|
Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. |
On July 26 2016 04:57 DeepElemBlues wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2016 04:53 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:51 DeepElemBlues wrote:On July 26 2016 04:47 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:42 Plansix wrote:On July 26 2016 04:40 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:36 Plansix wrote:On July 26 2016 04:27 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:24 Nyxisto wrote:
Sanders literally stated a year ago that he's not going to blow the Democratic party apart and will endorse the democratic candidate should he lose, what 'true colors' lol that's political talk m8 It shows he is tone deaf to his supporters and despite our ever changing world, he is not reacting to what is happening. He's simply following the same script. He should have denounced Trump and Clinton and left it at that, it's a bad move. Not really, no. It shows that there are a section of his supporters that are unwilling to compromise or influence government in any way beyond winning the nomination. This is a myopic and short sighted way to view politics, as no one wins all the time and no one can govern alone. He would need the DNC to get elected and a large part of it wouldn’t play ball. And I doubt there is anything he can say to convince them that he needs their support. Because they refuse to accept a world where he works with Clinton. Alright lets say for a second that you work in a company. You and another guy are working to become partner, which is a huge raise. You are way better educated and better skill-wise in your field. The other guy is simply more well connected at the office. He goes on to become partner, you aren't sure where you went wrong. A month passes by and later you discover that the executives were colluding to get the other guy in because his dad golfs with the CEO, and keep you out at all costs. Do you stay with that company or do you quit and find another job? That isn’t how politics works. You don’t “win” promotions. There isn’t a public voting process. He literally lost by 3.7 million votes. If the DNC could change that many minds and votes at their whim, they couldn’t have lost the House and Senate in 2010. I figured you'd dodge the question and open with your own rhetoric, I dont know why I bothered. You are usually one of the people's posts I skip over when I shadow this thread  You're too boxed in for my tastes. You can't dance around Sanders losing the overall primary vote by millions no matter how hard you try though. Implying I care even remotely about that If you're going to whine about how the decision was allegedly rigged against him then you kind of should care that he lost the total primary vote by millions. It severely undercuts the argument that the outcome wasn't valid. I won't imply it I'll say it straight out, if you want to complain about the rigged DNC and rigged Dem primaries and not have anyone disagree or declare that you don't want to talk to anyone who disagrees because they're obviously just extreme and not open-minded and blah blah blah, do it on Facebook. That's what Facebook is for, everybody can have their own personal echo chamber.
you seem to think im defending sanders when im doing the literal opposite, I have no idea what you're talking about.
|
Not to mention its terribly arrogant to think one gets to judge posting quality because they are "a moderate" as if thats some gold standard for passing judgement.
|
On July 26 2016 05:00 VayneAuthority wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2016 04:58 Plansix wrote:On July 26 2016 04:52 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:51 Plansix wrote:On July 26 2016 04:47 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:42 Plansix wrote:On July 26 2016 04:40 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:36 Plansix wrote:On July 26 2016 04:27 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:24 Nyxisto wrote:
Sanders literally stated a year ago that he's not going to blow the Democratic party apart and will endorse the democratic candidate should he lose, what 'true colors' lol that's political talk m8 It shows he is tone deaf to his supporters and despite our ever changing world, he is not reacting to what is happening. He's simply following the same script. He should have denounced Trump and Clinton and left it at that, it's a bad move. Not really, no. It shows that there are a section of his supporters that are unwilling to compromise or influence government in any way beyond winning the nomination. This is a myopic and short sighted way to view politics, as no one wins all the time and no one can govern alone. He would need the DNC to get elected and a large part of it wouldn’t play ball. And I doubt there is anything he can say to convince them that he needs their support. Because they refuse to accept a world where he works with Clinton. Alright lets say for a second that you work in a company. You and another guy are working to become partner, which is a huge raise. You are way better educated and better skill-wise in your field. The other guy is simply more well connected at the office. He goes on to become partner, you aren't sure where you went wrong. A month passes by and later you discover that the executives were colluding to get the other guy in because his dad golfs with the CEO, and keep you out at all costs. Do you stay with that company or do you quit and find another job? That isn’t how politics works. You don’t “win” promotions. There isn’t a public voting process. He literally lost by 3.7 million votes. If the DNC could change that many minds and votes at their whim, they couldn’t have lost the House and Senate in 2010. I figured you'd dodge the question and open with your own rhetoric, I dont know why I bothered. You are usually one of the people's posts I skip over when I shadow this thread You're too boxed in for my tastes. I didn’t dodge the question, your analogy sucked. Sanders is going to support Clinton because he got into politics to improve the lives of other people, not himself. He is fine. Refusing to be part of the process because he didn’t win won’t further his goals. His supporters don’t see that because a lot of them are used to the idea of compromise. Anything that you can't answer sucks lel. Like I said, you're too extremist for me. Sorry you didn’t get the answer you want. And if you think I am extreme, you are not prepared for the big, mean political world. I am just a socially left, fiscally centered independent. I’m not even a socialist. I got zero answer since you're too scared to even answer the question. you're one of the most far left people that posts in this thread easily.
He literally answered your question when he said: That isn’t how politics works. You don’t “win” promotions
He's saying your example is inaccurate, shows a lack of knowledge of the topic, and reveals something unintelligent about you that can't be explained by lack of education.
|
United Kingdom13775 Posts
On July 26 2016 05:01 Nevuk wrote:
To me this thread is far right land. I think it's just a matter of perspective
There's a fair number of agenda-pushers in here and a lot more people who are 100% sure that they're right and refuse to see otherwise. Overall I straight up ignore about 30% of the people I have seen posting here because they aren't worth talking to.
At least it's better than the Ukraine thread.
|
On July 26 2016 05:00 VayneAuthority wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2016 04:58 Plansix wrote:On July 26 2016 04:52 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:51 Plansix wrote:On July 26 2016 04:47 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:42 Plansix wrote:On July 26 2016 04:40 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:36 Plansix wrote:On July 26 2016 04:27 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:24 Nyxisto wrote:
Sanders literally stated a year ago that he's not going to blow the Democratic party apart and will endorse the democratic candidate should he lose, what 'true colors' lol that's political talk m8 It shows he is tone deaf to his supporters and despite our ever changing world, he is not reacting to what is happening. He's simply following the same script. He should have denounced Trump and Clinton and left it at that, it's a bad move. Not really, no. It shows that there are a section of his supporters that are unwilling to compromise or influence government in any way beyond winning the nomination. This is a myopic and short sighted way to view politics, as no one wins all the time and no one can govern alone. He would need the DNC to get elected and a large part of it wouldn’t play ball. And I doubt there is anything he can say to convince them that he needs their support. Because they refuse to accept a world where he works with Clinton. Alright lets say for a second that you work in a company. You and another guy are working to become partner, which is a huge raise. You are way better educated and better skill-wise in your field. The other guy is simply more well connected at the office. He goes on to become partner, you aren't sure where you went wrong. A month passes by and later you discover that the executives were colluding to get the other guy in because his dad golfs with the CEO, and keep you out at all costs. Do you stay with that company or do you quit and find another job? That isn’t how politics works. You don’t “win” promotions. There isn’t a public voting process. He literally lost by 3.7 million votes. If the DNC could change that many minds and votes at their whim, they couldn’t have lost the House and Senate in 2010. I figured you'd dodge the question and open with your own rhetoric, I dont know why I bothered. You are usually one of the people's posts I skip over when I shadow this thread You're too boxed in for my tastes. I didn’t dodge the question, your analogy sucked. Sanders is going to support Clinton because he got into politics to improve the lives of other people, not himself. He is fine. Refusing to be part of the process because he didn’t win won’t further his goals. His supporters don’t see that because a lot of them are used to the idea of compromise. Anything that you can't answer sucks lel. Like I said, you're too extremist for me. Sorry you didn’t get the answer you want. And if you think I am extreme, you are not prepared for the big, mean political world. I am just a socially left, fiscally centered independent. I’m not even a socialist. I got zero answer since you're too scared to even answer the question. you're one of the most far left people that posts in this thread easily.
This only shows that you have a very poor understanding of the left. First off, I am religious, pro-gun, very pro small business. I am not pro-union, not pro socialism and I am conflicted about a single payer plan due to the size of the US. I’m not a huge fan of federal regulation nationwide.
However, I am very anti-bank and multi-national publicly owned cooperation. And I am far left on social issues, including civil rights. But I am not way the most far left in this thread.
|
On July 26 2016 05:01 Nevuk wrote:
To me this thread is far right land. I think it's just a matter of perspective
This is hilarious. This place is anything but.
|
On July 26 2016 05:07 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2016 05:01 Nevuk wrote:
To me this thread is far right land. I think it's just a matter of perspective This is hilarious. This place is anything but.
For perspective, I'm fairly sure I'm by far the furthest left person in this thread, that one political quiz in the thread a few days ago had me at -8.8, -8.7
|
United States42606 Posts
On July 26 2016 05:07 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2016 05:01 Nevuk wrote:
To me this thread is far right land. I think it's just a matter of perspective This is hilarious. This place is anything but.
If you don't think right and left are a matter of perspective then stand facing someone and ask them to raise their right hand.
|
United Kingdom13775 Posts
On July 26 2016 05:07 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2016 05:01 Nevuk wrote:
To me this thread is far right land. I think it's just a matter of perspective This is hilarious. This place is anything but.
It's mostly "status quo lovers' land" with more than a pinch of Europeans who believe in the same.
|
On July 26 2016 05:03 LegalLord wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2016 05:01 Nevuk wrote:
To me this thread is far right land. I think it's just a matter of perspective There's a fair number of agenda-pushers in here and a lot more people who are 100% sure that they're right and refuse to see otherwise. Overall I straight up ignore about 30% of the people I have seen posting here because they aren't worth talking to. At least it's better than the Ukraine thread.
yea I mean this is insane, their opinions are obviously extreme and then they try to belittle my stance as a moderate and blame me as the problem, talk about wacko thinking. I forgot this thread isn't really worth posting in, just reading a select few people's posts.
I haven't said anything even remotely pro right and you have these people calling for my head as a "fake" moderate I mean please.
|
You are not the most left until you are challenging others to prove they are pure enough to call themselves progressive. You need 200% more gate keeping.
|
On July 26 2016 05:08 Nevuk wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2016 05:07 xDaunt wrote:On July 26 2016 05:01 Nevuk wrote:
To me this thread is far right land. I think it's just a matter of perspective This is hilarious. This place is anything but. For perspective, I'm fairly sure I'm by far the furthest left person in this thread, that one political quiz in the thread a few days ago had me at -8.8, -8.7
You could be right about being the biggest leftist in the thread, but, overall, this thread is way left of standard American politics.
|
On July 26 2016 04:58 VayneAuthority wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2016 04:56 zlefin wrote:On July 26 2016 04:51 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:50 zlefin wrote:On July 26 2016 04:33 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:31 zlefin wrote:On July 26 2016 04:27 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:24 Nyxisto wrote:
Sanders literally stated a year ago that he's not going to blow the Democratic party apart and will endorse the democratic candidate should he lose, what 'true colors' lol that's political talk m8 It shows he is tone deaf to his supporters and despite our ever changing world, he is not reacting to what is happening. He's simply following the same script. He should have denounced Trump and Clinton and left it at that, it's a bad move. isn't it more backbone to say what he believes is right, rather than to say whatever some of his supporters favor to get elected? No, after he got fucked by the party he should not be supporting them in the slightest but he's definitely taking behind the scene deals. That's where the tone deaf disconnect comes in he didn't get screwed over by the entire party; only be some parts of it. and it's not like he HIMSELF is a long-time democrat. I think you just aren't grasping the full situation well. No this is just why I can't take this election seriously, everyone is either far left or far right, very few moderates like myself left. Talking to anyone is like talking to a brick wall. haven't seen a good post since Kwark's. uhhh; I'm a moderate, and there's plent yof other moderates around. I'm not so sure you're a moderate, you don't really talk like one. But people can self-identify as whatever they like I guess. In fact the bulk of voters are independents adn moderates; if talking to everyone is like talking to a brick wall, have you considered that maybe the problem is something in your perception? that's more common really. Your sense of moderate vs extreme doesn't seem to matchup with how people typically use the term. You're going to tell me some one like Plansix can be spoken to rationally and he isn't the problem? If so you aren't a moderate.
He can be rather rough; but there's plenty of worse in the thread; and your sense of who's moderate and who isn't is simply terrible, and he did answer your question clearly. I am a moderate, you're simply wrong; not sure why, but you seem to be missing some basic details on how things work. and your definition of extremist is basically nonsense. you need to try considering that the problem is with you rather than with everyone else.
|
On July 26 2016 05:07 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2016 05:01 Nevuk wrote:
To me this thread is far right land. I think it's just a matter of perspective This is hilarious. This place is anything but.
I mean, coming from the guy who thinks that minority discrimination isn't real and conveniently disappears every time there's a police shooting
|
On July 26 2016 05:12 zlefin wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2016 04:58 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:56 zlefin wrote:On July 26 2016 04:51 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:50 zlefin wrote:On July 26 2016 04:33 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:31 zlefin wrote:On July 26 2016 04:27 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:24 Nyxisto wrote:
Sanders literally stated a year ago that he's not going to blow the Democratic party apart and will endorse the democratic candidate should he lose, what 'true colors' lol that's political talk m8 It shows he is tone deaf to his supporters and despite our ever changing world, he is not reacting to what is happening. He's simply following the same script. He should have denounced Trump and Clinton and left it at that, it's a bad move. isn't it more backbone to say what he believes is right, rather than to say whatever some of his supporters favor to get elected? No, after he got fucked by the party he should not be supporting them in the slightest but he's definitely taking behind the scene deals. That's where the tone deaf disconnect comes in he didn't get screwed over by the entire party; only be some parts of it. and it's not like he HIMSELF is a long-time democrat. I think you just aren't grasping the full situation well. No this is just why I can't take this election seriously, everyone is either far left or far right, very few moderates like myself left. Talking to anyone is like talking to a brick wall. haven't seen a good post since Kwark's. uhhh; I'm a moderate, and there's plent yof other moderates around. I'm not so sure you're a moderate, you don't really talk like one. But people can self-identify as whatever they like I guess. In fact the bulk of voters are independents adn moderates; if talking to everyone is like talking to a brick wall, have you considered that maybe the problem is something in your perception? that's more common really. Your sense of moderate vs extreme doesn't seem to matchup with how people typically use the term. You're going to tell me some one like Plansix can be spoken to rationally and he isn't the problem? If so you aren't a moderate. He can be rather rough; but there's plenty of worse in the thread; and your sense of who's moderate and who isn't is simply terrible, and he did answer your question clearly. I am a moderate, you're simply wrong; not sure why, but you seem to be missing some basic details on how things work. and your definition of extremist is basically nonsense.
If you can't calmly and objectively see both sides like Kwark's post earlier ( i know he's leftist but as a result not extremist) then you are extremist in my book. Full on left/right nut huggers are unbearable to me.
|
On July 26 2016 05:09 VayneAuthority wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2016 05:03 LegalLord wrote:On July 26 2016 05:01 Nevuk wrote:
To me this thread is far right land. I think it's just a matter of perspective There's a fair number of agenda-pushers in here and a lot more people who are 100% sure that they're right and refuse to see otherwise. Overall I straight up ignore about 30% of the people I have seen posting here because they aren't worth talking to. At least it's better than the Ukraine thread. yea I mean this is insane, their opinions are obviously extreme and then they try to belittle my stance as a moderate and blame me as the problem, talk about wacko thinking. I forgot this thread isn't really worth posting in, just reading a select few people's posts. I haven't said anything even remotely pro right and you have these people calling for my head as a "fake" moderate I mean please.
This is the biggest problem with the left right now. It actively suppresses critical thought and challenges to its positions. We are supposed to listen to our betters -- "the experts" -- and accept what they have to say with no questions asked. Can you imagine this shit flying among the leftists of the late 60s and 70s?
|
On July 26 2016 05:12 zlefin wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2016 04:58 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:56 zlefin wrote:On July 26 2016 04:51 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:50 zlefin wrote:On July 26 2016 04:33 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:31 zlefin wrote:On July 26 2016 04:27 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:24 Nyxisto wrote:
Sanders literally stated a year ago that he's not going to blow the Democratic party apart and will endorse the democratic candidate should he lose, what 'true colors' lol that's political talk m8 It shows he is tone deaf to his supporters and despite our ever changing world, he is not reacting to what is happening. He's simply following the same script. He should have denounced Trump and Clinton and left it at that, it's a bad move. isn't it more backbone to say what he believes is right, rather than to say whatever some of his supporters favor to get elected? No, after he got fucked by the party he should not be supporting them in the slightest but he's definitely taking behind the scene deals. That's where the tone deaf disconnect comes in he didn't get screwed over by the entire party; only be some parts of it. and it's not like he HIMSELF is a long-time democrat. I think you just aren't grasping the full situation well. No this is just why I can't take this election seriously, everyone is either far left or far right, very few moderates like myself left. Talking to anyone is like talking to a brick wall. haven't seen a good post since Kwark's. uhhh; I'm a moderate, and there's plent yof other moderates around. I'm not so sure you're a moderate, you don't really talk like one. But people can self-identify as whatever they like I guess. In fact the bulk of voters are independents adn moderates; if talking to everyone is like talking to a brick wall, have you considered that maybe the problem is something in your perception? that's more common really. Your sense of moderate vs extreme doesn't seem to matchup with how people typically use the term. You're going to tell me some one like Plansix can be spoken to rationally and he isn't the problem? If so you aren't a moderate. He can be rather rough; but there's plenty of worse in the thread; and your sense of who's moderate and who isn't is simply terrible, and he did answer your question clearly. I am a moderate, you're simply wrong; not sure why, but you seem to be missing some basic details on how things work. and your definition of extremist is basically nonsense. you need to try considering that the problem is with you rather than with everyone else.
I will totally admit to being a total dick at times. I have no excuse for that beyond that some days are bad days to post on the internet.
On July 26 2016 05:14 VayneAuthority wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2016 05:12 zlefin wrote:On July 26 2016 04:58 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:56 zlefin wrote:On July 26 2016 04:51 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:50 zlefin wrote:On July 26 2016 04:33 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:31 zlefin wrote:On July 26 2016 04:27 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 26 2016 04:24 Nyxisto wrote:
Sanders literally stated a year ago that he's not going to blow the Democratic party apart and will endorse the democratic candidate should he lose, what 'true colors' lol that's political talk m8 It shows he is tone deaf to his supporters and despite our ever changing world, he is not reacting to what is happening. He's simply following the same script. He should have denounced Trump and Clinton and left it at that, it's a bad move. isn't it more backbone to say what he believes is right, rather than to say whatever some of his supporters favor to get elected? No, after he got fucked by the party he should not be supporting them in the slightest but he's definitely taking behind the scene deals. That's where the tone deaf disconnect comes in he didn't get screwed over by the entire party; only be some parts of it. and it's not like he HIMSELF is a long-time democrat. I think you just aren't grasping the full situation well. No this is just why I can't take this election seriously, everyone is either far left or far right, very few moderates like myself left. Talking to anyone is like talking to a brick wall. haven't seen a good post since Kwark's. uhhh; I'm a moderate, and there's plent yof other moderates around. I'm not so sure you're a moderate, you don't really talk like one. But people can self-identify as whatever they like I guess. In fact the bulk of voters are independents adn moderates; if talking to everyone is like talking to a brick wall, have you considered that maybe the problem is something in your perception? that's more common really. Your sense of moderate vs extreme doesn't seem to matchup with how people typically use the term. You're going to tell me some one like Plansix can be spoken to rationally and he isn't the problem? If so you aren't a moderate. He can be rather rough; but there's plenty of worse in the thread; and your sense of who's moderate and who isn't is simply terrible, and he did answer your question clearly. I am a moderate, you're simply wrong; not sure why, but you seem to be missing some basic details on how things work. and your definition of extremist is basically nonsense. If you can't calmly and objectively see both sides like Kwark's post earlier ( i know he's leftist but as a result not extremist) then you are extremist in my book. Full on left/right nut huggers are unbearable to me.
Half my family is Republican. My grandfather would argue with all of his liberal grand children every holiday, and win because he was old and we young and stupid. My parents are small business owners and vote republican in all state elections, but democrats nationally. The concept that I can’t understand the other side is comical. I understand, I just don’t agree.
|
On July 26 2016 05:13 ticklishmusic wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2016 05:07 xDaunt wrote:On July 26 2016 05:01 Nevuk wrote:
To me this thread is far right land. I think it's just a matter of perspective This is hilarious. This place is anything but. I mean, coming from the guy who thinks that minority discrimination isn't real and conveniently disappears every time there's a police shooting
My expressed position is a little more nuanced than "minority discrimination isn't real," but whatever.
And as for the police shootings, I've posted plenty about them. But excuse me if I'm unwilling to make any conclusions before seeing the facts. God knows that the race-baiters on the left have fucked that one up enough.
|
On July 26 2016 05:10 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2016 05:08 Nevuk wrote:On July 26 2016 05:07 xDaunt wrote:On July 26 2016 05:01 Nevuk wrote:
To me this thread is far right land. I think it's just a matter of perspective This is hilarious. This place is anything but. For perspective, I'm fairly sure I'm by far the furthest left person in this thread, that one political quiz in the thread a few days ago had me at -8.8, -8.7 You could be right about being the biggest leftist in the thread, but, overall, this thread is way left of standard American politics.
Oh, that's definitely true. My job I work with a bunch of 70+ year old white men, now that's some really conservative stuff.
However, as far as online political discussion places go, this is one of the more conservative places to have discussion outside of sites devoted to the conservative side. It's also been decent for not being a total echo chamber, which has been a problem for reddit or sites like it.
On July 26 2016 05:10 Plansix wrote:
You are not the most left until you are challenging others to prove they are pure enough to call themselves progressive. You need 200% more gate keeping.
I'm so confused by this term, it was first used by Roosevelt and as far as I can tell it mostly referred to making national parks, or at least that's where I first heard the term in 2004. Every time I hear it I picture someone shouting about stuffed animals or smokey the bear.
Really though, progressive doesn't really seem that far left to me, it's mostly just used to refer to the liberal wing of the democratic party. And I've given up on anything I ever support actually happening, so I mostly am just an observer nowadays.
I think Sanders is a good enough politician to control his supporters unless the DNC keeps somehow shooting themselves, which isn't really his fault.
|
Rather I think the problem is that when people have their opinion challenged they resort to calling people their favorite buzzword instead of engaging in discourse. Note VayneAuthority has failed to explain how personal career advancement is the same as campaigning for a political platform.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
