The PUA community - Page 118

A major problem with the PUA stuff is that it attacks the symptoms of one’s disease and not the actual disease itself. Most of the solutions are surface solutions. So you feel better in the short run and get some quick results, but ultimately you do worse in the long run.

The main thing that turned me off from those books is that they didn’t talk about guiding principles and empowering mindsets, just loads and loads of tactics.

Another major problem is that even when pickup does recommend inner core work, which it terms “inner game,” it recommends it filtered through an outcome-dependent external validation mindframe, which causes the advice to undermine itself. I’ll go more into this later in the section on David DeAngelo, but the shorthand version is that it recommends for you to do all this inner work, but trains you to do it primarily for the outcome of getting validation from women.

So you walk in with the assumption that a woman is automatically of higher value than you and that you have to proactively prove your higher value by saying or doing something impressive before you know anything about her? Do you even know if she’s bringing anything to the table that makes her even worth impressing? The DHV comes down to bragging and humblebragging, and once you do either you give the other person authority over you because you are affirming that they are worth impressing and auditioning for, before they’ve even done anything to demonstrate they bring anything of value themselves. It’s another form of taking a test, except you’re volunteering on your own for a test that hasn’t even been offered yet!

On March 25 2012 08:11 Catch wrote:
Perhaps the most complete and upfront article about PUA I've ever seen. I'll warn you right now, it is incredible long (~20,000 words) but might just be the best thing I've ever read that really dissected pick up down to the core, discussing the good and (mostly) the bad. Probably the reason I say screw PUA as it is right now, and am more into the self improvement side of things.

The Rawness Letter #4
Note: You don't really need to read the other three, but it will make a lot more sense. I at least recommend letter number one.
Also, I skipped sections II and III in the link.

Some of my favorite quotes from the article...



^- Very prevalent in PU these days. Probably why I only read Mark's stuff.





A very insightful man, and actually one of the blogs I'll start reading from now on. This took me awhile to get through, and his other posts aren't nearly this long (Nor deal with PU really) but still are very high quality.

On March 25 2012 12:23 squattincassanova wrote:
Ever wonder why in so many pick up threads there are so many people that care more about what other PUAs do or think than actually talking to girls?

On March 25 2012 12:23 squattincassanova wrote:
Ever wonder why in so many pick up threads there are so many people that care more about what other PUAs do or think than actually talking to girls?

On March 25 2012 08:11 Catch wrote:
Perhaps the most complete and upfront article about PUA I've ever seen. I'll warn you right now, it is incredible long (~20,000 words) but might just be the best thing I've ever read that really dissected pick up down to the core, discussing the good and (mostly) the bad. Probably the reason I say screw PUA as it is right now, and am more into the self improvement side of things.

The Rawness Letter #4
Note: You don't really need to read the other three, but it will make a lot more sense. I at least recommend letter number one.
Also, I skipped sections II and III in the link...

On March 25 2012 12:10 shinosai wrote:


I liked this quote: "Ever wonder why pickup artists develop this fanatical hatred of beta males? It’s their hatred of the beta traits they fear still exist within themselves, so they try to destroy these unwanted traits by first projecting them onto other male targets and then destroying those other targets."

Anyways, it was an insightful article. I liked his analysis of Mystery and Style in particular, which brought out things that I had not noticed before. I still think PUA is valuable and that people can benefit from it without personality disorders, but it does seem rather prone to attracting those sorts of people.

The inner game paradox in particular is an interesting one. You have to be internally validated, but once you are, you externally validate yourself by how many women you've slept with. It's always my opinion that people counting the number of lays are still completely externally validated, and highly codependent. I mean, most people keep track of how many times they've gotten laid, but those who use the number as some sort of validator appear to me to have some deep seated issues.

It's also interesting to note that he doesn't condemn pua. Rather, he says that the sort of people that could actually sort through the good advice and recognize the bad advice are probably not the sort of people that are attracted to it. I agree.

Ever wonder why in so many pick up threads there are so many people that care more about what other PUAs do or think than actually talking to girls?

Hahaha I can't believe what I am reading.

Yeah, it's terrible to have sex with many different hot women because... because...

(... well, let's try to come up with an excuse...)
... yeah, because it means that you seek external validation!

Genius

On March 26 2012 07:57 Catch wrote:
Yeah, because me not sharing my conquests online with a bunch of anonymous people means exactly that. I don't come online to talk about girls, what point is there in that?

On March 26 2012 10:47 Xiphos wrote:
All those talk about validation is manifesting a cringe-worthy feeling to my mind. How about you go out there and do what the fuck you want? Don't seek approval from ANYBODY and just complete every daily task with the mindset of complete self-interest.

On March 26 2012 07:57 Catch wrote:


Oh hey shinosai.

I pretty much think ya hit it on the head, PUA is valuable but I look of it more as a springboard. A springboard that can easily snap; it did on me after all. I think PU also has a high tendency to really make people develop some symptoms of disorders, if not outright disorders themselves, such as anxiety or narcissism. I remember a quote that said that we often hate things in other people that we hate in ourselves.

As for the inner game thing I agree. Work on that inner game so you can be validated by women, not to validate yourself seems to be the message that pick up spews forth. That was the main thing I fell for, and when I didn't receive any external validation from women, it completely backfired on me. I also like his stance on how we try and say "Oh women do this because of an evolutionary basis" but if that were the case, men would be murdering others for taking the last steak or something inane like that.



Yeah, because me not sharing my conquests online with a bunch of anonymous people means exactly that. I don't come online to talk about girls, what point is there in that?



Or you could try reading it, instead of posting nonsense. He doesn't even condemn sex in the letters.

On March 26 2012 09:34 squattincassanova wrote:


whos says my post was about you?

On March 26 2012 18:00 squattincassanova wrote:
Actually my wide general comment about every PUA thread on the internet including this one. It has nothing to do with Catch. I honestly didn't even read his post.


To be honest, everything that could ever be debated in PUA has been, either on this thread, or thousands of other threads online. The only thing that hasn't been shared are peoples actual personal experiences. Thats why I am not going to type out pages of boring keyboard jockey material and rather I tell stories about my own life. Its more entertaining that way. Plus, if you wan't material, go bit torrent every damn RSD, MM, Sinn, David Deangelo, whatever the fuck you want and mental masterbate for the next 4 years.

On March 26 2012 20:26 gugarutz wrote:


but why are you on an online forum then, if i don't want to "mental masturbate" about pua then i'll get my friends and talk with them outside in a nice bar or whatever. the only reason i read about pua on the internet is because these forums are the only place i can philosophize about that since irl there are better things to do (aka girls).

Why would i share storys with strangers (trolls) on the internet when i can just talk irl with friends. the only exception i understand is when PUAs tell these stories to pump hopes and enthusiasm of afcs (their main market).

?!