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[ASL4] Ro8 Bisu vs Killer - Page 10

Forum Index > Brood War Tournaments
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Prev 1 8 9 10 All
PVJ
Profile Blog Joined July 2012
Hungary5221 Posts
October 23 2017 16:42 GMT
#181
Man, was this beautiful.
The heart's eternal vow
Golgotha
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Korea (South)8418 Posts
October 24 2017 04:11 GMT
#182
haha I told you guys that baxter was fucked. I looked at the video length of the youtube video and saw that it was an hour. I already knew it was 3-0. Bisu vs. Flash. Thank God!!!!!!!!!!!

Bisu looks so damn scary right now.
JBWKZ
Profile Joined May 2010
Vietnam8 Posts
October 24 2017 16:02 GMT
#183
hold it down for the toss baby.
My life for Aiur!~
Heartland
Profile Blog Joined May 2012
Sweden24593 Posts
October 24 2017 18:33 GMT
#184
On October 24 2017 13:11 Golgotha wrote:
haha I told you guys that baxter was fucked. I looked at the video length of the youtube video and saw that it was an hour. I already knew it was 3-0. Bisu vs. Flash. Thank God!!!!!!!!!!!

Bisu looks so damn scary right now.


Dude, you never check the video length, it's just a big fucking spoiler!
dRaW
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
Canada5744 Posts
October 24 2017 19:26 GMT
#185
Is there till the recommended vod thread somewhere? I want to catch the best games of ASL4.
I don't need luck, luck is for noobs, good luck to you though
VioleTAK
Profile Joined July 2006
4339 Posts
October 25 2017 03:13 GMT
#186
On October 25 2017 04:26 dRaW wrote:
Is there till the recommended vod thread somewhere? I want to catch the best games of ASL4.

If you want to watch only the best games, just wait a little longer and you'll be able to watch Bisu take down Flash in a glorious 3-2 series, followed by an awesome 3-1 on Larva, that won't hold a candle to the semi-finals that finally took down God, but a good send-off of Bisu to the army.
Every fan of Starcraft is a fan of Lim Yo Hwan by association
VioleTAK
Profile Joined July 2006
4339 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-10-25 14:00:01
October 25 2017 13:32 GMT
#187
I highly recommend watching this English subtitled review of the games, specifically to watch the interview at the end, which shows you are horribly wrong the translation during the live English stream is, they just changed everything...
Every fan of Starcraft is a fan of Lim Yo Hwan by association
NonY
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
8751 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-10-25 17:47:44
October 25 2017 17:45 GMT
#188
On October 23 2017 21:59 Liquid`Drone wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 23 2017 10:01 Dante08 wrote:
On October 23 2017 06:40 ArvickHero wrote:
On October 23 2017 03:44 Barneyk wrote:
But 1 sunken and 1 spore in your bases isn't that much of an investment when you have that many hatcheries and you know your opponent is going for DTs.

I'm tired of this type of criticism.

One sunken is 175 mineral (75+50+drone), not including lost mining time. You're suggesting a cost of 400+ minerals per base, which could easily be another control group of hydras, several groups of zerglings, or much faster tech. At a lower level, you might be able to shrug off the massive deficit through superior play. But against the greatest PvZ player in the world? Youre basically giving up the game. You'll deflect the harass, but then just get crushed either in an army engagement or by a timing attack.


So you're saying losing 10+ drones is better than building a sunken and spore? Bisu went sair DT for THREE games straight, if you know its coming it's way better to spend 400+ minerals rather than potentially lose your drones & tech. Not to mention you'll have to bring hydras and overlords back, which means more apm devoted to defending which means your other bases get attacked without you noticing. Also whats is another control group of hydras going to do when you have to bring your fighting hydras back to defend, which Killer did multiple times.

If you are better than your opponent I can understand why you would not want to invest in static defense, but against Bisu the best PvZer who did the same build 3 times in a row is just inexcusable.


There's an inbetween. One sunken and spore in each base would be a too significant investment, one that would make him fall too far behind. However, completely neglecting it did cost him any chance at the game. Like in the third game, he should have had one spore in the second base (the one where overlords can't travel too all that fast). Then he only needs to have enough hydras in that base to beat any impending dts, and he could have more overlords in his natural protected by a bigger swarm of hydra. So one spore+one sunken per base, that is too much. However, say, one spore and one additional hydra in his second natural, that actually would have stopped the harassment and made him enter the mid-game on pretty equal footing.

In addition to this, we have to keep in mind that having a predictable conservative response to a particular threat is not a viable way to win tournaments. That simplifies the meta game for your opponent far too much. If Bisu is prepared to go Sair/DT every game and in game 3 he encounters this overreaction, then in game 4 he can present the same threat but not actually commit to it as much (which is not a very tricky adjustment to make for him). So in the end, while you may want to mix in a really conservative play if you are very sure your opponent will do an aggressive play, you still have to be unpredictable.

If you don't have a build prepared, then your attempt will probably not be as optimal as you hoped, and you're better off playing the way you practiced. It is very difficult to improvise in the middle of a series at this level of play. Of course he encountered corsair/DT in practice and I'm sure he won many games against it, but in this series he fell short. It is reasonable to assume he didn't practice static defense builds at all. Whereas the protoss build and how much commitment there is to aggression is much more fluid, more easily adjusted game-to-game and even moment-to-moment.
"Fucking up is part of it. If you can't fail, you have to always win. And I don't think you can always win." Elliott Smith ---------- Yet no sudden rage darkened his face, and his eyes were calm as they studied her. Then he smiled. 'Witness.'
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