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Stop the Korean Invasion! - Page 13

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Chilling5pr33
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
Germany518 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-06 13:29:14
June 06 2012 13:28 GMT
#241
On June 06 2012 22:27 Hemula wrote:
Why this thread isn't closed?

Nah im fine with it, how else can you tell who is racist scum?
F-
Vansetsu
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States1454 Posts
June 06 2012 13:28 GMT
#242
This is a dumb thread. You want people from everywhere to play, but you don't care if everyone knows how to play well. Here's an idea: Korea built their scene, if we actually care so much, we can build ours? Our fan base might care but our player/team base does not. We have just as many (more actually) talented players here in the west (and not just the talking heads you see with fanclubs and podcasts), we just don't have disciplined settings and good people scouting for the talent. I know complete gosus that don't even try to play this game and have more than one account in GM, yet no one bothers to pick these players up and do something with them. Guess what happens? They stop playing video games, or start playing other shit casually or focus on college. If we want a talented scene, we need to find young players with skill, PAY THEM WELL and train the fuck out of them. It's a hit and miss investment and you'll miss more often than you'll hit, but if you want a real scene, you have to take raw talent and build it up, just like good people in sports have to do the work and train their bodies to become decent athletes. If enough people/teams start doing that, then all of the sudden we have real "scene" and we don't nessacarily have to watch Koreas metagame to be competitive, we start making our own.

But, even more importantly, everything above is pretty much irrelavant: Who the fuck cares if the highest caliber players eat noodles or fucking cheezburgers. Just because you can't prescribe to another culture doesn't mean that culture sucks, it means your shortchanging it beause you don't know how to appreciate something you don't understand. I don't root for people because they carry a flag or speak a certain language, I root for someone based on their skill, their passion to win, there hard work, ect. You can make a story out of anything, but if someones nationality is such an important part of the story you are looking for in a sport, then it's a shallow fucking story and I could give a fuck lss if you or any other person ever finds it.

I'm all about everyone being able to play well, more people playing at a high level globally is good for everyone. But until we put in our own amount of effort to even hit par with everyone else, I could care less. When I start seeing large teams with B-teams within themselves seriously taking gameing seriously, constantly trying to pick up new talent and not cash out on e-famous subpar players while they can, then I might get more excited about western e-sports, because we'll have teams that can compete with anyone. Until then, anything else is a novelty to see how much we are missing par, or how strong one of our anomoly players are (players like stephano nani or thorzain who get far based lots of natural skill and/or hard work).
Only by overcoming many obstacles does a river become - デイヴィ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ド
Maxquatre
Profile Joined April 2011
France493 Posts
June 06 2012 13:28 GMT
#243
On June 06 2012 22:27 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 06 2012 22:26 Maxquatre wrote:
On June 06 2012 22:23 shadymmj wrote:
the problem is that if u do that, it will be a big blow for the scene in korea. why have a 100 gosu players when only the 3 most gosu can show up at international tournaments? and the other 97 live off rice and canned tuna?


So we should be more concerned about korean scene than international scene?

Btw, was it that long ago when tourney outside of korea were without koreans and people were still very interested in them ?


People weren't anywhere near as intersted in them.

The audience for MLG's has grown phenomenally since they started inviting Koreans.


You mean since the game was not so difficult and advertised that random scrubs could play it ? (BW => SC2)
Aunvilgod
Profile Joined December 2011
2653 Posts
June 06 2012 13:29 GMT
#244
On June 06 2012 21:22 Corsica wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 06 2012 21:19 Hassybaby wrote:
On June 06 2012 21:17 Naniwa wrote:
On June 06 2012 21:16 Hassybaby wrote:
Damn people who practice the game more winning!

Right?



foreigners dont have same conditions as the koreans shut your mouth if you just jump on the bandwagon response


The EG, fnatic and TL houses would like to disagree



Koreans can play the game for the whole day, most of the foreigners have to study/work and dont have good infrastructure.


Then please explain why all the EG, Liquid and other foreign full-time players can´t compete with koreans on a regular basis.

ilovegroov | Blizzards mapmaker(s?) suck ass | #1 Protoss hater
masakenji
Profile Joined November 2011
Australia415 Posts
June 06 2012 13:29 GMT
#245
what a disgraceful thread.
zefreak
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
United States2731 Posts
June 06 2012 13:29 GMT
#246
On June 06 2012 22:26 Maxquatre wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 06 2012 22:23 shadymmj wrote:
the problem is that if u do that, it will be a big blow for the scene in korea. why have a 100 gosu players when only the 3 most gosu can show up at international tournaments? and the other 97 live off rice and canned tuna?


So we should be more concerned about korean scene than international scene?



I am. Most korean players don't get a salary from the team. It's disgraceful that Naniwa complains about korean's working together and their infrastructure when he gets payed by his team and many koreans who are better than him don't. If foreign tournaments didn't allow as many koreans to play, they would only have GSL for the vast majority of korean pros (MC etc would still be flown around by teams, but most wouldn't). The korean scene would definitely shrink.
www.gosu-sc.com - Starcraft News, Strategy and Merchandise
Dodgin
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
Canada39254 Posts
June 06 2012 13:30 GMT
#247
On a somewhat related note, I feel like a lot of people don't actually like the game but they like the drama surrounding it.

If your primary reason to watch Starcraft competition is not the gameplay then what are you doing here?
hitpoint
Profile Joined October 2010
United States1511 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-06 13:32:50
June 06 2012 13:30 GMT
#248
Agree fully with OP. Watching Korean vs Korean is boring. I want variety. I can watch GSL every day, I don't need the same product from MLG.

If that makes me racist scum, then I guess I'm racist scum. I know 90% of the people here would rather see foreigners mixed in a bit more, even if they won't admit it.
It's spelled LOSE not LOOSE.
Grovbolle
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
Denmark3811 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-06 13:30:57
June 06 2012 13:30 GMT
#249
The best players are more interesting than scrubs who can't beat the best. This OP makes little sense and is generally racist.

Koreans are better, is it because they are Koreans, or because they practise more and better????? It's a mystery...
Lies, damned lies and statistics: http://aligulac.com
zefreak
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
United States2731 Posts
June 06 2012 13:30 GMT
#250
On June 06 2012 22:24 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote:

Africa doesn't have as good an infrastructure for making footballers as Europe and South America. If only Drogba, Eto'o, Essien, Weah and Miller had spent all day whining about the injustice on the internet instead of working their asses off and becoming some of the best players in the world.

Every single sport in existance is dominated by certain countries. If you're too racist/pathetic to enjoy Brazilians playing football, Aussies playing cricket, Americans playing basketball, black people running or Koreans playing Starcraft you really need to take your racist hat off and think whether you even enjoy the game at all.


Great post, I think this should replace the OP
www.gosu-sc.com - Starcraft News, Strategy and Merchandise
HomeWorld
Profile Joined December 2011
Romania903 Posts
June 06 2012 13:31 GMT
#251
On June 06 2012 22:19 BoxingKangaroo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 06 2012 22:16 LimitSEA wrote:
On June 06 2012 22:11 Maxquatre wrote:
On June 06 2012 22:08 Jojo131 wrote:
On June 06 2012 22:02 Klaas wrote:
On June 06 2012 21:52 RageCommodore wrote:
That's like saying "ban the european teams from Soccer world championship, they are too strong!!!1"


Look at the qualifying spots for the world cup, the tournament would be composed of mostly european and south american teams if they didn't have limited spots. Countries like New Zealand, T&T, N. Korea and so on would never qualify.

Anyway I lose interest when brackets are filled nothing but koreans in foreign tournaments, while touranments without koreans have much less prestige, I want tournaments to find the middle ground and invite like half a dozen koreans at most.

But see, the middle ground will be "found" once foreigners actually earn those spots, not by artificially controlling who gets to compete.


Because obviously, we've seen more and more foreigners able to compete against koreans. And it's also pretty clear that seeing that none succeed, other will be motivated to continue working to win, especially when their korean counterparts do whatever they can to make sure that they can't. (Naniwa's previous comment)

Except that we have seen more foreigners able to compete against Koreans. Or are you going to ignore Naniwa's recent GSL run? Stephano's runs through other recent korean dominated tournaments? Foreigners can compete with Koreans, given enough time.


I don't think the number has increased, Sure we've got Stephano and Naniwa now, but we lost Jinro and Idra. Some people are suggesting, that once the BW pros switch, there'll be no foreigner that will be able to compete.


The thing is that Jinro and Idra (for example) are under performing (or simply put they need to step up their gameplay to be as competitive as they were). Also do not expect miracles from the BW pros switching to SC2, they are way way behind (i might add years behind) compared to current top SC2 players.

Anyway, we are stucked between two realities, one being the koreans that uplifted e-sports to the rank of national sport and the rest of the world who doesn't gives too much crap about e-sports (tho lately things are improving regarding it). Ofc koreans will dominate the scene for now and for a quite good reason.

Also I request this thread to be closed as it only brings up the worst aspects of us to surface.
Aeroplaneoverthesea
Profile Joined April 2012
United Kingdom1977 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-06 13:32:44
June 06 2012 13:31 GMT
#252
Okay so we've established that we need the following seeded into MLG pool play for ethnic/gender/sexual diversity purposes.

30% white guys.
20% black guys
10% homosexuals
10% women

This will show Kespa that foreign Esports means business!

(by the way if anyone has any other minority groups desperately in need of some affirmative action just PM me and I will pass the message on to Sundance.)
FakeDeath
Profile Joined January 2011
Malaysia6060 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-06 13:33:10
June 06 2012 13:31 GMT
#253
On June 06 2012 22:27 RageCommodore wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 06 2012 22:20 FakeDeath wrote:
On June 06 2012 22:15 RageCommodore wrote:
Funny thing is that right now, the foreigner/korean competition is really good because a lot of foreigners seem to do what they should do: step up their game. Guys like Illusion have shown that you don't have to be Stephano to give top Koreans a run for their money. Seriously, this topic was brought up after MLG Anaheim last year, and now it's coming back... is this some kind of Anaheim curse?


Illusion is a Korean =.= and I am talking about QuanticIllusion.
Stephano is an exception of the foreigners where he actually has talent and can perform well against koreans.


So you're basically saying that Illusion wouldn't be good if he wasn't of korean descent? You're pretty racist then if you think that way.


I am trying to say that Koreans have more passion for the game than foreigner and hence work harder than foreigner.
Therefore they post better results than foreigners.

This is not called being a racist.There is a reason why Koreans outperform the foreigners.
Play your best
BoxingKangaroo
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
Japan955 Posts
June 06 2012 13:31 GMT
#254
On June 06 2012 22:28 Chilling5pr33 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 06 2012 22:27 Hemula wrote:
Why this thread isn't closed?

Nah im fine with it, how else can you tell who is racist scum?


People love to jump on the racist train don't they.

I don't believe personalities translate very well across the language barrier.
A part of my enjoyment of sports comes from personalities playing any given game.

Therefore, more Koreans, less enjoyment for me. Does this make me racist?
Bocian
Profile Joined September 2010
Poland259 Posts
June 06 2012 13:32 GMT
#255
As a casual viewer i agree with the OP. I didn't watched recent IPL finals because stephano was out earlier and there were only koreans. I like GSL and i love GSTL but I wanna see my FAVOURITE players on mlg not only koreans, even if the game level would be lesser.
Flayer.
Profile Joined May 2012
Turkey31 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-06 13:33:49
June 06 2012 13:32 GMT
#256
On June 06 2012 21:45 opterown wrote:
You can always watch IEM instead


I laughed so hard when Socke said "It's like the swarm, even if you beat 3 or 4 of them it's like 10 others waiting"
ahahahahah!
I sense a soul in search of answers
Eufouria
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United Kingdom4425 Posts
June 06 2012 13:32 GMT
#257
Random German 1 who likes to drink beer, if you want to watch foreigners play lower quality games then you can just watch the early open bracket losers games, and leave the late stages of the tournament for those that want to see the best players play high quality games.

Frankly a lot of foreign players should be glad that most of the customers that bring in the money that funds the teams and tournaments are as ignorant of the Korean scene as you, and also see most of the best players in the world as 'Korean X who likes noodles.' If most Korean's were actually marketable to the general eSports watching public there would probably only be like 15 foreign players with salaries.

Also everyone knows 감자탕 > Noodles.
RinconH
Profile Joined April 2010
United States512 Posts
June 06 2012 13:32 GMT
#258
I feel I have far more insight into the Koreans personality (bc of watching GSL), than the "Foreigners".
meadbert
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States681 Posts
June 06 2012 13:32 GMT
#259
There is a huge disconnect between Europeans and Americans regarding this issue. In Europe it is common to have rules regarding the number of foreigners allowed per league and per team, but the idea itself is totally foreign in America.

We do not limit the number of Latin Americans that play Major League Baseball.

We do not limit the number of Europeans that play Basketball.

We do not limit the number of Europeans or Canadians that play on American ice hockey teams.

American believe in letting the best play regardless of where they are from.

ESL and European leagues can be the leagues that keep out some of the best players for representing the wrong country, but in America lets keep letting the best compete against the best.
Chilling5pr33
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
Germany518 Posts
June 06 2012 13:32 GMT
#260
On June 06 2012 22:30 Dodgin wrote:
On a somewhat related note, I feel like a lot of people don't actually like the game but they like the drama surrounding it.

If your primary reason to watch Starcraft competition is not the gameplay then what are you doing here?


Every other sport has his dramas as well and overall its just another interesting part of it.
Low level players cant get enough out of the play to only concentrate on that so they choose to look at the drama as well.
Every big and well known sport has that and that just shows how much the community grows.
Its a good thing believe me.
F-
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