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[MSL] Grand Final - Page 177

Forum Index > Brood War Tournaments
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dukethegold
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Canada5645 Posts
June 11 2011 14:30 GMT
#3521
On June 11 2011 21:30 Reyis wrote:
it was probably one of the most boring final ever -_-


In term of the final result, yes.

But in term of gameplay, definitely not. The recommend section speaks for itself.

All the ZvZ finals thus far have been dreadful.
WaterTower
Profile Joined May 2011
France138 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-11 14:38:23
June 11 2011 14:37 GMT
#3522
Everything lived up to the excitement, except I almost hope Flash would GG game 3 for the fun of it and play another game. With Flash at the controls, the UED would have never lost.
kuroshiroi
Profile Joined November 2010
3149 Posts
June 11 2011 14:37 GMT
#3523
On June 11 2011 20:14 TwoToneTerran wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 11 2011 20:09 kuroshiroi wrote:
On June 11 2011 19:56 Holgerius wrote:
On June 11 2011 19:51 kuroshiroi wrote:
On June 11 2011 19:47 Holgerius wrote:
On June 11 2011 19:46 kuroshiroi wrote:
On June 11 2011 19:36 Hinanawi wrote:
On June 11 2011 19:32 kuroshiroi wrote:
On June 11 2011 19:26 AppleTart wrote:
On June 11 2011 19:25 kuroshiroi wrote:
[quote]
He's going to win the next OSL and MSL too, if these finals were any indication. Zero is supposed to be the second best Zerg but he got absolutely dominated in every way. The only way Flash isn't winning both next season is if JD gets his shit together, which is getting to be rather unlikely.

These are dark times for BW fans but good times for Flash fans, I guess.


Last season was a very dark time for Flash fans, getting knocked out of both leagues by no namers in like Ro 32 or something

Yes, because 3 months of no individual leagues is so hard? Give me a break, it was a minor bump in the road after he won everything. And he won every game in PL in the meantime. Flash fans have nothing to complain about when compared to any other player in the last 2 years.


It's our reward for sticking by Flash back when he was in his dark days in 2009 when we all knew he had so much potential but just couldn't win important games like Jaedong and Bisu could.

By that logic, Bisu should win the next 6 Starleagues as a reward to his loyal fans, right? KTY hwaiting~

Except Bisu has 3 Golds in his resumé already. Flash sat on 1 measly gold and never even got close to a second despite showing ridiculous talent all the time.

Flash didn't win a starleague for a year, Bisu hasn't won one in 3, let one get anywhere near a final. Sounds fair to me. And you're saying Bisu isn't talented?

First off, it was almost two years betweem Flash's first and second gold.

What I'm saying is Bisu has already proven that he's one of the greatest players of all time, with his three golds. He has already taken his talent and turned it into Starleague titles, even if it was a while ago. Flash wasn't doing that at all during that long, dark period of time, and it looked like he, despite showing some of the best play people had ever seen, would never reach that position.

It was 18 months, guess how long is has been since JD won a starleague despite showing some of the best play people have ever seen in the meantime?

So what you're saying there's an arbitrary limit on how many starleague titles a player can win before you can't complain about your player having a hard time any more? Then people (I don't know if it's you too) should stop complaining about Flash's "slump" 6 months ago. He already had 5 titles by that time and was dominating PL.

You're free to complain about how hard it was to support him for those 18 long months of him having "only" won 1 OSL but it just looks extremely arrogant and disrespectful to every other fan. Just enjoy your Bonjwa, God and GOAT and keep quiet when people criticise him. It's the honourable thing to do.


You demonstrate absolutely no knowledge about Flash. There isn't a statute of limitations on remembering how you pitied a kid -- a very young kid -- who had the weight of an entire team thrown on his shoulders at 15 and had all of the world expected of him after a dominant OSL run. When your nickname is "Child Labor Terran" And a common reason you're dropping out of leagues is because you had to try to win 4 games in a row the day before a series against Best that he just blows from exhaustion and underpreparation.

It was sad, sadder than any truly S class game has ever been, because no one ever had so little help and so much expected of them. You're freaking ridiculous if you want to compare what Flash was going through to others. Oz for Jaedong was an amazing team, and don't get me started on SKT. It was more than just "Well he didn't win a lot of titles!" it was a much sadder story of almost abusive treatment of a child.

What Flash has done is a testament to his previous struggles. I know a lot of people begrudge Flash for his dominance, but his story is one hell of a feel good story when you look at it.

Spare me the sob story. Flash decided to win a starleague in 1 year and did just that. Flash definitely had higher expectations of himself than others ever did and he still does. He is a competitor and he has never complained about having to carry his team. He wants to win and that's what winners do, they make sacrifices and sometimes their efforts don't pay off. If he couldn't have carried his team, he had the option of quitting. But he didn't and he pushed through and here we are.

This isn't a sad story, at all. Even you said it's a feel-good story which is the opposite of sad. But that's not enough for Flash fans, Flash must win everything and Flash must be the best at everything and Flash must go through the biggest amount of hardship too. He brought the hardship on himself so I can't feel sorry for him. He has had the biggest amount of success in the shortest amount of time with very limited set-backs but you still find something to complain about. Unbelievable.

Congratulations, Flash. Your games are boring to watch since they're so one-sided but it's not your fault that everybody else is shit compared to you.
Fly Jaedong, fly!
OopsOopsBaby
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
Singapore3425 Posts
June 11 2011 14:41 GMT
#3524
just back from kwangwoon. should i say the games were underwhelming.
s3x2-2 xiao3x2+2 bone3+2+2
Jaksiel
Profile Joined November 2008
United States4130 Posts
June 11 2011 14:46 GMT
#3525
Bleh. I kept hoping Queens would appear in Game 3 to hit the undefended tanks.
Zero fighting.
FuRong
Profile Joined April 2010
New Zealand3089 Posts
June 11 2011 14:56 GMT
#3526
Rough belated live report from the venue:

12:30(?): TLers arrive, pick up tickets and eat Korean BBQ (I wasn't there so I dunno exactly what happened)
3:00: I turn up, everyone is standing around outside waiting. About 12 TLers in total. Zero line seems much longer than the Flash line. We wait in the Flash line.
3:30: Fangirls get allowed inside the venue, everyone else still waiting. It's damn hot, good thing that half of us each bought a huge bottle of Pocari.
4:25: Lines finally start to move, eventually we make it inside and get seated in the Flash section
4:30: Guy with whistle and loudspeaker warms up the crowd with KT chants, hype builds
4:45: Possible brief sighting of Zero in his booth
5:00: Lights dim, opening music begins, crowd goes crazy
5:05: A-pink come on stage and stand there awkwardly for about 5 minutes while the intro finishes, then launch into their performance. Better than I expected
5:20: Interviews and pre-game hype etc, crowd seems excited
5:50: Set 1 finally begins, guy sitting next to me with TL shirt (gorchiza?) gets his Team Liquid sign shown on TV. Five pages instantly added to this thread.
6:05: Zero taps out, lots of noise from the Flash side of the crowd
6:15: Set 2 begins, seems pretty even for quite a while.
6:25(?): Guy sitting next to me gets another TL sign shown on TV, I completely miss it
6:40: Zero's economy is ruined, but he seems to be making a comeback with Queens. Zero kills all the tanks and then ggs, leaving the crowd confused. Flash now up 2-0 but it takes us a while to figure out what just happened. Was it an Idra gg timing?
6:55: Set 3 begins, Flash goes for similar Valk build
7:15: Zero in trouble as Flash sieges his third, tank wall builds up and crowd senses the end. Defeat seems inevitable at this point so when the gg finally comes out it's a bit of an anticlimax
7:20: Lee Young Ho chant goes up on the Flash side of the crowd, Zero fans start leaving
7:25: Prize ceremony begins.
7:35: Ceremony finishes, closing credits begin to play
7:40: Raffle drawing for the crowd is held, ggggbabybabybaby wins a $100 ABC Mart voucher.
7:41: Chang Min (in English): "Nice to meet you, congratulations"
7:50: About ten of us head off to another Korean BBQ place, but the restaurant is not actually Korean BBQ even though the name is 코리안 바비큐. Confusion ensues.
8:30: We get owned by super-spicy chicken that we thought we could handle but really can't
9:30: We pay and leave. The end.
Don't hate the player, hate the game
HopLight
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Sweden999 Posts
June 11 2011 15:00 GMT
#3527
On June 11 2011 21:56 disciple wrote:
well he did say it starts to hurt after 3-4 games. hence I believe he rushed to finish the series so he can hold the trophy without any major problems


You have to admit, it is so much easier if you just 3-0 your opponent quickly rather than let it drag out for all 5.
Kznn
Profile Joined March 2011
Brazil9072 Posts
June 11 2011 15:05 GMT
#3528
Flash is just... insane... wow.

revy
Profile Joined September 2009
United States1524 Posts
June 11 2011 15:06 GMT
#3529
On June 11 2011 23:37 kuroshiroi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 11 2011 20:14 TwoToneTerran wrote:
On June 11 2011 20:09 kuroshiroi wrote:
On June 11 2011 19:56 Holgerius wrote:
On June 11 2011 19:51 kuroshiroi wrote:
On June 11 2011 19:47 Holgerius wrote:
On June 11 2011 19:46 kuroshiroi wrote:
On June 11 2011 19:36 Hinanawi wrote:
On June 11 2011 19:32 kuroshiroi wrote:
On June 11 2011 19:26 AppleTart wrote:
[quote]

Last season was a very dark time for Flash fans, getting knocked out of both leagues by no namers in like Ro 32 or something

Yes, because 3 months of no individual leagues is so hard? Give me a break, it was a minor bump in the road after he won everything. And he won every game in PL in the meantime. Flash fans have nothing to complain about when compared to any other player in the last 2 years.


It's our reward for sticking by Flash back when he was in his dark days in 2009 when we all knew he had so much potential but just couldn't win important games like Jaedong and Bisu could.

By that logic, Bisu should win the next 6 Starleagues as a reward to his loyal fans, right? KTY hwaiting~

Except Bisu has 3 Golds in his resumé already. Flash sat on 1 measly gold and never even got close to a second despite showing ridiculous talent all the time.

Flash didn't win a starleague for a year, Bisu hasn't won one in 3, let one get anywhere near a final. Sounds fair to me. And you're saying Bisu isn't talented?

First off, it was almost two years betweem Flash's first and second gold.

What I'm saying is Bisu has already proven that he's one of the greatest players of all time, with his three golds. He has already taken his talent and turned it into Starleague titles, even if it was a while ago. Flash wasn't doing that at all during that long, dark period of time, and it looked like he, despite showing some of the best play people had ever seen, would never reach that position.

It was 18 months, guess how long is has been since JD won a starleague despite showing some of the best play people have ever seen in the meantime?

So what you're saying there's an arbitrary limit on how many starleague titles a player can win before you can't complain about your player having a hard time any more? Then people (I don't know if it's you too) should stop complaining about Flash's "slump" 6 months ago. He already had 5 titles by that time and was dominating PL.

You're free to complain about how hard it was to support him for those 18 long months of him having "only" won 1 OSL but it just looks extremely arrogant and disrespectful to every other fan. Just enjoy your Bonjwa, God and GOAT and keep quiet when people criticise him. It's the honourable thing to do.


You demonstrate absolutely no knowledge about Flash. There isn't a statute of limitations on remembering how you pitied a kid -- a very young kid -- who had the weight of an entire team thrown on his shoulders at 15 and had all of the world expected of him after a dominant OSL run. When your nickname is "Child Labor Terran" And a common reason you're dropping out of leagues is because you had to try to win 4 games in a row the day before a series against Best that he just blows from exhaustion and underpreparation.

It was sad, sadder than any truly S class game has ever been, because no one ever had so little help and so much expected of them. You're freaking ridiculous if you want to compare what Flash was going through to others. Oz for Jaedong was an amazing team, and don't get me started on SKT. It was more than just "Well he didn't win a lot of titles!" it was a much sadder story of almost abusive treatment of a child.

What Flash has done is a testament to his previous struggles. I know a lot of people begrudge Flash for his dominance, but his story is one hell of a feel good story when you look at it.

Spare me the sob story. Flash decided to win a starleague in 1 year and did just that. Flash definitely had higher expectations of himself than others ever did and he still does. He is a competitor and he has never complained about having to carry his team. He wants to win and that's what winners do, they make sacrifices and sometimes their efforts don't pay off. If he couldn't have carried his team, he had the option of quitting. But he didn't and he pushed through and here we are.

This isn't a sad story, at all. Even you said it's a feel-good story which is the opposite of sad. But that's not enough for Flash fans, Flash must win everything and Flash must be the best at everything and Flash must go through the biggest amount of hardship too. He brought the hardship on himself so I can't feel sorry for him. He has had the biggest amount of success in the shortest amount of time with very limited set-backs but you still find something to complain about. Unbelievable.

Congratulations, Flash. Your games are boring to watch since they're so one-sided but it's not your fault that everybody else is shit compared to you.


Yikes you sound bitter. The point stands that lots of fans of people have been disappointed in not having won SLs in a while but Flash's case is a little bit different. Flash burst onto the scene, ran over Bacchus and the GOMstar and then failed in all the individual leagues for 18 months. Flash fans seriously questioned whether or not he would ever win another starleague. Did Flash just get lucky? Did the stars align for that one SL and now will never again?

Obviously it's no longer a question, and it has been incredibly easy to be a Flash fan since Summer of 2009. I suppose Bisu fan's can make an equally sad story though, burst onto the scene, stood at the threshold of bonjwaness and then fell off the earth (at least in individuals) for a long time. If Bisu comes back and wins a bunch of SLs in a row I think it will make for an entertaining story.
johanes
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
Czech Republic2246 Posts
June 11 2011 15:15 GMT
#3530
Is there any VOD with winners ceremony?
dukethegold
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Canada5645 Posts
June 11 2011 15:22 GMT
#3531
On June 11 2011 23:56 FuRong wrote:
Rough belated live report from the venue:

12:30(?): TLers arrive, pick up tickets and eat Korean BBQ (I wasn't there so I dunno exactly what happened)
3:00: I turn up, everyone is standing around outside waiting. About 12 TLers in total. Zero line seems much longer than the Flash line. We wait in the Flash line.
3:30: Fangirls get allowed inside the venue, everyone else still waiting. It's damn hot, good thing that half of us each bought a huge bottle of Pocari.
4:25: Lines finally start to move, eventually we make it inside and get seated in the Flash section
4:30: Guy with whistle and loudspeaker warms up the crowd with KT chants, hype builds
4:45: Possible brief sighting of Zero in his booth
5:00: Lights dim, opening music begins, crowd goes crazy
5:05: A-pink come on stage and stand there awkwardly for about 5 minutes while the intro finishes, then launch into their performance. Better than I expected
5:20: Interviews and pre-game hype etc, crowd seems excited
5:50: Set 1 finally begins, guy sitting next to me with TL shirt (gorchiza?) gets his Team Liquid sign shown on TV. Five pages instantly added to this thread.
6:05: Zero taps out, lots of noise from the Flash side of the crowd
6:15: Set 2 begins, seems pretty even for quite a while.
6:25(?): Guy sitting next to me gets another TL sign shown on TV, I completely miss it
6:40: Zero's economy is ruined, but he seems to be making a comeback with Queens. Zero kills all the tanks and then ggs, leaving the crowd confused. Flash now up 2-0 but it takes us a while to figure out what just happened. Was it an Idra gg timing?
6:55: Set 3 begins, Flash goes for similar Valk build
7:15: Zero in trouble as Flash sieges his third, tank wall builds up and crowd senses the end. Defeat seems inevitable at this point so when the gg finally comes out it's a bit of an anticlimax
7:20: Lee Young Ho chant goes up on the Flash side of the crowd, Zero fans start leaving
7:25: Prize ceremony begins.
7:35: Ceremony finishes, closing credits begin to play
7:40: Raffle drawing for the crowd is held, ggggbabybabybaby wins a $100 ABC Mart voucher.
7:41: Chang Min (in English): "Nice to meet you, congratulations"
7:50: About ten of us head off to another Korean BBQ place, but the restaurant is not actually Korean BBQ even though the name is 코리안 바비큐. Confusion ensues.
8:30: We get owned by super-spicy chicken that we thought we could handle but really can't
9:30: We pay and leave. The end.


Well, at least one of you guys got a 100 dollar voucher out of it.

Just think of a visit to the zoo.
mmdmmd
Profile Joined June 2007
722 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-11 15:58:02
June 11 2011 15:31 GMT
#3532
Man I love BW. For the past 10 years, we've more or less agreed that the Queen is one of the most useless unit in BW. And how wrong we were. Look forward to the day where someone finds a use for Scouts.

Now that BLizz is buddy with Kespa and Kespa is moving BW into international spot light, maybe we can finally ask the question:

Poll: Would you like to see BW getting patched again?

No, just let the Pros and Map makers do their best. (62)
 
65%

Just patch Scouts, it is the last unused unit in BW. (24)
 
25%

Yes, the game still needs some balancing (10)
 
10%

96 total votes

Your vote: Would you like to see BW getting patched again?

(Vote): Yes, the game still needs some balancing
(Vote): No, just let the Pros and Map makers do their best.
(Vote): Just patch Scouts, it is the last unused unit in BW.



koreasilver
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
9109 Posts
June 11 2011 15:37 GMT
#3533
ffs, no.
Specialist
Profile Blog Joined April 2007
United States803 Posts
June 11 2011 15:38 GMT
#3534
Flash is God of Starcraft. Period.
koreasilver
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
9109 Posts
June 11 2011 15:39 GMT
#3535
On June 11 2011 19:40 mustaju wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 11 2011 19:29 BLinD-RawR wrote:
On June 11 2011 19:28 Hyde wrote:
On June 11 2011 19:27 moopie wrote:
On June 11 2011 19:26 Hyde wrote:
On June 11 2011 19:22 Torenhire wrote:
On June 11 2011 19:21 Hyde wrote:
On June 11 2011 19:19 Torenhire wrote:
On June 11 2011 19:18 doothegee wrote:
On June 11 2011 19:16 bearbuddy wrote:
Time to punch something then go to sleep. Damn. Congrats to Flash.

Woongjin fan group crying session inc

There's only like five of us anyway


Could be worse, there's only 2 STX fans.

Me and Mustaju. Lol.

Last count on Nov 2010 revealed at least 203 stx tags


lol 203!

Should update the count, I'm actually kinda curious about the TL tags and % of people wearing what.

Hey, it's better than 2 lol, only people I recall with the tags are you, must, cs, and thepol

Yeah I wish they would update it also. I imagine SKT recieves another boost in numbers haha :D

Badges alone don't mean lack of fans :3

Yeah I know, as I'm a fan of a few other teams too :D


I love STX.

STX is only pure love to be shared with the precious few who are deserving of it.

STX used to be one of my favourite teams. But then Hwasin killed himself and July left for SC2.
okum
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
France5779 Posts
June 11 2011 15:40 GMT
#3536
On June 12 2011 00:38 LiLu wrote:
Flash is God of Starcraft. Period.

There is dispute about this. The Jaedong church is still strong.
Flash fan before it was cool | Coiner of "jangbang"
Lebesgue
Profile Joined October 2008
4542 Posts
June 11 2011 15:46 GMT
#3537
What a domination by Flash. I was a bit worried about the final as Zero has awesome ZvT but he got rolled over... So happy that Flash got golden badge :-)

And 3:0 in final and semi-final is damn impressive. Especially that maps are not that bad for Zergs...

mnesthes
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
5433 Posts
June 11 2011 15:49 GMT
#3538
Just finished watching the VODs and I think Flash had definitely had more preparation than Zero. In all games he used builds that rely on dishing out the aggression to fight the defensive ZvT style that Zero /Soulkey have been very successful in, then while applying that pressure he outexpanded the opponent. Zero was just too predictable in his style of choice.
<+LighTofHeaveN> Ppl call this "Indigo Children"
Caos2
Profile Joined November 2008
United States1728 Posts
June 11 2011 15:50 GMT
#3539
In his current form, Flash would be able to take most progamers using Protoss.
stevewch
Profile Joined February 2006
Hong Kong216 Posts
June 11 2011 15:54 GMT
#3540
the nickname of flash:ultimate weapon really says it all
i am hoping a new protoss come out and turnover flash, just like what reach has done in boxer's age.
SC forever!
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