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Intro
So you're a StarCraft 2 player, who's either never played StarCraft: Broodwar before or never played it competitively. With SC2 Beta coming to a close, you're going to need to find something to do, and what better place to practice than in the original? In fact, it's a jolly great idea to head over to ICCup right now and start downloading and playing the computer, even if the server's down (or, if ICCup Season 13 has started, play online!)
This guide will try to ease you into it, and maybe even remind some BW vets about all the mechanical handicaps they'll be presented with when they return. This guide is NOT for people who already know how to play broodwar, but only for the newbie (INCLUDING DIAMOND) players who are not familiar with broodwar.
I'll be concentrating much, much more on mechanics than strategy, because there are many more places where you can find guides about zerg/protoss/terran strategy, and in much more detail than I could give you. And so, I present part 1:
i. Auto-Mining
This will probably be one of the most difficult things for new broodwar players to learn. There's two parts to this: (a) The initial split and (b) new workers.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_PXvTyjfHic
We've all jizzed to this before, no shame.
The split is something that definitely takes practice to learn. If you've been sending all 6 workers to the same patch, then you'll definitely need some practice. If you've been splitting 3 and 3, then maybe you'll only need a bit of practice. And if you're Idra and split 2&2&2, then go ahead and skip the part about splitting. Any of the methods shown in the video above are just fine.
Next thing is that you cannot rally your town hall directly onto the minerals. Well, you can, but the workers produced will not mine until you manually give the command. This means its often better just to rally the town hall towards the mineral line, but not directly on it. Then, box the lower left of the town hall (as this is where units will always pop, unless blocked), and command the worker to mine once it appears. And yes, worker production is just as important, if not more so, in broodwar than in SC2.
ii. Building Selection and Macro
Macroing is infinitely harder in BW than SC2. There is one very simple reason for this: Multiple Building Selection. In broodwar, you will only be able to select on building at a time, and so you will either have to hotkey each individual gateway/barracks/factory/hatchery or manually click on them. This not only makes producing units difficult, but it takes much more time and effort to re-rally your buildings to a new location. It is suggested that you hotkey as many of your production facilities as you can, and use the minimap to re-rally your buildings. Or you could hotkey your facilities from 1-6 and then cycle through the buildings, re-rally, and then overwrite the hotkeys back to your army.
A third solution is to use the location hotkeys, F2, F3, and F4. These keys will bind the location of your screen, so that a very easy way to re-rally your buildings would be to set the locations to your production facilities, and then to the rally location. To use the location hotkeys, simply hold shift and press down on the F2-F4 keys, whichever you wish to bind to. The default location for all these keys is your starting location. For example, we bind F3 when we can see all our factories, then bind F4 over where we want to rally. We then hit F3, click a factory, hit F4, right click the desired rally, and repeat.
iii. Army Management
StarCraft just gets harder and harder. Right now, I assume you're thinking, “well, I could just hotkey my army to 1, then hotkey buildings from 2-0”. WRONG. Not only are you stripped of the ability to select multiple buildings, but you are also unable to select MORE THAN TWELVE UNITS. This makes moving large armies of zerglings very, very difficult. Your army, however, is also naturally split up, as you will have anywhere from 2 to 5 control groups of pure units. Different players have different preferences on what should be hotkeyed together and to where, but the most important thing is to actually have your army hotkeyed somewhere.
iv. Army Pathing
This is perhaps one of the most frustrating things as a broodwar player, but also yields some of the funniest results. Broodwar units move in one of two ways. The first way is if the units are clumped together, then they will move together. This is called “Magic Box” commanding. Experience will pretty much tell you how big it is, or you can actually read the linked guide.
If any of the selected units are outside of the magic box, however, then your units will act as if you gave the order to each of them individually. This results in conga lines of zerglings, dragoons, vultures, and creates jams at every choke point. This is also a very inefficient way of engaging an opponent's army. To counteract this “conga line” effect, most players will set up an arc of units, then a-move them together in fast succession (ie 1a2a3a). This is used for practically every unit mix except terran mech.
v. Worker Mechanics
While this may seem trivial, individual workers have been known to change the course of the game. Be it a probe laying down proxies or blocking a hatchery or drones defending against zerglings or scvs playing the role of a linebacker. Just watch game 2 of the Nony vs Idra TSL2 ro8 match.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HpmnIr_787w#t=02m50s
Every Terran player's nightmare, just add 12nex, dragoons, dark templar, arbiters, carriers... never mind.
While your probes won't be gosu enough to take down entire command centers, you could trick around your workers well enough to get by. In StarCraft 2, you may have noticed that workers could essentially “phase” through each other. This isn't always true in the original. The only way a worker could pass through another worker, or any other unit for that matter, would be through mineral or gas walking. What this means is that if you were to command a worker from inside your mineral line to get out and build a pylon, it would get stuck on every other worker that bumps into it. However, if you were to tell the worker to mine from your side patches, the worker would phase through its comrades to get to the patch, and then there's much less travel distance to get to the site of the pylon.
This is also useful when defending with workers. For example, say you're defending a 5pool as protoss.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PenNxWYGZs4#t=08m30s
Probes are imbalanced.
You could select a bunch of probes, and then tell them to mine a mineral patch together. All 12 workers would stack, and could block the zerglings from attacking the cannon, as well as doing damage simultaneously. Keep in mind that as soon as the workers are given a command other than to mine, they'll begin to unstack.
This video also shows how to hold position workers. There are 2 ways to do this. Because the worker does not naturally have the hold position command, you'll need to spam “stop” while selecting the worker to force it to stay in place. A second way to do this would be to select a worker along with a combat unit. For example, say you're playing TvZ against a 9pool. Instead of planting a barracks, we could simply pull 3 scvs to block the ramp, select them along with the marines defending the ramp, and hit hold position. Zerglings attacking the scvs will not force your linebackers out of the way, and instead get chewed up by marine shells.
If you're really kind of bad at macro (like me), then maybe you've found yourself queueing buildings in SC2. You can't do that in broodwar. If you plant a pylon, and then queue up an action after that, the probe will only obey actions that can be given by just a single right click (ie gather, move, attack). It cannot be told to build a second pylon. To make it even harder, your units will not move out of the way of a building site. You'll have to manually tell the marines at your natural to get out of the way before you can plant that command center. Or, even more annoyingly, tell you drones to move to the side so that you can plant a creep colony in your mineral line.
vi. Walling
I bet you think you already know how to do this. I'm also willing to bet that you're wrong. Not all buildings are unit tight in broodwar. Horizontally adjacent supply depots do not block zerglings, pylons block nothing smaller than a vulture, and walling as protoss is one of the most annoyingly hard things to perfect. There are individual guides on how to wall, so I just won't bother to say it here. Just go take a look at the  Sim City wiki.
Conclusion
Seriously, though, broodwar isn't that difficult of a transition from starcraft 2. Once the new ICCup season starts up, play a few games. Because I gurantee you, StarCraft 1 is better for practicing for StarCraft 2 than WarCraft 3 is, and as of right now, once you learn the ropes, it's going to be a lot more fun :D
Search around our Broodwar Strategy Forum or Liquipedia for your race specific and more advanced techniques  Take a look at Recommended Threads if you don't know where else to look for broodwar help. But as always, the best way to improve is to play more games! Don't be discouraged if you're losing, because a D player on ICCup is likely to be at least a platinum player on Bnet2.
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lol cool guide.
But I disagree. Brood War is more "difficult" to play because everyone that you play has most likely been playing the game much longer than you have.
Also, for all SC2 players trying out Brood War. THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH YOUR CLICKS, YOUR UNITS REALLY ARE THAT STUPID.
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i'm not saying bw is just as easy/more easy, i'm saying its completely, 100% possible to backtrack and play bw competitively moving in from sc2.
+ Show Spoiler +also, your caps lock'd sentence might need a bit of tweaking ;D
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shit, hit quote instead of edit
sorry
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United States47024 Posts
On June 01 2010 04:36 majesty.k)seRapH wrote:
ii. Building Selection and Macro
Macroing is infinitely harder in BW than SC2. There is one very simple reason for this: Multiple Building Selection. In broodwar, you will only be able to select on building at a time, and so you will either have to hotkey each individual gateway/barracks/factory/hatchery or manually click on them. This not only makes producing units difficult, but it takes much more time and effort to re-rally your buildings to a new location. It is suggested that you hotkey as many of your production facilities as you can, and use the minimap to re-rally your buildings. Or you could hotkey your facilities from 1-6 and then cycle through the buildings, re-rally, and then overwrite the hotkeys back to your army.
Shift+F2,F3,F4 really deserves a mention here, seeing as it's a lot smoother than either of those solutions.
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man.. im still having troubles splitting t_t..
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You need to add a section about port forwarding and joining games, lag, ICCUP. One of the biggest barriers to entry for my friends was just getting the game set up so we could play. It's hard to get into a game when you have trouble logging onto iccup.
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On June 01 2010 05:26 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On June 01 2010 04:36 majesty.k)seRapH wrote:
ii. Building Selection and Macro
Macroing is infinitely harder in BW than SC2. There is one very simple reason for this: Multiple Building Selection. In broodwar, you will only be able to select on building at a time, and so you will either have to hotkey each individual gateway/barracks/factory/hatchery or manually click on them. This not only makes producing units difficult, but it takes much more time and effort to re-rally your buildings to a new location. It is suggested that you hotkey as many of your production facilities as you can, and use the minimap to re-rally your buildings. Or you could hotkey your facilities from 1-6 and then cycle through the buildings, re-rally, and then overwrite the hotkeys back to your army.
Shift+F2,F3,F4 really deserves a mention here, seeing as it's a lot smoother than either of those solutions.
ok, added. I personally never use this to re-rally, but my minimap method does tend to produce a lot of mis-rallies >.>
On June 01 2010 06:11 thunk wrote:
You need to add a section about port forwarding and joining games, lag, ICCUP. One of the biggest barriers to entry for my friends was just getting the game set up so we could play. It's hard to get into a game when you have trouble logging onto iccup.
I actually don't know anything about the port forwarding and crap. i just download the icc antihack and made games 
if someone wants to post that, i'll add it, unless its so big that it deserves its own thread.
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Well written post.
I can fully attribute my mediocur level of success in SC2 to deciding to play BW more competatively when I'd heard SC2 was coming out.
SC1 teaches you a lot of things that are very helpful with SC2, that you can probably learn faster in it then in SC2 itself...
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If new diamond level players will have trouble is it even worth it if you're just bronze/silver?
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On June 01 2010 07:10 durecell wrote:
If new diamond level players will have trouble is it even worth it if you're just bronze/silver?
After you learn the basics of BW you'll skyrocket from Silver to Diamond in no time when beta comes back online.
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because a D player on ICCup is likely to be at least a platinum player on Bnet2.
That's me, rofl.
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On June 01 2010 05:06 majesty.k)seRapH wrote:i'm not saying bw is just as easy/more easy, i'm saying its completely, 100% possible to backtrack and play bw competitively moving in from sc2. + Show Spoiler +also, your caps lock'd sentence might need a bit of tweaking ;D
You might not say it but your OP sure as hell explains it.
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On June 01 2010 07:10 durecell wrote:
If new diamond level players will have trouble is it even worth it if you're just bronze/silver?
Yes. The average, mediocre BW player on iCCup (D-ranked) will be at least platinum in SC2 if they dedicate any relatively significant amount of time to it.
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On June 01 2010 10:20 Kyuukyuu wrote:Show nested quote +On June 01 2010 07:10 durecell wrote:
If new diamond level players will have trouble is it even worth it if you're just bronze/silver? Yes. The average, mediocre BW player on iCCup (D-ranked) will be at least platinum in SC2 if they dedicate any relatively significant amount of time to it.
D+ on iCCup, Silver on SC2 LOL.
Stalker/Immortal every game isn't that great.
Btw, i also split 2&2&2 haha but that's mostly because I didn't trust the autosplit when I 1st started playing beta
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i was c- on icuup, but i was 50~ on diamond, if u need micro practice, get on bw, helps out so much
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lol i like everyone's post here about how a nooby level at sc bw is a "platinum" level in sc2. makes me feel like i am one of the elites. you have your bnet users...then you have your "iccup" users. and the iccup elites shit out a shit that shits in the bnet elite's mouth. cause literally a bnet user with 250-50 record will lose to a D level
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Man, I wish someone had done this backwards and listed the features in SC2 that aren't in SC:BW.
I think the basics about strategy are the same in both games (with regard to choosing when it's okay to attack, when you should expand to build an advantage, etc), but otherwise they are just totally different games and only speed will translate. Getting good at SC:BW to get good at SC2 will feel like getting good at WarCraft II to get good at SC:BW.
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On June 01 2010 10:20 Kyuukyuu wrote:Show nested quote +On June 01 2010 07:10 durecell wrote:
If new diamond level players will have trouble is it even worth it if you're just bronze/silver? Yes. The average, mediocre BW player on iCCup (D-ranked) will be at least platinum in SC2 if they dedicate any relatively significant amount of time to it.
I was D+/C- on BW and Random Diamond in SC2, and I still mass Thors whenever I get Terran lol.
The macro of your average non-BW player just cannot keep up.
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I'm someone who has experienced the world of Starcraft primarily through SC2. I think this thread is awesome. When I was younger I played the SC1 and BW campaigns and enjoyed the story but, never got into the multiplayer.
It's nice to see a thread like this to help out all bad-at-rts-wow-converts like me. Also, any post with an excuse to throw in that Idra CC cancel is automatically double awesome.
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On June 01 2010 12:29 heroyi wrote:
lol i like everyone's post here about how a nooby level at sc bw is a "platinum" level in sc2. makes me feel like i am one of the elites. you have your bnet users...then you have your "iccup" users. and the iccup elites shit out a shit that shits in the bnet elite's mouth. cause literally a bnet user with 250-50 record will lose to a D level
Wrong, depends who you play and how competitive you are, my very first iccup season from playing Bnet USEast 3v3 bgh was B-, within 3 seasons I reached B+. I find that the people on the bnet servers tend to have either better micro / better macro or better early game multitasking than iccupers(this is one or the other, the avg skill on bnet servers is around c- clearly) because they have been around longer, or their play style is different. Being it "cheese" or w/e the play on bnet is much more unorthodox and essential to improving your skill.
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I am jerking it hard to that video..
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I'm D- on iccup and gold on starcraft 2 mainly because i fumble whenever i get harassed ;_;
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fuck yeah bw
I love this game more than anything even after the sequel
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On June 01 2010 13:03 dRaW wrote:Show nested quote +On June 01 2010 12:29 heroyi wrote:
lol i like everyone's post here about how a nooby level at sc bw is a "platinum" level in sc2. makes me feel like i am one of the elites. you have your bnet users...then you have your "iccup" users. and the iccup elites shit out a shit that shits in the bnet elite's mouth. cause literally a bnet user with 250-50 record will lose to a D level Wrong, depends who you play and how competitive you are, my very first iccup season from playing Bnet USEast 3v3 bgh was B-, within 3 seasons I reached B+. I find that the people on the bnet servers tend to have either better micro / better macro or better early game multitasking than iccupers(this is one or the other, the avg skill on bnet servers is around c- clearly) because they have been around longer, or their play style is different. Being it "cheese" or w/e the play on bnet is much more unorthodox and essential to improving your skill.
There is just no way this isn't a troll
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On June 01 2010 05:06 majesty.k)seRapH wrote:i'm not saying bw is just as easy/more easy, i'm saying its completely, 100% possible to backtrack and play bw competitively moving in from sc2. + Show Spoiler +also, your caps lock'd sentence might need a bit of tweaking ;D
I have to diasgree...
SC2 is just a RTS...People coming form Bw/wc3 and also aoe is able to play at least at a medium level from the beginning.
Why?
Because you have clear in your head bascis of economy, micromanagement, harass,..
But it is absolutely impossible to play competitive at Bw in 2 motnhs. They will barely hit C if they are really talented. Nothing more.
However I will don't reinstall BW on my computer for the month without the beta..i know myself and i don't want to get addicted another time
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Thanks for writing up this guide, and thanks for pony express to bringing this guide to my attention.
I'll think about giving it a shot (i had iccup installed) but i don't think i will have the balls to do so. I will probably be playing altitude or some moba game during sc2 downtime
But who knows...
Oh and for the record im low diamond player, but i just don't see myself in not failing miserably in bw. The idea of sending each worker to mine with addition to macroing without multiple building selection would just put my brain into meltdown. I do like challenges though...
Well who knows, we will see...
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United Arab Emirates5091 Posts
lol this is funny.
10/10 for effort though, nice job for the sc2 kids.
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The OP definitely needs to warn SC2 players of SC1 spellcasting. Nothing's more frustating for a newby than seeing those 10 vessels all irradiateing the shit out of a single ultralisk.
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On June 01 2010 13:03 dRaW wrote:Show nested quote +On June 01 2010 12:29 heroyi wrote:
lol i like everyone's post here about how a nooby level at sc bw is a "platinum" level in sc2. makes me feel like i am one of the elites. you have your bnet users...then you have your "iccup" users. and the iccup elites shit out a shit that shits in the bnet elite's mouth. cause literally a bnet user with 250-50 record will lose to a D level Wrong, depends who you play and how competitive you are, my very first iccup season from playing Bnet USEast 3v3 bgh was B-, within 3 seasons I reached B+. I find that the people on the bnet servers tend to have either better micro / better macro or better early game multitasking than iccupers(this is one or the other, the avg skill on bnet servers is around c- clearly) because they have been around longer, or their play style is different. Being it "cheese" or w/e the play on bnet is much more unorthodox and essential to improving your skill.
This is bullshit. Or, you played like iccup season 2 when 200 people played. A D player on iccup will win over 50% of bnet games easy. C- player will win 90%. C/C+ will win 100% of games against true bnet players, they would only lose to another iccuper on bnet or the VERY rare skilled bnet player.
Btw this thread makes me miss broodwar. I played iccup for about 2-3 years and managed to go from D- to C+/B- and made a fair amount of "friends" in the process.
Now that I think about it the SC2 environment is nothing like the iccup/bnet environment, and broodwar was just such a fun game. Not saying SC2 is bad, and I'll definitely stick with it, but broodwar was definitely better. Something about it made it so fun.
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H'okay, well I'm officially afraid to load up the single player campaign again through fear that the AI will laugh at me.
Thanks.
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On June 01 2010 12:51 FiveAlarm wrote:
I'm someone who has experienced the world of Starcraft primarily through SC2. I think this thread is awesome. When I was younger I played the SC1 and BW campaigns and enjoyed the story but, never got into the multiplayer.
It's nice to see a thread like this to help out all bad-at-rts-wow-converts like me. Also, any post with an excuse to throw in that Idra CC cancel is automatically double awesome.
Except I can just imagine poor IdrA stumbling upon this thread, seeing the video and clutching himself in pain like he has been stabbed by a ringwraith 
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lol, after 2 months (march -> may) of hardcore iccup (max rank D+ ftw), i tried sc2.
it was so easy, besides the lack of BO.
and whoever said you won't fail miserably at bw, trust me, you will.
microing/macroing individually isn't a bitch. multitasking both is a bitch.
+ you don't have the leisure of hotkeying 8 gateways and pressing z = multitasking is harder.
all my opinion =P
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United States47024 Posts
On June 03 2010 04:39 _Air_ wrote:
This is bullshit. Or, you played like iccup season 2 when 200 people played. A D player on iccup will win over 50% of bnet games easy. C- player will win 90%. C/C+ will win 100% of games against true bnet players, they would only lose to another iccuper on bnet or the VERY rare skilled bnet player.
Or a hacker, which is fairly common on B.net.
Granted, not all hackers are going to be good enough to beat a C-level player, even with hacks.
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On June 03 2010 14:36 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On June 03 2010 04:39 _Air_ wrote:
This is bullshit. Or, you played like iccup season 2 when 200 people played. A D player on iccup will win over 50% of bnet games easy. C- player will win 90%. C/C+ will win 100% of games against true bnet players, they would only lose to another iccuper on bnet or the VERY rare skilled bnet player.
Or a hacker, which is fairly common on B.net. Granted, not all hackers are going to be good enough to beat a C-level player, even with hacks.
we should have a team match, hackers vs C/B level players!
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i would love to get in on that game- can i join the players tho lol
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This is a nice idea but I think it will be useless. In my opinion, Sc/bw will go play the game wc3 player will go back to warcraft3 and C&C play will go back to C&C
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On June 04 2010 02:13 StoLiVe wrote:
This is a nice idea but I think it will be useless. In my opinion, Sc/bw will go play the game wc3 player will go back to warcraft3 and C&C play will go back to C&C
This is true. SC:BW would be very very hard to pick up now, considering the mechanics of the game itself are significantly harder, but even more important is that the overall level of players is very high.
Also, Im willing to bet that C/C+ players would roll a (map) hacker on broodwar. A standard push would win, the player would see it coming and not be able to macro enough to stop it. Although mineral hacks are another story...
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and that's why ladies and gentleman SCBW > SC2 in strategy and tactical aspect!
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penis poop balls cream. i like turtles
User was temp banned for this post.
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After playing hundreds of games of SC2, playing BW is so painful, even though I started as a BW player and got to C+ on PGT a while ago.
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On June 01 2010 13:03 dRaW wrote:Show nested quote +On June 01 2010 12:29 heroyi wrote:
lol i like everyone's post here about how a nooby level at sc bw is a "platinum" level in sc2. makes me feel like i am one of the elites. you have your bnet users...then you have your "iccup" users. and the iccup elites shit out a shit that shits in the bnet elite's mouth. cause literally a bnet user with 250-50 record will lose to a D level Wrong, depends who you play and how competitive you are, my very first iccup season from playing Bnet USEast 3v3 bgh was B-, within 3 seasons I reached B+. I find that the people on the bnet servers tend to have either better micro / better macro or better early game multitasking than iccupers(this is one or the other, the avg skill on bnet servers is around c- clearly) because they have been around longer, or their play style is different. Being it "cheese" or w/e the play on bnet is much more unorthodox and essential to improving your skill.
Lol, I'm pretty sure every single sentence is this reply is false.
Unless you post your iccup profile in which case only 90% of your reply is false
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Dude i need serious help with BW. i'm a pretty good SC2 player, back before patch 13 when the lag spikes started murdering me in almost every game i played. had to play on a friends computer on a differet connection to even get a lag free game mostly. i think SC2 hates my drivers. anyway. I played BW and i'm just terrible at it. just awful. i mean i was #3 platinum (with 2k points) before diamond league existed and i can't handle BW. it's not that it's alot harder, it's that i don't know what to do. zerg is pretty rediculously different between the two games and I want help. i can handle the bad unit control, and handle (kinda) the more click-based macro, but i don't know any strategies to use, i hardly know the units, only knowing zergling( which is way different from in SC2), hydra, ultralisk (also very different), and mutalisk. >.< .
Yeah BW is definitely a different game. and if you are a BW player going to SC2 you'll have a hard time too. the only difference is your hands will be fast, but you'll be tripped up like crazy on hotkeys like i am with the BW hotkeys.
if anyone wants to help me with BW i'd loooove to get some practice in. i'm so bad haha.
EDIT: also i disagree stronger that for strategy BW > SC2. strategy and execution of the strategy are extremely important in SC2 and probably more important than in BW. the only reason BW's strategies are more complicated is purely due to age. tactics wise, probably right that BW > SC2 because of the awful awful AI.
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United States47024 Posts
On June 08 2010 05:08 PrinceXizor wrote:
Dude i need serious help with BW. i'm a pretty good SC2 player, back before patch 13 when the lag spikes started murdering me in almost every game i played. had to play on a friends computer on a differet connection to even get a lag free game mostly. i think SC2 hates my drivers. anyway. I played BW and i'm just terrible at it. just awful. i mean i was #3 platinum (with 2k points) before diamond league existed and i can't handle BW. it's not that it's alot harder, it's that i don't know what to do. zerg is pretty rediculously different between the two games and I want help. i can handle the bad unit control, and handle (kinda) the more click-based macro, but i don't know any strategies to use, i hardly know the units, only knowing zergling( which is way different from in SC2), hydra, ultralisk (also very different), and mutalisk. >.< .
Yeah BW is definitely a different game. and if you are a BW player going to SC2 you'll have a hard time too. the only difference is your hands will be fast, but you'll be tripped up like crazy on hotkeys like i am with the BW hotkeys.
if anyone wants to help me with BW i'd loooove to get some practice in. i'm so bad haha.
EDIT: also i disagree stronger that for strategy BW > SC2. strategy and execution of the strategy are extremely important in SC2 and probably more important than in BW. the only reason BW's strategies are more complicated is purely due to age. tactics wise, probably right that BW > SC2 because of the awful awful AI.
Watch pro games. Even D-level players are incredibly precise with basic build orders, and have a reasonably good understanding of the general game-flow. You definitely won't get by with just "this unit does this"--unless you're cheesing every game, you're going to need a reasonable understanding of what should be happening at a given point in the game.
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On June 01 2010 13:03 dRaW wrote:Show nested quote +On June 01 2010 12:29 heroyi wrote:
lol i like everyone's post here about how a nooby level at sc bw is a "platinum" level in sc2. makes me feel like i am one of the elites. you have your bnet users...then you have your "iccup" users. and the iccup elites shit out a shit that shits in the bnet elite's mouth. cause literally a bnet user with 250-50 record will lose to a D level Wrong, depends who you play and how competitive you are, my very first iccup season from playing Bnet USEast 3v3 bgh was B-, within 3 seasons I reached B+. I find that the people on the bnet servers tend to have either better micro / better macro or better early game multitasking than iccupers(this is one or the other, the avg skill on bnet servers is around c- clearly) because they have been around longer, or their play style is different. Being it "cheese" or w/e the play on bnet is much more unorthodox and essential to improving your skill.
Average skill level on bnet is c-.... LOL more like d- or that cpu rank thing.
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On June 01 2010 13:03 dRaW wrote:Show nested quote +On June 01 2010 12:29 heroyi wrote:
lol i like everyone's post here about how a nooby level at sc bw is a "platinum" level in sc2. makes me feel like i am one of the elites. you have your bnet users...then you have your "iccup" users. and the iccup elites shit out a shit that shits in the bnet elite's mouth. cause literally a bnet user with 250-50 record will lose to a D level Wrong, depends who you play and how competitive you are, my very first iccup season from playing Bnet USEast 3v3 bgh was B-, within 3 seasons I reached B+. I find that the people on the bnet servers tend to have either better micro / better macro or better early game multitasking than iccupers(this is one or the other, the avg skill on bnet servers is around c- clearly) because they have been around longer, or their play style is different. Being it "cheese" or w/e the play on bnet is much more unorthodox and essential to improving your skill.
rofl yeah ok troll
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Yeah I have gone back and tried BW some, and it is really hard tbh. I played WC3 TFT at around rank #200 USEast in 2006 or whatever when I stopped. Based on that experience, I easily made top diamond in SC2 - not super gosu, but not bad either. APM maybe 110 as recorded by SC2 at end of beta.
But jeez... BW is just... hard. I guess lot of that has to do with the fact that BW doesn't have any "modern" rts features that I'm sort of used to now.
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its ok guys, i can barely stay in the mid-D range right now ^_^
granted, i'm using an outdated strategy, and often in the wrong matchups, buti can tell that a lot of the players i'm beating is simply because i'm overwheming them through pure macro. watch a few progames, read a few guides, and you'll start to do fine. and by fine i mean mid-D, which is probably around average right now.
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I find it hilarious all the people that are trying to pretend like their D rankings on iccup are impressive because its in bw.
a D is a D my friends, and it is terribad.
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United States47024 Posts
On June 08 2010 07:04 Soel wrote:
I find it hilarious all the people that are trying to pretend like their D rankings on iccup are impressive because its in bw.
a D is a D my friends, and it is terribad.
Honestly, "terribad" by SC1 standards is absolutely phenomenal by the standards of any other RTS. Even if you can hold a solid D, you're probably within the top 10% of all players that ever played BW, if not less than that.
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On June 08 2010 05:40 TheYango wrote:
Watch pro games. Even D-level players are incredibly precise with basic build orders, and have a reasonably good understanding of the general game-flow. You definitely won't get by with just "this unit does this"--unless you're cheesing every game, you're going to need a reasonable understanding of what should be happening at a given point in the game.
It doesn't help i don't understand some of the mechanics, apparently hydralisks and tanks deal damage based on the size of the target? i'm watching alot of pro games, have been since i started playing SC2. i'm just lacking an understanding of the game really. i'll keep watching but i feel like getting school a bunch of times and watching the replays would help me alot more.
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A tip for those who will be playing protoss in sc:bw, be very wary of dragoon pathing, and the ai for reavers, because they tend to mess with you a lot. Don't expect that when you drop a reaver, that it will target the worker line. You will need to target the workers (and sometimes even if you do target them, the scarab decides to move somewhere else)
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I'm willing to bet the average SC2 player closes the browser window by the time he gets to the third sentence of point iii., if he lasted that long, that is... HAH.
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I just played BW yesterday I got totally rolled by a friend of mine...
Man, I gotta say my closest match with him was a ZvZ haha!
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lol? strategy is more important in sc2 ? are you kidding me?
If anything, they'll be equal, if not favoring bw. do you really think if two players of equal skill in bw faced each other, strategy is still stressed more in sc2? what a joke
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I suggest for people new to bw to check out liquipedia. It is incredibly helpful.
I am horribad at bw(d rank) and platinum at sc2. I started out as silver though as I was new to the game but slowly moved up ranks.
If you want to play bw competitively you need to dedicate tons and tons of hours into the game which I was not willing to do(so frustrating to lose 80% of the time) and as someone stated before the really really talented people can only get to C- in the span of two months. Btw, don't even dream of higher than A- unless you're korean.
And yes you will lose a lot more in bw than in sc2. Unlike sc2 where your ratios are 1:1 or higher, the normal is 1:3 in iccup.
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I love the OP idea. So smart. So glad someone did it.
To the good BW players (C or better)... it's sometimes hard for them to understand, I think, how many people are bad at BW. How many thousands and thousands have tried to play it. And just failed miserably. You never hear about those people. They don't write a post on TL about how they played for 6 months and never got to D+ so see ya... they just stop.
Conversely, you get to C or, god forbid, B... and see people in the Chats on ICC and figure there must be a ton of B players, because these channels are pretty full... and I can find games. That is just not the case. Then, anyone on TL makes 3 threads about how the finally got to C and "yay, pat me on the back". So you might think "a good majority of these people make it to C or higher." Nope.
These are the 1-2% of people who have tried to ICCup.
Being in a lowbie-casual clan on ICC I've seen the people come and go.
It's not something everyone can do. Not to mention all the time and practice it takes.
If there were a ton of ton of C-B BW players, Platinum/Diamond would have been a lot more competitive in SC2. But the C-B BW players are SOOOOOO diluted by the influx of purely new SC2 players, its almost non existent.
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On June 08 2010 10:49 Conversion wrote:
lol? strategy is more important in sc2 ? are you kidding me?
If anything, they'll be equal, if not favoring bw. do you really think if two players of equal skill in bw faced each other, strategy is still stressed more in sc2? what a joke
from watching pro games, they seem equal, with BW strats being more complicated, but i put that up to there being over a decade with brood war and months with SC2.
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Broodwar's mechanics are on a different level than sc2's. It takes along time to learn them and even longer to be good!
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I went from D- (1 on the rating scale) to 4000+ in less than 6 months (then I got a sc2 beta key ^^).
BW is hard to learn but it's not THAT hard once you get it. On the other hand SC2 is more noob friendly so it's funnier and I like it better :/.
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I got defeated by 1 Vulture. So bad.
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Oh God, I forgot how brutally unforgiving this game is. Fuck you, dragoon pathing.
I feel violated.
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So went back to broodwar after not playing or watching any of it for 4 months straight or so.
I thought something was wrong with my computer because of how stupid the graphics looked. After I got past that, I had some trouble beating D/D+ players (Was a previously C+/B-).
SC2 mechanics are a joke compared to broodwar. Its not like I forgot much about the game, but broodwar mechanics are so unique and much more difficult than SC2.
O well if I can at least get back to C I'll be happy
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After playing 2 games on iccup last night... im blown away by the skill of BW players. My macro is HORRIBLE ( i had 4000 minerals and 2000 gas at one point), and cant figure out what units to use. I thought i used to be good at BW, too... i guess i need alot of practice. Pathing is bad, no MBS makes macro sooo hard, and honestly fuck high templar. Psy storm might as well just say "i win,"
PS i actually went 1-1 but still.
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EPT
