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More business executives are departing en masse from Trump administration advisory positions, with a new set of resignations from a Commerce Department advisory board following an exodus from two business groups advising the White House, which then disbanded both of them.
More than half of the members of the 15-person Digital Economy Board of Advisors, an expert board set up last year by the Obama administration to help the federal government navigate the digital economy, are known to have resigned this week in the wake of President Donald Trump's controversial comments about the violence last week in Charlottesville, Virginia, that left one person dead.
Those no longer participating as of Friday afternoon include co-chairs Zoë Baird, president and CEO of the Markle Foundation; Mitchell Baker, executive chairwoman of the tech organization Mozilla; David L. Cohen, senior vice president and chief diversity officer at Comcast; Karen Bartleson, president of the Institute of Electrical and Electronics Engineers; Marta Tellado, president and CEO of Consumer Reports; James Manyika, director of the McKinsey Global Institute; Sonia Katyal, chancellor’s professor of law at the University of California at Berkeley School of Law; and Corey Thomas, president and CEO of cybersecurity firm Rapid7. Their departures were confirmed by those individuals, their representatives or emails obtained by POLITICO.
The departures amplify the increasing rift between private-sector advisers and the Trump White House. Merck CEO Kenneth Frazier set off a chain reaction when he resigned Monday from a manufacturing council that Trump appointed, saying he didn't condone how the president responded to the events in Charlottesville. During his presidency and the transition leading up to it, Trump has leaned on business leaders to bolster his messages of job and economic growth, often appearing in photo ops with CEOs in the Oval Office or at Trump Tower.
The departures differ from those from the White House advisory groups because they mark a case of outside experts distancing themselves not simply from the White House or Trump, but from a federal agency. Some commentators have floated the possibility that business leaders eager not to be seen engaging with the White House or the president might instead chose to deal directly with federal agencies, such as the Wilbur Ross-led Commerce Department.
All of the digital economy board members who resigned had been appointed to the posts by then-Secretary of Commerce Penny Pritzker 16 months ago to what were meant to be two-year terms. At the time, Pritzker described the group, known internally as DEBA, as a way of tapping the expertise of those familiar with digitally based industries and business models — including those based on or around the internet — to help the Commerce Department evolve from its long-standing focus on manufacturing and other traditional industries.
Some of those who have left the board explicitly framed the end of their participation as a response to Trump's comments on the events in Charlottesville.
"It is the responsibility of leaders to take action and lift up each and every American. Our leaders must unequivocally denounce bigotry, racism, sexism, hate, and violence," Baker wrote in a resignation note addressed to Ross. Bartleson, in her own letter to Ross, wrote, "IEEE's core values, code of ethics, and code of conduct — and certainly my own principles — have no room for hatred, violence, racism, and discrimination."
Lyft President John Zimmer had originally been named as a participant in the Pritzker-appointed panel, but he was not included on a more recent listing of group members. In a statement given to POLITICO, a Lyft spokesperson said that "Lyft executives are not participating and will not participate in any advisory panel associated with the Trump administration."
A Comcast spokesperson declined to comment on the motivations behind Cohen's departure this week but said that Ross should have the opportunity to name his own hand-chosen members of the board should he opt to continue the panel.
The remaining members of the board did not respond to requests for comment or otherwise could not be immediately reached.
The digital economy board moves come shortly after the shuttering earlier this week of two business-engaging groups created by Trump, one focused on American manufacturing and the other a "strategic and policy forum." In a tweet, Trump took credit for ending those groups' short runs, though other reporting suggests their members had already chosen to disband before his announcement, following a string of resignations after Frazier's.
According to those familiar with the activities of the digital economy board, the group had not met or otherwise conducted activities during the first eight months of the Trump administration.
The Commerce Department did not respond to requests for comment.
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United States42643 Posts
On August 19 2017 06:24 Jockmcplop wrote:
Maybe you're right KwarK but I think its a little bit more complex than that.
You can't blame the media without acknowledging how the media has changed and moved more into the hands of the underground. I honestly think Jordan Peterson has more influence than Fox News when it comes to trans rights or specifically those who seem to be absolutely against trans rights.
Because of this the casual observer (or someone like me looking at North America from afar) only gets to see the extreme cases. I see fucking nutjob canadians screaming at Peterson like he's some kind of Nazi and I'm more inclined to take his side because the people he is talking about who are trying to shut down speech and insist on being called zee and zer etc. are right there on camera crying and bitching and screaming.
There is no benefit to anyone in simply filming normal gender neutral/non binary people having a sensible discussion about stuff, that content isn't out there in the media.
This obviously tilts how people feel.
For example I don't really know many trans people, and those who I do know are binary he/she trans. The only time I hear about the issue in America it is framed as people kicking off on a campus and assaulting people or screaming and foghorning them and of course my initial impression is that these people seem to be fucking crazy.
Obviously we all know better than to generalize on that basis but it can't help but colour your impressions of the issue. I mean you're saying that trans people are doing what they've been doing forever, and these centre right guys on Youtube absolutely disagree with you, so to me it just looks like everything's a bit different because of the extreme cases you see online.
What I meant by things haven't changed is that with things like the trans bathrooms controversy, trans people have always been using the bathrooms that conservatives are now protesting against. In the case of the Target trans bathroom hysteria Targets already had single occupancy bathrooms in their stores that men and women could both use. Target said that trans people could use them and the American right flipped their shit over it and demanded a boycott. It's a manufactured issue.
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On August 19 2017 05:40 Jockmcplop wrote:
Yeah the non binary - random identity + pronoun thing is kind of off to me too.
I wouldn't mind it except the rest of us are supposed to somehow keep in mind a totally separate and specific mode of behaviour because a few people want to act out (not always the case but sometimes).
The best analogy I can think of for this behaviour is the goth thing that was huge about 15-20 years ago. Everyone had goths at their school and most people thought they were a bit weird, but they didn't insist on full on fucking legal protection from disrespect. You could call someone a fucking stupid goth and not get accused of hate crime.
Everything now is so shrouded in sensitivity to this stuff that you can literally change your identity for attention at will and expect the world to bend itself around your newfound needs. I find it all just a bit pathetic to be honest.
Once again I completely understand binary switching but there's a whole world of attention seeking behaviour that to me seems psychologically unhealthy (not mentally ill) and its being reinforced by the law.
Maybe I'm just old and the world has moved on past the point where i can keep up with it though.
Ok, short reality check:
Does anyone here actually no a person that wishes to be called by a weird pronoun (Anything except he/she/they)? (No, weird people in weird internet forums do not count)
If not, i think we can safely assume that this is basically a nonissue. As far as i understand, no one here has a problem with calling people their choice out of those three?
From what i can tell, the main thing people argue is that they fear that people will demand people use "Ugabuublabluupshuu" as the pronoun when announcing them. From what i can tell, no one actually demands such a thing. As far as i know, trans people mostly want to be called "he" or "she", and a few want "they". So if the thing that people fear will become a problem does not appear to be a problem, and no one has a problem with the thing people actually want, i don't quite understand why this is a discussion.
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Again, bears repeating, if the only time you've heard of these "genders" is on a random corner of the internet, then the law would not apply to it.
Would be the same as a sudden twitter trend to redefine "murder" to unicorn tracking or something. Sure, it may be noteworthy in an absurdist kind of way, but unless it has become so common place that it's used in casual conversation and basically overtaken the usually accepted definition, the law does not care.
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Identity does not solely fall into the subjects whim. It is a complex process of negotiation of the being with the world. If the being proposes that it is that or that, because it feels that way, while lacking a lot of attributes normally attached to the that, the world surely cries foul play.
Even if one is inclined to be a decent person and would like to call a person everything it wants, although it is not clear if this is the truth, one enters hereby the realm of lies, which has its own hosts of problems.
If my friend wants me to call him a king, I will surely do that, because I love his quirks - and because he really has the regal air surrounding him. If my colleague at work wants the same from me, I will hesitate though, but might do it, because she is a good lass. But if some higher up wants me to do her bidding, using a force in waiting, I will not only hesitate, but I will fight against such nonsense on stilts.
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This will help a whole bunch. This is how politics works.
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Why not, instead of diversifying gender pronouns, reduce it to one, universal pronoun?
Why not make bathrooms one facility instead of two separate ones?
Why not make everything standard unisex, from clothes to toys to cars.
Or would that not jive well because diversity is as natural as it can be (especially for the last one)?
If that is the case, it's almost like diversity is a natural phenomenon, just like when trying to find a mate, you don't want to procreate with your siblings or parent in order to mix up the gene pool so that your offspring has a better fighting chance in a potentially harsher nature.
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Release the kraken.
On a serious note, this was completely expected, either he didn't have as much as we believed, or he just cashed in
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On August 19 2017 07:05 Godwrath wrote:Release the kraken. On a serious note, this was completely expected, either he didn't have as much as we believed, or he just cashed in
Can't wait to have some new levels of crazy in (alt)right wing media.
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This is a good proposal. But it will take time, and, I think, it really can't be enforced, or better: should not.
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On August 19 2017 06:24 m4ini wrote:Show nested quote +On August 19 2017 06:17 Plansix wrote:
All right, I’ve seen the attack chopper meme enough to give people this heads up:
That joke and meme has a really weird history involving 4chan and some super transphobic stuff. So your mileage may vary on that joke when dealing with someone who is trans or is aware of the meme’s history. I’ve meet people who don’t care and folks who do not find it at all funny.
I don’t personally care, but I gave someone the impression I was a transphobic 4chan goon a couple years back and they thought I was an asshole for quite some time. So fair warning. Replace attack chopper with any inanimate/fantasy object/animal. I didn't mean attack chopper literally, nobody here did i think - it's used as a single phrase to describe an issue while having transgender people explicitly detached from that. So no, that was neither a joke, nor do i care if someone's offended by me using it after i explicitly and distinctively made the cut between "idiots" and "transpeople".
I don't understand what the big deal is with calling someone a pronoun that they prefer. A few months ago I hung out with a friend of a friend who, in the most basic terms, looked like a cross-dressing man (she was in a dress and heels) and she introduced herself with a girl's name. I didn't assume anything and when gender identity came up in context, I very sincerely told her that I was inexperienced navigating the conversation and asked her how she identified. She was happy to have the conversation and thankful that I had asked, and she said she identified as a woman and preferred to be referenced as she/ her.
I don't presume to know everything that goes on in a person's head, and I'm sure that my experiences and identity are not identical to everyone else's. If it's something that's that important to someone else and has no negative consequences other than getting used to a pronoun that might seem counterintuitive to me because of my lack of experience, then I really don't mind trying to be respectful of others' identity preferences.
Those who complain about non-cisgendered people and the annoyances that come with respecting gender identity seem to use arguments very similar to anti- gay marriage arguments. Ew it's icky or different or against my religion. How could I tell my kids about this? What about random slippery slopes of marrying dogs and chairs and identifying as a dog or chair? Who the hell cares, it doesn't affect you, and either leave the situation alone or try to get to know someone before saying they're full of shit or a bad person.
Why is it so hard to act humanely and compassionate and respectful these days?
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On August 19 2017 07:09 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:Show nested quote +On August 19 2017 06:24 m4ini wrote:On August 19 2017 06:17 Plansix wrote:
All right, I’ve seen the attack chopper meme enough to give people this heads up:
That joke and meme has a really weird history involving 4chan and some super transphobic stuff. So your mileage may vary on that joke when dealing with someone who is trans or is aware of the meme’s history. I’ve meet people who don’t care and folks who do not find it at all funny.
I don’t personally care, but I gave someone the impression I was a transphobic 4chan goon a couple years back and they thought I was an asshole for quite some time. So fair warning. Replace attack chopper with any inanimate/fantasy object/animal. I didn't mean attack chopper literally, nobody here did i think - it's used as a single phrase to describe an issue while having transgender people explicitly detached from that. So no, that was neither a joke, nor do i care if someone's offended by me using it after i explicitly and distinctively made the cut between "idiots" and "transpeople". I don't understand what the big deal is with calling someone a pronoun that they prefer. A few months ago I hung out with a friend of a friend who, in the most basic terms, looked like a cross-dressing man (she was in a dress and heels) and she introduced herself with a girl's name. I didn't assume anything and when gender identity came up in context, I very sincerely told her that I was inexperienced navigating the conversation and asked her how she identified. She was happy to have the conversation and thankful that I had asked, and she said she identified as a woman and preferred to be referenced as she/ her. I don't presume to know everything that goes on in a person's head, and I'm sure that my experiences and identity are not identical to everyone else's. If it's something that's that important to someone else and has no negative consequences other than getting used to a pronoun that might seem counterintuitive to me because of my lack of experience, then I really don't mind trying to be respectful of others' identity preferences. Those who complain about non-cisgendered people and the annoyances that come with respecting gender identity seem to use arguments very similar to anti- gay marriage arguments. Ew it's icky or different or against my religion. How could I tell my kids about this? What about random slippery slopes of marrying dogs and chairs and identifying as a dog or chair? Who the hell cares, it doesn't affect you, and either leave the situation alone or try to get to know someone before saying they're full of shit or a bad person. Why is it so hard to act humanely and compassionate and respectful these days?
Before you butt into a discussion, read it first. Your entire post is worthless redundant, considering that this was already established by all parties in the discussion.
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On August 19 2017 07:06 m4ini wrote:Show nested quote +On August 19 2017 07:05 Godwrath wrote:Release the kraken. On a serious note, this was completely expected, either he didn't have as much as we believed, or he just cashed in Can't wait to have some new levels of crazy in (alt)right wing media.
This might as well read: I'm going to fight congress. All of the GOP. I will assure that the next 4 years will accomplish nothing.
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On August 19 2017 07:10 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On August 19 2017 07:06 m4ini wrote:On August 19 2017 07:05 Godwrath wrote:Release the kraken. On a serious note, this was completely expected, either he didn't have as much as we believed, or he just cashed in Can't wait to have some new levels of crazy in (alt)right wing media. This might as well read: I'm going to fight congress. All of the GOP. I will assure that the next 4 years will accomplish nothing.
Of course, that's what it means. "Fight Trumps enemies" is a very broad description considering the few places where he has friends, all of which are pretty much either racist or outright Nazis.
edit: weee, remastered finally finished download, ums maps here i come!
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Poor Bannon. That whole statement just wreaks of "I'm still totally fucking buff and didn't lose!"
I really don't buy this bullshit about how Bannon can do more outside the admin than within.
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I really don't buy this bullshit about how Bannon can do more outside the admin than within.
Actually, that might be correct. As part of the WH, he had to be to some degree careful what he said and the "level of reality" had to match at least somewhat current events.
Now he can go full conspiracy shit again, which would have gotten him fired beforehand.
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On August 19 2017 07:10 m4ini wrote:Show nested quote +On August 19 2017 07:09 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On August 19 2017 06:24 m4ini wrote:On August 19 2017 06:17 Plansix wrote:
All right, I’ve seen the attack chopper meme enough to give people this heads up:
That joke and meme has a really weird history involving 4chan and some super transphobic stuff. So your mileage may vary on that joke when dealing with someone who is trans or is aware of the meme’s history. I’ve meet people who don’t care and folks who do not find it at all funny.
I don’t personally care, but I gave someone the impression I was a transphobic 4chan goon a couple years back and they thought I was an asshole for quite some time. So fair warning. Replace attack chopper with any inanimate/fantasy object/animal. I didn't mean attack chopper literally, nobody here did i think - it's used as a single phrase to describe an issue while having transgender people explicitly detached from that. So no, that was neither a joke, nor do i care if someone's offended by me using it after i explicitly and distinctively made the cut between "idiots" and "transpeople". I don't understand what the big deal is with calling someone a pronoun that they prefer. A few months ago I hung out with a friend of a friend who, in the most basic terms, looked like a cross-dressing man (she was in a dress and heels) and she introduced herself with a girl's name. I didn't assume anything and when gender identity came up in context, I very sincerely told her that I was inexperienced navigating the conversation and asked her how she identified. She was happy to have the conversation and thankful that I had asked, and she said she identified as a woman and preferred to be referenced as she/ her. I don't presume to know everything that goes on in a person's head, and I'm sure that my experiences and identity are not identical to everyone else's. If it's something that's that important to someone else and has no negative consequences other than getting used to a pronoun that might seem counterintuitive to me because of my lack of experience, then I really don't mind trying to be respectful of others' identity preferences. Those who complain about non-cisgendered people and the annoyances that come with respecting gender identity seem to use arguments very similar to anti- gay marriage arguments. Ew it's icky or different or against my religion. How could I tell my kids about this? What about random slippery slopes of marrying dogs and chairs and identifying as a dog or chair? Who the hell cares, it doesn't affect you, and either leave the situation alone or try to get to know someone before saying they're full of shit or a bad person. Why is it so hard to act humanely and compassionate and respectful these days? Before you butt into a discussion, read it first. Your entire post is worthless redundant, considering that this was already established by all parties in the discussion.
? I did read the discussion, and I was agreeing with the situation... I didn't say you or anyone else was wrong or saying anything inappropriately. My point, as I wrote, was that yeah, it really isn't that hard to respect someone's gender identity in the grand scheme of things. Your conversation (as well as Jock's and Simberto's and others' posts) reminded me of that anecdote that I wished to share.
Just because someone wants to reply to you doesn't mean they're trying to refute something you said 
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FUCK YOU DPB, YOU'RE WRONG!!!!!!1
Also, I'd like to (re)address that these sorts of topics that do sort of deal with society, but on a more hypothetical level and also at times have more to do with ethics, philosophy and psychology that these matters could be discussed in a separate thread.
For now these issues are related to the American continent, but I think these are all pretty universal concepts.
Would it be worth it to discuss these topics in a different thread or no?
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On August 19 2017 07:20 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:Show nested quote +On August 19 2017 07:10 m4ini wrote:On August 19 2017 07:09 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On August 19 2017 06:24 m4ini wrote:On August 19 2017 06:17 Plansix wrote:
All right, I’ve seen the attack chopper meme enough to give people this heads up:
That joke and meme has a really weird history involving 4chan and some super transphobic stuff. So your mileage may vary on that joke when dealing with someone who is trans or is aware of the meme’s history. I’ve meet people who don’t care and folks who do not find it at all funny.
I don’t personally care, but I gave someone the impression I was a transphobic 4chan goon a couple years back and they thought I was an asshole for quite some time. So fair warning. Replace attack chopper with any inanimate/fantasy object/animal. I didn't mean attack chopper literally, nobody here did i think - it's used as a single phrase to describe an issue while having transgender people explicitly detached from that. So no, that was neither a joke, nor do i care if someone's offended by me using it after i explicitly and distinctively made the cut between "idiots" and "transpeople". I don't understand what the big deal is with calling someone a pronoun that they prefer. A few months ago I hung out with a friend of a friend who, in the most basic terms, looked like a cross-dressing man (she was in a dress and heels) and she introduced herself with a girl's name. I didn't assume anything and when gender identity came up in context, I very sincerely told her that I was inexperienced navigating the conversation and asked her how she identified. She was happy to have the conversation and thankful that I had asked, and she said she identified as a woman and preferred to be referenced as she/ her. I don't presume to know everything that goes on in a person's head, and I'm sure that my experiences and identity are not identical to everyone else's. If it's something that's that important to someone else and has no negative consequences other than getting used to a pronoun that might seem counterintuitive to me because of my lack of experience, then I really don't mind trying to be respectful of others' identity preferences. Those who complain about non-cisgendered people and the annoyances that come with respecting gender identity seem to use arguments very similar to anti- gay marriage arguments. Ew it's icky or different or against my religion. How could I tell my kids about this? What about random slippery slopes of marrying dogs and chairs and identifying as a dog or chair? Who the hell cares, it doesn't affect you, and either leave the situation alone or try to get to know someone before saying they're full of shit or a bad person. Why is it so hard to act humanely and compassionate and respectful these days? Before you butt into a discussion, read it first. Your entire post is worthless redundant, considering that this was already established by all parties in the discussion. ? I did read the discussion, and I was agreeing with the situation... I didn't say you or anyone else was wrong or saying anything inappropriately. My point, as I wrote, was that yeah, it really isn't that hard to respect someone's gender identity in the grand scheme of things. Your conversation reminded me of that anecdote that I wished to share. Just because someone wants to reply to you doesn't mean they're trying to refute something you said
If it contains questions like "Why is it so hard to act humanely and compassionate and respectful these days?" or starts with "i don't understand what the big deal is with calling someone the pronoun they prefer", then i disagree. You quoted a posting of mine that had nothing to do with what you said (again, already established long ago that i certainly would call a trans his preferred pronoun). So of course, i'd assumed you think i wouldn't.
My bad then.
FUCK YOU DPB, YOU'RE WRONG!!!!!!1
Honest question, what exactly are you trying to accomplish by completely and deliberately misrepresenting statements that are unanimously agreed upon by all parties? You get a kick out of it or something?
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EPT
