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On September 22 2015 08:27 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2015 08:13 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 08:03 xDaunt wrote:On September 22 2015 05:49 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 22 2015 05:30 farvacola wrote:
Scott Walker is out. Here's an article on it.
Gov. Scott Walker of Wisconsin has concluded he no longer has a path to the Republican presidential nomination and plans to drop out of the 2016 campaign, according to three Republicans familiar with his decision, who spoke on condition of anonymity.
Mr. Walker called a news conference in Madison at 6 p.m. Eastern time.
“The short answer is money,” said a supporter of Mr. Walker’s who was briefed on the decision. “He’s made a decision not to limp into Iowa.”
The supporter said Mr. Walker’s fund-raising had dried up after his decline in the polls and that campaign officials did not feel they could risk going into debt with the race so uncertain. The governor, who was scheduled to be in New York and Washington this week, partly to raise money, had built up an expansive staff, bringing on aides and consultants detailed to everything from Christian conservative outreach to Super Tuesday states. But his fund-raising did not keep pace with the money needed to sustain such an infrastructure.
Mr. Walker’s intended withdrawal is a humiliating climb down for a Republican governor once seen as all but politically invincible. He started the year at the top of the polls but has seen his position gradually deteriorate, amid the rise of Donald J. Trump’s populist campaign and repeated missteps by Mr. Walker himself.
In the most recent CNN survey, Mr. Walker drew support nationally from less than one-half of one percent of Republican primary voters. He faced growing pressure to shake up his campaign staff, a step he was loath to take, according to Republicans briefed on his deliberations.
I find this absolutely hilarious. On January 31 2015 01:13 xDaunt wrote:On January 31 2015 01:08 Mohdoo wrote:On January 31 2015 01:01 xDaunt wrote:On January 31 2015 00:59 RCMDVA wrote:
Mitt - officially not running.
Good riddance. He's given it a go twice already. I think we've seen enough. Who are you hoping to win the Republican ticket? Same person you expect to? As of now, Scott Walker and Scott Walker. Of course, this is subject to change as the campaign evolves. I don't really understand the Carson-hype (such as it is). Frankly, the Tea Party already has their damn-near-perfect candidate in Scott Walker. He's pretty much everything they could want and without the baggage. Most importantly, he's actually electable. Eventually the big money republican donors are going to figure out that no one wants Jeb and will start sending more funds Walker's way. So xDaunt, with your your analysis so wrong and your favorite out months before the first primary, who's your new preferred candidate? Who exactly correctly predicted that the republican race would be where it is now or would have anything resembling its current trajectory? With Jeb's continued popular marginalization, so far I'm looking fairly correct on that point. It's just going to be another candidate that finishes him off. Trump sucking up all of the air aside, Walker didn't do himself any favors after getting into the race. Specifically, he failed to bone up on issues beyond those that he dealt with in Wisconsin. His debate performances were not good. He didn't really make a good case for himself after he announced. For the record, I don't have anyone that I support at this stage and have kept an open mind to just about everyone. The only candidates whom I know that I don't like are Jeb, Jindal, Huckabee, and Carson. Do you think Trump would make a good president? Do you think Obama has made a good president? What exactly did Obama have to show for himself back in 2007-2008 beyond the ability to give a really good speech? From the perspective of skillsets and experience, Trump is infinitely more qualified to be president than Obama was back then. People don't get to where to Trump is unless they are incredibly impressive on a multitude of levels. In short, I can't say that I know that Trump would make a good president. But I don't see anything that immediately disqualifies him from that possibility.
I wasn't being accusatory or rhetorical or saying anything about Obama lol. I just wanted to know your sincere opinion on Trump.
Trump has no political experience, so how does that make him more qualified as a politician than a politician? Let alone "infinitely more qualified"?
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On September 22 2015 08:27 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2015 08:13 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 08:03 xDaunt wrote:On September 22 2015 05:49 GreenHorizons wrote:On September 22 2015 05:30 farvacola wrote:
Scott Walker is out. Here's an article on it.
Gov. Scott Walker of Wisconsin has concluded he no longer has a path to the Republican presidential nomination and plans to drop out of the 2016 campaign, according to three Republicans familiar with his decision, who spoke on condition of anonymity.
Mr. Walker called a news conference in Madison at 6 p.m. Eastern time.
“The short answer is money,” said a supporter of Mr. Walker’s who was briefed on the decision. “He’s made a decision not to limp into Iowa.”
The supporter said Mr. Walker’s fund-raising had dried up after his decline in the polls and that campaign officials did not feel they could risk going into debt with the race so uncertain. The governor, who was scheduled to be in New York and Washington this week, partly to raise money, had built up an expansive staff, bringing on aides and consultants detailed to everything from Christian conservative outreach to Super Tuesday states. But his fund-raising did not keep pace with the money needed to sustain such an infrastructure.
Mr. Walker’s intended withdrawal is a humiliating climb down for a Republican governor once seen as all but politically invincible. He started the year at the top of the polls but has seen his position gradually deteriorate, amid the rise of Donald J. Trump’s populist campaign and repeated missteps by Mr. Walker himself.
In the most recent CNN survey, Mr. Walker drew support nationally from less than one-half of one percent of Republican primary voters. He faced growing pressure to shake up his campaign staff, a step he was loath to take, according to Republicans briefed on his deliberations.
I find this absolutely hilarious. On January 31 2015 01:13 xDaunt wrote:On January 31 2015 01:08 Mohdoo wrote:On January 31 2015 01:01 xDaunt wrote:On January 31 2015 00:59 RCMDVA wrote:
Mitt - officially not running.
Good riddance. He's given it a go twice already. I think we've seen enough. Who are you hoping to win the Republican ticket? Same person you expect to? As of now, Scott Walker and Scott Walker. Of course, this is subject to change as the campaign evolves. I don't really understand the Carson-hype (such as it is). Frankly, the Tea Party already has their damn-near-perfect candidate in Scott Walker. He's pretty much everything they could want and without the baggage. Most importantly, he's actually electable. Eventually the big money republican donors are going to figure out that no one wants Jeb and will start sending more funds Walker's way. So xDaunt, with your your analysis so wrong and your favorite out months before the first primary, who's your new preferred candidate? Who exactly correctly predicted that the republican race would be where it is now or would have anything resembling its current trajectory? With Jeb's continued popular marginalization, so far I'm looking fairly correct on that point. It's just going to be another candidate that finishes him off. Trump sucking up all of the air aside, Walker didn't do himself any favors after getting into the race. Specifically, he failed to bone up on issues beyond those that he dealt with in Wisconsin. His debate performances were not good. He didn't really make a good case for himself after he announced. For the record, I don't have anyone that I support at this stage and have kept an open mind to just about everyone. The only candidates whom I know that I don't like are Jeb, Jindal, Huckabee, and Carson. Do you think Trump would make a good president? Do you think Obama has made a good president? What exactly did Obama have to show for himself back in 2007-2008 beyond the ability to give a really good speech? From the perspective of skillsets and experience, Trump is infinitely more qualified to be president than Obama was back then. People don't get to where to Trump is unless they are incredibly impressive on a multitude of levels. In short, I can't say that I know that Trump would make a good president. But I don't see anything that immediately disqualifies him from that possibility.
Trump has repeatedly displayed complete ignorance when it comes to both foreign and domestic issues.
I'm pretty sure that should make anyone question his ability to lead.
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On September 22 2015 08:15 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2015 08:12 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 08:08 Jormundr wrote:On September 22 2015 08:02 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 07:54 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 07:44 Stratos_speAr wrote:On September 22 2015 06:34 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 06:14 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 06:12 DickMcFanny wrote:
I like how Ben Carson says batshit insane, intellectually offensive things for months and nobody cares, now he says that someone who believes in theocracy shouldn't be elected president of a 'democracy' and he's getting flak for it from all sides.
There seems to be this cognitive dissonance on the democratic side. Defend gay rights, defend women's rights, defend freedom of speech, defend the right to religion, defend a democratic government... and defend the religion that hates all of these things.
Apparently you can deny the biggest problem the world has ever faced even exists, but if you say that a member of a death cult who literally yearns for the world to end shouldn't have control over the largest nuclear arsenal of the world you've crossed a line.
But that's how it works, you can't criticise an ideology without the 'ideots' feeling personally offended.
Thank Krishna he didn't criticise trickle-down economics, he might not have lived to tell the tale. So you're talking about Christianity, right? Because I am pretty sure that religion hates gays, abortions, women and all that if you read it the right way. No argument there. But you can't go on stage saying that a Christian shouldn't be president, because literally every single one of them has officially been a Christian. And there are degrees to terribleness. If you believe in any liberal values, Islam is objectively worse than the other religions. This is really short-sighted. Every religion has terrible, human-rights-violating values baked into their holy scriptures. Agreed, and it's not really surprising. These texts came out thousands of years ago; they're certainly not entirely relevant to the year 2015, given our more advanced understanding of facts, morality, etc. Yes, imagine what a mess Islam would be in if people took those words literally. Oops. It would look like the republican primary. Also, it's not like all Muslims are fundamentalist nutjobs. A small fringe group is. We'd live in a much worse world if the billions of Christians and Muslims were all extremists, but most understand that such a lifestyle is absurd. The overwhelming majority of them by an overwhelming margin.
Well that's just simply untrue.
In almost all Muslim majority countries the 'overwhelming majority' of people does believe that Sharia law should be the law of the land and is the revealed truth of their god.
If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than two thirds, you have Jordan, Indonesia, Egypt...
If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than three quarters... Let's try Pakistan, Morocco, Palestine...
Even if you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than 90% there's Iraq, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia..
In none of the Sub-Saharan or Middle Eastern Muslim majority countries, and especially not in East Asia, does a significant majority of people believe that women should have the same rights as men.
You can't judge by the Muslims in the USA, who are well educated, better integrated than black and hispanic people and who actually do better than the average American.
Of course it's stupid to define Islam by ISIS, but it's just as stupid to ignore the fact that in every Muslim majority country women are significantly worse off than men, Non-Muslims are significantly worse off than Muslims and a large majority of the population believes in Sharia law.
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On September 22 2015 07:51 DickMcFanny wrote:
I'm talking about climate change. That is the biggest problem the world has ever faced, choose whichever metric you like.
I'd say the biggest was all out nuclear war; which was (and possibly remains) a bigger problem than climate change. By the metric: risk of killing 90% of the world's population in the next 20 years.
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On September 22 2015 08:41 DickMcFanny wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2015 08:15 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 08:12 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 08:08 Jormundr wrote:On September 22 2015 08:02 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 07:54 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 07:44 Stratos_speAr wrote:On September 22 2015 06:34 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 06:14 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 06:12 DickMcFanny wrote:
I like how Ben Carson says batshit insane, intellectually offensive things for months and nobody cares, now he says that someone who believes in theocracy shouldn't be elected president of a 'democracy' and he's getting flak for it from all sides.
There seems to be this cognitive dissonance on the democratic side. Defend gay rights, defend women's rights, defend freedom of speech, defend the right to religion, defend a democratic government... and defend the religion that hates all of these things.
Apparently you can deny the biggest problem the world has ever faced even exists, but if you say that a member of a death cult who literally yearns for the world to end shouldn't have control over the largest nuclear arsenal of the world you've crossed a line.
But that's how it works, you can't criticise an ideology without the 'ideots' feeling personally offended.
Thank Krishna he didn't criticise trickle-down economics, he might not have lived to tell the tale. So you're talking about Christianity, right? Because I am pretty sure that religion hates gays, abortions, women and all that if you read it the right way. No argument there. But you can't go on stage saying that a Christian shouldn't be president, because literally every single one of them has officially been a Christian. And there are degrees to terribleness. If you believe in any liberal values, Islam is objectively worse than the other religions. This is really short-sighted. Every religion has terrible, human-rights-violating values baked into their holy scriptures. Agreed, and it's not really surprising. These texts came out thousands of years ago; they're certainly not entirely relevant to the year 2015, given our more advanced understanding of facts, morality, etc. Yes, imagine what a mess Islam would be in if people took those words literally. Oops. It would look like the republican primary. Also, it's not like all Muslims are fundamentalist nutjobs. A small fringe group is. We'd live in a much worse world if the billions of Christians and Muslims were all extremists, but most understand that such a lifestyle is absurd. The overwhelming majority of them by an overwhelming margin. Well that's just simply untrue. In almost all Muslim majority countries the 'overwhelming majority' of people does believe that Sharia law should be the law of the land and is the revealed truth of their god. If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than two thirds, you have Jordan, Indonesia, Egypt... If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than three quarters... Let's try Pakistan, Morocco, Palestine... Even if you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than 90% there's Iraq, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia.. In none of the Sub-Saharan or Middle Eastern Muslim majority countries, and especially not in East Asia, does a significant majority of people believe that women should have the same rights as men. You can't judge by the Muslims in the USA, who are well educated, better integrated than black and hispanic people and who actually do better than the average American. Of course it's stupid to define Islam by ISIS, but it's just as stupid to ignore the fact that in every Muslim majority country women are significantly worse off than men, Non-Muslims are significantly worse off than Muslims and a large majority of the population believes in Sharia law.
By that logic, black people are literally the worst.
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On September 22 2015 07:13 DickMcFanny wrote:
To come back to politics:
Why are these republican clowns so eager to attack Obama, yet not one of them picks up on the terror campaign Obama has going on in Pakistan (and Yemen)? Why aren't they demanding he be tried by an international council?
No American politician would ever demand that any American be tried by an international council. America defers to no one. The Hague? What's that? Somewhere in Europe maybe?
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On September 22 2015 08:43 Jormundr wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2015 08:41 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 08:15 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 08:12 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 08:08 Jormundr wrote:On September 22 2015 08:02 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 07:54 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 07:44 Stratos_speAr wrote:On September 22 2015 06:34 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 06:14 Plansix wrote:
[quote]
So you're talking about Christianity, right? Because I am pretty sure that religion hates gays, abortions, women and all that if you read it the right way. No argument there. But you can't go on stage saying that a Christian shouldn't be president, because literally every single one of them has officially been a Christian. And there are degrees to terribleness. If you believe in any liberal values, Islam is objectively worse than the other religions. This is really short-sighted. Every religion has terrible, human-rights-violating values baked into their holy scriptures. Agreed, and it's not really surprising. These texts came out thousands of years ago; they're certainly not entirely relevant to the year 2015, given our more advanced understanding of facts, morality, etc. Yes, imagine what a mess Islam would be in if people took those words literally. Oops. It would look like the republican primary. Also, it's not like all Muslims are fundamentalist nutjobs. A small fringe group is. We'd live in a much worse world if the billions of Christians and Muslims were all extremists, but most understand that such a lifestyle is absurd. The overwhelming majority of them by an overwhelming margin. Well that's just simply untrue. In almost all Muslim majority countries the 'overwhelming majority' of people does believe that Sharia law should be the law of the land and is the revealed truth of their god. If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than two thirds, you have Jordan, Indonesia, Egypt... If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than three quarters... Let's try Pakistan, Morocco, Palestine... Even if you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than 90% there's Iraq, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia.. In none of the Sub-Saharan or Middle Eastern Muslim majority countries, and especially not in East Asia, does a significant majority of people believe that women should have the same rights as men. You can't judge by the Muslims in the USA, who are well educated, better integrated than black and hispanic people and who actually do better than the average American. Of course it's stupid to define Islam by ISIS, but it's just as stupid to ignore the fact that in every Muslim majority country women are significantly worse off than men, Non-Muslims are significantly worse off than Muslims and a large majority of the population believes in Sharia law. By that logic, black people are literally the worst.
Not the point at all. This is about an ideology, not about the people who believe in it.
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On September 22 2015 08:43 Jormundr wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2015 08:41 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 08:15 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 08:12 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 08:08 Jormundr wrote:On September 22 2015 08:02 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 07:54 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 07:44 Stratos_speAr wrote:On September 22 2015 06:34 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 06:14 Plansix wrote:
[quote]
So you're talking about Christianity, right? Because I am pretty sure that religion hates gays, abortions, women and all that if you read it the right way. No argument there. But you can't go on stage saying that a Christian shouldn't be president, because literally every single one of them has officially been a Christian. And there are degrees to terribleness. If you believe in any liberal values, Islam is objectively worse than the other religions. This is really short-sighted. Every religion has terrible, human-rights-violating values baked into their holy scriptures. Agreed, and it's not really surprising. These texts came out thousands of years ago; they're certainly not entirely relevant to the year 2015, given our more advanced understanding of facts, morality, etc. Yes, imagine what a mess Islam would be in if people took those words literally. Oops. It would look like the republican primary. Also, it's not like all Muslims are fundamentalist nutjobs. A small fringe group is. We'd live in a much worse world if the billions of Christians and Muslims were all extremists, but most understand that such a lifestyle is absurd. The overwhelming majority of them by an overwhelming margin. Well that's just simply untrue. In almost all Muslim majority countries the 'overwhelming majority' of people does believe that Sharia law should be the law of the land and is the revealed truth of their god. If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than two thirds, you have Jordan, Indonesia, Egypt... If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than three quarters... Let's try Pakistan, Morocco, Palestine... Even if you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than 90% there's Iraq, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia.. In none of the Sub-Saharan or Middle Eastern Muslim majority countries, and especially not in East Asia, does a significant majority of people believe that women should have the same rights as men. You can't judge by the Muslims in the USA, who are well educated, better integrated than black and hispanic people and who actually do better than the average American. Of course it's stupid to define Islam by ISIS, but it's just as stupid to ignore the fact that in every Muslim majority country women are significantly worse off than men, Non-Muslims are significantly worse off than Muslims and a large majority of the population believes in Sharia law. By that logic, black people are literally the worst.
And there are 1.6 billion Muslims in the world. Whole nations he just doesn't factor into the narrative that Muslims are the blight he claims.
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On September 22 2015 08:57 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2015 08:43 Jormundr wrote:On September 22 2015 08:41 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 08:15 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 08:12 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 08:08 Jormundr wrote:On September 22 2015 08:02 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 07:54 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 07:44 Stratos_speAr wrote:On September 22 2015 06:34 DickMcFanny wrote:
[quote]
No argument there. But you can't go on stage saying that a Christian shouldn't be president, because literally every single one of them has officially been a Christian.
And there are degrees to terribleness. If you believe in any liberal values, Islam is objectively worse than the other religions. This is really short-sighted. Every religion has terrible, human-rights-violating values baked into their holy scriptures. Agreed, and it's not really surprising. These texts came out thousands of years ago; they're certainly not entirely relevant to the year 2015, given our more advanced understanding of facts, morality, etc. Yes, imagine what a mess Islam would be in if people took those words literally. Oops. It would look like the republican primary. Also, it's not like all Muslims are fundamentalist nutjobs. A small fringe group is. We'd live in a much worse world if the billions of Christians and Muslims were all extremists, but most understand that such a lifestyle is absurd. The overwhelming majority of them by an overwhelming margin. Well that's just simply untrue. In almost all Muslim majority countries the 'overwhelming majority' of people does believe that Sharia law should be the law of the land and is the revealed truth of their god. If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than two thirds, you have Jordan, Indonesia, Egypt... If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than three quarters... Let's try Pakistan, Morocco, Palestine... Even if you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than 90% there's Iraq, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia.. In none of the Sub-Saharan or Middle Eastern Muslim majority countries, and especially not in East Asia, does a significant majority of people believe that women should have the same rights as men. You can't judge by the Muslims in the USA, who are well educated, better integrated than black and hispanic people and who actually do better than the average American. Of course it's stupid to define Islam by ISIS, but it's just as stupid to ignore the fact that in every Muslim majority country women are significantly worse off than men, Non-Muslims are significantly worse off than Muslims and a large majority of the population believes in Sharia law. By that logic, black people are literally the worst. And there are 1.6 billion Muslims in the world. Whole nations he just doesn't factor into the narrative that Muslims are the blight he claims.
I'm very interested to hear those numbers. Which nations are you referring to exactly?
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On September 22 2015 08:41 DickMcFanny wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2015 08:15 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 08:12 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 08:08 Jormundr wrote:On September 22 2015 08:02 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 07:54 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 07:44 Stratos_speAr wrote:On September 22 2015 06:34 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 06:14 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 06:12 DickMcFanny wrote:
I like how Ben Carson says batshit insane, intellectually offensive things for months and nobody cares, now he says that someone who believes in theocracy shouldn't be elected president of a 'democracy' and he's getting flak for it from all sides.
There seems to be this cognitive dissonance on the democratic side. Defend gay rights, defend women's rights, defend freedom of speech, defend the right to religion, defend a democratic government... and defend the religion that hates all of these things.
Apparently you can deny the biggest problem the world has ever faced even exists, but if you say that a member of a death cult who literally yearns for the world to end shouldn't have control over the largest nuclear arsenal of the world you've crossed a line.
But that's how it works, you can't criticise an ideology without the 'ideots' feeling personally offended.
Thank Krishna he didn't criticise trickle-down economics, he might not have lived to tell the tale. So you're talking about Christianity, right? Because I am pretty sure that religion hates gays, abortions, women and all that if you read it the right way. No argument there. But you can't go on stage saying that a Christian shouldn't be president, because literally every single one of them has officially been a Christian. And there are degrees to terribleness. If you believe in any liberal values, Islam is objectively worse than the other religions. This is really short-sighted. Every religion has terrible, human-rights-violating values baked into their holy scriptures. Agreed, and it's not really surprising. These texts came out thousands of years ago; they're certainly not entirely relevant to the year 2015, given our more advanced understanding of facts, morality, etc. Yes, imagine what a mess Islam would be in if people took those words literally. Oops. It would look like the republican primary. Also, it's not like all Muslims are fundamentalist nutjobs. A small fringe group is. We'd live in a much worse world if the billions of Christians and Muslims were all extremists, but most understand that such a lifestyle is absurd. The overwhelming majority of them by an overwhelming margin. Well that's just simply untrue. In almost all Muslim majority countries the 'overwhelming majority' of people does believe that Sharia law should be the law of the land and is the revealed truth of their god. If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than two thirds, you have Jordan, Indonesia, Egypt... If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than three quarters... Let's try Pakistan, Morocco, Palestine... Even if you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than 90% there's Iraq, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia.. In none of the Sub-Saharan or Middle Eastern Muslim majority countries, and especially not in East Asia, does a significant majority of people believe that women should have the same rights as men. You can't judge by the Muslims in the USA, who are well educated, better integrated than black and hispanic people and who actually do better than the average American. Of course it's stupid to define Islam by ISIS, but it's just as stupid to ignore the fact that in every Muslim majority country women are significantly worse off than men, Non-Muslims are significantly worse off than Muslims and a large majority of the population believes in Sharia law.
Considering the only Muslims that could be President of the United States are by and large the Muslims in the United States who are well educated I think it's perfectly fine to judge Carson's statement through the lens of that population. They're certainly no death cult. Unless we've veered ultra far off of that topic into just religious argument I guess.
I mean, when Ted Cruz is disagreeing with your insanity you know you've gone off the deep end.
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On September 22 2015 09:00 DickMcFanny wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2015 08:57 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 08:43 Jormundr wrote:On September 22 2015 08:41 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 08:15 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 08:12 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 08:08 Jormundr wrote:On September 22 2015 08:02 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 07:54 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 07:44 Stratos_speAr wrote:
[quote]
This is really short-sighted.
Every religion has terrible, human-rights-violating values baked into their holy scriptures. Agreed, and it's not really surprising. These texts came out thousands of years ago; they're certainly not entirely relevant to the year 2015, given our more advanced understanding of facts, morality, etc. Yes, imagine what a mess Islam would be in if people took those words literally. Oops. It would look like the republican primary. Also, it's not like all Muslims are fundamentalist nutjobs. A small fringe group is. We'd live in a much worse world if the billions of Christians and Muslims were all extremists, but most understand that such a lifestyle is absurd. The overwhelming majority of them by an overwhelming margin. Well that's just simply untrue. In almost all Muslim majority countries the 'overwhelming majority' of people does believe that Sharia law should be the law of the land and is the revealed truth of their god. If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than two thirds, you have Jordan, Indonesia, Egypt... If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than three quarters... Let's try Pakistan, Morocco, Palestine... Even if you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than 90% there's Iraq, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia.. In none of the Sub-Saharan or Middle Eastern Muslim majority countries, and especially not in East Asia, does a significant majority of people believe that women should have the same rights as men. You can't judge by the Muslims in the USA, who are well educated, better integrated than black and hispanic people and who actually do better than the average American. Of course it's stupid to define Islam by ISIS, but it's just as stupid to ignore the fact that in every Muslim majority country women are significantly worse off than men, Non-Muslims are significantly worse off than Muslims and a large majority of the population believes in Sharia law. By that logic, black people are literally the worst. And there are 1.6 billion Muslims in the world. Whole nations he just doesn't factor into the narrative that Muslims are the blight he claims. I'm very interested to hear those numbers. Which nations are you referring to exactly?
Turkey is fine. Pakistan is working on it. Same with Egypt. Kuwaiti is fine and function. All of these nations have problems, but no worse than China or a South American Nation. And to be perfectly honest, I don't think we have room claim that US is this perfect land since our prison population is insane and we spend a lot of time debating if our police force has a problem with shooting people when few other "civilized nations" have this problem.
So some nations have problems with women's rights and education, we imprison the largest percentage of our citizens. And our cops shoot unarmed people a lot more than any place else. You take the good with the bad.
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On September 22 2015 09:03 TheTenthDoc wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2015 08:41 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 08:15 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 08:12 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 08:08 Jormundr wrote:On September 22 2015 08:02 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 07:54 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 07:44 Stratos_speAr wrote:On September 22 2015 06:34 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 06:14 Plansix wrote:
[quote]
So you're talking about Christianity, right? Because I am pretty sure that religion hates gays, abortions, women and all that if you read it the right way. No argument there. But you can't go on stage saying that a Christian shouldn't be president, because literally every single one of them has officially been a Christian. And there are degrees to terribleness. If you believe in any liberal values, Islam is objectively worse than the other religions. This is really short-sighted. Every religion has terrible, human-rights-violating values baked into their holy scriptures. Agreed, and it's not really surprising. These texts came out thousands of years ago; they're certainly not entirely relevant to the year 2015, given our more advanced understanding of facts, morality, etc. Yes, imagine what a mess Islam would be in if people took those words literally. Oops. It would look like the republican primary. Also, it's not like all Muslims are fundamentalist nutjobs. A small fringe group is. We'd live in a much worse world if the billions of Christians and Muslims were all extremists, but most understand that such a lifestyle is absurd. The overwhelming majority of them by an overwhelming margin. Well that's just simply untrue. In almost all Muslim majority countries the 'overwhelming majority' of people does believe that Sharia law should be the law of the land and is the revealed truth of their god. If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than two thirds, you have Jordan, Indonesia, Egypt... If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than three quarters... Let's try Pakistan, Morocco, Palestine... Even if you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than 90% there's Iraq, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia.. In none of the Sub-Saharan or Middle Eastern Muslim majority countries, and especially not in East Asia, does a significant majority of people believe that women should have the same rights as men. You can't judge by the Muslims in the USA, who are well educated, better integrated than black and hispanic people and who actually do better than the average American. Of course it's stupid to define Islam by ISIS, but it's just as stupid to ignore the fact that in every Muslim majority country women are significantly worse off than men, Non-Muslims are significantly worse off than Muslims and a large majority of the population believes in Sharia law. Considering the only Muslims that could be President of the United States are by and large the Muslims in the United States who are well educated I think it's perfectly fine to judge Carson's statement through the lens of that population.
Good point. I might have soapboxed a bit. Yes, Muslim Americans are probably not worse qualified than the average American to be president.
On September 22 2015 08:46 IgnE wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2015 07:13 DickMcFanny wrote:
To come back to politics:
Why are these republican clowns so eager to attack Obama, yet not one of them picks up on the terror campaign Obama has going on in Pakistan (and Yemen)? Why aren't they demanding he be tried by an international council? No American politician would ever demand that any American be tried by an international council. America defers to no one. The Hague? What's that? Somewhere in Europe maybe?
Sigh, I know that, I guess I just find it ironic / sad that the most heavily and in most cases most unfairly criticised president in the history of the US gets a free pass on crimes against humanity that in a fair world would get him incarcerated for life.
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On September 22 2015 09:10 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2015 09:00 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 08:57 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 08:43 Jormundr wrote:On September 22 2015 08:41 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 08:15 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 08:12 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 08:08 Jormundr wrote:On September 22 2015 08:02 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 07:54 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
[quote]
Agreed, and it's not really surprising. These texts came out thousands of years ago; they're certainly not entirely relevant to the year 2015, given our more advanced understanding of facts, morality, etc. Yes, imagine what a mess Islam would be in if people took those words literally. Oops. It would look like the republican primary. Also, it's not like all Muslims are fundamentalist nutjobs. A small fringe group is. We'd live in a much worse world if the billions of Christians and Muslims were all extremists, but most understand that such a lifestyle is absurd. The overwhelming majority of them by an overwhelming margin. Well that's just simply untrue. In almost all Muslim majority countries the 'overwhelming majority' of people does believe that Sharia law should be the law of the land and is the revealed truth of their god. If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than two thirds, you have Jordan, Indonesia, Egypt... If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than three quarters... Let's try Pakistan, Morocco, Palestine... Even if you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than 90% there's Iraq, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia.. In none of the Sub-Saharan or Middle Eastern Muslim majority countries, and especially not in East Asia, does a significant majority of people believe that women should have the same rights as men. You can't judge by the Muslims in the USA, who are well educated, better integrated than black and hispanic people and who actually do better than the average American. Of course it's stupid to define Islam by ISIS, but it's just as stupid to ignore the fact that in every Muslim majority country women are significantly worse off than men, Non-Muslims are significantly worse off than Muslims and a large majority of the population believes in Sharia law. By that logic, black people are literally the worst. And there are 1.6 billion Muslims in the world. Whole nations he just doesn't factor into the narrative that Muslims are the blight he claims. I'm very interested to hear those numbers. Which nations are you referring to exactly? Turkey is fine. Pakistan is working on it. Same with Egypt. Kuwaiti is fine and function. All of these nations have problems, but no worse than China or a South American Nation. And to be perfectly honest, I don't think we have room claim that US is this perfect land since our prison population is insane and we spend a lot of time debating if our police force has a problem with shooting people when few other "civilized nations" have this problem.
If I were a woman I wouldn't want to live in any of those countries.
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On September 22 2015 06:12 DickMcFanny wrote:
I like how Ben Carson says batshit insane, intellectually offensive things for months and nobody cares, now he says that someone who believes in theocracy shouldn't be elected president of a 'democracy' and he's getting flak for it from all sides.
There seems to be this cognitive dissonance on the democratic side. Defend gay rights, defend women's rights, defend freedom of speech, defend the right to religion, defend a democratic government... and defend the religion that hates all of these things.
Attacking Carson for his quote isn't defending Islam. It's defending the first amendment and the rights of Muslims. I don't believe that identifying as a Muslim is a sufficient reason to disqualify someone for presidency. Believing all the awful things in the Quran about women's rights is. But not every Muslim believes those passages just like how most Christians today are intelligent enough to ignore all the appalling passages in the Bible. Using your logic, any Christian would be unfit for president too.
I agree that liberals who defend Islam on the grounds of religious tolerance are cowardly and hypocritical. The religion can and should be criticized, but denying first amendment rights to Muslims is another thing IMO.
Personally I don't give a fuck what a presidential candidate's self-professed religious beliefs are, so long as the policies they make are based on reason instead of scripture. Conversely I think any candidate who decides on policies from his/her religious beliefs has already proven themselves unfit to be president. Unfortunately this already disqualifies a good number of the Republicans.
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On September 22 2015 09:12 IgnE wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2015 09:10 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 09:00 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 08:57 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 08:43 Jormundr wrote:On September 22 2015 08:41 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 08:15 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 08:12 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 08:08 Jormundr wrote:On September 22 2015 08:02 DickMcFanny wrote:
[quote]
Yes, imagine what a mess Islam would be in if people took those words literally. Oops. It would look like the republican primary. Also, it's not like all Muslims are fundamentalist nutjobs. A small fringe group is. We'd live in a much worse world if the billions of Christians and Muslims were all extremists, but most understand that such a lifestyle is absurd. The overwhelming majority of them by an overwhelming margin. Well that's just simply untrue. In almost all Muslim majority countries the 'overwhelming majority' of people does believe that Sharia law should be the law of the land and is the revealed truth of their god. If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than two thirds, you have Jordan, Indonesia, Egypt... If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than three quarters... Let's try Pakistan, Morocco, Palestine... Even if you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than 90% there's Iraq, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia.. In none of the Sub-Saharan or Middle Eastern Muslim majority countries, and especially not in East Asia, does a significant majority of people believe that women should have the same rights as men. You can't judge by the Muslims in the USA, who are well educated, better integrated than black and hispanic people and who actually do better than the average American. Of course it's stupid to define Islam by ISIS, but it's just as stupid to ignore the fact that in every Muslim majority country women are significantly worse off than men, Non-Muslims are significantly worse off than Muslims and a large majority of the population believes in Sharia law. By that logic, black people are literally the worst. And there are 1.6 billion Muslims in the world. Whole nations he just doesn't factor into the narrative that Muslims are the blight he claims. I'm very interested to hear those numbers. Which nations are you referring to exactly? Turkey is fine. Pakistan is working on it. Same with Egypt. Kuwaiti is fine and function. All of these nations have problems, but no worse than China or a South American Nation. And to be perfectly honest, I don't think we have room claim that US is this perfect land since our prison population is insane and we spend a lot of time debating if our police force has a problem with shooting people when few other "civilized nations" have this problem. If I were a woman I wouldn't want to live in any of those countries.
If we are going to be theoretical, if I were an Arab woman, I wouldn't' want to live in the US. Because the nation is kinda racist. I would live in Kuwaiti, given the option. But this is all theory since I am a white dude.
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On September 22 2015 09:11 DickMcFanny wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2015 09:03 TheTenthDoc wrote:On September 22 2015 08:41 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 08:15 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 08:12 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 08:08 Jormundr wrote:On September 22 2015 08:02 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 07:54 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 07:44 Stratos_speAr wrote:On September 22 2015 06:34 DickMcFanny wrote:
[quote]
No argument there. But you can't go on stage saying that a Christian shouldn't be president, because literally every single one of them has officially been a Christian.
And there are degrees to terribleness. If you believe in any liberal values, Islam is objectively worse than the other religions. This is really short-sighted. Every religion has terrible, human-rights-violating values baked into their holy scriptures. Agreed, and it's not really surprising. These texts came out thousands of years ago; they're certainly not entirely relevant to the year 2015, given our more advanced understanding of facts, morality, etc. Yes, imagine what a mess Islam would be in if people took those words literally. Oops. It would look like the republican primary. Also, it's not like all Muslims are fundamentalist nutjobs. A small fringe group is. We'd live in a much worse world if the billions of Christians and Muslims were all extremists, but most understand that such a lifestyle is absurd. The overwhelming majority of them by an overwhelming margin. Well that's just simply untrue. In almost all Muslim majority countries the 'overwhelming majority' of people does believe that Sharia law should be the law of the land and is the revealed truth of their god. If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than two thirds, you have Jordan, Indonesia, Egypt... If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than three quarters... Let's try Pakistan, Morocco, Palestine... Even if you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than 90% there's Iraq, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia.. In none of the Sub-Saharan or Middle Eastern Muslim majority countries, and especially not in East Asia, does a significant majority of people believe that women should have the same rights as men. You can't judge by the Muslims in the USA, who are well educated, better integrated than black and hispanic people and who actually do better than the average American. Of course it's stupid to define Islam by ISIS, but it's just as stupid to ignore the fact that in every Muslim majority country women are significantly worse off than men, Non-Muslims are significantly worse off than Muslims and a large majority of the population believes in Sharia law. Considering the only Muslims that could be President of the United States are by and large the Muslims in the United States who are well educated I think it's perfectly fine to judge Carson's statement through the lens of that population. Good point. I might have soapboxed a bit. Yes, Muslim Americans are probably not worse qualified than the average American to be president. Show nested quote +On September 22 2015 08:46 IgnE wrote:On September 22 2015 07:13 DickMcFanny wrote:
To come back to politics:
Why are these republican clowns so eager to attack Obama, yet not one of them picks up on the terror campaign Obama has going on in Pakistan (and Yemen)? Why aren't they demanding he be tried by an international council? No American politician would ever demand that any American be tried by an international council. America defers to no one. The Hague? What's that? Somewhere in Europe maybe? Sigh, I know that, I guess I just find it ironic / sad that the most heavily and in most cases most unfairly criticised president in the history of the US gets a free pass on crimes against humanity that in a fair world would get him incarcerated for life.
Can you please elaborate on these crimes that deserve life imprisonment? I assume you're referring to Obama?
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On September 22 2015 09:14 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2015 09:12 IgnE wrote:On September 22 2015 09:10 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 09:00 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 08:57 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 08:43 Jormundr wrote:On September 22 2015 08:41 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 08:15 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 08:12 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 08:08 Jormundr wrote:
[quote]
It would look like the republican primary. Also, it's not like all Muslims are fundamentalist nutjobs. A small fringe group is. We'd live in a much worse world if the billions of Christians and Muslims were all extremists, but most understand that such a lifestyle is absurd. The overwhelming majority of them by an overwhelming margin. Well that's just simply untrue. In almost all Muslim majority countries the 'overwhelming majority' of people does believe that Sharia law should be the law of the land and is the revealed truth of their god. If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than two thirds, you have Jordan, Indonesia, Egypt... If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than three quarters... Let's try Pakistan, Morocco, Palestine... Even if you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than 90% there's Iraq, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia.. In none of the Sub-Saharan or Middle Eastern Muslim majority countries, and especially not in East Asia, does a significant majority of people believe that women should have the same rights as men. You can't judge by the Muslims in the USA, who are well educated, better integrated than black and hispanic people and who actually do better than the average American. Of course it's stupid to define Islam by ISIS, but it's just as stupid to ignore the fact that in every Muslim majority country women are significantly worse off than men, Non-Muslims are significantly worse off than Muslims and a large majority of the population believes in Sharia law. By that logic, black people are literally the worst. And there are 1.6 billion Muslims in the world. Whole nations he just doesn't factor into the narrative that Muslims are the blight he claims. I'm very interested to hear those numbers. Which nations are you referring to exactly? Turkey is fine. Pakistan is working on it. Same with Egypt. Kuwaiti is fine and function. All of these nations have problems, but no worse than China or a South American Nation. And to be perfectly honest, I don't think we have room claim that US is this perfect land since our prison population is insane and we spend a lot of time debating if our police force has a problem with shooting people when few other "civilized nations" have this problem. If I were a woman I wouldn't want to live in any of those countries. If we are going to be theoretical, if I were an Arab woman, I wouldn't' want to live in the US. Because the nation is kinda racist. I would live in Kuwaiti, given the option. But this is all theory since I am a white dude.
just live in the bay area or nyc or something and you're generally fine and have way more rights and aren't as socially constrained
like i can't imagine any well-off educated arab woman would rather live in the places that specifically pigeonhole females into restricted roles to a much greater extent (if you're not well-off you don't have much of a choice anyway and without education you might be more indoctrinated into believing those restrictions are right/good)
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On September 22 2015 09:18 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2015 09:11 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 09:03 TheTenthDoc wrote:On September 22 2015 08:41 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 08:15 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 08:12 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 08:08 Jormundr wrote:On September 22 2015 08:02 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 07:54 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 07:44 Stratos_speAr wrote:
[quote]
This is really short-sighted.
Every religion has terrible, human-rights-violating values baked into their holy scriptures. Agreed, and it's not really surprising. These texts came out thousands of years ago; they're certainly not entirely relevant to the year 2015, given our more advanced understanding of facts, morality, etc. Yes, imagine what a mess Islam would be in if people took those words literally. Oops. It would look like the republican primary. Also, it's not like all Muslims are fundamentalist nutjobs. A small fringe group is. We'd live in a much worse world if the billions of Christians and Muslims were all extremists, but most understand that such a lifestyle is absurd. The overwhelming majority of them by an overwhelming margin. Well that's just simply untrue. In almost all Muslim majority countries the 'overwhelming majority' of people does believe that Sharia law should be the law of the land and is the revealed truth of their god. If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than two thirds, you have Jordan, Indonesia, Egypt... If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than three quarters... Let's try Pakistan, Morocco, Palestine... Even if you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than 90% there's Iraq, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia.. In none of the Sub-Saharan or Middle Eastern Muslim majority countries, and especially not in East Asia, does a significant majority of people believe that women should have the same rights as men. You can't judge by the Muslims in the USA, who are well educated, better integrated than black and hispanic people and who actually do better than the average American. Of course it's stupid to define Islam by ISIS, but it's just as stupid to ignore the fact that in every Muslim majority country women are significantly worse off than men, Non-Muslims are significantly worse off than Muslims and a large majority of the population believes in Sharia law. Considering the only Muslims that could be President of the United States are by and large the Muslims in the United States who are well educated I think it's perfectly fine to judge Carson's statement through the lens of that population. Good point. I might have soapboxed a bit. Yes, Muslim Americans are probably not worse qualified than the average American to be president. On September 22 2015 08:46 IgnE wrote:On September 22 2015 07:13 DickMcFanny wrote:
To come back to politics:
Why are these republican clowns so eager to attack Obama, yet not one of them picks up on the terror campaign Obama has going on in Pakistan (and Yemen)? Why aren't they demanding he be tried by an international council? No American politician would ever demand that any American be tried by an international council. America defers to no one. The Hague? What's that? Somewhere in Europe maybe? Sigh, I know that, I guess I just find it ironic / sad that the most heavily and in most cases most unfairly criticised president in the history of the US gets a free pass on crimes against humanity that in a fair world would get him incarcerated for life. Can you please elaborate on these crimes that deserve life imprisonment? I assume you're referring to Obama?
Of course I am. His drone programme has killed, depending on whom you ask, at least 500 civilian targets in Pakistan and another 100 (approximately) in Yemen, Somalia and Afghanistan. Many of those were children.
Even the official targets were in most cases people who were suspected (not convicted) of at some point in the future possibly backing terrorist groups. That's like Minority Report to the second degree.
To be clear, we're not talking about civilian casualties in a war. We're talking about by American and international law, innocent people getting killed for crimes they have not committed.
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On September 22 2015 09:14 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2015 09:12 IgnE wrote:On September 22 2015 09:10 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 09:00 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 08:57 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 08:43 Jormundr wrote:On September 22 2015 08:41 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 08:15 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 08:12 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 08:08 Jormundr wrote:
[quote]
It would look like the republican primary. Also, it's not like all Muslims are fundamentalist nutjobs. A small fringe group is. We'd live in a much worse world if the billions of Christians and Muslims were all extremists, but most understand that such a lifestyle is absurd. The overwhelming majority of them by an overwhelming margin. Well that's just simply untrue. In almost all Muslim majority countries the 'overwhelming majority' of people does believe that Sharia law should be the law of the land and is the revealed truth of their god. If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than two thirds, you have Jordan, Indonesia, Egypt... If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than three quarters... Let's try Pakistan, Morocco, Palestine... Even if you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than 90% there's Iraq, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia.. In none of the Sub-Saharan or Middle Eastern Muslim majority countries, and especially not in East Asia, does a significant majority of people believe that women should have the same rights as men. You can't judge by the Muslims in the USA, who are well educated, better integrated than black and hispanic people and who actually do better than the average American. Of course it's stupid to define Islam by ISIS, but it's just as stupid to ignore the fact that in every Muslim majority country women are significantly worse off than men, Non-Muslims are significantly worse off than Muslims and a large majority of the population believes in Sharia law. By that logic, black people are literally the worst. And there are 1.6 billion Muslims in the world. Whole nations he just doesn't factor into the narrative that Muslims are the blight he claims. I'm very interested to hear those numbers. Which nations are you referring to exactly? Turkey is fine. Pakistan is working on it. Same with Egypt. Kuwaiti is fine and function. All of these nations have problems, but no worse than China or a South American Nation. And to be perfectly honest, I don't think we have room claim that US is this perfect land since our prison population is insane and we spend a lot of time debating if our police force has a problem with shooting people when few other "civilized nations" have this problem. If I were a woman I wouldn't want to live in any of those countries. If we are going to be theoretical, if I were an Arab woman, I wouldn't' want to live in the US. Because the nation is kinda racist. I would live in Kuwaiti, given the option. But this is all theory since I am a white dude.
My girlfriend, Moroccan, doesn't want to return to Morocco (not just because of the woeful state of women's rights, but they do play a part). But having lived in Brazil, she doesn't want to return to Europe either. Exactly because she felt like a second-rate citizen. Here she is simply accepted as a foreigner from a country most people can't place on a map. It makes our next step tricky, because we're not here long-term.
But so much for that off-topic discussion. I just thought this might be an interesting anecdote to add to your point 
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On September 22 2015 09:27 DickMcFanny wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2015 09:18 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 09:11 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 09:03 TheTenthDoc wrote:On September 22 2015 08:41 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 08:15 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 08:12 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On September 22 2015 08:08 Jormundr wrote:On September 22 2015 08:02 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 07:54 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
[quote]
Agreed, and it's not really surprising. These texts came out thousands of years ago; they're certainly not entirely relevant to the year 2015, given our more advanced understanding of facts, morality, etc. Yes, imagine what a mess Islam would be in if people took those words literally. Oops. It would look like the republican primary. Also, it's not like all Muslims are fundamentalist nutjobs. A small fringe group is. We'd live in a much worse world if the billions of Christians and Muslims were all extremists, but most understand that such a lifestyle is absurd. The overwhelming majority of them by an overwhelming margin. Well that's just simply untrue. In almost all Muslim majority countries the 'overwhelming majority' of people does believe that Sharia law should be the law of the land and is the revealed truth of their god. If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than two thirds, you have Jordan, Indonesia, Egypt... If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than three quarters... Let's try Pakistan, Morocco, Palestine... Even if you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than 90% there's Iraq, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia.. In none of the Sub-Saharan or Middle Eastern Muslim majority countries, and especially not in East Asia, does a significant majority of people believe that women should have the same rights as men. You can't judge by the Muslims in the USA, who are well educated, better integrated than black and hispanic people and who actually do better than the average American. Of course it's stupid to define Islam by ISIS, but it's just as stupid to ignore the fact that in every Muslim majority country women are significantly worse off than men, Non-Muslims are significantly worse off than Muslims and a large majority of the population believes in Sharia law. Considering the only Muslims that could be President of the United States are by and large the Muslims in the United States who are well educated I think it's perfectly fine to judge Carson's statement through the lens of that population. Good point. I might have soapboxed a bit. Yes, Muslim Americans are probably not worse qualified than the average American to be president. On September 22 2015 08:46 IgnE wrote:On September 22 2015 07:13 DickMcFanny wrote:
To come back to politics:
Why are these republican clowns so eager to attack Obama, yet not one of them picks up on the terror campaign Obama has going on in Pakistan (and Yemen)? Why aren't they demanding he be tried by an international council? No American politician would ever demand that any American be tried by an international council. America defers to no one. The Hague? What's that? Somewhere in Europe maybe? Sigh, I know that, I guess I just find it ironic / sad that the most heavily and in most cases most unfairly criticised president in the history of the US gets a free pass on crimes against humanity that in a fair world would get him incarcerated for life. Can you please elaborate on these crimes that deserve life imprisonment? I assume you're referring to Obama? Of course I am. His drone programme has killed, depending on whom you ask, at least 500 civilian targets in Pakistan and another 100 (approximately) in Yemen, Somalia and Afghanistan. Many of those were children. Even the official targets were in most cases people who were suspected (not convicted) of at some point in the future possibly backing terrorist groups. That's like Minority Report to the second degree. To be clear, we're not talking about civilian casualties in a war. We're talking about by American and international law, innocent people getting killed for crimes they have not committed.
George W. Bush and Chaney first please. If we are going for war crimes, lets go them and start with tricking Congress into declaring war on a sovereign nation based on bad intelligence. And move on the authorizing torture(and being super fucking open about it too) and work our way down.
And then we can go after George W. Bush for creating the drone program you are objecting too.
On September 22 2015 09:35 Acrofales wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2015 09:14 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 09:12 IgnE wrote:On September 22 2015 09:10 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 09:00 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 08:57 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 08:43 Jormundr wrote:On September 22 2015 08:41 DickMcFanny wrote:On September 22 2015 08:15 Plansix wrote:On September 22 2015 08:12 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
[quote]
Also, it's not like all Muslims are fundamentalist nutjobs. A small fringe group is. We'd live in a much worse world if the billions of Christians and Muslims were all extremists, but most understand that such a lifestyle is absurd. The overwhelming majority of them by an overwhelming margin. Well that's just simply untrue. In almost all Muslim majority countries the 'overwhelming majority' of people does believe that Sharia law should be the law of the land and is the revealed truth of their god. If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than two thirds, you have Jordan, Indonesia, Egypt... If you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than three quarters... Let's try Pakistan, Morocco, Palestine... Even if you define the 'overwhelming majority' as more than 90% there's Iraq, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia.. In none of the Sub-Saharan or Middle Eastern Muslim majority countries, and especially not in East Asia, does a significant majority of people believe that women should have the same rights as men. You can't judge by the Muslims in the USA, who are well educated, better integrated than black and hispanic people and who actually do better than the average American. Of course it's stupid to define Islam by ISIS, but it's just as stupid to ignore the fact that in every Muslim majority country women are significantly worse off than men, Non-Muslims are significantly worse off than Muslims and a large majority of the population believes in Sharia law. By that logic, black people are literally the worst. And there are 1.6 billion Muslims in the world. Whole nations he just doesn't factor into the narrative that Muslims are the blight he claims. I'm very interested to hear those numbers. Which nations are you referring to exactly? Turkey is fine. Pakistan is working on it. Same with Egypt. Kuwaiti is fine and function. All of these nations have problems, but no worse than China or a South American Nation. And to be perfectly honest, I don't think we have room claim that US is this perfect land since our prison population is insane and we spend a lot of time debating if our police force has a problem with shooting people when few other "civilized nations" have this problem. If I were a woman I wouldn't want to live in any of those countries. If we are going to be theoretical, if I were an Arab woman, I wouldn't' want to live in the US. Because the nation is kinda racist. I would live in Kuwaiti, given the option. But this is all theory since I am a white dude. My girlfriend, Moroccan, doesn't want to return to Morocco (not just because of the woeful state of women's rights, but they do play a part). But having lived in Brazil, she doesn't want to return to Europe either. Exactly because she felt like a second-rate citizen. Here she is simply accepted as a foreigner from a country most people can't place on a map. It makes our next step tricky, because we're not here long-term. But so much for that off-topic discussion. I just thought this might be an interesting anecdote to add to your point
To quote my friend from Bangladesh, "Being brown in a country of white people isn't always a ton of fun."
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EPT
