• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 01:58
CET 07:58
KST 15:58
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups C & D Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview2TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners12Intel X Team Liquid Seoul event: Showmatches and Meet the Pros10[ASL20] Finals Preview: Arrival13
Community News
Weekly Cups (Nov 10-16): Reynor, Solar lead Zerg surge1[TLMC] Fall/Winter 2025 Ladder Map Rotation14Weekly Cups (Nov 3-9): Clem Conquers in Canada4SC: Evo Complete - Ranked Ladder OPEN ALPHA9StarCraft, SC2, HotS, WC3, Returning to Blizzcon!45
StarCraft 2
General
Mech is the composition that needs teleportation t SC: Evo Complete - Ranked Ladder OPEN ALPHA RotterdaM "Serral is the GOAT, and it's not close" [TLMC] Fall/Winter 2025 Ladder Map Rotation Weekly Cups (Nov 10-16): Reynor, Solar lead Zerg surge
Tourneys
Constellation Cup - Main Event - Stellar Fest 2025 RSL Offline Finals Dates + Ticket Sales! $5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship RSL Revival: Season 3 Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 500 Fright night Mutation # 499 Chilling Adaptation Mutation # 498 Wheel of Misfortune|Cradle of Death Mutation # 497 Battle Haredened
Brood War
General
FlaSh on: Biggest Problem With SnOw's Playstyle What happened to TvZ on Retro? BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ SnOw's ASL S20 Finals Review BW General Discussion
Tourneys
[BSL21] GosuLeague T1 Ro16 - Tue & Thu 22:00 CET [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Small VOD Thread 2.0 [BSL21] RO32 Group D - Sunday 21:00 CET
Strategy
Current Meta How to stay on top of macro? PvZ map balance Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
Clair Obscur - Expedition 33 Beyond All Reason Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Should offensive tower rushing be viable in RTS games? Path of Exile
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread SPIRED by.ASL Mafia {211640}
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine The Games Industry And ATVI About SC2SEA.COM
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread Korean Music Discussion
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion NBA General Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023 TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Dyadica Gospel – a Pulp No…
Hildegard
Coffee x Performance in Espo…
TrAiDoS
Saturation point
Uldridge
DnB/metal remix FFO Mick Go…
ImbaTosS
Reality "theory" prov…
perfectspheres
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 2165 users

Manipulating Scarabs

Forum Index > Brood War Strategy
Post a Reply
MeSaber
Profile Joined December 2009
Sweden1235 Posts
Last Edited: 2022-03-28 17:29:55
March 28 2022 17:22 GMT
#1
When people say scarabs 'dud' what actually happens is that you are unknowingly manipulating scarabs when you move the target. I have mentioned this in some other thread but i wanted to showcase (again) what you can do to be safe from scarabs, also what you can do to help scarabs hit the target.

Examples of scarab not finding the path because of a moving target (red probe): [Replay]
[image loading] [image loading] [image loading]

What you can see on the most right image; moving objects (teal probe) blocking a scarab is way more abrupting to scarab pathfinding than static objects.

This is why most of the time when you aim a scarab at a center worker to get maximum damage; when your opponent moves all workers at once it will 'dud'. You dont necessarily have to go away from the scarab either. Some luck can play a role where it have the opportunity to go straight through all blocking probes or if the probes blocking stops, giving scarab pathfinding an easier time to navigate.

As seen on the images, static objects gets a try on pathfinding (red arrows) while moving objects blocking the path do not. Most likely because it never gets the time to pathfind around the blocking object as it keeps moving away from the scarab, resetting pathfinding algorithm.



So how do you actually get the most damage out of scarabs?

As seen in the image below, you can see the reaver can shoot through minerals if you drop it close enough to mineral line. This i would argue is the safest option to keep reaver both alive and do damage to whatever stack of workers you want to attack (as the scarab will jump through all minerals straight to target).

Next is the Green square which serves as the perfect position to get workers cornered. They have nowhere to go resulting in lost workers and hopefully many if aimed correctly (aim at a worker that isnt already blocked by another unit).

As the defender you have four options if a reaver comes:
1. Do nothing, let probes die until reaver is dead.
2. If reaver drops at the Green square you pull probes to gas and then to center map to keep them as unstacked as possible.
3. Flee to base as thats a long distance and you wont need to micromanage them anymore after that, probes will die as you will go straight through reaver (Green square).
4. Keep probes unstacked by going to Center map (yellow lines upwards)

I would say option 4 (yellow lines) is best because it will makes workers unstacked the quickest and starts moving asap. If reaver aims incorrectly (at a worker followed by another worker) it will most certainly 'dud'. Least workers will be killed.

[Replay]
[image loading]

And the scenario if reaver is too far from minerals: (green static target / blue moving target) [Replay]
[image loading]

I encourage you (who uses reaver a lot) to study your own games where you use reaver and see if you can apply this information somewhere to un-'dud' your games.

Maybe sometime in the future; all games becomes un-dud:ed. That would be really cool to see.

I guess thats all i had to say for now. Thank you for reading.
-.-
limbhaze
Profile Joined March 2022
2 Posts
March 29 2022 13:17 GMT
#2
--- Nuked ---
EndingLife
Profile Blog Joined December 2002
United States1598 Posts
March 29 2022 13:29 GMT
#3
Real good stuff. Sick post!
imBLIND
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
United States2626 Posts
April 01 2022 05:52 GMT
#4
I've always wondered if some kind of science existed for reaver scarabs. Is there a way to take this knowledge even further? The game that comes to mind is Flash vs Rush ASL10, where Flash's rando-toss reaver got 16 kills with extremely surprising hits. Even some pros were shocked. Is this luck, or is it possible Flash knows something that we don't?

im deaf
MeSaber
Profile Joined December 2009
Sweden1235 Posts
Last Edited: 2022-04-02 05:49:29
April 01 2022 06:53 GMT
#5
As i mentioned in the post above, a moving target makes scarab use another form of engagement, more like "predicted movement" where it estimates where SCV will be in time, trying to intercept it in its way, thats what happening on the first shot that passes all SCVs, as they are following a predefined pathfinding which is made at map making. So the prediction says SCV will move to the left so it passes all SCV on its left side, not getting blocked by SCVs behind the target.

This then damages a lot of SCVs as scarabs have splash damage and SCVs good enough HP to survive even the 50% splash radius. This is why you rarely see many SCVs die because you have to hit em in the smallest radius that does 100% dmg.

Second shot in main also damages some SCVs.

Third shot, most SCVs are already damaged to the point they will die of scarabs outer splash radius which does 25% (Maybe its the 50%, else all SCVs would be dead).

Reaver splash: (Rightclick image - Open image in new TAB for full size) Wiki: (Wiki)Splash Damage
[image loading]


Compared to Siege Tank splash:
[image loading]

-.-
AleXoundOS
Profile Joined January 2011
Georgia458 Posts
April 05 2022 15:49 GMT
#6
Thank you for the in-depth explanation.
https://bwapi.github.io - An API for interacting with Starcraft: Broodwar (1.16.1)
MineraIs
Profile Joined September 2020
United States846 Posts
Last Edited: 2022-04-07 20:40:03
April 07 2022 20:39 GMT
#7
Every situation will be different with reavers because of the pathing regions being different.
✯ [ twitch.tv/MrMineraIs ] ✯ [ Check out my Maps: https://tl.net/forum/brood-war/612442-official-maps-by-minerals ] ✯
MeSaber
Profile Joined December 2009
Sweden1235 Posts
Last Edited: 2022-04-09 06:45:40
April 08 2022 04:55 GMT
#8
On April 08 2022 05:39 MineraIs wrote:
Every situation will be different with reavers because of the pathing regions being different.


I dont think Scarabs follow those regions. The Reaver does to determine if it can shoot or not. Once the Scarab is out, it SEEMS like it doesnt follow any region paths.

I could test this further of course but for now my conclusion is it doesnt use those paths (as mentioned in the post how they differ from worker pathing).

Edit: It could likely be that region paths are used until the target is moving, then it goes for some own path prediction.
-.-
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 3h 2m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RuFF_SC2 210
ProTech115
SortOf 87
Trikslyr24
StarCraft: Brood War
Sea 4089
Calm 3903
BeSt 353
Zeus 276
EffOrt 119
Shinee 49
Sharp 28
NotJumperer 19
Hm[arnc] 9
Dota 2
monkeys_forever697
League of Legends
JimRising 634
Reynor53
Counter-Strike
Coldzera 1377
Other Games
summit1g10079
hungrybox214
C9.Mang0180
rGuardiaN22
Dewaltoss4
trigger2
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick643
StarCraft: Brood War
UltimateBattle 92
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• practicex 12
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Rush1574
Other Games
• imaqtpie452
Upcoming Events
The PondCast
3h 2m
Replay Cast
16h 2m
RSL Revival
1d
herO vs Zoun
Classic vs Reynor
Maru vs SHIN
MaxPax vs TriGGeR
BSL: GosuLeague
1d 14h
RSL Revival
2 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
2 days
RSL Revival
3 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
3 days
IPSL
3 days
Julia vs Artosis
JDConan vs DragOn
RSL Revival
4 days
[ Show More ]
Wardi Open
4 days
IPSL
4 days
StRyKeR vs OldBoy
Sziky vs Tarson
Replay Cast
4 days
Monday Night Weeklies
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Wardi Open
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-11-16
Stellar Fest: Constellation Cup
Eternal Conflict S1

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
SOOP Univ League 2025
YSL S2
BSL Season 21
CSCL: Masked Kings S3
SLON Tour Season 2
RSL Revival: Season 3
META Madness #9
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025

Upcoming

BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
HSC XXVIII
RSL Offline Finals
WardiTV 2025
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026: Closed Qualifier
eXTREMESLAND 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.