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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.

In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up!

NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious.
Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action.
TheTenthDoc
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States9561 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-07-19 16:50:10
July 19 2016 16:49 GMT
#86541
On July 20 2016 01:41 xDaunt wrote:
The response to Melania's speech is highly amusing. Y'all and the media are unhinged.


You can't say with a straight face that Chelsea giving a speech at the Democratic convention that contained passages identical to Palin's from 2008 wouldn't be received with equal "unhingedness" by the media.
xDaunt
Profile Joined March 2010
United States17988 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-07-19 16:52:25
July 19 2016 16:51 GMT
#86542
On July 20 2016 01:49 TheTenthDoc wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 20 2016 01:41 xDaunt wrote:
The response to Melania's speech is highly amusing. Y'all and the media are unhinged.


You can't say with a straight face that Chelsea giving a speech at the Democratic convention that contained passages identical to Palin's from 2008 wouldn't be received with equal "unhingedness" by the media.

Sure I can. Politicians rip off speeches all of the time. That, and the mainstream media is in the tank for Hillary anyway, so you can't count on them to take her to task for anything that isn't as obvious as the FBI Director discussing "extreme carelessness."
Doodsmack
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7224 Posts
July 19 2016 16:51 GMT
#86543
On July 20 2016 01:41 xDaunt wrote:
The response to Melania's speech is highly amusing. Y'all and the media are unhinged.


It's interesting to contemplate why the campaign would deny the plagiarism. But I don't imagine you're actually defending the idiocy of it, you're just saying you think the media and the left blow everything out of proportion.
ticklishmusic
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
United States15977 Posts
July 19 2016 16:52 GMT
#86544
just wanted to mention im glad that people are using battery correctly
(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
Doodsmack
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7224 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-07-19 16:55:08
July 19 2016 16:53 GMT
#86545
On July 20 2016 01:51 xDaunt wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 20 2016 01:49 TheTenthDoc wrote:
On July 20 2016 01:41 xDaunt wrote:
The response to Melania's speech is highly amusing. Y'all and the media are unhinged.


You can't say with a straight face that Chelsea giving a speech at the Democratic convention that contained passages identical to Palin's from 2008 wouldn't be received with equal "unhingedness" by the media.

Sure I can. Politicians rip off speeches all of the time. That, and the mainstream media is in the tank for Hillary anyway, so you can't count on them to take her to task for anything that isn't as obvious as the FBI Director discussing "extreme carelessness."


I'm not sure it's very honest to deny the idiocy of plagiarism by implying it happens all the time.
PassiveAce
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States18076 Posts
July 19 2016 16:57 GMT
#86546
Lie

Cheat

Steal

Keel

EVERYBODYS DOING IT
Call me Marge Simpson cuz I love you homie
xDaunt
Profile Joined March 2010
United States17988 Posts
July 19 2016 16:57 GMT
#86547
On July 20 2016 01:53 Doodsmack wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 20 2016 01:51 xDaunt wrote:
On July 20 2016 01:49 TheTenthDoc wrote:
On July 20 2016 01:41 xDaunt wrote:
The response to Melania's speech is highly amusing. Y'all and the media are unhinged.


You can't say with a straight face that Chelsea giving a speech at the Democratic convention that contained passages identical to Palin's from 2008 wouldn't be received with equal "unhingedness" by the media.

Sure I can. Politicians rip off speeches all of the time. That, and the mainstream media is in the tank for Hillary anyway, so you can't count on them to take her to task for anything that isn't as obvious as the FBI Director discussing "extreme carelessness."


I'm not sure it's very honest to deny the idiocy of plagiarism by implying it happens all the time.

I'm not denying anything.
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
July 19 2016 16:59 GMT
#86548
On July 20 2016 01:48 xDaunt wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 20 2016 01:45 KwarK wrote:
On July 20 2016 01:41 xDaunt wrote:
The response to Melania's speech is highly amusing. Y'all and the media are unhinged.

Do you not believe she did it or not believe she did anything wrong?

In all likelihood, someone did it. I'm just amused by the reaction. I'd say that it has an air of desperation to it, but none of you think that Trump can win, anyway.

The funny part is that, as others have pointed out, the media focusing on Melania's speech has diverted attention from how much of a shitshow the rest of the event was, so everyone going all-in on this actually is a net positive for Trump.
Moderator
Doodsmack
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7224 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-07-19 17:06:12
July 19 2016 17:01 GMT
#86549
On July 20 2016 00:22 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Show nested quote +
Does anybody else have the sense that Donald Trump is slipping off the rails? His speeches have always had a rambling, free association quality, but a couple of the recent ones have, as the Republican political consultant Mike Murphy put it, passed from the category of rant to the category of full on “drunk wedding toast.”

Trump’s verbal style has always been distinct. He doesn’t really speak in sentences or paragraphs. His speeches are punctuated by five- or six-word jabs that are sort of strung together by connections that can only be understood through chaos theory: “They want the wall … I dominated with the evangelicals … I won in a landslide … We can’t be the stupid people anymore.”

Occasionally Trump will attempt a sentence longer than eight words, but no matter what subject he starts the sentence with, by the end he has been pulled over to the subject of himself. Here’s an example from the Mike Pence announcement speech: “So one of the primary reasons I chose Mike was I looked at Indiana, and I won Indiana big.” There’s sort of a gravitational narcissistic pull that takes command whenever he attempts to utter a compound thought.

Trump has also always been a little engine fueled by wounded pride. For example, writing in BuzzFeed, McKay Coppins recalls the fusillade of abuse he received from Trump after writing an unflattering profile (he called Mar-a-Lago a “nice, if slightly dated, hotel”).

Trump was so inflamed he tweeted retaliation at Coppins several times a day and at odd hours, calling him a “dishonest slob” and “true garbage with no credibility.” The attacks went on impressively for over two years, which must rank Coppins in the top 100,000 on the list of people Donald Trump resents.

Over the past few weeks these longstanding Trump patterns have gone into hyperdrive. This is a unique moment in American political history in which the mental stability of one of the major party nominees is the dominating subject of conversation.

Everybody is telling Trump to ratchet it down and be more sober, but at a rally near Cincinnati this month and in his Pence announcement speech on Saturday, Trump launched his verbal rocket ship straight through the stratosphere, and it landed somewhere on the dark side of Planet Debbie.


Source


"Occasionally Trump will attempt a sentence longer than eight words, but no matter what subject he starts the sentence with, by the end he has been pulled over to the subject of himself. Here’s an example from the Mike Pence announcement speech: “So one of the primary reasons I chose Mike was I looked at Indiana, and I won Indiana big.” There’s sort of a gravitational narcissistic pull that takes command whenever he attempts to utter a compound thought.

Trump has also always been a little engine fueled by wounded pride. For example, writing in BuzzFeed, McKay Coppins recalls the fusillade of abuse he received from Trump after writing an unflattering profile (he called Mar-a-Lago a “nice, if slightly dated, hotel”).

Trump was so inflamed he tweeted retaliation at Coppins several times a day and at odd hours, calling him a “dishonest slob” and “true garbage with no credibility.” The attacks went on impressively for over two years, which must rank Coppins in the top 100,000 on the list of people Donald Trump resents."


This analysis of Trump in the present day and past matches up well with the Art of the Deal author's story. According to the Art of the Deal author, who shadowed Trump for 18 months and was with him more than any other person, and quite possibly got to know him better than any other person, Trump's personality characteristics veer into the extreme. Narcissism is a driving motivator, he has no attention span except to talk about himself. And just look, he attacked this guy for 2 years. Multiple other reporters have said Trump attacked them like that for a VERY long time. That's petty to the extreme. The author is genuinely terrified of a Trump presidency, for reasons of Trump's personality at a very basic level.

And Trump supporters want to write the author's story off as biased. This really shows you how little support Trump would have if people didn't hate the media.
Doodsmack
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7224 Posts
July 19 2016 17:02 GMT
#86550
On July 20 2016 01:57 xDaunt wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 20 2016 01:53 Doodsmack wrote:
On July 20 2016 01:51 xDaunt wrote:
On July 20 2016 01:49 TheTenthDoc wrote:
On July 20 2016 01:41 xDaunt wrote:
The response to Melania's speech is highly amusing. Y'all and the media are unhinged.


You can't say with a straight face that Chelsea giving a speech at the Democratic convention that contained passages identical to Palin's from 2008 wouldn't be received with equal "unhingedness" by the media.

Sure I can. Politicians rip off speeches all of the time. That, and the mainstream media is in the tank for Hillary anyway, so you can't count on them to take her to task for anything that isn't as obvious as the FBI Director discussing "extreme carelessness."


I'm not sure it's very honest to deny the idiocy of plagiarism by implying it happens all the time.

I'm not denying anything.


Allow me to rephrase:

I'm not sure it's very honest to claim plagiarism happens all the time in political speeches.
xDaunt
Profile Joined March 2010
United States17988 Posts
July 19 2016 17:05 GMT
#86551
On July 20 2016 01:59 TheYango wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 20 2016 01:48 xDaunt wrote:
On July 20 2016 01:45 KwarK wrote:
On July 20 2016 01:41 xDaunt wrote:
The response to Melania's speech is highly amusing. Y'all and the media are unhinged.

Do you not believe she did it or not believe she did anything wrong?

In all likelihood, someone did it. I'm just amused by the reaction. I'd say that it has an air of desperation to it, but none of you think that Trump can win, anyway.

The funny part is that, as others have pointed out, the media focusing on Melania's speech has diverted attention from how much of a shitshow the rest of the event was, so everyone going all-in on this actually is a net positive for Trump.

If there's one thing that I've learned over the past year watching the Trump campaign, it's that none of this is going to matter anyway.
Doodsmack
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7224 Posts
July 19 2016 17:06 GMT
#86552
On July 20 2016 02:05 xDaunt wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 20 2016 01:59 TheYango wrote:
On July 20 2016 01:48 xDaunt wrote:
On July 20 2016 01:45 KwarK wrote:
On July 20 2016 01:41 xDaunt wrote:
The response to Melania's speech is highly amusing. Y'all and the media are unhinged.

Do you not believe she did it or not believe she did anything wrong?

In all likelihood, someone did it. I'm just amused by the reaction. I'd say that it has an air of desperation to it, but none of you think that Trump can win, anyway.

The funny part is that, as others have pointed out, the media focusing on Melania's speech has diverted attention from how much of a shitshow the rest of the event was, so everyone going all-in on this actually is a net positive for Trump.

If there's one thing that I've learned over the past year watching the Trump campaign, it's that none of this is going to matter anyway.


The primary and general are very different things.
CobaltBlu
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States919 Posts
July 19 2016 17:07 GMT
#86553
The plagiarism is just incompetence but the lame excuses coming from the campaign are what is really ridiculous. They have no respect for the people they purport to represent.
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands22051 Posts
July 19 2016 17:09 GMT
#86554
On July 20 2016 02:06 Doodsmack wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 20 2016 02:05 xDaunt wrote:
On July 20 2016 01:59 TheYango wrote:
On July 20 2016 01:48 xDaunt wrote:
On July 20 2016 01:45 KwarK wrote:
On July 20 2016 01:41 xDaunt wrote:
The response to Melania's speech is highly amusing. Y'all and the media are unhinged.

Do you not believe she did it or not believe she did anything wrong?

In all likelihood, someone did it. I'm just amused by the reaction. I'd say that it has an air of desperation to it, but none of you think that Trump can win, anyway.

The funny part is that, as others have pointed out, the media focusing on Melania's speech has diverted attention from how much of a shitshow the rest of the event was, so everyone going all-in on this actually is a net positive for Trump.

If there's one thing that I've learned over the past year watching the Trump campaign, it's that none of this is going to matter anyway.


The primary and general are very different things.

He is right tho, those who already love Trump do so in the face of a LOT of this sort of stuff, one more piece of evidence in a long line is not going to change their mind.
Getting people who support Trump to change there mind will take something truly big or very personal.
Not evidence of incompetents piece #27543
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-07-19 17:13:49
July 19 2016 17:11 GMT
#86555
On July 20 2016 02:09 Gorsameth wrote:
He is right tho, those who already love Trump do so in the face of a LOT of this sort of stuff, one more piece of evidence in a long line is not going to change their mind.
Getting people who support Trump to change there mind will take something truly big or very personal.
Not evidence of incompetents piece #27543

The decider isn't getting Trump supporters to not vote for Trump. It's getting people who don't like either candidate to decide that Trump is shitty enough to be worth voting against, rather than just not voting for either candidate because they both suck.

The same is true on the other side as well, so both sides are focused on making their opponent look worse, rather than trying to make their own candidate look better.
Moderator
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands22051 Posts
July 19 2016 17:13 GMT
#86556
On July 20 2016 02:11 TheYango wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 20 2016 02:09 Gorsameth wrote:
He is right tho, those who already love Trump do so in the face of a LOT of this sort of stuff, one more piece of evidence in a long line is not going to change their mind.
Getting people who support Trump to change there mind will take something truly big or very personal.
Not evidence of incompetents piece #27543

The decider isn't getting Trump supporters to not vote for Trump. It's getting people who don't like either candidate to decide that Trump is shitty enough to be worth voting against, rather than just not voting for either candidate because they both suck.

And the same applies to that. if the previous 27542 shows of incompetence didn't help then one more won't make the difference.
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
July 19 2016 17:18 GMT
#86557
But Conventions are for Independent voters not already die hard supporters. Never mind the fact that Roll Call was a debacle showing that the GOP unity is also a farce.
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
TheTenthDoc
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States9561 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-07-19 17:25:21
July 19 2016 17:24 GMT
#86558
On July 20 2016 01:51 xDaunt wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 20 2016 01:49 TheTenthDoc wrote:
On July 20 2016 01:41 xDaunt wrote:
The response to Melania's speech is highly amusing. Y'all and the media are unhinged.


You can't say with a straight face that Chelsea giving a speech at the Democratic convention that contained passages identical to Palin's from 2008 wouldn't be received with equal "unhingedness" by the media.

Sure I can. Politicians rip off speeches all of the time. That, and the mainstream media is in the tank for Hillary anyway, so you can't count on them to take her to task for anything that isn't as obvious as the FBI Director discussing "extreme carelessness."


I think it's pretty unlikely you wouldn't see it hit CNN and it would be all over the conservative media sphere, especially if there were multiple public statements from the Clinton campaign saying it never happened. It might not hit MSNBC though.

(it'd also be all over r/politics/Vox/Salon because they salivate at anything that makes Clinton look bad but they're not really "media" per se)

But we'll never know because Chelsea's speech writer probably won't be a total idiot.
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
July 19 2016 17:24 GMT
#86559
On July 20 2016 02:13 Gorsameth wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 20 2016 02:11 TheYango wrote:
On July 20 2016 02:09 Gorsameth wrote:
He is right tho, those who already love Trump do so in the face of a LOT of this sort of stuff, one more piece of evidence in a long line is not going to change their mind.
Getting people who support Trump to change there mind will take something truly big or very personal.
Not evidence of incompetents piece #27543

The decider isn't getting Trump supporters to not vote for Trump. It's getting people who don't like either candidate to decide that Trump is shitty enough to be worth voting against, rather than just not voting for either candidate because they both suck.

And the same applies to that. if the previous 27542 shows of incompetence didn't help then one more won't make the difference.

But it is two separate races. The people who decide general elections are not the people that ignored all 27542 fuck ups.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
xDaunt
Profile Joined March 2010
United States17988 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-07-19 17:27:25
July 19 2016 17:26 GMT
#86560
On July 20 2016 02:18 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
But Conventions are for Independent voters not already die hard supporters. Never mind the fact that Roll Call was a debacle showing that the GOP unity is also a farce.

The people who are even remotely inclined to consider supporting Trump aren't really going to care about what happens at the conventions. There are so many other obvious, overriding considerations, that the overblown focus on Melania's speech is little more than a media-driven tempest in a teapot.This isn't the kind of thing that moves the needle, particularly when people already accept and acknowledge that Trump's campaign is an ongoing trainwreck. His campaign can make any number of additional, similar errors, and still win in November.
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