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[ASL8] Ro24 Group B

Forum Index > Brood War Tournaments
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BLinD-RawR
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
ALLEYCAT BLUES49886 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-07-02 10:26:41
July 02 2019 07:36 GMT
#1

Afreeca Starleague Season 8


Tuesday, Jul 02 10:00am GMT (GMT+00:00)


(Wiki)Afreeca Starleague Season 8


Casters & Hosts


Tasteless | Artosis | RAPiD | NoRegreT


Streams


Korean Afreeca Stream
ENG Afreeca Stream (Artosis and Cadenzie)


Matchups and Maps



[image loading]      [image loading]
(Z)Larva              ajuk12

[image loading]      [image loading]
(T)Mong              (T)Rush






Results


+ Show Spoiler [Full results] +




Recommended Games


+ Show Spoiler [Larva vs ajuk12] +

+ Show Spoiler [Mong vs Rush] +

+ Show Spoiler [Winners Game] +

+ Show Spoiler [Losers Game] +

+ Show Spoiler [Final] +




CSS: FO-nTTaX
Banner: v1


Brood War EICWoo Jung Ho, never forget.| Twitter: @BLinDRawR
TL+ Member
oEkY
Profile Joined August 2016
Germany645 Posts
July 02 2019 08:33 GMT
#2
thanks for this thread, but the player pics show Flash/Guemchi and Sacsri
jjmmtt
Profile Joined January 2011
Australia995 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-07-02 08:48:27
July 02 2019 08:45 GMT
#3
Says Larva vs n00B in the Events column lmao. Welp, I guess one of the billions of players with the ID "noob" had to make it eventually :D:D I really wish we had a pro player that rep'd that ID proudly.
TornadoSteve
Profile Joined March 2018
1000 Posts
July 02 2019 09:05 GMT
#4
Little do i know about mr Ajuk, but the other 3 are looking in amazing shape lately. Hyped
AttackZerg
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States7454 Posts
July 02 2019 09:28 GMT
#5
If Larva can't make it past this group. I doubt we will ever see him win a major.
He is clearly, clearly, CLEARLY. The top dog in this group.

I am tired of seeing the most creative, talented zergs getting wrecked on any map with unique features.
Please make map specific builds my zerg dudes. The age of protoss is built upon the era of zerg complacency.

Do better Zergs~!!

Every time, we get new maps it's, "Which obvious strategy will the hive race fail to have anticipated this time".
Let's end the protoss insurgence and slap those drug addled terrans back to moon landings.

Zerg HWAITING 2019!
Jackal03
Profile Joined October 2009
Brazil7469 Posts
July 02 2019 10:01 GMT
#6
gogogo larva, this is your chance
BW is back
oxKnu
Profile Joined December 2017
1143 Posts
July 02 2019 10:01 GMT
#7
Larva vs nOOB is a really nice matchup IMO. It's Bo1 so that sucks but it's interesting because I estimate nOOB as being on a close level to the top foreigner protoss (Bonyth) - probably better but close enough for me. nOOB has played in plenty of foreigner leagues showing that he is really good but not elite.I want to see how large the discrepancy is between him and Larva. Assuming this will be a macro game (which Larva should push for no matter what).
bovienchien
Profile Joined March 2014
Vietnam1152 Posts
July 02 2019 10:11 GMT
#8
My head: Larva, Mong
My heart: Mong, Rush
https://www.facebook.com/StarcraftRemasteredVN/
oEkY
Profile Joined August 2016
Germany645 Posts
July 02 2019 10:12 GMT
#9
Hm... what happened to Mong? Thought we'll see the Pig-Terran today, but he looks more like Slim-Terran these days :O
GTR
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
51397 Posts
July 02 2019 10:16 GMT
#10
larva with a sub-50% record in asl lol
Commentator
razorsuKe
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Canada2000 Posts
July 02 2019 10:24 GMT
#11
so... afreeca's maintenance is for the exact during of this group? nice.
EntusGalleries.com - CJ Uniform Sale
GTR
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
51397 Posts
July 02 2019 10:24 GMT
#12
Commentator
Jackal03
Profile Joined October 2009
Brazil7469 Posts
July 02 2019 10:28 GMT
#13
protoss is gonna starve
BW is back
Jackal03
Profile Joined October 2009
Brazil7469 Posts
July 02 2019 10:29 GMT
#14
well, noob is a proper name for the protoss, lol
BW is back
Jackal03
Profile Joined October 2009
Brazil7469 Posts
July 02 2019 10:31 GMT
#15
larva just stomping
BW is back
oxKnu
Profile Joined December 2017
1143 Posts
July 02 2019 10:33 GMT
#16
On July 02 2019 19:01 oxKnu wrote:
Larva vs nOOB is a really nice matchup IMO. It's Bo1 so that sucks but it's interesting because I estimate nOOB as being on a close level to the top foreigner protoss (Bonyth) - probably better but close enough for me. nOOB has played in plenty of foreigner leagues showing that he is really good but not elite.I want to see how large the discrepancy is between him and Larva. Assuming this will be a macro game (which Larva should push for no matter what).


Yeah, the actual game consolidated what I thought this would be like.
TaardadAiel
Profile Joined May 2017
Bulgaria750 Posts
July 02 2019 10:36 GMT
#17
The skill difference is exacerbated by the big stage. Experience in televised offline matches is a factor besides the obvious skill gap.
WriterReV hwaiting!
Jackal03
Profile Joined October 2009
Brazil7469 Posts
July 02 2019 10:44 GMT
#18
rush could've got so many more scv
BW is back
r33k
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Italy3402 Posts
July 02 2019 10:49 GMT
#19
CadenZie needs to use her outside voice
Jackal03
Profile Joined October 2009
Brazil7469 Posts
July 02 2019 10:51 GMT
#20
mong just rolled and died, lol

rush multi attacking was too much for him
BW is back
TaardadAiel
Profile Joined May 2017
Bulgaria750 Posts
July 02 2019 10:54 GMT
#21
This felt like a boxing match somehow.
WriterReV hwaiting!
TaardadAiel
Profile Joined May 2017
Bulgaria750 Posts
July 02 2019 10:56 GMT
#22
Poll: Recommend Larva vs nOOB?

No (6)
 
55%

If you have time (4)
 
36%

Yes (1)
 
9%

11 total votes

Your vote: Recommend Larva vs nOOB?

(Vote): Yes
(Vote): No
(Vote): If you have time



Poll: Recommend Rush Vs Mong?

Yes (5)
 
50%

If you have time (5)
 
50%

No (0)
 
0%

10 total votes

Your vote: Recommend Rush Vs Mong?

(Vote): Yes
(Vote): No
(Vote): If you have time



WriterReV hwaiting!
AttackZerg
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States7454 Posts
July 02 2019 11:06 GMT
#23
The stream is super choppy for me tonight, anyone else?
nojok
Profile Joined May 2011
France15845 Posts
July 02 2019 11:08 GMT
#24
Are the numbers of viewers of afreeca shown on TL accurate? It seems awfully low for it to be able to pay for the venue and all the staff.

Kadenzie is saying interesting things but she needs to speak louder and put some emotions, it should get better when she's more comfortable I guess.
"Back then teams that won were credited, now it's called throw. I think it's sad." - Kuroky - Flap Flap Wings!
Jackal03
Profile Joined October 2009
Brazil7469 Posts
July 02 2019 11:09 GMT
#25
On July 02 2019 20:08 nojok wrote:
Are the numbers of viewers of afreeca shown on TL accurate? It seems awfully low for it to be able to pay for the venue and all the staff.

Kadenzie is saying interesting things but she needs to speak louder and put some emotions, it should get better when she's more comfortable I guess.


yeah, i think she's slowly getting more comfortable and speaking more
BW is back
Jackal03
Profile Joined October 2009
Brazil7469 Posts
July 02 2019 11:15 GMT
#26
I love BCs
BW is back
TaardadAiel
Profile Joined May 2017
Bulgaria750 Posts
July 02 2019 11:17 GMT
#27
Wow, Rush is on fire!
WriterReV hwaiting!
Jackal03
Profile Joined October 2009
Brazil7469 Posts
July 02 2019 11:18 GMT
#28
easy game for rush
BW is back
BLinD-RawR
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
ALLEYCAT BLUES49886 Posts
July 02 2019 11:18 GMT
#29
Poll: Recommend Winner's Game?

Yes (9)
 
82%

No (1)
 
9%

If you have time (1)
 
9%

11 total votes

Your vote: Recommend Winner's Game?

(Vote): Yes
(Vote): No
(Vote): If you have time

Brood War EICWoo Jung Ho, never forget.| Twitter: @BLinDRawR
TL+ Member
ggsimida
Profile Joined August 2015
1141 Posts
July 02 2019 11:18 GMT
#30
ASL8CHAMPRUSH
outscar
Profile Joined September 2014
2832 Posts
July 02 2019 11:20 GMT
#31
Offline Larva is kinda sloppy compared his online form. Happy for Rush coming out as first.
sunbeams are never made like me...
nojok
Profile Joined May 2011
France15845 Posts
July 02 2019 11:20 GMT
#32
Larva was way too passive, bio's main weakness is that it's hard to control past a certain population but larva never put the map on fire, rush could just focus on the key points of the map and use his units effectively.
"Back then teams that won were credited, now it's called throw. I think it's sad." - Kuroky - Flap Flap Wings!
outscar
Profile Joined September 2014
2832 Posts
July 02 2019 11:25 GMT
#33
Now Larva should pray nOOb takes out Mong because if Mong practiced hard his playstyle vs. Zerg is outstanding as I've watched his couple games on stream, mechanics are top level.
sunbeams are never made like me...
Wonk
Profile Joined March 2017
546 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-07-02 11:31:12
July 02 2019 11:30 GMT
#34
So happy to see rush advance, he's always been probably my favourite "upcoming" terran since that super long TvT vs. mind seasons ago

really liking the casting combo of artosis +cadenzie, it feels a bit more informative than usuaual and it's really nice to watch a ZvT with a cast from both sides
nojok
Profile Joined May 2011
France15845 Posts
July 02 2019 11:33 GMT
#35
Get tossed mong.
"Back then teams that won were credited, now it's called throw. I think it's sad." - Kuroky - Flap Flap Wings!
Jackal03
Profile Joined October 2009
Brazil7469 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-07-02 11:34:03
July 02 2019 11:33 GMT
#36
noob knocks mong!

good old proxy gate
BW is back
LaStScan
Profile Joined May 2011
Korea (South)1289 Posts
July 02 2019 11:34 GMT
#37
SouL)P(nOOB did it :O
[image loading]
Trying my best for ASL, ASTL
Jackal03
Profile Joined October 2009
Brazil7469 Posts
July 02 2019 11:42 GMT
#38
hoping that lava can beat noob again
BW is back
BLinD-RawR
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
ALLEYCAT BLUES49886 Posts
July 02 2019 11:45 GMT
#39
Poll: Recommend Losers Game?

No (7)
 
70%

If you have time (3)
 
30%

Yes (0)
 
0%

10 total votes

Your vote: Recommend Losers Game?

(Vote): Yes
(Vote): No
(Vote): If you have time

Brood War EICWoo Jung Ho, never forget.| Twitter: @BLinDRawR
TL+ Member
ggsimida
Profile Joined August 2015
1141 Posts
July 02 2019 11:53 GMT
#40
thats a nice probe massacre
Wonk
Profile Joined March 2017
546 Posts
July 02 2019 11:53 GMT
#41
god these probes
BLinD-RawR
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
ALLEYCAT BLUES49886 Posts
July 02 2019 11:54 GMT
#42
Poll: Recommend Final Game?

If you have time (7)
 
64%

No (3)
 
27%

Yes (1)
 
9%

11 total votes

Your vote: Recommend Final Game?

(Vote): Yes
(Vote): No
(Vote): If you have time

Brood War EICWoo Jung Ho, never forget.| Twitter: @BLinDRawR
TL+ Member
Jackal03
Profile Joined October 2009
Brazil7469 Posts
July 02 2019 11:54 GMT
#43
Lol, that was really easy

noob has to improve a lot his PvZ
BW is back
nojok
Profile Joined May 2011
France15845 Posts
July 02 2019 11:55 GMT
#44
One zerg and one terran advance, toss is out, a good day of BW.
"Back then teams that won were credited, now it's called throw. I think it's sad." - Kuroky - Flap Flap Wings!
outscar
Profile Joined September 2014
2832 Posts
July 02 2019 11:58 GMT
#45
As expected although thought Larva would advance first as this is the most easiest group he can ask.
sunbeams are never made like me...
JoinTheRain
Profile Blog Joined September 2018
Bulgaria408 Posts
July 02 2019 12:00 GMT
#46
I always expect higher quality from Larva, much like with Best. He advanced, yes, but his ZvT is looking far from convincing. He better hope for a ZvP Ro16 because any capable terran (and there are not incapable ones left it seems) should beat him to a pulp in BoX.
And the P, taking a game off Mong, nice performance, there is no shame to lose twice to Larva, I hope n00b stays around.
As for Rush - what can one say - domination in both his wins, it must feel amazing for him when his efforts actually yield some results.
A nice set of games, all in all.
The subject-matter of the art of living is each person's own life.
TaardadAiel
Profile Joined May 2017
Bulgaria750 Posts
July 02 2019 12:04 GMT
#47
Larva has no reason to be happy today.

Rush looking really strong right now, though, GJ by him! He really has some momentum. Nice to see the Flash/Last dominated Terran scene to liven up a little with Sharp and Rush improving lately.
WriterReV hwaiting!
neutralrobot
Profile Joined July 2011
Australia1025 Posts
July 02 2019 12:34 GMT
#48
I missed the beginning of the cast. Did they say where Tasteless is? Super cool to have Cadenzie on, but when they said he wouldn't be there for the first GSL group either, I got a little concerned.
Maru | Life | PartinG || I guess I like aggressive control freaks... || Reynor will one day reign supreme || *reyn supreme
RowdierBob
Profile Blog Joined May 2003
Australia12958 Posts
July 02 2019 13:13 GMT
#49
Good for noob to win a game but those games v Larva were painful.
"Terrans are pretty much space-Australians" - H
Wonk
Profile Joined March 2017
546 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-07-02 13:37:31
July 02 2019 13:27 GMT
#50
On July 02 2019 21:34 neutralrobot wrote:
I missed the beginning of the cast. Did they say where Tasteless is? Super cool to have Cadenzie on, but when they said he wouldn't be there for the first GSL group either, I got a little concerned.


I think they said during the last ASL that he'd booked some family vacation or something similar.

Anyway, good games, shame ajuk12/noob kinda fell apart there in the same way we saw with soma, but a really good cast. The TvZ especially was great. not sure whether it was just cadenzie's increased confidence casting or the production team but she seemed much clearer and more talkative, just compared to the KSL qualifiers. It's really nice to hear somebody give the counterplay from the zerg perspective in TvZ, which is definitely lacking in tastosis casts. hope to see this caster combo again.
Xain0n
Profile Joined November 2018
Italy3963 Posts
July 02 2019 13:46 GMT
#51
On July 02 2019 22:27 Wonk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 02 2019 21:34 neutralrobot wrote:
I missed the beginning of the cast. Did they say where Tasteless is? Super cool to have Cadenzie on, but when they said he wouldn't be there for the first GSL group either, I got a little concerned.


I think they said during the last ASL that he'd booked some family vacation or something similar.

Anyway, good games, shame ajuk12/noob kinda fell apart there in the same way we saw with soma, but a really good cast. The TvZ especially was great. not sure whether it was just cadenzie's increased confidence casting or the production team but she seemed much clearer and more talkative, just compared to the KSL qualifiers. It's really nice to hear somebody give the counterplay from the zerg perspective in TvZ, which is definitely lacking in tastosis casts. hope to see this caster combo again.


Well, Noob fell apart against Larva while Soma did so against Flash, there's a difference; I believed in him, but Rush and Larva brought the Liquibet home today.
Highgamer
Profile Joined October 2015
1399 Posts
July 02 2019 14:08 GMT
#52
Rush looked really solid in these games, just strong standard play. I like.

Really enjoyed the chill casting of this one, too. I think they're a good combo (as long as Artosis doesn't mind the little extra effort he has to put in compared to when he's with other, more experienced casters).
Wonk
Profile Joined March 2017
546 Posts
July 02 2019 14:58 GMT
#53
On July 02 2019 22:46 Xain0n wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 02 2019 22:27 Wonk wrote:
On July 02 2019 21:34 neutralrobot wrote:
I missed the beginning of the cast. Did they say where Tasteless is? Super cool to have Cadenzie on, but when they said he wouldn't be there for the first GSL group either, I got a little concerned.


I think they said during the last ASL that he'd booked some family vacation or something similar.

Anyway, good games, shame ajuk12/noob kinda fell apart there in the same way we saw with soma, but a really good cast. The TvZ especially was great. not sure whether it was just cadenzie's increased confidence casting or the production team but she seemed much clearer and more talkative, just compared to the KSL qualifiers. It's really nice to hear somebody give the counterplay from the zerg perspective in TvZ, which is definitely lacking in tastosis casts. hope to see this caster combo again.


Well, Noob fell apart against Larva while Soma did so against Flash, there's a difference; I believed in him, but Rush and Larva brought the Liquibet home today.


In my mind they're on about the same level. Soma's games vs. Flash were exponentially more crumbly due to the skill difference. Larva definitely didn't play his best today, but it still showed.
Dante08
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
Singapore4121 Posts
July 02 2019 15:30 GMT
#54
Larva played so weird in that ZvT against Rush while his ZvP looks amazing. I thought that playing against Flash would increase his powers but I think it messed him up a little haha.

Also great casting by Cadenzie! Really good knowledge and insight of the game.
Jaeyun
Profile Joined June 2017
United States202 Posts
July 02 2019 15:51 GMT
#55
Rush has always been a very solid and intelligent player, so not surprised about his results. Larva's build was fine but the killer in that game was when he invested in those mutas and got absolutely nothing done with them. If you saw, he made 2 mutas from his 3rd base but never was able to group them together until later, and when he harassed, he was trying to do damage with only like 5, which was not worth it at all. If he had his full group of mutas altogether and if he caught Rush off guard, it would have paid off very well given no turrets in either bases.

The muta fail was compounded by the fact that it's hard to take a good 4th from that position and he was playing 3 gases all game. Great game by Rush though, I do hope he advances in the RO8.
www.twitch.tv/jaeyun
BisuDagger
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Bisutopia19207 Posts
July 02 2019 17:22 GMT
#56
On July 03 2019 00:30 Dante08 wrote:
Larva played so weird in that ZvT against Rush while his ZvP looks amazing. I thought that playing against Flash would increase his powers but I think it messed him up a little haha.

Also great casting by Cadenzie! Really good knowledge and insight of the game.

Chiming in to say great job to Cadenzie too. My only comment would be to speak up a little bit more confidently. Because she is casting next to a heavily experienced caster like Artosis, the volume and projection level is very different The content being spoken was fine, just adding in some stronger inflections and tones into what is said would really make a difference.
ModeratorFormer Afreeca Starleague Caster: http://afreeca.tv/ASL2ENG2
Nematocyst
Profile Joined October 2017
United States164 Posts
July 02 2019 18:05 GMT
#57
Yeah, Cadenzie could stand to speak louder. The first cast I saw her, she was even quieter, so she's improving.

BTW, was that Rapid in the giraffe suit? The first footage of the audience from behind, I was thinking: that has to be Rapid.
Ideas
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
United States8075 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-07-02 18:26:23
July 02 2019 18:25 GMT
#58
The cast was great, Cadenzie is definitely improving. I love Tasteless but it'd be cool if she was subbed in a little more often during Zerg-heavy days or something haha.

Between today's games and the End of the World series Larva's ZvP is looking really good. But his ZvT just doesn't seem very flexible. I've said it before but I think that he's a far weaker player on non-standard maps where he can't do the standard "take an empty main base for the 3rd, guard it with 2 lurkers, expand down the ramp for the 4th". It's annoying as hell to take a 4th on Sylphid in ZvT, and Larva didn't really seem to have a great plan for getting one or doing much with his super fast 3rd base.
I like starcraft
LfunkGG
Profile Joined February 2019
78 Posts
July 02 2019 19:21 GMT
#59
are there first person videos again for this?
sM.Zik
Profile Joined June 2011
Canada2543 Posts
July 02 2019 20:01 GMT
#60
Already noticing improvements on Cadenzie's casting compared to last time, keep up the good work! It's nice to have a solid zerg player on the casting desk.
Jaedong Fighting! | youtube.com/ZikGaming
Burled_Sapele
Profile Joined June 2019
10 Posts
July 02 2019 20:19 GMT
#61
Enjoyable games (and casting) today; the games on Multiverse showed that there is quite the potential for unorthodox things to take place.

Glad to see Rush advance with solid games; not so sure about Larva in spite of some of the more poignant observations about his play (re: Jaeyun's post above). Am I mistaken in thinking that Soma and nOOB are the first two amateurs in ASL to win a game (both elimination matches, at that)? That would be noteworthy in itself and quite an achievement for both of them.
Akio
Profile Blog Joined January 2019
Finland1838 Posts
July 02 2019 20:51 GMT
#62
Enjoyed the casting and insight from Artosis and Cadenzie
Mine gas, build tanks.
machinus
Profile Joined January 2010
United States290 Posts
July 02 2019 23:18 GMT
#63
Zoe was great!!!
LaStScan
Profile Joined May 2011
Korea (South)1289 Posts
July 03 2019 00:16 GMT
#64
From the rumor i hear, ASL8 is Mong's last tourney before the military service.
Trying my best for ASL, ASTL
LaStScan
Profile Joined May 2011
Korea (South)1289 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-07-03 00:19:14
July 03 2019 00:18 GMT
#65
On July 03 2019 05:19 Burled_Sapele wrote:
Enjoyable games (and casting) today; the games on Multiverse showed that there is quite the potential for unorthodox things to take place.

Glad to see Rush advance with solid games; not so sure about Larva in spite of some of the more poignant observations about his play (re: Jaeyun's post above). Am I mistaken in thinking that Soma and nOOB are the first two amateurs in ASL to win a game (both elimination matches, at that)? That would be noteworthy in itself and quite an achievement for both of them.


nOOB is expro from WeMadeFOX
Trying my best for ASL, ASTL
Turbovolver
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Australia2384 Posts
July 03 2019 01:08 GMT
#66
Just wanna echo Rush being awesome and enjoying Cadenzie's casting.
The original Bogus fan.
KamMoye
Profile Joined December 2010
United States721 Posts
July 03 2019 02:35 GMT
#67
Larva is too rigid. He's not skilled with offensive play, only opportunistic, defensive and macro play.

This works just fine in ZvP, where you can indirectly dictate gameflow. Not so in TvZ, where T has point on game flow and risk-reward begins to skew towards offensive disruption.

Top Terran pros know Larva is too one-dimensional to threaten them. Ditto the best PvZers. In other words, Larva is one big execution test.

He plays with just enough refinement to serve as a gatekeeper but lacks the nuance to serve as a serious tournament threat.

+1 to Cadenzie/Artosis feedback. The patience with which you both casted was excellent. Cadenzie is still too quiet but she is a focused quiet, which helps the audience become immersed. Far far better than Rapid, that's for sure!
RWLabs
Profile Joined March 2017
Korea (South)273 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-07-03 03:40:45
July 03 2019 03:39 GMT
#68
Despite what the Youtube chat might suggest, I liked Cadenzie's cast. She probably has more knowledge of the progamer scene and current meta than anyone else at the moment. I do wish she showed more enthusiasm, which I understand can be difficult in front of thousands of viewers.

Also @KamMoye is it necessary to talk down Rapid?
Aldaris was the good guy of Brood War.
sysen
Profile Joined June 2018
26 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-07-03 04:14:20
July 03 2019 04:13 GMT
#69
I Agree with what other people said about Cadenzie's casting. She definitely improved since last time, but she doesnt speak clear enaugh.... sometimes, i can barely even understand her (she's mumbling too much for my taste), when i have no problem at all with Tasteless.

But i guess if she keep improving, she can be a very great caster in the future.

ggsimida
Profile Joined August 2015
1141 Posts
July 03 2019 04:23 GMT
#70
larva picked the wrong map to play that macro defensive game. like someone mentioned it has to be one of the maps where you take a easily defensible 4th from the 3rd. fine to play defensively and concede map control to terran but 4th should be feasibly achievable to be taken in the first place. i was watching from larva's pov and i thought he generally have the game well controlled defensively and even generating good counterplay at rush's 3rd. all up till the the point when the BCs showed up at his base, everything crumbles as the lack of 4th gas means he couldn't churn out enough units to deal with both the bcs/impending doomdrops and the frontline pressure.
Motivate
Profile Joined June 2011
2860 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-07-03 04:40:21
July 03 2019 04:37 GMT
#71
I dont know why Artosis (and a lot of other people) are so obsessed with the Rush guy. He has only made it out of ro24 once and has never impressed me with his play. Super overhyped imo, but maybe he's more impressive online.

Cadenzie has really good game knowledge. She just mumbles way too much and at first I thought it was someone who spoke English as a second language. Probably a confidence thing that will improve with time. I certainly feel she contributes more game discussion than Tasteless, who just makes jokes with Artosis and constantly complains about every race besides Protoss.
TaardadAiel
Profile Joined May 2017
Bulgaria750 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-07-03 05:59:35
July 03 2019 05:58 GMT
#72
I think Cadenzie's input is great. Sure, she still tends to mumble, but she has markedly improved on it. I have no trouble understanding every word. And the Zerg insight is really useful. Plus, I personally like her accent.

And Rush is definitely impressive online, plus he has had some pretty neat results lately. Winning the CMSL was no small feat, considering the competition. Action is a fairly decent ZvTer, Mini reached two consecutive offline finals and Soma has one of the best online ZvT records, particularly the best (I think) against Flash. This is not to say he's the favourite to win the tournament, but he's in good form.
WriterReV hwaiting!
KamMoye
Profile Joined December 2010
United States721 Posts
July 03 2019 07:43 GMT
#73
On July 03 2019 12:39 RWLabs wrote:

Also @KamMoye is it necessary to talk down Rapid?

Necessary? About as necessary as for you to respond to it. Do I stand by it? Absolutely. Feelings hurt? You'll get over it.
Miragee
Profile Joined December 2009
8470 Posts
July 03 2019 11:48 GMT
#74
Watched all the games now. I really like how Multiverse plays out. I hope it's going to stay for longer.

Also +1 on the Cadenzie/Artosis comments, really enjoyed the cast!
Chronopolis
Profile Joined April 2009
Canada1484 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-07-03 17:19:44
July 03 2019 17:18 GMT
#75
It's pretty cool having Cadenzie's insight into zerg and the korean meta. Feels like the first time we get a bit more glimpse into the players and background behind the strats.
RWLabs
Profile Joined March 2017
Korea (South)273 Posts
July 03 2019 19:45 GMT
#76
On July 03 2019 16:43 KamMoye wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 03 2019 12:39 RWLabs wrote:

Also @KamMoye is it necessary to talk down Rapid?

Necessary? About as necessary as for you to respond to it. Do I stand by it? Absolutely. Feelings hurt? You'll get over it.

My feelings aren't hurt. I just dislike the Brood War culture of crapping on people enthusiastic about the game because their skills aren't quite there yet.
Aldaris was the good guy of Brood War.
PVJ
Profile Blog Joined July 2012
Hungary5214 Posts
July 03 2019 21:09 GMT
#77
Not that what I have to add is anything new but would like to also throw my words of appreciation, great cast and interesting series overall today.

Would have hoped for more from Mong after his KCM performances. Will there be no ASL in the autumn / winter? Or is it just that his military is not exactly at end of year but maybe Sept / Oct or something?
The heart's eternal vow
Dante08
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
Singapore4121 Posts
July 04 2019 04:08 GMT
#78
On July 03 2019 03:25 Ideas wrote:
The cast was great, Cadenzie is definitely improving. I love Tasteless but it'd be cool if she was subbed in a little more often during Zerg-heavy days or something haha.

Between today's games and the End of the World series Larva's ZvP is looking really good. But his ZvT just doesn't seem very flexible. I've said it before but I think that he's a far weaker player on non-standard maps where he can't do the standard "take an empty main base for the 3rd, guard it with 2 lurkers, expand down the ramp for the 4th". It's annoying as hell to take a 4th on Sylphid in ZvT, and Larva didn't really seem to have a great plan for getting one or doing much with his super fast 3rd base.


Yeah Larva seems to play better on standard maps where he can use his experience and mechanics to gain an edge but falls apart abit on less standard ones. I remember him playing amazingly during the mech switch period because he knew what the Terrans were going to do and just macro-ed like a boss.

Hopefully he can put in more practice on ZvT, I would love to see him go deep in a tournament.
Liquid`Zephyr
Profile Blog Joined October 2006
United States996 Posts
July 04 2019 05:15 GMT
#79
Also stopped by to say the commentary was great (especially the tvzs). I thought she spoke pretty clearly. I think generally you don't want to force a way of speaking that isn't yours/natural but yeah it'd be nice to see it a bit louder/relatively more dynamic in time. I hope she sticks with it. I enjoyed the show a lot.
Team LiquidPoorUser
Dante08
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
Singapore4121 Posts
July 04 2019 15:45 GMT
#80
Maybe Cadenzie can join the casting archon to form a trio? Like a supporting caster role or something, the Koreans usually have 3 casters as well.
LfunkGG
Profile Joined February 2019
78 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-07-04 16:30:41
July 04 2019 16:26 GMT
#81
cadenzie's cast worked this time, previosly it was annoying. good improvement.
rush played pretty soild. i always thought he had great mechanics and good understanding of game. he looks promising. i didn't expect a lot from mong, and it was a good experience for new toss guy noob. it was bad, im sure he can't do worse next time.
KamMoye
Profile Joined December 2010
United States721 Posts
July 04 2019 19:02 GMT
#82
On July 04 2019 04:45 RWLabs wrote:
My feelings aren't hurt. I just dislike the Brood War culture of crapping on people enthusiastic about the game because their skills aren't quite there yet.


What? I wasn't talking about Rapid's enthusiasm. What point are you trying to make? I'm one person. I'm not "Brood War culture." I have specific reasons for what I say, whether it's praise or criticism or whatever. If you'd like to hear my specific reasons, I'll be glad to share them. Otherwise, have a nice day.
GTR
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
51397 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-07-04 20:04:03
July 04 2019 20:03 GMT
#83
On July 05 2019 00:45 Dante08 wrote:
Maybe Cadenzie can join the casting archon to form a trio? Like a supporting caster role or something, the Koreans usually have 3 casters as well.


it's been constantly proven over time that it just doesn't work as well in english as it does in korean.
producers try to make it work, and it simply doesn't.
Commentator
Martha1
Profile Joined July 2019
3 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-07-05 08:59:53
July 05 2019 08:59 GMT
#84
lol outside voice 🤦‍♀️
TornadoSteve
Profile Joined March 2018
1000 Posts
July 05 2019 09:39 GMT
#85
Seriously tho, group A and B were kind of disapointing. Looking forwards better games especially from JD in group C
JoinTheRain
Profile Blog Joined September 2018
Bulgaria408 Posts
July 05 2019 09:54 GMT
#86
I like everything about Cadenzie's casting. The girl is doing phenomenal when I consider the following - she is pretty young, she has not had any experience being on camera and being live on top of all. But most of all - she has not had any kind of formal training on how to behave in front of the camera or what vocabulary to use in order to entertain the public. She is doing her best, sharing knowledge ob builds and what's going on and this is great if you ask me. She can not be expected to be some kind of jokester like Tasteless who has known Artosis for 20 years.
I would advice people to please refrain from criticizing her harshly or in immoderate words. She is the best we have right now, we should cherish her, we should praise her. Yes, sure, point some errors if you are better than her, this is acceptable and most welcome. But if you're just a whiny couch potato - do not do it, it does not become a man to act in this way.
All in all - Cadenzie, you're doing great, keep it up! Your knowledge is unparalleled, your attitude is genuine, even your modesty and occasional reluctance to speak when unsure is charming. I'd much prefer frugality with words when one is uncertain rather than some oafish audacious loquacity.
The subject-matter of the art of living is each person's own life.
Szinkler
Profile Joined July 2018
Hungary394 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-07-05 12:21:55
July 05 2019 11:00 GMT
#87
I didn't want to say anything about Cadenzie's casting here but this last comment made me. Not because of what JoinTheRain wrote (okay, partly), but it was not the first comment "praising her"/"for her" and I absolutely disagree with that and think have to say the other side's piece. And I know a lot of people personally who has the same opinion as me.
I know it's subjective, but she has a very "bad" voice and she doesn't articulate words. Whatever she says just irritates me/us. (I wouldn't write these if I was the only one with this opinion because I can be an exception, but I am not)
She has a great knowledge of the game, much better than Tastless' that is a plus, but basically that is the only one. I would rather listen to Artosis or Rapid alone than to have her. I have nothing against her (I really respect her for what she achieved in SC!), but she is just not suited for casting. And I am fairly certain you can't correct the "faults" I mentioned in a short period of time because it's those kind of errors... speech "errors" ( i don't know the word). At this age it would take years to correct this. I'm not saying it's impossible.

((What you mention that she is pretty young, no experience, first time in front of camera etc, doesn't matter because it has nothing to do with her speech error, she has the same on stream and for sure in real life as well))

I wanted to say my piece because I am not alone with this opinion. I don't want to hurt her of anything but these are the facts. I have lot of "errors", faults as well, everyone does. If she tries the almost impossible road to correct hers, kudos to her and maybe in a couple of years it's going to be different.

I am not going to reply to anyone regarding this here. (If you wish we can talk on discord.)


To say something about Day 2: pretty bad games, overall quality of games were really low in my opinion. The TvT was decent, but the other games... Larva vs Rush, so many mistakes.
Dante08
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
Singapore4121 Posts
July 05 2019 11:10 GMT
#88
On July 05 2019 05:03 GTR wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 05 2019 00:45 Dante08 wrote:
Maybe Cadenzie can join the casting archon to form a trio? Like a supporting caster role or something, the Koreans usually have 3 casters as well.


it's been constantly proven over time that it just doesn't work as well in english as it does in korean.
producers try to make it work, and it simply doesn't.


Interesting, why is that so?
Alpha-NP-
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States1242 Posts
July 05 2019 13:22 GMT
#89
I liked watching Cadenzie co-casting because of her Zerg input. It is nice to have a decent Zergs perspective. But some of her posts on this forum seem a little self-praising. How good is she in comparison to the old iccup rankings and compared to players like Bonyth or Eonzerg?
JoinTheRain
Profile Blog Joined September 2018
Bulgaria408 Posts
July 05 2019 14:32 GMT
#90
On July 05 2019 22:22 Alpha-NP- wrote:
How good is she in comparison to players like Bonyth or Eonzerg?


I would say skill-wise she is at about their level or slightly worse in terms of execution but nothing absurd like A ICCUP vs C+ ICCUP. There was some KCM where she played and won vs Bonyth (I hope I am not utterly wrong about this one and if I am, please correct me) and yes, it is just one game yet the point is she is comfortable playing against the best of foreign BW players and she is not getting smashed.
The subject-matter of the art of living is each person's own life.
Lorch
Profile Joined June 2011
Germany3672 Posts
July 05 2019 14:49 GMT
#91
On July 05 2019 05:03 GTR wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 05 2019 00:45 Dante08 wrote:
Maybe Cadenzie can join the casting archon to form a trio? Like a supporting caster role or something, the Koreans usually have 3 casters as well.


it's been constantly proven over time that it just doesn't work as well in english as it does in korean.
producers try to make it work, and it simply doesn't.


"constantly"
I can remember like 3 times in the last 10 years that it was actually tried, and that is across BW and SC2 (outside of fun events like Homestory Cup or the Remastered Launch Party). I personaly always enjoyed 3 way casts whenever they were tried, it would obviously take some getting used to. I think it might as well be worth trying it for a full season of something. I don't think the occasional series that it was tried on was enough of an indicator. Why not try it for an entire ASL or KSL season so we get a definitive answer on whether it can work?
Ideas
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
United States8075 Posts
July 05 2019 15:03 GMT
#92
On July 05 2019 23:49 Lorch wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 05 2019 05:03 GTR wrote:
On July 05 2019 00:45 Dante08 wrote:
Maybe Cadenzie can join the casting archon to form a trio? Like a supporting caster role or something, the Koreans usually have 3 casters as well.


it's been constantly proven over time that it just doesn't work as well in english as it does in korean.
producers try to make it work, and it simply doesn't.


"constantly"
I can remember like 3 times in the last 10 years that it was actually tried, and that is across BW and SC2 (outside of fun events like Homestory Cup or the Remastered Launch Party). I personaly always enjoyed 3 way casts whenever they were tried, it would obviously take some getting used to. I think it might as well be worth trying it for a full season of something. I don't think the occasional series that it was tried on was enough of an indicator. Why not try it for an entire ASL or KSL season so we get a definitive answer on whether it can work?


I'm guessing it's more if a money thing than a format thing. Hell I still find it crazy that ASL/KSL do an English cast at all when they give it away FOR FREE and none of the ads are in English or targeted towards non-Koreans at all. A 3rd caster makes the whole thing 50% more expensive.
I like starcraft
Cryoc
Profile Joined July 2011
Germany909 Posts
July 05 2019 15:44 GMT
#93
On July 05 2019 23:32 JoinTheRain wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 05 2019 22:22 Alpha-NP- wrote:
How good is she in comparison to players like Bonyth or Eonzerg?


I would say skill-wise she is at about their level or slightly worse in terms of execution but nothing absurd like A ICCUP vs C+ ICCUP. There was some KCM where she played and won vs Bonyth (I hope I am not utterly wrong about this one and if I am, please correct me) and yes, it is just one game yet the point is she is comfortable playing against the best of foreign BW players and she is not getting smashed.

She won vs Dewalt with a Hydra bust. Using that to estimate her skill level close to Dewalt is very bold.

Regarding her speech, I think it is fine besides being quieter than Artosis. And I take that flaw any time considering the much better strategic inside of the commentary.
http://www.twitch.tv/cryoc
Nematocyst
Profile Joined October 2017
United States164 Posts
July 05 2019 16:09 GMT
#94
On July 05 2019 22:22 Alpha-NP- wrote:
How good is she in comparison to the old iccup rankings and compared to players like Bonyth or Eonzerg?


I know you didn't mention this to say she shouldn't cast or anything. But I want to give my opinion on why I like her as a caster. Faults aside, she's got fantastic insight on Korean BW. Her experience in that area is incredible, and to allow us peons to listen to her thoughts on it is helpful towards any cast. Either she wants to be a full time caster or she doesn't, but I welcome her presence because she provides first hand knowledge of playing on teams and just knowing most of the top ex-pros.

Being good in tournament setting is a small piece of the puzzle. Artosis seldom fares well, but as a caster, his perspective is truly second to none among English speaking casters.
KrsNinja
Profile Joined December 2003
Norway24 Posts
July 05 2019 21:45 GMT
#95
I think Cad is a great addition to the commentating. Previously Tasteless was the Expert protoss, and Artosis of Course Terran, now we have someone really knowledgable to share insights on Zerg as well and they can mix around pending the matchups etc.
My tombstone will display: He reached 300 in APM
Puosu
Profile Blog Joined April 2007
6984 Posts
July 06 2019 16:56 GMT
#96
On July 05 2019 20:00 Szinkler wrote:
I didn't want to say anything about Cadenzie's casting here but this last comment made me. Not because of what JoinTheRain wrote (okay, partly), but it was not the first comment "praising her"/"for her" and I absolutely disagree with that and think have to say the other side's piece. And I know a lot of people personally who has the same opinion as me.
I know it's subjective, but she has a very "bad" voice and she doesn't articulate words. Whatever she says just irritates me/us. (I wouldn't write these if I was the only one with this opinion because I can be an exception, but I am not)
She has a great knowledge of the game, much better than Tastless' that is a plus, but basically that is the only one. I would rather listen to Artosis or Rapid alone than to have her. I have nothing against her (I really respect her for what she achieved in SC!), but she is just not suited for casting. And I am fairly certain you can't correct the "faults" I mentioned in a short period of time because it's those kind of errors... speech "errors" ( i don't know the word). At this age it would take years to correct this. I'm not saying it's impossible.

((What you mention that she is pretty young, no experience, first time in front of camera etc, doesn't matter because it has nothing to do with her speech error, she has the same on stream and for sure in real life as well))

I wanted to say my piece because I am not alone with this opinion. I don't want to hurt her of anything but these are the facts. I have lot of "errors", faults as well, everyone does. If she tries the almost impossible road to correct hers, kudos to her and maybe in a couple of years it's going to be different.

I am not going to reply to anyone regarding this here. (If you wish we can talk on discord.)


To say something about Day 2: pretty bad games, overall quality of games were really low in my opinion. The TvT was decent, but the other games... Larva vs Rush, so many mistakes.

cool, non-american accent is a "speech error"
KamMoye
Profile Joined December 2010
United States721 Posts
July 08 2019 15:58 GMT
#97
Yeah, Cadenzie's presence adds major layers of subtlety and depth and while her voice isn't great, her pacing *is*. I'd be perfectly happy with her + Artosis or her + Tasteless every time.
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