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US Politics Mega-thread - Page 3095

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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.

In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up!

NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious.
Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action.
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23218 Posts
March 01 2016 23:35 GMT
#61881
On March 02 2016 08:29 Doublemint wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 02 2016 08:19 GreenHorizons wrote:
On March 02 2016 08:17 kwizach wrote:
On March 02 2016 08:15 GreenHorizons wrote:
On March 02 2016 08:06 kwizach wrote:
On March 02 2016 08:04 GreenHorizons wrote:
On March 02 2016 07:58 oneofthem wrote:
wall street supports hillary for defense against a guy like bernie. not because hillary will do their bidding but having an actively hostile major party is a risk and hillary is another layer of hedging against that risk. it is very rational even if they hugely prefer rubio or cruz over hillary.


That's mostly fair. I mean obviously they would prefer Rubio and his plan to eliminate capital gains taxes but the idea that Hillary will get anything significant done is pretty specious. That Hillary will be a defense for Wall st is not what I thought people were looking for in a Democratic nominee.

Are you actually going to stop whining about Hillary at one point? Or is Sanders' upcoming crushing defeat going to make things even worse in the next few days? Hillary has put forward a more serious plan for financial regulation and reform than Sanders. Let that sink in for a second.



Mmmhmm "serious".

I get that it's important to try to get Bernie out before the rest of the states (like New York) votes because it will look really bad for her to lose the state she represented as a Senator. Especially considering Trump is actually doing well there.

Hillary v Trump opens up a whole new path to 270, I'm going to keep reminding folks how terrible of an idea it is to put Hillary up in a general. Only Yoav mentioned that you'll all have to just pray that Hillary doesn't get indicted (even if later found innocent) or even that the FBI's leaks (which will come if she isn't indicted) don't expose something campaign ending. Bernie is the preference of many/most states that will actually vote D.

Hillary supporters have to admit that they supported her knowing full well her campaign could implode at any moment. What if trump releases his Transcripts? She'll be out of excuses and whatever he said won't matter.

Putting Hillary up in a general is a catastrophically bad idea I just want that to be clear and get everyone on record so that if she wins, I can remind you all how wrong you were.

You've been on record for saying that about fifty times. We get it.


So long as people defend her or advocate for her I'll be around to remind folks how bad of an idea that is.


then carry on with this thought and draw the final conclusion. the alternative is going hillary (including biting your tongue, making a fist in your pocket and cursing the 2 party system) . or going nowhere and by doing so indirectly strengthening trump. not going to vote does not send signals, I have been there. politicians laugh at that.

and considering how low the voter turnout usually is for US elections it is a very worrying fact as well. basically tearing a sizeable hole in the fabric of the world's "first" democracy.

on second thought... there is a third option as well. men who just want to watch the world burn might also vote for trump.


It's not over yet and between Trump and the FBI, Hillary's campaign could end at any moment. Plus there are more than 2 people on the ballot come November. Call it whatever you want but I won't be persuaded to vote for her based on rationalizations.

Democrats don't get to hold my vote hostage on the pretense that the alternative is worse. They want to win, they have to earn my vote.

If people want to blame anyone, they can blame the 10's of millions of Americans who don't even bother to vote, or the politicians that so discouraged them, not people who vote their convictions and not a party line or for the person they dislike less.
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
jcarlsoniv
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States27922 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-03-01 23:37:13
March 01 2016 23:36 GMT
#61882
On March 02 2016 08:26 ticklishmusic wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 02 2016 07:54 jcarlsoniv wrote:
On March 02 2016 07:20 ticklishmusic wrote:
right, because ex-president bill clinton is all about that voter suppression

or, as a poll worker said, the lines are long because its a popular voting site in an urban area with high population density

unless bill is going to pull a george wallace this is a complete non issue

sigh


Bias aside, and not to necessarily suggest it's voter suppression - what he is doing there is illegal. At my polling place, there was a cute little sign randomly (150ft I guess) outside the polling place saying "No Electioneering Beyond This Point".

Is it a major crime? No, I think it's a misdemeanor or whatever. But it's still kinda messed up.

On March 02 2016 07:37 ticklishmusic wrote:
on the other hand, sanders' new best friend, alan grayson, is a guy running a hedge fund (or 3, but hey who's counting) in the Caymans and under the gun for ethics violations and probably insider trading of some sort. but hey, he's one of the good wall street millionahs.


Has there been particular communication between them? Legit question - I really only saw that Grayson endorsed Bernie.


hes kind of thumbing his nose at the rules, but i doubt he's actually doing anything illegal.



Within 150 feet of a polling place…no person shall solicit votes for or against, or otherwise promote or oppose, any person or political
party or position on a ballot question, to be voted on at the current election. No campaign material intended to influence the vote of a
voter in the ongoing election, including campaign literature, buttons, signs, and ballot stickers, may be posted, exhibited, circulated, or
distributed in the polling place, in the building where it is located, on the building walls, on the premises where the building stands, or
within 150 feet of an entrance door to the building. ( 950 CMR 53.03(18); 54.04.22))


Source (for Massachusetts)

I mean, again, it's not a major deal, and it could be argued that "oh I'm sure people walk buy with buttons or shit all the time", but unless I'm misunderstanding that breaking a law is "illegal", then what he's doing was pretty objectively illegal.
Soniv ||| Soniv#1962 ||| @jcarlsoniv ||| The Big Golem ||| Join the Glorious Evolution. What's your favorite aminal, a bear? ||| Joe "Don't call me Daniel" "Soniv" "Daniel" Carlsberg LXIX ||| Paging Dr. John Shadow
plasmidghost
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
Belgium16168 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-03-01 23:41:11
March 01 2016 23:38 GMT
#61883
Sanders is done. He'll drop out of the race within two weeks. I expect Kasich to drop out within the next two days. Carson is stubborn, so I doubt he'll drop out until April. Cruz and Rubio will form an unholy alliance and try to merge their support, with the backing of the GOP establishment, into a last-ditch effort to Stump the Trump. They will fail. Trump will then turn his low-orbit ion cannon directly onto Shillary and completely BTFO her. On inauguration day next year, Trump will say "Obama... you're fired," before dissolving Congress and declaring himself president for life, ushering America into a new era of prosperity that the world will never see again.
Yugoslavia will always live on in my heart
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
March 01 2016 23:39 GMT
#61884
On March 02 2016 08:38 plasmidghost wrote:
Sanders is done. He'll drop out of the race within two weeks. I expect Kasich to drop out within the next two days. Carson is stubborn, so I doubt he'll drop out until April. Cruz and Rubio will form an unholy alliance and try to merge their support, with the backing of the GOP establishment, into a last-ditch effort to Stump the Trump. They will fail.


If Cruz did that he can kiss his Senate seat goodbye as Rubio is as establishment as it gets.
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23218 Posts
March 01 2016 23:41 GMT
#61885
On March 02 2016 08:36 jcarlsoniv wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 02 2016 08:26 ticklishmusic wrote:
On March 02 2016 07:54 jcarlsoniv wrote:
On March 02 2016 07:20 ticklishmusic wrote:
right, because ex-president bill clinton is all about that voter suppression

or, as a poll worker said, the lines are long because its a popular voting site in an urban area with high population density

unless bill is going to pull a george wallace this is a complete non issue

sigh


Bias aside, and not to necessarily suggest it's voter suppression - what he is doing there is illegal. At my polling place, there was a cute little sign randomly (150ft I guess) outside the polling place saying "No Electioneering Beyond This Point".

Is it a major crime? No, I think it's a misdemeanor or whatever. But it's still kinda messed up.

On March 02 2016 07:37 ticklishmusic wrote:
on the other hand, sanders' new best friend, alan grayson, is a guy running a hedge fund (or 3, but hey who's counting) in the Caymans and under the gun for ethics violations and probably insider trading of some sort. but hey, he's one of the good wall street millionahs.


Has there been particular communication between them? Legit question - I really only saw that Grayson endorsed Bernie.


hes kind of thumbing his nose at the rules, but i doubt he's actually doing anything illegal.



Show nested quote +
Within 150 feet of a polling place…no person shall solicit votes for or against, or otherwise promote or oppose, any person or political
party or position on a ballot question, to be voted on at the current election. No campaign material intended to influence the vote of a
voter in the ongoing election, including campaign literature, buttons, signs, and ballot stickers, may be posted, exhibited, circulated, or
distributed in the polling place, in the building where it is located, on the building walls, on the premises where the building stands, or
within 150 feet of an entrance door to the building. ( 950 CMR 53.03(18); 54.04.22))


Source (for Massachusetts)

I mean, again, it's not a major deal, and it could be argued that "oh I'm sure people walk buy with buttons or shit all the time", but unless I'm misunderstanding that breaking a law is "illegal", then what he's doing was pretty objectively illegal.


Reports of him electioneering inside some polling places too. If it was a polling place at least in his state or better that he could actually vote at he might be able to make the case he isn't electioneering. But he's not he's in a state Hillary is worried about losing inside polling places where he has no reason to be other than to influence voters.
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
ticklishmusic
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
United States15977 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-03-01 23:41:51
March 01 2016 23:41 GMT
#61886
On March 02 2016 08:36 jcarlsoniv wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 02 2016 08:26 ticklishmusic wrote:
On March 02 2016 07:54 jcarlsoniv wrote:
On March 02 2016 07:20 ticklishmusic wrote:
right, because ex-president bill clinton is all about that voter suppression

or, as a poll worker said, the lines are long because its a popular voting site in an urban area with high population density

unless bill is going to pull a george wallace this is a complete non issue

sigh


Bias aside, and not to necessarily suggest it's voter suppression - what he is doing there is illegal. At my polling place, there was a cute little sign randomly (150ft I guess) outside the polling place saying "No Electioneering Beyond This Point".

Is it a major crime? No, I think it's a misdemeanor or whatever. But it's still kinda messed up.

On March 02 2016 07:37 ticklishmusic wrote:
on the other hand, sanders' new best friend, alan grayson, is a guy running a hedge fund (or 3, but hey who's counting) in the Caymans and under the gun for ethics violations and probably insider trading of some sort. but hey, he's one of the good wall street millionahs.


Has there been particular communication between them? Legit question - I really only saw that Grayson endorsed Bernie.


hes kind of thumbing his nose at the rules, but i doubt he's actually doing anything illegal.



Show nested quote +
Within 150 feet of a polling place…no person shall solicit votes for or against, or otherwise promote or oppose, any person or political
party or position on a ballot question, to be voted on at the current election. No campaign material intended to influence the vote of a
voter in the ongoing election, including campaign literature, buttons, signs, and ballot stickers, may be posted, exhibited, circulated, or
distributed in the polling place, in the building where it is located, on the building walls, on the premises where the building stands, or
within 150 feet of an entrance door to the building. ( 950 CMR 53.03(18); 54.04.22))


Source (for Massachusetts)

I mean, again, it's not a major deal, and it could be argued that "oh I'm sure people walk buy with buttons or shit all the time", but unless I'm misunderstanding that breaking a law is "illegal", then what he's doing was pretty objectively illegal.


as long as he wasn't like "vote for hillary" i think he's technically on the right side of the law. from what i've read he showed up, chatted, thanked the workers and such. not something i would risk personally, but bill clinton is his own man.
(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
Saryph
Profile Joined April 2010
United States1955 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-03-01 23:41:48
March 01 2016 23:41 GMT
#61887
At my primary location (Virginia) there were only Trump signs on the side of the road. Pretty sure we're in trouble. The funny thing is, I don’t know a single person where I live who supports him.
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States42640 Posts
March 01 2016 23:41 GMT
#61888
On March 02 2016 08:38 plasmidghost wrote:
Sanders is done. He'll drop out of the race within two weeks. I expect Kasich to drop out within the next two days. Carson is stubborn, so I doubt he'll drop out until April. Cruz and Rubio will form an unholy alliance and try to merge their support, with the backing of the GOP establishment, into a last-ditch effort to Stump the Trump. They will fail.

Carson isn't stubborn, Carson is running a book tour scam in which he and his friends spend donated money freely on their own expenses and launder campaign money, which they can't just keep, into book money, which they can.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15684 Posts
March 01 2016 23:43 GMT
#61889
On March 02 2016 08:41 KwarK wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 02 2016 08:38 plasmidghost wrote:
Sanders is done. He'll drop out of the race within two weeks. I expect Kasich to drop out within the next two days. Carson is stubborn, so I doubt he'll drop out until April. Cruz and Rubio will form an unholy alliance and try to merge their support, with the backing of the GOP establishment, into a last-ditch effort to Stump the Trump. They will fail.

Carson isn't stubborn, Carson is running a book tour scam in which he and his friends spend donated money freely on their own expenses and launder campaign money, which they can't just keep, into book money, which they can.

Sarah Palin made everyone realize how easy it is to make a few mil of a a book.
plasmidghost
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
Belgium16168 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-03-01 23:47:02
March 01 2016 23:45 GMT
#61890
On March 02 2016 08:41 KwarK wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 02 2016 08:38 plasmidghost wrote:
Sanders is done. He'll drop out of the race within two weeks. I expect Kasich to drop out within the next two days. Carson is stubborn, so I doubt he'll drop out until April. Cruz and Rubio will form an unholy alliance and try to merge their support, with the backing of the GOP establishment, into a last-ditch effort to Stump the Trump. They will fail.

Carson isn't stubborn, Carson is running a book tour scam in which he and his friends spend donated money freely on their own expenses and launder campaign money, which they can't just keep, into book money, which they can.

I really hate career politicians and greedy bastards
Yugoslavia will always live on in my heart
jcarlsoniv
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States27922 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-03-01 23:47:43
March 01 2016 23:47 GMT
#61891
On March 02 2016 08:41 ticklishmusic wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 02 2016 08:36 jcarlsoniv wrote:
On March 02 2016 08:26 ticklishmusic wrote:
On March 02 2016 07:54 jcarlsoniv wrote:
On March 02 2016 07:20 ticklishmusic wrote:
right, because ex-president bill clinton is all about that voter suppression

or, as a poll worker said, the lines are long because its a popular voting site in an urban area with high population density

unless bill is going to pull a george wallace this is a complete non issue

sigh


Bias aside, and not to necessarily suggest it's voter suppression - what he is doing there is illegal. At my polling place, there was a cute little sign randomly (150ft I guess) outside the polling place saying "No Electioneering Beyond This Point".

Is it a major crime? No, I think it's a misdemeanor or whatever. But it's still kinda messed up.

On March 02 2016 07:37 ticklishmusic wrote:
on the other hand, sanders' new best friend, alan grayson, is a guy running a hedge fund (or 3, but hey who's counting) in the Caymans and under the gun for ethics violations and probably insider trading of some sort. but hey, he's one of the good wall street millionahs.


Has there been particular communication between them? Legit question - I really only saw that Grayson endorsed Bernie.


hes kind of thumbing his nose at the rules, but i doubt he's actually doing anything illegal.



Within 150 feet of a polling place…no person shall solicit votes for or against, or otherwise promote or oppose, any person or political
party or position on a ballot question, to be voted on at the current election. No campaign material intended to influence the vote of a
voter in the ongoing election, including campaign literature, buttons, signs, and ballot stickers, may be posted, exhibited, circulated, or
distributed in the polling place, in the building where it is located, on the building walls, on the premises where the building stands, or
within 150 feet of an entrance door to the building. ( 950 CMR 53.03(18); 54.04.22))


Source (for Massachusetts)

I mean, again, it's not a major deal, and it could be argued that "oh I'm sure people walk buy with buttons or shit all the time", but unless I'm misunderstanding that breaking a law is "illegal", then what he's doing was pretty objectively illegal.


as long as he wasn't like "vote for hillary" i think he's technically on the right side of the law. from what i've read he showed up, chatted, thanked the workers and such. not something i would risk personally, but bill clinton is his own man.


Dude.

Yes, Bill Clinton is his own man. But he's also directly the image of the "Clinton" brand. Being there, right outside the polling place, walking around polling place, is more overt than a Hillary banner hanging over a door. It's not like he's just hanging out.

It's not really worth arguing the point further - it is what it is. You advocate constantly for Bernie supporters to acknowledge the flaws of their candidate. It would be nice if you could do the same, look at this, and acknowledge "hmm, yeah, that could be a non-zero amount of sketchy."
Soniv ||| Soniv#1962 ||| @jcarlsoniv ||| The Big Golem ||| Join the Glorious Evolution. What's your favorite aminal, a bear? ||| Joe "Don't call me Daniel" "Soniv" "Daniel" Carlsberg LXIX ||| Paging Dr. John Shadow
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15684 Posts
March 01 2016 23:49 GMT
#61892
On March 02 2016 08:39 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 02 2016 08:38 plasmidghost wrote:
Sanders is done. He'll drop out of the race within two weeks. I expect Kasich to drop out within the next two days. Carson is stubborn, so I doubt he'll drop out until April. Cruz and Rubio will form an unholy alliance and try to merge their support, with the backing of the GOP establishment, into a last-ditch effort to Stump the Trump. They will fail.


If Cruz did that he can kiss his Senate seat goodbye as Rubio is as establishment as it gets.


And it's not like people can vote for both of them. An unholy alliance doesn't actually help either of them. Trump coming close to Cruz and Texas and clearly demolishing Rubio in Florida paints a picture where they can't really afford to even help each other. They need to beat everyone, individually.
SolaR-
Profile Blog Joined February 2004
United States2685 Posts
March 01 2016 23:49 GMT
#61893
On March 02 2016 08:41 Saryph wrote:
At my primary location (Virginia) there were only Trump signs on the side of the road. Pretty sure we're in trouble. The funny thing is, I don’t know a single person where I live who supports him.


I live in Virginia(Richmond) and I support him. Go Trump!
ticklishmusic
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
United States15977 Posts
March 01 2016 23:50 GMT
#61894
On March 02 2016 08:47 jcarlsoniv wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 02 2016 08:41 ticklishmusic wrote:
On March 02 2016 08:36 jcarlsoniv wrote:
On March 02 2016 08:26 ticklishmusic wrote:
On March 02 2016 07:54 jcarlsoniv wrote:
On March 02 2016 07:20 ticklishmusic wrote:
right, because ex-president bill clinton is all about that voter suppression

or, as a poll worker said, the lines are long because its a popular voting site in an urban area with high population density

unless bill is going to pull a george wallace this is a complete non issue

sigh


Bias aside, and not to necessarily suggest it's voter suppression - what he is doing there is illegal. At my polling place, there was a cute little sign randomly (150ft I guess) outside the polling place saying "No Electioneering Beyond This Point".

Is it a major crime? No, I think it's a misdemeanor or whatever. But it's still kinda messed up.

On March 02 2016 07:37 ticklishmusic wrote:
on the other hand, sanders' new best friend, alan grayson, is a guy running a hedge fund (or 3, but hey who's counting) in the Caymans and under the gun for ethics violations and probably insider trading of some sort. but hey, he's one of the good wall street millionahs.


Has there been particular communication between them? Legit question - I really only saw that Grayson endorsed Bernie.


hes kind of thumbing his nose at the rules, but i doubt he's actually doing anything illegal.



Within 150 feet of a polling place…no person shall solicit votes for or against, or otherwise promote or oppose, any person or political
party or position on a ballot question, to be voted on at the current election. No campaign material intended to influence the vote of a
voter in the ongoing election, including campaign literature, buttons, signs, and ballot stickers, may be posted, exhibited, circulated, or
distributed in the polling place, in the building where it is located, on the building walls, on the premises where the building stands, or
within 150 feet of an entrance door to the building. ( 950 CMR 53.03(18); 54.04.22))


Source (for Massachusetts)

I mean, again, it's not a major deal, and it could be argued that "oh I'm sure people walk buy with buttons or shit all the time", but unless I'm misunderstanding that breaking a law is "illegal", then what he's doing was pretty objectively illegal.


as long as he wasn't like "vote for hillary" i think he's technically on the right side of the law. from what i've read he showed up, chatted, thanked the workers and such. not something i would risk personally, but bill clinton is his own man.


Dude.

Yes, Bill Clinton is his own man. But he's also directly the image of the "Clinton" brand. Being there, right outside the polling place, walking around polling place, is more overt than a Hillary banner hanging over a door. It's not like he's just hanging out.

It's not really worth arguing the point further - it is what it is. You advocate constantly for Bernie supporters to acknowledge the flaws of their candidate. It would be nice if you could do the same, look at this, and acknowledge "hmm, yeah, that could be a non-zero amount of sketchy."


i said it's something i wouldn't do, and yes it's sketchy.

he's pushing the law 100% but by the letter of the law there's nothing wrong is what i'm saying.
(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
Doublemint
Profile Joined July 2011
Austria8504 Posts
March 01 2016 23:52 GMT
#61895
On March 02 2016 08:35 GreenHorizons wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 02 2016 08:29 Doublemint wrote:
On March 02 2016 08:19 GreenHorizons wrote:
On March 02 2016 08:17 kwizach wrote:
On March 02 2016 08:15 GreenHorizons wrote:
On March 02 2016 08:06 kwizach wrote:
On March 02 2016 08:04 GreenHorizons wrote:
On March 02 2016 07:58 oneofthem wrote:
wall street supports hillary for defense against a guy like bernie. not because hillary will do their bidding but having an actively hostile major party is a risk and hillary is another layer of hedging against that risk. it is very rational even if they hugely prefer rubio or cruz over hillary.


That's mostly fair. I mean obviously they would prefer Rubio and his plan to eliminate capital gains taxes but the idea that Hillary will get anything significant done is pretty specious. That Hillary will be a defense for Wall st is not what I thought people were looking for in a Democratic nominee.

Are you actually going to stop whining about Hillary at one point? Or is Sanders' upcoming crushing defeat going to make things even worse in the next few days? Hillary has put forward a more serious plan for financial regulation and reform than Sanders. Let that sink in for a second.



Mmmhmm "serious".

I get that it's important to try to get Bernie out before the rest of the states (like New York) votes because it will look really bad for her to lose the state she represented as a Senator. Especially considering Trump is actually doing well there.

Hillary v Trump opens up a whole new path to 270, I'm going to keep reminding folks how terrible of an idea it is to put Hillary up in a general. Only Yoav mentioned that you'll all have to just pray that Hillary doesn't get indicted (even if later found innocent) or even that the FBI's leaks (which will come if she isn't indicted) don't expose something campaign ending. Bernie is the preference of many/most states that will actually vote D.

Hillary supporters have to admit that they supported her knowing full well her campaign could implode at any moment. What if trump releases his Transcripts? She'll be out of excuses and whatever he said won't matter.

Putting Hillary up in a general is a catastrophically bad idea I just want that to be clear and get everyone on record so that if she wins, I can remind you all how wrong you were.

You've been on record for saying that about fifty times. We get it.


So long as people defend her or advocate for her I'll be around to remind folks how bad of an idea that is.


then carry on with this thought and draw the final conclusion. the alternative is going hillary (including biting your tongue, making a fist in your pocket and cursing the 2 party system) . or going nowhere and by doing so indirectly strengthening trump. not going to vote does not send signals, I have been there. politicians laugh at that.

and considering how low the voter turnout usually is for US elections it is a very worrying fact as well. basically tearing a sizeable hole in the fabric of the world's "first" democracy.

on second thought... there is a third option as well. men who just want to watch the world burn might also vote for trump.


It's not over yet and between Trump and the FBI, Hillary's campaign could end at any moment. Plus there are more than 2 people on the ballot come November. Call it whatever you want but I won't be persuaded to vote for her based on rationalizations.

Democrats don't get to hold my vote hostage on the pretense that the alternative is worse. They want to win, they have to earn my vote.

If people want to blame anyone, they can blame the 10's of millions of Americans who don't even bother to vote, or the politicians that so discouraged them, not people who vote their convictions and not a party line or for the person they dislike less.


well that's a somewhat ok position to have, besides the statement that hillary's campaign could end any minute now(lol).

just don't be mad if the outcome will be worse than the already expected one.
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15684 Posts
March 01 2016 23:54 GMT
#61896
Yeah I'm sure Clinton's campaign could just die at any moment. All these millionaires donating don't have any sort of inside connections to give them a feel for how strong the case against her is. They are donating millions on a whim, fully knowing she may end up in federal prison.
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-03-01 23:56:50
March 01 2016 23:55 GMT
#61897
Interesting Trump, and Rubio are both in Florida tonight.
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23218 Posts
March 01 2016 23:56 GMT
#61898
On March 02 2016 08:54 Mohdoo wrote:
Yeah I'm sure Clinton's campaign could just die at any moment. All these millionaires donating don't have any sort of inside connections to give them a feel for how strong the case against her is. They are donating millions on a whim, fully knowing she may end up in federal prison.


How quickly we forget about Jeb.
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
xDaunt
Profile Joined March 2010
United States17988 Posts
March 01 2016 23:56 GMT
#61899
Here's an amusing article from the Politico recounting how wrong most of the media pundits were when analyzing Trump's campaign last year. I think the key lesson here, like I have been advocating for some time now, is that people need to start thinking outside of the box when assessing what's going on. This anything but a typical election. We'll see whether this is a real "sea change" type of election, but at least for now, I think we can safely disregard a lot of what we think we know about American politics and the American electorate.
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15684 Posts
March 01 2016 23:58 GMT
#61900
I think Jeb would have done well if not for running against Trump. He was in the wrong place at the wrong time. The establishment had no idea how to handle him and so now he's toast. It's also an entirely different situation. The information you're talking about pertains to being arrested, not elected. Jeb's problem was getting support, not going to jail.
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