[ASL] Round of 8 Groups

[ASL] Round of 8 Groups - Page 6

slappy

United States1271 Posts

December 30 2016 18:41 GMT

#101

On December 28 2016 12:54 Varbind wrote:
Keep in mind Jaedong plays last, two weeks from now. I imagine he will be pumped for this and will be in form by that time.

I pray for this! JD certainly did look rusty. I'm still rooting for him

classicyellow83

United States2393 Posts

December 31 2016 02:21 GMT

#102

5 out of 8 players are in [NeOx].

PVJ

Hungary5221 Posts

December 31 2016 18:08 GMT

#103

On December 29 2016 03:16 classicyellow83 wrote:

Show nested quote +

Each player picks 1 map to take out for game 1 and 5. So the map orders will be different for all groups. Far as i know Best took out CB and Hero took out Benzene.
The maps are Circuit Breaker, Eye of the Storm, Benzene, and Demian.

Eye of the Storm! Thanks.

God, that will be vetoed the fuck out for many vPs I guess. Good map pool overall though, I think. Can't wait!

Jealous

10415 Posts

December 31 2016 22:19 GMT

#104

On December 30 2016 02:57 FlaShFTW wrote:

Show nested quote +

On December 29 2016 17:13 Jealous wrote:

On December 29 2016 11:28 FlaShFTW wrote:

On December 28 2016 12:29 darktreb wrote:

On December 28 2016 11:53 FlaShFTW wrote:

On December 28 2016 11:34 darktreb wrote:

On December 27 2016 23:43 TheFoReveRwaR wrote:

On December 27 2016 23:41 PuckSama. wrote:
What a RO8... I don't know if I've ever seen this level before... You change Guemchi by Effort and it's just just the most insane RO8 ever =D

At some point you have to acknowledge effort's inability to preform when it matters in the post kespa era. He's simply not the best right now despite his practice results.

Umm ... he won an SSL/ASL just one year ago. Against Bisu in the finals no less.

He gets knocked out early in the next two leagues and suddenly it's "inability to perform in the post kespa era"? That's asinine.

if i were you id go to liquipedia and look at how many times he gets knocked out of online tournaments as well. out of like the 5-6 tournaments hes been in, he won 1, placed 2nd at another, and the other 4 got knocked out of the groupstages.

Let's take a look here starting from most recent:
ASL2: Round of 24 exit (out of 24)
Thrill SL: Ro16 exit (out of 16)
NalRa SL: Ro8 exit (out of 8 players)
ASL1: Ro16 exit (out of 16)
41 Ranking: Ro8 exit (out of 12 players)
Terror NINUS: 2nd (out of 16)
41 SL: Ro32 exit (out of 32)
VANT: Winner (out of 32)

Yeah, I don't think anyone's claiming he's been great in leagues, or even performed near his standard. But he won the most important league once, and got second in another decent league. And yeah, he lost some BO3's or round robin 3 game / dual tournaments where he was a favorite. It's not great for sure, but those are still top ~5 results out of all players.

Just feels like this has turned into one of those situations where you start with a small sample size --> big narrative --> now everyone's on the lookout for the narrative, thus further amplifying it.

"some bo3s or round robin" is an understatement. when you play in 8 tournaments and lose in the group stages in 6 of them, yeah, your win looks like a fluke. consistency proves results, not a random fluke win in an offline tournament. shuttle's win looks more and more like a fluke after he got smashed in groups in asl2. same with sharp.

It's hard to compare the two tournaments because of the vastly different player pool. Sharp and Shuttle may indeed have been the best players in ASL1 on gameday, but that is no longer the case because of the influx of TBLS and co. On the grand scale of things we can say Shuttle is lucky to have won, but to say it is a fluke is not appropriate I think. Maybe I am digging too deep into semantics, but I think you see where I'm going with this. Iris beating Bisu in game 5 on RotK or Byzantium or whatever it was and continuing to not be relevant thereafter is a fluke. ForGG becoming godlike and crushing some of the best players at the time then fading immediately after his title win was a fluke. Shuttle winning ASL1 when his playing field was relatively insignificant compared to what ASL2 offers is not a fluke, it's just fortune.

Effort's VANT run through featured 2 super easy groups to advance from. He had to play Hiya, Zelot, and Pure in the Ro32 and still lost to Hiya. His Ro16 group was ZerO, July, and Rush and lost to ZerO but it's ZvZ so whatever. In the Round of 8 he faced Guemchi so el oh el rofl 3-1. Ro4 was a ZvZ vs ZerO so ok whatever, it's ZvZ anything can happen, and yeah, he beat Bisu 3-1. If those results weren't fluked, he should be stomping people. Seriously, 3-1 over Bisu and you can't make it out of groups anymore? That, and Bisu was probably super tilted in BoX with Zergs after an embarrassing 0-3 to Hero in the SSL11 as well. Yeah, it's a fluke from anyone who isn't a super big fanboy of EffOrt right now.

For example: 41 Ranking he couldn't even get out of a group with a rusty Kal, Hiya, and a shitty TvZ in Mong.
In ASL 1 he couldn't make it out of a group with mediocre PvZ free, shitty PvZ Shuttle, and meh TvZ ssak.
He then lost to Bisu 1-2 in Nal_Ra which again, if 3-1 wasn't a fluke, he should have won this one.
And in Thrill, he didn't even make it out of a group with Sky, Hoejja, and Sharp.
I don't think I need to remind you what happened in the asl 2 either.

I wasn't talking about Effort but I guess I'll address that. I think Effort is one of the best Zergs to ever play the game and he looks incredibly impressive on stream. But in tournament I think he flubs a lot. He's just not consistent enough. I wouldn't call any win of his a fluke but I'm not surprised when he drops out either. Losing 1-2 to Bisu after going 3-1 just puts them at roughly 50%, which is what I'd expect tbh. Bisu played pretty bad in the 1-3 finals against Effort imo, didn't adapt well to Effort whereas Effort had pretty safely countered Bisu's Zealot-first aggression.

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[ASL] Round of 8 Groups - Page 6

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