[article] Pimpest Plays 2007 - Page 5

ZenDeX

Philippines2916 Posts

May 26 2009 23:25 GMT

#81

On May 27 2009 07:02 AttackZerg wrote:
I will help on any area of this project I can. I'm not just throwing out shit, I actually realize how much I miss how good it used to be.

+1

Let's extend Liquid Plays back to 2008. I seriously think this is the only logical thing to do now.

Aylear

Norway3988 Posts

May 26 2009 23:38 GMT

#82

On May 27 2009 07:58 Gradius wrote:

Show nested quote +

I'm not calling you dumb. Do you disagree that expecting the videos to be higher quality than anything else that exists is unreasonable?

That's what you said? I thought what you said was "This is just dumb." It was difficult to discern the constructive "this is unreasonable" comment amidst the personal rebuttal you directed at me. Granted, I called the PP07 writing bad, so I understand your desire to defend yourself against me to begin with, but the problem with your rebuttal is of a similar nature to the problems inherent in the PP07 article. Whatever you meant to say disappeared beneath what you said. Beginning a counter-argument with "this is just dumb" does nothing but lose focus, and causes threads to descend into the personal and the psychoanalytical.

I took issue with your writing (that of saying something was "just dumb"), and subsequently pointed it out hyperbolically. You can discard my opinion if you like - saying that's not at all what you said and that it's my own fault for reading too much into it - and I won't blame you, but when someone makes a point of something in a statement you've made, it's remiss to dismiss it as simply a problem with the other person's reading comprehension.

More to the point: Expecting videos to be of a higher quality than they can realistically be is unreasonable. That's why, when you clarified this point, I said "that's too bad." Unfortunately, the videos still don't look any better. I fully realise these limitations are brought on by what's available, but going from the full length replays and high quality screenshots of previous PP incarnations to blurry YouTube quality is not the step up one has come to expect from the increased technological quality and bandwidth availability. The quality of the videos sadly reflected the rest of the unpolished article. That's why I made the careless comment, for which I apologise.

AttackZerg

United States7581 Posts

May 26 2009 23:55 GMT

#83

Plexa please pm me the list of games and moments that you think are the best of 2008.

Also anybody else please include them in pms to me, solo moments or entire games.

Please put Great Plays in the title of the pm so I can at a later date still easily recognize them!

If I can get a very strong list then I can personally begin contacting members of the community to help me. I am sure that I can organize at least 5-6 people to work with me(1 writer-1 video producer/director-1 editor - and 3 people to help me figure out the most accurate and appealing ways to present the whole project and rate the videos, and also add new features to it)

Anybody with any type of advise that they can give me to get the ball rolling is also more then welcome! This will be my first project of this sort. I imagine that without straining I can produce a high quality 'great plays of 2008' before august.

Cheers!

LordofAscension

United States589 Posts

May 27 2009 15:25 GMT

#84

On May 27 2009 06:43 GrandInquisitor wrote:
... an article that's basically your site's only reason for continued existence, you don't make such grade-school level mistakes. It's not just about NaDa and his "inhuman feet of control" while "Yamtoing". The article as a whole is riddled with spelling and grammar mistakes. I would be embarrassed to turn that into any of my professors, from middle school onwards.

I was definitely ready to let this go but this is just a fallacy of fact. If you think PP is the only reason for SC:L's continued existence you are so definitely wrong. We may not garner the numbers that TL does but I'll bet you that we'll be on par again after the release of SC2. You may not find the story compelling or the single-player important but thousands of others do. SC:L provides new coverage, original editorial content, as well as the one of the most accessible lore resources available. Just because you do not find this content important and the fact that PP is our one foray into the competitive scene does not render our site any less relevant to a SC user. You have effectively and adequately demonstrated the "bashing" I was referring to before, in a general sense, but this time you obviously have no knowledge of the facts.

On May 27 2009 08:55 AttackZerg wrote:
Plexa please pm me the list of games and moments that you think are the best of 2008.

Also anybody else please include them in pms to me, solo moments or entire games.

Please put Great Plays in the title of the pm so I can at a later date still easily recognize them!

If I can get a very strong list then I can personally begin contacting members of the community to help me. I am sure that I can organize at least 5-6 people to work with me(1 writer-1 video producer/director-1 editor - and 3 people to help me figure out the most accurate and appealing ways to present the whole project and rate the videos, and also add new features to it)

Anybody with any type of advise that they can give me to get the ball rolling is also more then welcome! This will be my first project of this sort. I imagine that without straining I can produce a high quality 'great plays of 2008' before august.

Cheers!

Good luck. But the fact remains, even if you dispute the recent quality, the community is attached to PP, TL isn't the only site on the planet that reads PP.

~LoA

AttackZerg

United States7581 Posts

May 27 2009 15:36 GMT

#85

I'm sure if anybody did a good job people would be interested to see it.

(Edit: don't act like the people reading pp's matter to anyone who has worked on the project, if so many people view it,then you should have respected them enough to put forth something good. Who is the guy who created SCL? He didn't used to suck.)

fast ball player

206 Posts

May 27 2009 15:57 GMT

#86

the level of writing is remarkably bad. it's clear the guy is not too smart and is using wayyy too many words to try and appear smart. just tons and tons of unnecessary irrelevant words. mark twain said the best writers say the most using the least words; every word thats not strictly necessary should be edited out.

"Flash serves up a rush; as reward for the intestinal fortitude required to pull off such a play, Flash storms into Bisu's base and cleans up the mess - game over."

wtf is that sentence. the entire first clause (before the comma) should be cut, as should everything after the word base. Flaash storms into bisu's base. just say what happened.

at the same time i think its pretty shitty to give this guy a hard time for trying to defend the legitimacy of SCL and PP. if you dont like it you dont have to read it. he did it for free, which i concede doesnt mean he should get zero criticism ever, but neither should people talk like SCL owes them anything because they did not pay money for PP.

LordofAscension

United States589 Posts

May 27 2009 16:17 GMT

#87

On May 28 2009 00:36 AttackZerg wrote:
I'm sure if anybody did a good job people would be interested to see it.

I agree - effort by a community member is always appreciated.

(Edit: don't act like the people reading pp's matter to anyone who has worked on the project, if so many people view it,then you should have respected them enough to put forth something good. Who is the guy who created SCL? He didn't used to suck.)

Thanks again for demonstrating the bashing. SC:L has been around for 10 years and at least gone through 4 different webmasters. I'm sorry you think I suck but I didn't work on 07's pimpest plays. Though obviously I should have read it more thoroughly before it went out.

Edit: Why not join the PP team? If you are keen to help out - make the feature better

On May 28 2009 00:57 fast ball player wrote:
the level of writing is remarkably bad. it's clear the guy is not too smart and is using wayyy too many words to try and appear smart. just tons and tons of unnecessary irrelevant words. mark twain said the best writers say the most using the least words; every word thats not strictly necessary should be edited out.

Some bad writing definitely ended up in there but I don't think you can accurately surmise that the author is not intelligent...

"Flash serves up a rush; as reward for the intestinal fortitude required to pull off such a play, Flash storms into Bisu's base and cleans up the mess - game over."

wtf is that sentence. the entire first clause (before the comma) should be cut, as should everything after the word base. Flaash storms into bisu's base. just say what happened.

If you read some of the previous year's PP's there's much of that "high style" of writing. Someone earlier in the thread said that the author wasn't excited enough - this was obviously an effort to add the author's style.

at the same time i think its pretty shitty to give this guy a hard time for trying to defend the legitimacy of SCL and PP. if you dont like it you dont have to read it. he did it for free, which i concede doesnt mean he should get zero criticism ever, but neither should people talk like SCL owes them anything because they did not pay money for PP.

Thanks - I think. But this could just be a nice of way of saying: "Don't give SC:L a hard time even though it is crap because it is free..." Which, I obviously don't think is a fair statement. Just because we don't appeal to everyone certainly doesn't mean we are irrelevant. We have several partnerships with sites - including TL for various things and we're proud to be a member of this community.

Also - the work on PP08 has already commenced (with new authors) and there is a hard date so it will be out much sooner than the previous two. Perhaps we can find some redemption in that.

~LoA

luckybeni2

Germany1065 Posts

May 27 2009 16:17 GMT

#88

The Chalrenge game is by far the coolest game I ever saw. It's like : Defend your base for one hour singleplayer mission.

Chef

10810 Posts

May 27 2009 16:33 GMT

#89

On May 28 2009 01:17 LordofAscension wrote:
Also - the work on PP08 has already commenced (with new authors) and there is a hard date so it will be out much sooner than the previous two. Perhaps we can find some redemption in that.

~LoA

gl gl

All I want to see (as a fan of PP) is effort and discipline right now. The quality of the finished product is not that critical as long as it doesn't look like it's done between the hours of 2 and 6 am the night before it's due. I don't think anyone (despite what they say) really expects a professional and premium magazine quality release, we just want to feel like the people working on the project respect what they are doing. SC community is strong because we're about effort and love for the game, not necessarily genius work.

Really, that was my only gripe with this years release. Parts of it looked like the person just didn't care anymore.

LordofAscension

United States589 Posts

May 27 2009 16:44 GMT

#90

On May 28 2009 01:33 Chef wrote:

gl gl

Thanks

All I want to see (as a fan of PP) is effort and discipline right now. The quality of the finished product is not that critical as long as it doesn't look like it's done between the hours of 2 and 6 am the night before it's due. I don't think anyone (despite what they say) really expects a professional and premium magazine quality release, we just want to feel like the people working on the project respect what they are doing. SC community is strong because we're about effort and love for the game, not necessarily genius work.

Really, that was my only gripe with this years release. Parts of it looked like the person just didn't care anymore.

Thanks for the constructive criticism. We'll definitely make that a priority - and we are looking at trying to make these magazine quality - we'll just have to try harder

~LoA

Chef

10810 Posts

May 27 2009 17:06 GMT

#91

Let your writers know if they want some help editing and some feedback, they should PM me and I'd be happy to give my time.

AttackZerg

United States7581 Posts

May 27 2009 23:44 GMT

#92

LordofAscension ,

I will glady help out with pp2008.

I have MANY ideas about new and improved features.

PM me or email me at zerokewlio @ hotmail dot com to let me know exactly where you guys are.

Also a forum member helped me out with a strong list of possiblities that I would like to forward on to get the ball rolling.

I think you will love some of my ideas.

Please contact me quickly so that we can get the ball rolling!!!!!!!!!

Although I don't expect anything to move at warp, I am excited and hope that I can bring my new ideas and energy into pp's!

MayorITC

Korea (South)798 Posts

May 28 2009 00:40 GMT

#93

On May 26 2009 12:08 MaZza[KIS] wrote:

Show nested quote +

No... I don't understand why you would COME ON TL to bash TL. He's doing the exact thing that everyone else is.

Show nested quote +

Wow man... there are so many contradictions in what you wrote, not to mention the dismissive logic and deterministic attitude. Really there is no point arguing with you so I wont. I'll just give you the simple COURTESY of acknowledging what you wrote? Does that suffice?

LoA is not coming on to TL to bash TL. That may be the skewed interpretation that you've resigned yourself to believe, but the gist I got from his post was:
1. We're trying to contribute to the SC community therefore there's no reason to respond to positive efforts with criticism in a negative manner.
2. We're taking recommendations/help for 2008 PP.

Also, the individual(s) who did bash PP 2007 don't represent TL as a whole so it's absurd to say that he's "bashing TL" when he's responding to a few select individuals only. There isn't a single sentence in his post that implicates TL.

And if you're going to call out "so many contradictions" in Gradius' post, at least have the balls to name them instead of acting like a douche. I didn't notice any in his post so I'm wondering if you even know what contradiction means. If you want an example of a contradiction, look no further than your own post.

Really there is no point arguing with you so I wont. I'll just give you the simple COURTESY of acknowledging what you wrote?

This is a contradiction. Acknowledgement of a post means that there's merit to it and it's worthy of consideration. However, you've simply dismissed his post by saying that there is no point in arguing with him.

This is a case of where your words are contradicting each other.

Here's another example.

You write an argument against Gradius yet conclude your post with "there's no point arguing with you so I wont" when in fact you just did less than 10 seconds ago or however long it took you to write your post.

This is a case of where your actions contradict your words. It also suggests you're fucking stupid, but that's a whole new subject up for debate.

Oh, and please elaborate on "dismissive logic" and "deterministic attitude." Determinism is the concept that all events are connected in order. It's a theoretical view of the world and saying that someone has a "deterministic attitude" is a poor attempt to refute someone's credibility. More importantly, Gradius' post has nothing to do with determinism.

Now, let's move onto "dismissive logic." Logic is the "art and science of reasoning which seeks to identify and understand the principles of valid demonstration and inference." Dismissive is the exact opposite as it means rejecting serious consideration. This is not to be confused with skepticism because skeptics do not believe in something until there is proof without a reasonable doubt. A dismissive person ignores the notion all together. A person can be skeptical and logical, but dismissive is the antithesis of logical. Stop pulling random words of your ass. It only makes you look impressive until someone comes along and reveals how stupid you really are.

fast ball player

206 Posts

May 28 2009 03:34 GMT

#94

my biggest problem with the writing is sometimes there was so much fancy language it was hard to even tell what the point was.

LordofAscension

United States589 Posts

May 28 2009 05:07 GMT

#95

On May 28 2009 02:06 Chef wrote:
Let your writers know if they want some help editing and some feedback, they should PM me and I'd be happy to give my time.

Thanks - we'll take advantage of that offer.

On May 28 2009 12:34 fast ball player wrote:
my biggest problem with the writing is sometimes there was so much fancy language it was hard to even tell what the point was.

Thanks for the feedback - we'll keep that in mind.

~LoA