Over the past month ahk-gosu has claimed to be able to beat Korean pro gamers. When people disagreed with him, he retaliated by saying that if you don't believe him, then play him. So just like everybody else, I was curious of how good this guy is. I chased him down after a week's worth of PMs to finally be able to get a game with him.
Some history before we get started:
ahk-gosu's thread on how pros don't impress him and that he can beat them:
On October 25 2004 00:05 ahk-gosu wrote: after watching a huge amount of vods/replays even though im still waiting for my dream siva vs sync vod i realized that progamers arent really THAT good except a few select people
seriously im not trying to be cocky but i can beat some of these pro gamers.
If you look at the responses in the thread, most people disagreed with him. But ahk-gosu didn't think so. His reply:
On October 25 2004 00:05 ahk-gosu wrote: and how seem to know how i play huh 1v1 me and no you cant really judge me
i have played some zerg pro gamers before and i have beaten some of them
and as for performing under pressure lets say i played mufasa in my lion king play elementary school lol
When a replay was posted about how he plays really bad, he responded:
that was one of my horrible games but the micro was good
im a lot better now seriously if you wanna play a game just msg me
on useast ahk-gosu ill do a best of 3 with you
This was the quote that sparked my interests to get a 1v1 best of 3 series going on with this guy to see if he can back it up.
Some more histories about how ahk-gosu really does think that he is at least a pro-gamer level:
On October 15 2004 01:15 exalted wrote: ahk-gosu you don't need to watch those you can already beat progamers so why bother?
ahk-gosu's response:
On October 15 2004 11:13 ahk-gosu wrote: fine i will
one day ill show you all
When someone told ahk-gosu that he isn't pro gamer level, his response:
On October 29 2004 21:15 ahk-gosu wrote: well thats why im taking challenges from people that think i suck.
Ahk-gosu also makes a topic asking how to make a replay pack of himself for others to see:
He was once again told by a forum member that he cannot beat pro gamers. Ahk-gosu responded that the joke is old and that he CAN indeed beat pro gamers:
On October 25 2004 00:05 ahk-gosu wrote: pheer that joke is getting old
and yes i can beat pros....
So yes, I was curious. It's my chance to play against someone who's supposedly of a pro gamer skill level at the least. Who wouldn't want to? So I PM'ed him for a week trying to catch him online to play him in a best of 3 series.
Here are the results:
Game 1 on Nostalgia:
In the first game tfeign wanted to test ahk-gosu's ability to handle cheese. Tfeign opted for a fast dt rush and eagerly wanted to know how well ahk-gosu is capable of handling this much-encountered game situation. The result is as follows, as tfeign's dt managed to stealthily swipe away 22 of ahk-gosu's probes before he was able to catch on and put an end to this ordeal:
Out of desperation, Ahk-gosu attempted to counter with his army of dragoons. Yet unfortunately, his hopeful journey was stopped dead in its track halfway as they were quickly dissipated by tfeign's opposing dragoon force. The game ended shortly after as tfeign's reckless army of dragoons vigilantly marched across the crimson battlefield of Nostalgia to secure a swift victory at the mainland of Ahk-gosu's base.
Statistics:
Game length: 8 minutes 15 seconds Final Score: Tfeign.legend: 22680 ahk-gosu: 15991 APM: Tfeign.legend: 368apm ahk-gosu: 132apm
Game 2 on Lost Temple
In this second encounter, tfeign wanted to examine ahk-gosu's ability to play a straight up match without any sort of cheese. Tfeign did not cheese Ahk-gosu at all this game and just played a normal, straight up PvP on Lost Temple. The duration of this game lasted a bit longer than the previous, and understandably so. Surprisingly, ahk-gosu was never able to move his units out of the boundary of his base at all during the entire length of this match. The picture below shows the furthest that ahk-gosu was ever able to move out of his base within the course of this 15 minute game before retreating and forfeiting the game as tfeign advanced with an unwearied army of zealots/goons/templars/reavers, parading through the fields of Lost Temple unscathed, and finally reached the destination of Ahk-gosu's base as Tfeign's army laid wastes to his opponent's men in a climatic battle to finally seal the epic series between the pro-killer Ahk-gosu and the valiant tfeign who dared to defy against it:
Yes, that was the furthest that Ahk-gosu was ever able to move away from his base in the entire duration of this game. He was not able to mount any offense at all.
Statistics:
Game length: 15 minutes 25 seconds Final Score[fixed]: Tfeign.legend: 64844 ahk-gosu: 48277 APM: Tfeign.legend: 305apm ahk-gosu: 130apm
Final results of the bo3: Tfeign.Legend > ahk-gosu 2-0
Ahk-gosu said after the 2 games that he wasn't playing for real today and will msg me to rematch some time down this week. I'll look forward to our rematch and will give any applicable updates (if it does happen)
Thanks for the game reports tfeign. Sounds like awesome games, cant wait for the VODs. I guess it wasn't gosu's day that day... Anyway, you up to be a news reporter for KT-KTF? 'cause that was awesome.
EDIT: btw is ur score right on the second game? cuz it says that he had 15k more score than u
Oops. Thanks for pointing that out. Error fixed.
On November 01 2004 22:05 Klogon wrote: Thanks for the game reports tfeign. Sounds like awesome games, cant wait for the VODs. I guess it wasn't gosu's day that day... Anyway, you up to be a news reporter for KT-KTF? 'cause that was awesome.
Yeah I'd love to be but college is killing me. I have hardly time to even play and Monday is my only free day of the week. Maybe when break comes
On November 01 2004 22:12 Excalibur_Z wrote: Both of those replay links 404 for me.
Solar: and as for performing under pressure lets say i played mufasa in my lion king play elementary school lol
This is his progaming experience; basically he's saying that becuase he's done this he has nerves of steel, did you notice the composure he had after getting beaten? I wasn't there to witness it but being a big fan of his I know he would take it calmly:
To add a little to the thread, he and I had a little "PM" war about a week ago:
"hey thx for the bad manner signature your quite the loser that you took the time to do that. best of luck in life because you will need it. "
I replied by changing two letters:
hey thx for the bad manner PM your quite the loser that you took the time to do that. best of luck in life because you will need it.
"freedom of speech you fucken slut
all of your pms will be deleted without looking at it have a good day you fucken fag"
game1: ahk-gosu shows his true talent by instead of scouting with his probe attacking tfeigns gas miners which had no effect on tfeign and ahk-gosu although in a base with a warping zeal legs building diddnt even want to scout what his opponet was doing and this lost him the game.
ok summary of game 2, ahk-gosu does not know the meaning of macro he had 3 gates and 800 minerals so he lost the game tfeign on the otherhand had good macro and owned him in general :O
overall i dont see ahk-gosu getting much higher than 1050 on pgtour or c2 on wgtour from those replays but you never know those could of just been two bad games from a true pro.
dont watch the reps anyway. ahk-gosu is a rather bad player player with middlish macro and no idea of how BOs work. Absolutely no micro displayed in this game. Its a camp fest with "gosu" managing to mismacro himself to dead in 15 minutes.
He also manages to be 30 supply down from his opponent without any military units dying on either side, and only a few obs and a probe dying. He even had expoed at the same time as tfeign. Thats what I call macro.
I really would like to see more bo3/bo5 challenges between members on this board as a method of dispute resolution. After all, SC really is the common bond here. It does not have to be in a mean or spiteful way, but something like this was pretty funny, and I don't see it as all that mean. His opening post post respectful, yet powerful. tfeign, you could have been a total ass about this, but you werent. I think (and hope) that maybe you have spurred a new trend!
Damn Tfeign your max apm was 615! WIth 72% hotkeys. Makes me feel I dont use my hotkeys enough. What minimum percentage of the APM should hotkeys be to constitute "good but not excessive" usage of them? Anyone?
im not defending "gosu" in any way ... but why does anyone care about him at all, i must have met like 10000000000 clones of this retard on bnet since 98, at one point i even acted kinda like one. please dont make a habit out of exploiting every loser on bnet that thinks thier far better than they truly are, although remotely amusing this is such a waste of time. if you ask me keep reporting on real progamers, and even up and coming gamers, instead of having us read about two low level players...
come on.. there are so many peoples around like this idiot ahk-gosu.. how can u even spend time with these people.. wasting your time in playing them..
On November 02 2004 02:22 AK-Nemesis wrote: well, his time spent on him hasn't actually been a total waste, look how much entertainment it created for the forumers
On November 01 2004 22:18 exalted wrote: Solar: and as for performing under pressure lets say i played mufasa in my lion king play elementary school lol
This is his progaming experience; basically he's saying that becuase he's done this he has nerves of steel, did you notice the composure he had after getting beaten? I wasn't there to witness it but being a big fan of his I know he would take it calmly:
To add a little to the thread, he and I had a little "PM" war about a week ago:
"hey thx for the bad manner signature your quite the loser that you took the time to do that. best of luck in life because you will need it. "
I replied by changing two letters:
hey thx for the bad manner PM your quite the loser that you took the time to do that. best of luck in life because you will need it.
"freedom of speech you fucken slut
all of your pms will be deleted without looking at it have a good day you fucken fag"
Guess i got owned.
Ohhh I've never understood why some people resort to cussing so fast. And its even lamer when they say fucken instead of fucking lol
hahaha, absolutely hilarious. Don't know how I missed this post all day :O I wonder if ahk will man up and post, or forever be the laughing stock of tl.net history
"im not defending "gosu" in any way ... but why does anyone care about him at all, i must have met like 10000000000 clones of this retard on bnet since 98, at one point i even acted kinda like one. please dont make a habit out of exploiting every loser on bnet that thinks thier far better than they truly are, although remotely amusing this is such a waste of time. if you ask me keep reporting on real progamers, and even up and coming gamers, instead of having us read about two low level players...
just my opinion"
I agree with you 100% but there is already so much news about progamers, there is just too many replays and VODs nowadays I guess a tale of mediocrity and drama in the teamliquid community just makes seemingly stupid grudges seem really funny. I personally have a vendetta against ahk-gosu so I would have definitely done something similar as tfeign, and the fact that there was not only one, but two people wanted to do this as well just makes me laugh - I don't believe you have seen too many of the posts, but you're right - there are tons of people like this on battle.net, basically whereever you go in every field.
That's why it's so funny when we bash them to death [and basically he's the only one on teamliquid that has said he can beat progamers]
At worst, now when he says "yes I can beat progamers" you can tell he is joking, as opposed to the thread that started it all "are progamers rly that good?"
I wonder if after reading this he decded to be done with TL.net? Seeing as how this thread is 4 pages long, and still no response from the pro-gamer himself.
On November 02 2004 05:19 [GiTM]-Ace wrote: wow u guyz are mean. why not let him think he can beat pros we all know he cant. u guyz are like the bastards who say santa clause is real
It's just so much fun. Poking fun at ppl for our entertainment.
We're all officially bullys picking on the new kid. Maybe our mothers didn't love us enough when we were younger
On November 02 2004 00:02 mrmin123 wrote: i feel so bad for ahk-gosu.
lol.
edit: why the fuck does everything tl.net related have so much drama. :[
This is really a reality show. The results of locking 10 000 peoples browsers to only TL.net. Which is why you see doctor threads, girl threads, religion threads, politic threads and lots of drama on a starcraft forum
On November 02 2004 00:17 Gandalf the Wizard wrote: Damn Tfeign your max apm was 615! WIth 72% hotkeys. Makes me feel I dont use my hotkeys enough. What minimum percentage of the APM should hotkeys be to constitute "good but not excessive" usage of them? Anyone?
101 apm if you remove his hotkeying. Although that isn't accurate either his hotkeying would be in line with move and select if he wasn't trying to boost it, so 130 or so real apm
i dont see why you remove this hotkey from his apm to measure it? i think sometimes mashing hotkeys can be good for a player.. when i play and nothing much is happening i tend to slow down.. but if you can keep your speed and adrenaline up by non stop play, then your reaction times and movement skills will be much greatly increased. sometimes hotkey mashing can be a good thing and i do think this thread is a bit mean, but although i sometimes think/dream about being a pro, i dont come out and go omg im > pros and they arnt that good. Consider this thread tough love we love him.. we just trying to show him the truth
no, mashing your hotkeys to that extent can't make you a good player, infact if anything it would be detrimental to your play because you are too occupied trying to boost your apm solely to look good on bwchart, and all the actions that matter suffer.
Mashing your hotkeys won't ever help your play, it's not like you need a constant reminder of where the number row on your keyboard is and if you stopped hamfisting them for 3 seconds they'd up and vanish. You'll never gain speed from doing that, and it's as chobo as ahk-gosu thinking he can beat pros
tfeign whats ur aka? If he can't beat an unknown from USA, he can't beat a progamer -_-;. I bet he can't make it past b6 late in the season with 200 games =_=;
On November 01 2004 22:18 exalted wrote: Solar: and as for performing under pressure lets say i played mufasa in my lion king play elementary school lol
I think this ahk-gosu "newbie" should be banned from tl.forums, actually we need someone to make fun of *_* DooMeR, the quote was refering to that he has nerves of steel because he played Mufasa (Lion King) in his elementary school theater. :O~
Most pros fall between 20-40% hotkeys in most games. I checked a few testie reps and those showed his hotkeys to constitute 8-20%, and if he were to raise it (by some spamming) to 40%, he'd raise his apm from ~150 to the more pro-ish 200+ range.
So it just boils down on your style of play.
But I think the 72% hotkeys might have been to add insult to injury
i saw some reps of herimto... he was good :p i got one of leg vs him leg loses =[
and i didnt say that spamming hotkeys make you a good gamer, just saying that i see it 'to a certain extent' usefull to keep your adrenaline up in a slow point of the game. but im no pro-gamer =[ sorry
On November 02 2004 08:32 sm wrote: i saw some reps of herimto... he was good :p i got one of leg vs him leg loses =[
and i didnt say that spamming hotkeys make you a good gamer, just saying that i see it 'to a certain extent' usefull to keep your adrenaline up in a slow point of the game. but im no pro-gamer =[ sorry
not every one of your clicks or button presses has to be critical, I often cycle through my hotkeys to make sure everything is in line and to keep my fingers moving as well, I usually have 30-40% hotkey wth 200 apm. tfeign merely mashed his hotkeys as fast as he could with the intent of inflating his apm far higher than the reality of a player of his skill level so he could post it in this thread to make himself look like he is some gosu, which is why I said it was pathetic.
herimto holds down ctrl + # which gives you a free 30 actions a second, an equally pathetic method of faking actual speed
The game ended shortly after as tfeign's reckless army of dragoons vigilantly marched across the crimson battlefield of Nostalgia to secure a swift victory at the mainland of Ahk-gosu's base.
good work tfeign! I wonder if there are even more so-called progamers here on TL;) more than 50% hotkey truly sux,i analysed the replay and u really did the 1,2,3,1,2,3.. thing all the time lol Oh one more thing, i don't know what program u used to capture screenshots, but Starcraft can make screenshots of it's own, just press printscreen and a screenshot will be saved to your BW directory with .pcx extension.
On November 02 2004 08:32 sm wrote: i saw some reps of herimto... he was good :p i got one of leg vs him leg loses =[
and i didnt say that spamming hotkeys make you a good gamer, just saying that i see it 'to a certain extent' usefull to keep your adrenaline up in a slow point of the game. but im no pro-gamer =[ sorry
not every one of your clicks or button presses has to be critical, I often cycle through my hotkeys to make sure everything is in line and to keep my fingers moving as well, I usually have 30-40% hotkey wth 200 apm. tfeign merely mashed his hotkeys as fast as he could with the intent of inflating his apm far higher than the reality of a player of his skill level so he could post it in this thread to make himself look like he is some gosu, which is why I said it was pathetic.
herimto holds down ctrl + # which gives you a free 30 actions a second, an equally pathetic method of faking actual speed
personally i never fake it. cant see how a guy can? -- its a joke ok? but in sc terms, i get ya
Should have seen the guy on Europe named SlayerS_BoxerRs (Or similiar)... 304 apm or therabouts, 8 seconds into game apparently he selects my nexus >_< but it looked cool, but without hotkeys it was just a 100 apm or so Didnt beat him, somehow his dropships flew one of the few safe ways into my base >_<
On November 02 2004 12:20 HungZerg wrote: he claimed he beat pros and then he goes and loses 22 probes to one dt..... how can you expect him to show on any thread for quite some time
but he wasnt playing for real, so it's no big deal. he's still better
Congrats, you nearly broke your hand spamming hotkeys to impress tl.net no toss user could ever need 300 apm or more. I get about 170, and I waste a lot of clicks/hotkeys.
I doubt that he normally spams keys that much. Also, as someone else said, to be able to spam that much, and still win says even more about Gosu. Funny thread, by the way.
Well, if this had been up for liquibet, I would have once again lost points as the heavily self-proclaimed favored pro-killer ahk-gosu manages to somehow lose!
I have to admit this is a little mean. But there is an important lesson learned here.
WOW, great thread good work t-feign, and who cares about the hot-key spamming, you still beat the stuffing out of him. ahk-gosu... I think it would be cool if he showed up talking shit. I hope he does.
And as far as solving things by BW bo5's I think its a great idea!
Lets see who do I want to play..........
FUCK you FA... you have no skills and I hope you die from choking on rice. As far as I can tell, you give strategy advice without having anything to back it up. When have you ever given a replay showing your amazing skills. Never. And even though I just started playing BW again a week ago (didn't have a comp) I'll kick your butt.
Ohhh and Testie, you hacking bastard. You would lose to ahk-gosu if you played with BW scanner on. So what if you beat a korean once in the WCG... once on gamei I beat a korean too. I'll bet that guy was Nal_Ra. And I whooped his but. You only ever got any attention because you are friends with tsunami anyway.
On November 02 2004 13:47 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote: testie challenged me to a best of 19000001 but i told him i dont play newbies
HAHA
hmmm i dont know where that came from but its not even funny at all its pretty much sad and dull anyways
ahk-gosu sory mean i know youve been reading the 4 pages but....1/1 msg ahk-gosu :D
Ummm... I thought it was funny... I think that even in this intolerant world, people can recognize that not everyone finds the same things to be funny. Gimme a break man
ROFL, poor guy.....THat was so funny i almost shat myself like that other fellows friend the other day...And if anyone from this forum wants to play give me a holla on UsEast, the name is............ BeAsT)Lw(...
On November 02 2004 08:49 SoMuchBetter wrote: If he can spam that much in one game and still win, isn't it kind of proving a point?
No it really isn't because i tried spamming one game in a 2v2 game and played real at the same time and got 375 apm. It doesn't really affect ur play because u can just click 1 2 3, 1 2 3, in between every neccessary click like building units out of ur factories. Well at least it didn't affect my play because i didnt play any worse than how i usually play.
On November 02 2004 00:17 Gandalf the Wizard wrote: Damn Tfeign your max apm was 615! WIth 72% hotkeys. Makes me feel I dont use my hotkeys enough. What minimum percentage of the APM should hotkeys be to constitute "good but not excessive" usage of them? Anyone?
On November 02 2004 06:42 racebannon wrote: 72% hotkey is pretty pathetic.
101 apm if you remove his hotkeying. Although that isn't accurate either his hotkeying would be in line with move and select if he wasn't trying to boost it, so 130 or so real apm
You obviously don't understand that scrolling through hotkeys allows you to keep track of how fast certain units/ tech will be finished. Though it is not necessary to have that many hotkey actions, it is very useful.
o and as for all those people saying i insult them
please check out what they posted before i insulted them
i wrote all those fucken idiot and t(-_-t) crap because the people that i was insulting were putting me down which i will not stay unresponsive to. please look at your own actions before you judge mine.
i know some of you guys will never let me forget this event but i will beat tfeign. he caught me at a bad time as i know many of you have when you just suck one day. that was the first game ive played in like 2 weeks. ive been very busy because i have other things in life other than starcraft.
ive been busy studying for the sats and I work as eb in American Red Cross.
On November 02 2004 18:09 ahk-gosu wrote: i know some of you guys will never let me forget this event but i will beat tfeign. he caught me at a bad time as i know many of you have when you just suck one day. that was the first game ive played in like 2 weeks. ive been very busy because i have other things in life other than starcraft.
ive been busy studying for the sats and I work as eb in American Red Cross.
Okay, yeah; blah blah blah. You lost, so accept it with some sort of dignity. It was honorable that you took the challenge when it was presented. You also lost 22 probes to a DT which even good players on a bad day would never do, so you can make all the excuses you want but no one cares, or if they do it's because they are funny.
Ahk-Gosu from watching the replays it looks like he simply outplayed you and i doubt that even in your best condition you would even stand a chance vs him. Maybe you can re him when you learn to macro.
On November 02 2004 18:11 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote: gl in round 2 ahk-gosu :D
On November 02 2004 18:12 ahk-gosu wrote: i wont really need it.
That'll be a good quote to use on the next update
And cmon...a progamer-killer wouldn't lose 22 probes to 1 dt to me even on their absolute worst day..
I do acknowledge your guts to accept challenges but jeez...I've never seen that thinks so highly of his skills when in reality you still need alot of work
Anyway, send me a msg whenever you're ready for our next series. I'll be looking forward to it
On November 02 2004 18:09 ahk-gosu wrote: i know some of you guys will never let me forget this event but i will beat tfeign. he caught me at a bad time as i know many of you have when you just suck one day. that was the first game ive played in like 2 weeks. ive been very busy because i have other things in life other than starcraft.
ive been busy studying for the sats and I work as eb in American Red Cross.
I support you because you are rad in general. I hope you beat tfeign next round. However, your statements concerning civic virtue really distrubed me. It is obvious that you are volunterring to bolster you resume for college. If you volunteer for the American Red Cross, you should do it from the kindness of your own heart, not for individual accolade.
im not working at red cross to "bolster" my chances at a good college.
i work as the executive board for red cross in greater new york.
im the freaken board for crying out loud. i got put into that position in less than a year because i was helping out a lot. i put in like 100 hours in less than a year.
seriously man. i was even on the dragon boat team for the hong kong festival. we got third place because some team cheated through a loophole. i trained all summer for that.
seriously dood. this is one thing im not doing for myself.
i've actually learned to like gosu a lot, he's a like the little fighter in the kungfu movies and the criminals just push him aside and he's like still trying to fight, hopefully we can learn from the badguys and just bitchslap him to a pulp beyond the point of return to scratch out the possibility of where he goes butterfly effect style and starts beating the shit out of the guy with a metal rod
On November 02 2004 21:51 dan1st wrote: Can we have like a... liquibet for this please?
a liquibet for these guys? think before you speak.
if this best of 3 challenge is gonna even go on at all for anyone on this forum, atleast have it be worth it somehow, like the loser is ip banned from the site for 1 week with no posting rights, something along those lines to spice it up.
On November 02 2004 21:51 dan1st wrote: Can we have like a... liquibet for this please?
a liquibet for these guys? think before you speak.
if this best of 3 challenge is gonna even go on at all for anyone on this forum, atleast have it be worth it somehow, like the loser is ip banned from the site for 1 week with no posting rights, something along those lines to spice it up.
Oh by golly, mine was obviously a joke. Didn't know you could misunderstand that. You should probably think too before you speak...
I dont understand how some of you write that u have respect for ahk-gosu...I havent seen a single intilligent post from him...he gives bullshit advice in the strategy forum(even his zerg advice sucked regardless what some of u seems to think..and him trying to give advice for protoss that he just started playing and terran that he doesnt play at all and wich he knows absolutely nothing about just adds to it...), he claims that he's good when he actually sucks and then he comes up with excuses and tries to seem nice so that every1 wont flame him every time he posts..and then he made that thread about how amazing it is to go fast +1 in pvz and then when every1 says he's a moron and its old and blablbalba he says he's going to leave and is being such a fucking drama queen getting ppl to feel sry for him and then after some ppl actually were nice to him even thougt he didnt deserve it AT ALL he says he was just joking and acts like an arrogant asshole starting to flame the ppl who told him off..he's a stupid little kid who doesnt deserve respect from anyone at all... on a side note he's prolly making up all that shit about working for the american red cross etc aswell just so that ppl will think he's a nice guy even thougt he's a total jack ass
hahaha, this almost made my day :D! There are so many things one could say to flame the living shit out of ahk-gosu, and he kinda deserves it, he needs to be taken down to earth ffs. But I will only say this:
I hope you beat him, ahk, and I hope you beat him good!
On November 02 2004 18:12 ahk-gosu wrote: i wont really need it.
That'll be a good quote to use on the next update
And cmon...a progamer-killer wouldn't lose 22 probes to 1 dt to me even on their absolute worst day..
I do acknowledge your guts to accept challenges but jeez...I've never seen that thinks so highly of his skills when in reality you still need alot of work
Anyway, send me a msg whenever you're ready for our next series. I'll be looking forward to it
Theres a rekrul vs nazgul game in which nazgul was winning, but then a single dt from rekrul got some 35 or so kills and that turned the game in his favor.
Anyways, ahk said manner>skill and I agree with that. He accepted the challenge and he's willing to rematch.
On November 03 2004 04:13 Hippopotamus wrote: Can someone explain the point of this thread to me?
I remember when I was a naive poster like urself.
I'll tell you when you're older
Why would someone make a thread like this? I mean does that guy have nothing better to do than publically humiliate others? I don't know the full story... but the creator of this topic never mentioned ahk-gosu ever doing anything to him directly, so if nobody did anything to you directly why make such a thread? I mean there're people full of hot air everywhere, but if there is nothing personal why humiliate them like that? No matter how bad that other person was it's just really low to make a thread like this after he accepted to play your challenge and didn't badmouth you afterwards.
On November 03 2004 04:13 Hippopotamus wrote: Can someone explain the point of this thread to me?
I remember when I was a naive poster like urself.
I'll tell you when you're older
Why would someone make a thread like this? I mean does that guy have nothing better to do than publically humiliate others? I don't know the full story... but the creator of this topic never mentioned ahk-gosu ever doing anything to him directly, so if nobody did anything to you directly why make such a thread? I mean there're people full of hot air everywhere, but if there is nothing personal why humiliate them like that? No matter how bad that other person was it's just really low to make a thread like this after he accepted to play your challenge and didn't badmouth you afterwards.
On November 03 2004 04:13 Hippopotamus wrote: Can someone explain the point of this thread to me?
I remember when I was a naive poster like urself.
I'll tell you when you're older
Why would someone make a thread like this? I mean does that guy have nothing better to do than publically humiliate others? I don't know the full story... but the creator of this topic never mentioned ahk-gosu ever doing anything to him directly, so if nobody did anything to you directly why make such a thread? I mean there're people full of hot air everywhere, but if there is nothing personal why humiliate them like that? No matter how bad that other person was it's just really low to make a thread like this after he accepted to play your challenge and didn't badmouth you afterwards.
If you read the first post, tfeign isn't a total ass about it. He explained the situation, and posted what he did. He didn't go like "OMG I =0wNZORZ J00 N00B." Although this thread was created with the intent of humiliation, it's all the people responding to the topic that's being an ass about it.
I think tfeign's original post had more than just a subtle amount of irony, condescension, and downright mockery in it, and frankly he could have handled the whole situation with a boatload more class than he chose to.
O well I guess different people different views, personally I'd never make such a thread even about someone I REALLY dislike if that person acted honorably.
On November 03 2004 05:28 Hautamaki wrote: I think tfeign's original post had more than just a subtle amount of irony, condescension, and downright mockery in it, and frankly he could have handled the whole situation with a boatload more class than he chose to.
You stole my thoughts again.
I think this thread has damaged tfeign more than ahk-gosu, but thats just my opinion.
how did he act honorably? he made a thread he could beat pro-gamers and such. now he goes off making stupid excuses. blah all the honor of this thread belongs to tfeign. who cares he spammed his hotkeys. it looks cool to have 370 apm and totally rape someone even if he isn't good.
On November 02 2004 19:00 tfeign wrote: How come you still act so presumptuous ahk-gosu
On November 02 2004 18:11 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote: gl in round 2 ahk-gosu :D
On November 02 2004 18:12 ahk-gosu wrote: i wont really need it.
That'll be a good quote to use on the next update
And cmon...a progamer-killer wouldn't lose 22 probes to 1 dt to me even on their absolute worst day..
I do acknowledge your guts to accept challenges but jeez...I've never seen that thinks so highly of his skills when in reality you still need alot of work
Anyway, send me a msg whenever you're ready for our next series. I'll be looking forward to it
Theres a rekrul vs nazgul game in which nazgul was winning, but then a single dt from rekrul got some 35 or so kills and that turned the game in his favor.
Anyways, ahk said manner>skill and I agree with that. He accepted the challenge and he's willing to rematch.
I was going to post something similar
while I don't think ahk-gosu is even close to being a "good" player, losing 22 probes against a dt is something any player in the world regardless of skill can end up doing. you don't get a warning, thus it's pretty much luck based if you notice it or not, unless you're a player who looks at his supply all the time, which is something most people don't. in fact, if there's fighting going on, you're going to be either very lucky, or very BAD to notice a dt before it kills 12+ probes.
didn't bother watching the replay so I dunno if there was fighting going on, I guess not. but either way that doesn't mean jack shit.
the game lasted 8 min.. everyone still builds probes at the time a dt can arrive at your base. if u don't atleast see the probes exploding it is very sad.. ofcourse its different in mid/end game, cause ur busy everywhere except at ur nexus'
most good people have their nexus hotkeyed. if there's any kind of fighting (or microing period) going on, you don't look back at your nexus to send probes to minerals. it doesn't take a dt particulary long to kill 22 probes. say a 4 goon vs 4 goon battle is enough to make 22 probes go boom, as you want to spend your time watching and microing 4 goons vs 4 goons more than you want to spend your time sending probes to mine.
likewise, you want to spend your time killing probes with dt over microing 4 goons vs 4 goons.
once again I didn't watch the replay, and if there was no fighting or scouting whatsoever going on, it's definitely not *good*. but it doesn't mean jack shit. it's like saying someone is bad because he loses once against a 5pool.
I find it stupid that people are bashing about this fake apm and whatever when tfeign never claimed to be "good" - he just wanted to play against a player who could beat progamers. To bash him becuase of his effort is retarded and more attention should be paid to how ahk-gosu responds to valid comments on strategy forum and his comments that led to the game report in the first place.
He definitely had the right to do this in such a manner and if I would have done the same (was looking to), I would have trash talked him much worse. Notice how ahk-gosu says he has a chance to win, he doesn't, I believe he legitimately believes he has skill and to let him live this fantasy is practically a crime in my book. Ignorance leads to too many problems, one being that they start ranting about how progamres aren't that great, put useless comments backed up by curses in strategy forums...wait..
What's the point here ? I agree that losing 22 probes to a DT can happen, but not to a player who considers himself capable of beating pro gamers. Come on, on the one hand tfeign wanted to embarrass gosu, but on the other gosu's first post to this site was this "pro gamers don't impress me" thing. It's necessary somebody tells him: buddy, you might be a nice guy, but dont praise yourself in such a ridiculous way. And that's what happend, a thing he should learn has been tought to him.
yea, i gotta agree with some of the previous posts.. the tfeign bashing for hitting so many hotkeys is kind of dumb. i mean, what if someone has a habit of scrolling the screen around a lot? or moving his mouse in circles a lot? these actions are constant, fast movements that have the possibility of helping someone's game, but are most likely just a habit that makes people comfortable.. just like hitting hotkeys repeatedly. so tfeign does something that we can analyze from bwchart - big deal
and about ahk-gosu's losing so many probes to a DT, i wasnt going to say anything for fear of persecution, but i dont think it's true to say that "any good player in any shape would never lose 22 probes to a DT" if the guy hasnt been playing much recently, then the first things to go will be his micro/macro/general speed.. so him getting "outplayed" is not proof to me that he is not good. the strategies and tactics that he relied on when he had the speed are going to fail, and you wont even get to see his overall strategy and skill. if he truly is out of shape, then you must give him a chance to get in shape and show what he knows.
personally, since im pretty out of shape, i wouldnt even attempt the strats i used when i was at my best, cuz they'd crumble under my inability to execute them.. so if you saw me play now, you'd just see me doing general unoriginal strats and executing them poorly, and i'd look really really bad.. and that's not a fair assessment
On November 03 2004 07:10 Wirthi wrote: What's the point here ? I agree that losing 22 probes to a DT can happen, but not to a player who considers himself capable of beating pro gamers. Come on, on the one hand tfeign wanted to embarrass gosu, but on the other gosu's first post to this site was this "pro gamers don't impress me" thing. It's necessary somebody tells him: buddy, you might be a nice guy, but dont praise yourself in such a ridiculous way. And that's what happend, a thing he should learn has been tought to him.
Lots of progamers have lost dozens of probes to dts. Lots of progamers have lost games because of dts once in a while. Even drone said that can happen once in a while even to top level gamers, so it doesnt mean much. And we all respect drones opinion.
I think we've all been reading too much into what tfeign and ahk-gosu said and all this flaming has crucified them both. Maybe this thread should be closed and a small post be made about the rematch?
A lot of people got pissed at ahk-gosu because of his i-can-beat-progamers post. But after 11 pages of flaming, how can you expect ahk NOT to be at least slightly pissed?
On November 03 2004 07:22 Gandalf the Wizard wrote: I think we've all been reading too much into what tfeign and ahk-gosu said and all this flaming has crucified them both. Maybe this thread should be closed and a small post be made about the rematch?
A lot of people got pissed at ahk-gosu because of his i-can-beat-progamers post. But after 11 pages of flaming, how can you expect ahk NOT to be at least slightly pissed?
After the comments he made, he should expect to get slammed for losing to a random person.
There should be two more rematches, both best of three, I think. That way, if they really wanted to, they could prove who the better player was (unless tfeign is to win again). That way, no one can say, "We split a series of BO3, you're still not better than me... blah blah... we won the same amount of games vs each other... blah blah."
For gosu to come back and make a flame thread about beating him the next time, if he was to do so, would only make him look WORSE, because, if he is as good as he said he was, he shouldn't have lost this series, and the next should be a given-- if he's that good.
On November 03 2004 07:18 NonY wrote: yea, i gotta agree with some of the previous posts.. the tfeign bashing for hitting so many hotkeys is kind of dumb. i mean, what if someone has a habit of scrolling the screen around a lot? or moving his mouse in circles a lot? these actions are constant, fast movements that have the possibility of helping someone's game, but are most likely just a habit that makes people comfortable.. just like hitting hotkeys repeatedly. so tfeign does something that we can analyze from bwchart - big deal
and about ahk-gosu's losing so many probes to a DT, i wasnt going to say anything for fear of persecution, but i dont think it's true to say that "any good player in any shape would never lose 22 probes to a DT" if the guy hasnt been playing much recently, then the first things to go will be his micro/macro/general speed.. so him getting "outplayed" is not proof to me that he is not good. the strategies and tactics that he relied on when he had the speed are going to fail, and you wont even get to see his overall strategy and skill. if he truly is out of shape, then you must give him a chance to get in shape and show what he knows.
personally, since im pretty out of shape, i wouldnt even attempt the strats i used when i was at my best, cuz they'd crumble under my inability to execute them.. so if you saw me play now, you'd just see me doing general unoriginal strats and executing them poorly, and i'd look really really bad.. and that's not a fair assessment
ok carry on ;o
because he didn't 'move his mouse around' simply to post a thread about it and make specific note about how fast he moved his mouse around to make himself look like a good starcraft player? He hotkeyed his nexus multiple times and went to town on those fucking keys and then had the audacity to post a direct comparison of his apm and goku's as if his meant something, when the reality was tfeign is a 100 apm player if he isn't setting out to artificially inflate his apm.
it's pathetic to spam so much, it's even more pathetic (and stupid) to include your inflated apm in your post as a means of putting down the person you played against. The only reason he put that there was to make himself far superior than what he is. Honestly thinking your ability to cycle to your nexus 300 times a minute has a real world application in SC is about as deluded as ahk-goku thinking he can beat pros. In other words it's as fraudulent and pathetic as I initially said it was
edit: cycling your hotkeys is a good thing, keeping your hands moving is also a good thing. Doing it for no reason (hotkeying stupid shit just to spam it) is counter productive. Showing off your fake apm is retarded. Therefore it is my conclusion that this was a battle of retards and that tfeign setting out to disprove this guys claims to be greater than he is was hypocritical when tfeign goes out of his own way to make himself look greater than he is as well
Well like I said, I don't know the full story, but if he accepted challenge, and didn't trash talk I'd call that honorable.
he's been acting like a moron in several threads and he has acted all but honorably..since u say urself u dont "know the full story" I dont think u should say anything more untill u have at least read a 5~~ of his posts (in other threads than this).
@drone if u read the battle report u see that tfeign wrote that he tried a cheese dt rush and the game lasted 8 minutes so I dont think anything else happened in the game except both players doing their bo's then the dt went into ahk's base killed 22 probes without him being able to do anything since he had no obs and then he got ran over..
I think ppl r getting to hang up on the "I can beat progamers" thingy..he has written tons of stupid things and he has acted like a moron in every comment/thread I've seen him...
the above paragraph should be read extra carefully by nony,cambium and the rest thinking its been to much flaming and that we're treating ahk unfairly..in the rematch once ahk has goten 'back in shape' or something like that we'll see how encridibly good he can really be...or an even better idea how about if ahk uploaded a few replays of him playing "good" so that we can all see how gosu he really is..
if you think that i posted moronic comments every time you dont know the full story either. i only respond to peoples comments. i dont start with them.
and as for me posting flames if i beat tfeign i doubt i would stoop to his level. after all, its just a game. starcraft is just a game.
having 1 typo in a sentance that you typed out has nothing to do with your iq
Insulting someone about iq and making a typo like that... Geez I would get him on that too if someone insulted me like that. And the "w" is pretty damn far from the "o" ? Oh but still, if you insult someone, you can expect something back.
On November 03 2004 09:31 ahk-gosu wrote: if you think that i posted moronic comments every time you dont know the full story either. i only respond to peoples comments. i dont start with them.
and as for me posting flames if i beat tfeign i doubt i would stoop to his level. after all, its just a game. starcraft is just a game.
stoop to his level? he coulda flamed you a helluva lot more than he did considering what a moron you are in other threads, and then how badly you got raped. im quite sure i would've and from alot of the replies here so would alot of other people. you should be grateful he was as nice as he was.
and what difference does it make if youre replying to other people? you still make dumbass posts. and you were the one who started the thread about you beating progamers, no one else prompted that. and considering your little performance here i think its quite obvious that that was about as moronic as you can get.
having 1 typo in a sentance that you typed out has nothing to do with your iq
Insulting someone about iq and making a typo like that... Geez I would get him on that too if someone insulted me like that. And the "w" is pretty damn far from the "o" ? Oh but still, if you insult someone, you can expect something back.
Yeah, it's not like he spelt the word "teo" instead of "two," because that'd just be a mishit on a key. Spelling the word "two," as in the number, "too," as in also, is pretty damn stupid, especially when you're making fun of someone's IQ.
Slaughter)BiO, was the typo on sentence intentional?
Gosu, you're right-- it is just a game. It should be taken that way, but when you start saying you can beat pros, you have to expect to take a lot of crap after losing to this guy, who is essentially a nobody. If you beat him next go around, good for you; if you lose to him next go around, maybe you aren't as good as you thought you were.
having 1 typo in a sentance that you typed out has nothing to do with your iq
Insulting someone about iq and making a typo like that... Geez I would get him on that too if someone insulted me like that. And the "w" is pretty damn far from the "o" ? Oh but still, if you insult someone, you can expect something back.
Yeah, it's not like he spelt the word "teo" instead of "two," because that'd just be a mishit on a key. Spelling the word "two," as in the number, "too," as in also, is pretty damn stupid, especially when you're making fun of someone's IQ.
Slaughter)BiO, was the typo on sentence intentional?
Gosu, you're right-- it is just a game. It should be taken that way, but when you start saying you can beat pros, you have to expect to take a lot of crap after losing to this guy, who is essentially a nobody. If you beat him next go around, good for you; if you lose to him next go around, maybe you aren't as good as you thought you were.
I dont know if the typo was intentional but a lot of people take shortcuts like that all the time while typing over the internet.
Yeah, it's not like he spelt the word "teo" instead of "two," because that'd just be a mishit on a key. Spelling the word "two," as in the number, "too," as in also, is pretty damn stupid, especially when you're making fun of someone's IQ.
Slaughter)BiO, was the typo on sentence intentional?
Gosu, you're right-- it is just a game. It should be taken that way, but when you start saying you can beat pros, you have to expect to take a lot of crap after losing to this guy, who is essentially a nobody. If you beat him next go around, good for you; if you lose to him next go around, maybe you aren't as good as you thought you were.
I dont know if the typo was intentional but a lot of people take shortcuts like that all the time while typing over the internet.[/QUOTE]
No, I mean, was your typo on the word sentence intentional? You spelled "sentence," "sentance."
EPT
![[image loading]](http://server5.uploadit.org/files/tfeign-22killtemplar.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://server5.uploadit.org/files/tfeign-furthesthecouldgo.jpg)
P
