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US Politics Mega-thread - Page 8717

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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.

In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up!

NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious.
Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action.
Logo
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States7542 Posts
September 12 2017 17:17 GMT
#174321
On September 13 2017 02:11 Plansix wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2017 02:05 Mohdoo wrote:
On September 13 2017 02:04 LegalLord wrote:
On September 13 2017 01:59 Mohdoo wrote:
What do people think about senator Merkley running for president? He's got a great review from me, but I am curious what others think. He's in Iowa right now, so he definitely seems like he's going that direction.

A cursory view yields a fairly positive view. Don't know or care to research his history though.

He's also co-sponsoring Bernie's healthcare bill. It's funny to see how suddenly everyone wants to ride the Bernie train.

Bernie won in the end, but he now has to make the deal with the rest of the democratic party. This is how minds and politics are changed. Progress does not come in huge leaps, but through a slow grind.

Show nested quote +
On September 13 2017 02:09 Logo wrote:
On September 13 2017 02:05 Mohdoo wrote:
On September 13 2017 02:04 LegalLord wrote:
On September 13 2017 01:59 Mohdoo wrote:
What do people think about senator Merkley running for president? He's got a great review from me, but I am curious what others think. He's in Iowa right now, so he definitely seems like he's going that direction.

A cursory view yields a fairly positive view. Don't know or care to research his history though.

He's also co-sponsoring Bernie's healthcare bill. It's funny to see how suddenly everyone wants to ride the Bernie train.


I'm curious how many people would actually be sponsoring it if it had any sort of chance of passing.

It would be the ACA hearings 2.0, but without a super majority. We are a very long way from getting anything like this through the senate.


Well what I mean is I wonder how many senators are quick to sign on because they know it's symbolic so they can say they support it and score points but without ever having to defend the bill or lose much face with the lobbyists who don't want to see this type of healthcare come about.
Logo
brian
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States9643 Posts
September 12 2017 17:19 GMT
#174322
gotta wonder why an editor would let a comparison to cersei lannister slide. like how are you going to get more work doing that? certainly nobody wants to be compared to cersei lannister. that's just stupidity.
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
September 12 2017 17:22 GMT
#174323
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
Sadist
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
United States7328 Posts
September 12 2017 17:27 GMT
#174324
Please stop calling it Single Payer! Its going to screw up the message!
How do you go from where you are to where you want to be? I think you have to have an enthusiasm for life. You have to have a dream, a goal and you have to be willing to work for it. Jim Valvano
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
September 12 2017 17:28 GMT
#174325
On September 13 2017 02:19 brian wrote:
gotta wonder why an editor would let a comparison to cersei lannister slide. like how are you going to get more work doing that? certainly nobody wants to be compared to cersei lannister. that's just stupidity.

The quote is terrible, but I can see how it slipped by. Cersei is a complex villain that has very human motivation, including trying to protect her children in a world where she doesn’t get to make her own decision. Like that she can’t even choose who to marry. And a lot of critics watching the show note that she is hated more than her father, who openly pushes his family to being terrible people to gain power. A lot of women critics say she is a terrible person, but a very believable villain for many women who understand exactly where she is coming from.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15743 Posts
September 12 2017 17:29 GMT
#174326
On September 13 2017 02:27 Sadist wrote:
Please stop calling it Single Payer! Its going to screw up the message!


Isn't medicare for all just another way to say single payer?
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
September 12 2017 17:32 GMT
#174327
On September 13 2017 02:29 Mohdoo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2017 02:27 Sadist wrote:
Please stop calling it Single Payer! Its going to screw up the message!


Isn't medicare for all just another way to say single payer?

Yep. Also, Obamacare is the ACA.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
LegalLord
Profile Blog Joined April 2013
United States13779 Posts
September 12 2017 17:34 GMT
#174328
On September 13 2017 02:13 Nevuk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2017 02:08 LegalLord wrote:
On September 13 2017 02:05 Mohdoo wrote:
On September 13 2017 02:04 LegalLord wrote:
On September 13 2017 01:59 Mohdoo wrote:
What do people think about senator Merkley running for president? He's got a great review from me, but I am curious what others think. He's in Iowa right now, so he definitely seems like he's going that direction.

A cursory view yields a fairly positive view. Don't know or care to research his history though.

He's also co-sponsoring Bernie's healthcare bill. It's funny to see how suddenly everyone wants to ride the Bernie train.

The more Hillary talks, the more Democrats see that that faux-pragmatic "centrism" is a loser's game. If Democrats jump off that game it's prudence more than anything else.

Her book is turning into a goldmine of ridiculous quotes


Are you sure you're not just taking full pages of her out of context?
History will sooner or later sweep the European Union away without mercy.
Sadist
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
United States7328 Posts
September 12 2017 17:37 GMT
#174329
On September 13 2017 02:29 Mohdoo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2017 02:27 Sadist wrote:
Please stop calling it Single Payer! Its going to screw up the message!


Isn't medicare for all just another way to say single payer?




Alot of Americans have no idea wtf single payer means. It gives republicans room to spin it as big government and death panels and tons of other shit.

Medicare is already around and has a pretty good reputation. It also is harder to spin against when we already have it for seniors so people are more familiar with it.


Democrats suck at branding. Looks like they are trying to get this right but I am worried they will screw it up somehow.
How do you go from where you are to where you want to be? I think you have to have an enthusiasm for life. You have to have a dream, a goal and you have to be willing to work for it. Jim Valvano
LegalLord
Profile Blog Joined April 2013
United States13779 Posts
September 12 2017 17:38 GMT
#174330
On September 13 2017 02:27 Sadist wrote:
Please stop calling it Single Payer! Its going to screw up the message!

Look, I would call it UHC if that term weren't shitted on by association with "socialism." Because frankly UHC is what I want.
History will sooner or later sweep the European Union away without mercy.
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18869 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-09-12 17:46:16
September 12 2017 17:46 GMT
#174331
Using Medicare as the entryway prototype for an eventual American universal healthcare system is the best way to go about doing this, I think, so let's hope they stick to the message and this thing snowballs
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
September 12 2017 17:49 GMT
#174332
On September 13 2017 02:34 LegalLord wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2017 02:13 Nevuk wrote:
On September 13 2017 02:08 LegalLord wrote:
On September 13 2017 02:05 Mohdoo wrote:
On September 13 2017 02:04 LegalLord wrote:
On September 13 2017 01:59 Mohdoo wrote:
What do people think about senator Merkley running for president? He's got a great review from me, but I am curious what others think. He's in Iowa right now, so he definitely seems like he's going that direction.

A cursory view yields a fairly positive view. Don't know or care to research his history though.

He's also co-sponsoring Bernie's healthcare bill. It's funny to see how suddenly everyone wants to ride the Bernie train.

The more Hillary talks, the more Democrats see that that faux-pragmatic "centrism" is a loser's game. If Democrats jump off that game it's prudence more than anything else.

Her book is turning into a goldmine of ridiculous quotes

https://twitter.com/charliespiering/status/907587984983289861

Are you sure you're not just taking full pages of her out of context?


It's her book...
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
September 12 2017 17:54 GMT
#174333
On September 13 2017 02:49 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2017 02:34 LegalLord wrote:
On September 13 2017 02:13 Nevuk wrote:
On September 13 2017 02:08 LegalLord wrote:
On September 13 2017 02:05 Mohdoo wrote:
On September 13 2017 02:04 LegalLord wrote:
On September 13 2017 01:59 Mohdoo wrote:
What do people think about senator Merkley running for president? He's got a great review from me, but I am curious what others think. He's in Iowa right now, so he definitely seems like he's going that direction.

A cursory view yields a fairly positive view. Don't know or care to research his history though.

He's also co-sponsoring Bernie's healthcare bill. It's funny to see how suddenly everyone wants to ride the Bernie train.

The more Hillary talks, the more Democrats see that that faux-pragmatic "centrism" is a loser's game. If Democrats jump off that game it's prudence more than anything else.

Her book is turning into a goldmine of ridiculous quotes

https://twitter.com/charliespiering/status/907587984983289861

Are you sure you're not just taking full pages of her out of context?


It's her book...

Did someone kill the humor center in your brain?
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
jcarlsoniv
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States27922 Posts
September 12 2017 17:55 GMT
#174334
On September 13 2017 02:32 Plansix wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2017 02:29 Mohdoo wrote:
On September 13 2017 02:27 Sadist wrote:
Please stop calling it Single Payer! Its going to screw up the message!


Isn't medicare for all just another way to say single payer?

Yep. Also, Obamacare is the ACA.


Because no one ever screwed up that association...


It is uplifting to see support for med-for-all swinging this way (and go go MA senators). I think a necessary step to get this far was a failed repeal though - a ridiculous % of people didn't know Obamacare == ACA, and it's become very clear that there is bipartisan support among the people for something that actually works for us. There's still a loooooooooong slog, but let's see how closer we get with it this time.
Soniv ||| Soniv#1962 ||| @jcarlsoniv ||| The Big Golem ||| Join the Glorious Evolution. What's your favorite aminal, a bear? ||| Joe "Don't call me Daniel" "Soniv" "Daniel" Carlsberg LXIX ||| Paging Dr. John Shadow
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
September 12 2017 17:56 GMT
#174335
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
September 12 2017 17:58 GMT
#174336
On September 13 2017 02:55 jcarlsoniv wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2017 02:32 Plansix wrote:
On September 13 2017 02:29 Mohdoo wrote:
On September 13 2017 02:27 Sadist wrote:
Please stop calling it Single Payer! Its going to screw up the message!


Isn't medicare for all just another way to say single payer?

Yep. Also, Obamacare is the ACA.


Because no one ever screwed up that association...


It is uplifting to see support for med-for-all swinging this way (and go go MA senators). I think a necessary step to get this far was a failed repeal though - a ridiculous % of people didn't know Obamacare == ACA, and it's become very clear that there is bipartisan support among the people for something that actually works for us. There's still a loooooooooong slog, but let's see how closer we get with it this time.

That was sort of my point. Labeling, name and the history of words matter a lot. The Obamacare/ACA split is proof positive of that. It is how you convince people to vote for their own healthcare plans to be canceled without a replacement.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
zlefin
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
United States7689 Posts
September 12 2017 18:05 GMT
#174337
On September 13 2017 02:55 jcarlsoniv wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 13 2017 02:32 Plansix wrote:
On September 13 2017 02:29 Mohdoo wrote:
On September 13 2017 02:27 Sadist wrote:
Please stop calling it Single Payer! Its going to screw up the message!


Isn't medicare for all just another way to say single payer?

Yep. Also, Obamacare is the ACA.


Because no one ever screwed up that association...


It is uplifting to see support for med-for-all swinging this way (and go go MA senators). I think a necessary step to get this far was a failed repeal though - a ridiculous % of people didn't know Obamacare == ACA, and it's become very clear that there is bipartisan support among the people for something that actually works for us. There's still a loooooooooong slog, but let's see how closer we get with it this time.

last I heard; there's still a lot of people who don't know that they're the same thing.
Great read: http://shorensteincenter.org/news-coverage-2016-general-election/ great book on democracy: http://press.princeton.edu/titles/10671.html zlefin is grumpier due to long term illness. Ignoring some users.
TheTenthDoc
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States9561 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-09-12 18:26:50
September 12 2017 18:25 GMT
#174338
Note that Medicare still requires you to pay insurance premiums, deductibles, and copays, particularly for parts B and D, so calling it single payer is a pretty gross exaggeration (unless the bill waives that component of Medicare in which case it's kind of a misnomer to call it Medicare for all). They're just all way lower than commercial insurance, though Part D is its own little snowflake of madness.
semantics
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
10040 Posts
September 12 2017 18:29 GMT
#174339
A single payer won't solve anything until the US actually regulates its medical industry, you can have private insurance if you force them to operate as nonprofits, you have to cap prices on old medical technology, you can't charge me 20 grand for a CAT scan that shit been around since the 70's. Cost of medical supplies also need caps on their profit margins and removing a la carte pricing so you pay for the package of getting someone healthy not make more money if you mess up and require more things to be done.
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-09-12 18:44:04
September 12 2017 18:43 GMT
#174340
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
Prev 1 8715 8716 8717 8718 8719 10093 Next
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