stain on their character, rather than something that also isn't really their fault, just something that they should acknowledge and try to improve. If a black person says they feel discriminated against, there is no reason - not even wealth - to disbelieve them. Of course people see it as a stain on their character rather than just another adjective. Look at how the Left uses the term for its political purposes. Look at how Leftist posters use the term around here. The intent is clearly defamatory, and the response from anyone to whom the Left tries to attach this label rightfully will be somewhere between "fuck you" and "I hope you get run over by a bus." Where 'the Left' (possibly the worst of the all-encompassing generalisation made) call someone racist, it is fairly often because they are. Sometimes they are not racist, and 'the Left' (whatever this means) is mistaken, but that's OK because if no one is allowed to call anyone racist, which is surely the alternative, then racism will never get called out. If 'the Left' (in this case the people kneeling) protest structural racism, then they have called the system racist which we can, with some thought, establish as a nuanced criticism of both our institutions and individuals within society. Its not an insult to anyone, just an observation. Just because Joe Whitey is too sensitive to accept that observation doesn't mean it isn't true. Do you think that 40%+ of the country is racist? That's the argument that is being advanced by the Left and many posters here. That is a very clear overuse of the term. It's very clear that your usage of racism is very apologetic towards perpetrators so feel free to accept differing opinions on that one. Of course I'm going to be apologetic towards the "racists" when the entire republican party and all conservatives/right-wingers are being labeled "racists." It's a patently absurd use of the term. And I find it very telling that y'all won't concede either that this is an overuse of the term or that this use of the term has a negative impact on discourse. This is such trash I'm pretty sick of seeing it. The racism has a negative impact on the discourse, the term just upsets too many on the right's white fragility. Sorry dude, you're definitely reaching by trying to paint with a broad brush and labeling far too many of the "others" as racist. Not at all productive and while I do think you believe what you say, I hope you realize how absurd this "all the bad people are just racist" crusade is. You grind the term down into meaninglessness.
This is also dumb, I have on several occasions admitted I have done/said racist things, it's a mass delusion that seems to be preventing so many on the right (and plenty on the left) from doing the same and actually trying to improve the situation.
Sorry, no get out of white supremacy free card for those who want to blame being called names for standing idle in the face of the constitution they claim to hold dear being regularly and systemically violated when it comes to PoC rights.
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On September 26 2017 04:28 Artisreal wrote:Show nested quote +On September 26 2017 04:16 xDaunt wrote:
@GH -- Of course I'm not going to stop using that argument. I know it's right and, judging by the muted responses that I get from people around here, effective. You see people not reacting to your umpteenth time saying you can't accept terms of discourse that hurt your feelings as them condoning it? It's just very apparent that unless you're in a black person's skin for a whole you'll never understand the position gh and others are coming from.
Looks like you and a bunch of other people need to learn what a "muted response" is. Here's a hint -- there's a reason why I didn't say "no response."
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I think a problem that becomes very apparent in this thread is that everyone on the Right thinks everyone on the Left is calling everyone on the Right a racist. To actually be able to have this conversation, you first need the Left to not label everything as racist, but you also need the Right to stop victimizing themselves and claiming everyone thinks that they're all racists. In this thread at least, the number of Right-wingers claiming that the Left is labeling them all as racists well outnumbers anyone who is actually saying that everyone on the Right is a racist. I haven't seen anyone make that claim recently, and I don't think it's a healthy one to make. But I also think it's incorrect for the conservatives in this thread to be obsessing over the idea so much. It reaches a point where it distracts from the ability to actually talk about what is and isn't racist in current events, which doesn't help anything.
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On September 26 2017 04:32 kollin wrote:Show nested quote +On September 26 2017 04:30 LegalLord wrote:On September 26 2017 04:14 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 26 2017 04:11 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 04:09 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 26 2017 02:54 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 02:52 Emnjay808 wrote:
I was wondering why the NFL thread hardly had any political talk, but it was all here lol. Now I got something to distract me from studying o/ Like I said last night, people generally don't want to mix sports and politics. And this is one of the reasons why the NFL is going to be the big loser in all of this. STOP SPREADING THIS LIE! It's ridiculous and obnoxious, and at this point I know you know it's not true but you keep repeating it anyway. Stop! You should go comfort all of the NFL owners who are shitting themselves over this political mess that they have gotten themselves into. Fine, if you stop repeating this trash lie. On September 26 2017 03:37 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 03:35 Artisreal wrote:On September 26 2017 03:32 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 03:30 kollin wrote:On September 26 2017 03:23 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 03:18 kollin wrote:On September 26 2017 03:09 xDaunt wrote:
[quote]
There are a few things at work here. First, people don't want to be bombarded with politics in their entertainment unless they're actively seeking politics out. Second, the message at issue here is a particularly toxic one that people really don't want to be beaten over the head with. Average Joe Whitey doesn't want to hear people tell him that his country is racist, which necessarily implies that he is racist. Third, Average Joe Whitey really doesn't want to hear this message from a bunch of patently privileged sports athletes who earn millions of dollars per year and, for all intents and purposes, live in fantasy land. The problem to me is that people see an accusation of racism as an irremovable stain on their character, rather than something that also isn't really their fault, just something that they should acknowledge and try to improve. If a black person says they feel discriminated against, there is no reason - not even wealth - to disbelieve them. Of course people see it as a stain on their character rather than just another adjective. Look at how the Left uses the term for its political purposes. Look at how Leftist posters use the term around here. The intent is clearly defamatory, and the response from anyone to whom the Left tries to attach this label rightfully will be somewhere between "fuck you" and "I hope you get run over by a bus." Where 'the Left' (possibly the worst of the all-encompassing generalisation made) call someone racist, it is fairly often because they are. Sometimes they are not racist, and 'the Left' (whatever this means) is mistaken, but that's OK because if no one is allowed to call anyone racist, which is surely the alternative, then racism will never get called out. If 'the Left' (in this case the people kneeling) protest structural racism, then they have called the system racist which we can, with some thought, establish as a nuanced criticism of both our institutions and individuals within society. Its not an insult to anyone, just an observation. Just because Joe Whitey is too sensitive to accept that observation doesn't mean it isn't true. Do you think that 40%+ of the country is racist? That's the argument that is being advanced by the Left and many posters here. That is a very clear overuse of the term. It's very clear that your usage of racism is very apologetic towards perpetrators so feel free to accept differing opinions on that one. Of course I'm going to be apologetic towards the "racists" when the entire republican party and all conservatives/right-wingers are being labeled "racists." It's a patently absurd use of the term. And I find it very telling that y'all won't concede either that this is an overuse of the term or that this use of the term has a negative impact on discourse. This is such trash I'm pretty sick of seeing it. The racism has a negative impact on the discourse, the term just upsets too many on the right's white fragility. Sorry dude, you're definitely reaching by trying to paint with a broad brush and labeling far too many of the "others" as racist. Not at all productive and while I do think you believe what you say, I hope you realize how absurd this "all the bad people are just racist" crusade is. You grind the term down into meaninglessness. Oh my god that so clearly isn't what he's saying or doing this debate is actually unbearable.
This debate about the sports protest and the statues is unbearable I agree.
On September 26 2017 04:35 NewSunshine wrote:
I think a problem that becomes very apparent in this thread is that everyone on the Right thinks everyone on the Left is calling everyone on the Right a racist. To actually be able to have this conversation, you first need the Left to not label everything as racist, but you also need the Right to stop victimizing themselves and claiming everyone thinks that they're all racists. In this thread at least, the number of Right-wingers claiming that the Left is labeling them all as racists well outnumbers anyone who is actually saying that everyone on the Right is a racist. I haven't seen anyone make that claim recently, and I don't think it's a healthy one to make. But I also think it's incorrect for the conservatives in this thread to be obsessing over the idea so much. It reaches a point where it distracts from the ability to actually talk about what is and isn't racist in current events, which doesn't help anything.
We've gone well over the difference between what the right considers being called racist and what the left doesn't consider callings someone racist is.
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On September 26 2017 04:35 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On September 26 2017 04:28 Artisreal wrote:On September 26 2017 04:16 xDaunt wrote:
@GH -- Of course I'm not going to stop using that argument. I know it's right and, judging by the muted responses that I get from people around here, effective. You see people not reacting to your umpteenth time saying you can't accept terms of discourse that hurt your feelings as them condoning it? It's just very apparent that unless you're in a black person's skin for a whole you'll never understand the position gh and others are coming from. Looks like you and a bunch of other people need to learn what a "muted response" is. Here's a hint -- there's a reason why I didn't say "no response."
No, you need to learn that your argument is trash and people are sick of seeing treated as a remotely sensible/informed position.
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On September 26 2017 04:36 Sermokala wrote:Show nested quote +On September 26 2017 04:32 kollin wrote:On September 26 2017 04:30 LegalLord wrote:On September 26 2017 04:14 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 26 2017 04:11 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 04:09 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 26 2017 02:54 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 02:52 Emnjay808 wrote:
I was wondering why the NFL thread hardly had any political talk, but it was all here lol. Now I got something to distract me from studying o/ Like I said last night, people generally don't want to mix sports and politics. And this is one of the reasons why the NFL is going to be the big loser in all of this. STOP SPREADING THIS LIE! It's ridiculous and obnoxious, and at this point I know you know it's not true but you keep repeating it anyway. Stop! You should go comfort all of the NFL owners who are shitting themselves over this political mess that they have gotten themselves into. Fine, if you stop repeating this trash lie. On September 26 2017 03:37 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 03:35 Artisreal wrote:On September 26 2017 03:32 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 03:30 kollin wrote:On September 26 2017 03:23 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 03:18 kollin wrote:
[quote]
The problem to me is that people see an accusation of racism as an irremovable stain on their character, rather than something that also isn't really their fault, just something that they should acknowledge and try to improve. If a black person says they feel discriminated against, there is no reason - not even wealth - to disbelieve them. Of course people see it as a stain on their character rather than just another adjective. Look at how the Left uses the term for its political purposes. Look at how Leftist posters use the term around here. The intent is clearly defamatory, and the response from anyone to whom the Left tries to attach this label rightfully will be somewhere between "fuck you" and "I hope you get run over by a bus." Where 'the Left' (possibly the worst of the all-encompassing generalisation made) call someone racist, it is fairly often because they are. Sometimes they are not racist, and 'the Left' (whatever this means) is mistaken, but that's OK because if no one is allowed to call anyone racist, which is surely the alternative, then racism will never get called out. If 'the Left' (in this case the people kneeling) protest structural racism, then they have called the system racist which we can, with some thought, establish as a nuanced criticism of both our institutions and individuals within society. Its not an insult to anyone, just an observation. Just because Joe Whitey is too sensitive to accept that observation doesn't mean it isn't true. Do you think that 40%+ of the country is racist? That's the argument that is being advanced by the Left and many posters here. That is a very clear overuse of the term. It's very clear that your usage of racism is very apologetic towards perpetrators so feel free to accept differing opinions on that one. Of course I'm going to be apologetic towards the "racists" when the entire republican party and all conservatives/right-wingers are being labeled "racists." It's a patently absurd use of the term. And I find it very telling that y'all won't concede either that this is an overuse of the term or that this use of the term has a negative impact on discourse. This is such trash I'm pretty sick of seeing it. The racism has a negative impact on the discourse, the term just upsets too many on the right's white fragility. Sorry dude, you're definitely reaching by trying to paint with a broad brush and labeling far too many of the "others" as racist. Not at all productive and while I do think you believe what you say, I hope you realize how absurd this "all the bad people are just racist" crusade is. You grind the term down into meaninglessness. Oh my god that so clearly isn't what he's saying or doing this debate is actually unbearable. This debate about the sports protest and the statues is unbearable I agree.
True enough. Probably a good time to bow out.
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I couldn't care less whether or not some NFL millionaires are taking a knee during the national anthem...
The sole purpose of Trump's latest brain fart is to distract from this sorry excuse of a healthcare bill, they're gonna vote for this week and quite frankly it baffles me, how everyone seems to go for Trump's bait.
(I know that's a long sentence, but I love commas  )
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On September 26 2017 04:37 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On September 26 2017 04:35 xDaunt wrote:On September 26 2017 04:28 Artisreal wrote:On September 26 2017 04:16 xDaunt wrote:
@GH -- Of course I'm not going to stop using that argument. I know it's right and, judging by the muted responses that I get from people around here, effective. You see people not reacting to your umpteenth time saying you can't accept terms of discourse that hurt your feelings as them condoning it? It's just very apparent that unless you're in a black person's skin for a whole you'll never understand the position gh and others are coming from. Looks like you and a bunch of other people need to learn what a "muted response" is. Here's a hint -- there's a reason why I didn't say "no response." No, you need to learn that your argument is trash and people are sick of seeing treated as a remotely sensible/informed position.
I have yet to see a good explanation for why the argument is "trash." Perhaps it got lost in all of the posts like yours.
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On September 26 2017 04:34 LegalLord wrote:Show nested quote +On September 26 2017 04:10 brian wrote:On September 26 2017 04:07 LegalLord wrote:You go LeBron! Power to the people! did you see Trumps clap back at the GSW with ‘The penguins have been invited and they’re coming!’ you got em good man. the 100% white team in the whitest sport in america didn’t have their invitation revoked and that really gets your point across about how it’s not about race. like even if i wanted to take his word for it that it’s not about race for him, and i’ll admit i don’t, how could I? Really, it's the hyperbole that bothers me. Trump may be a dumbass with no sense of tact but LeBron is ever so slightly reaching with what is essentially a ever so subtle call for revolution. So why not just say it outright?
Maybe you're ever so subtly projecting. I see no such call for revolution. I see a call for solidarity among Americans, made with far more understanding and tact than anything that has ever left Trump's mouth. I honestly don't see what the problem is with what he said, it was very well put.
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On September 26 2017 04:40 thePunGun wrote:I couldn't care less whether or not some NFL millionaires are taking a knee during the national anthem... The sole purpose of Trump's latest brain fart is to distract from this sorry excuse of a healthcare bill, they're gonna vote for this week and quite frankly it baffles me, how everyone seems to go for Trump's bait. (I know that's a long sentence, but I love commas )
Well the healthcare bill is basically a foregone conclusion at this point. It's dead and we've all pretty much accepted Obamacare as the norm of the moment.
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EPT
