EPT[Translation] 334 on Playing with Savior - Page 6
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fishbowl
United States1575 Posts
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arb
Noobville17922 Posts
Interestingly enough I think Rekrul was the first one to mention anything about Savior matchfixing or anything and no one believed him, and he mentioned it quite a while before it came to light too. But I am pretty happy Savior managed to win, even if it was 2v2. | ||
Rekrul
Korea (South)17174 Posts
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fiorentina
1 Post
User was warned for this post | ||
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States46670 Posts
 Thanks for the translation! | ||
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radadaundandan
Bulgaria3148 Posts
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Boundz(DarKo)
5311 Posts
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xing999ye
China1 Post
who did not make One mistake in his life? | ||
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CutTheEnemy
Canada373 Posts
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sluggaslamoo
Australia4494 Posts
On December 05 2013 12:29 Rekrul wrote: why would i hate savior? he made me alot of $ On December 04 2013 05:56 Rekrul wrote: awww weak, fuck savior i hope he is banned and burns forever lol | ||
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orth0dox
28 Posts
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BigFan
TLADT24920 Posts
On December 06 2013 08:53 orth0dox wrote: I never understood so much hatred directed at Savior, yeah he did bad thing, and what even worse even didn't feel penance about it (from what i have heard). But this is just stupid. BW is my favorite game ever, and i don't care about savior being jerk or not, neither i am interested in his private life. But his contribution in game is undisputed, he's n1 candidate to watch for me. TL banned his stream, and i still kinda resent that decision. You may hate him, but seriously, just leave him alone. Why everyone spits at him publicly and it is considered normal, but no one officially blame Blizzard for making everything to kill their own child? As for me Savior didn't damage game in any means, he just damaged KESPA and they are very rancorous about it. What Blizzard did was much worse. I wonder how bitter Savior must feel considering that's been going on since the matchfixing scandal and will probably continue for a long while to come. | ||
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29 fps
United States5725 Posts
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Weirdkid
Singapore2431 Posts
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nekotrap
130 Posts
On December 08 2013 21:43 Weirdkid wrote: There's actually like an interview with Ma Jae Yoon on Fomos I think, where they talk a bit about the tournament in China, and about the scandal. Yes, it was translated by lemmata here in this thread for anyone who hasn't seen it yet http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=437131¤tpage=23#459 | ||
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purgerinho
Croatia919 Posts
i can see some arguing (again) so i'll put my two cents: it's not like he was not punished for what he did... he is my favorite player of all time and match fixing scandal can't change it.. yes, i was sad he was a part of that scandal but it was bigger hit for me was when i realized he will not get the second chance... some people are saying he is the reason BW died but that statement is really too funny to take it seriously... i love that guy, i'm not ok with banning his stream here because acting so aggressively moralistic is just hypocritical but we are people and people love to behave in that way... they will spit on savior but at same time they will use some brands known for fixing prices on the market and destroying competition in that way or cheating on the customers... that guy "served" his time and i hope he will play the game no matter what "saints" are saying... imagine the society where you are punished for your acts for the rest of your life... that society would suck.. | ||
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Chef
10810 Posts
On December 11 2013 08:16 purgerinho wrote: great article and translation, thank you for that! i can see some arguing (again) so i'll put my two cents: it's not like he was not punished for what he did... he is my favorite player of all time and match fixing scandal can't change it.. yes, i was sad he was a part of that scandal but it was bigger hit for me was when i realized he will not get the second chance... some people are saying he is the reason BW died but that statement is really too funny to take it seriously... i love that guy, i'm not ok with banning his stream here because acting so aggressively moralistic is just hypocritical but we are people and people love to behave in that way... they will spit on savior but at same time they will use some brands known for fixing prices on the market and destroying competition in that way or cheating on the customers... that guy "served" his time and i hope he will play the game no matter what "saints" are saying... imagine the society where you are punished for your acts for the rest of your life... that society would suck.. I am all for reintegration into society and forgiveness, and in some ways I believe things were more complicated for Savior than people would have you think, but I think there is a difference between forgiving someone and approving of this kind of action. I think a lot more people could forgive Savior in their hearts if he really stopped playing games or at least Brood War and showed true repentance. Please consider the following scarecrows  :-A girlfriend or boyfriend cheats on you. You can forgive that person, but you shouldn't get back together with that person. -A pedophile teacher molests a child . You might forgive this person, but you shouldn't let them teach children or work with children again. Savior's situation is not precisely the same, but my feelings about it are. I was a person hoping for Savior to rise again all through his slump before we found out about the matchfixing, and a person who believed that he was probably partially a victim himself and fell into a very bad crowd when he was trying to make friends and be liked. But I still don't think he should play StarCraft anymore. Perhaps I take a more romantic view of repentance than you might like, but I think the romantic view lends itself to greater honesty, and it's less pitchforky without pretending wrongdoings don't matter. | ||
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Fuchsteufelswild
Australia2028 Posts
On December 11 2013 08:16 purgerinho wrote: imagine the society where you are punished for your acts for the rest of your life... that society would suck.. Many many people do not make such mistakes as those. Branching out into a slightly more broad but related topic, there's way too much excuse-making for stupid behaviour by people where they expect complete forgiveness because "Oh, you know, it was in the past, people do stupid things when they're young etc. etc.". It's just petty excuse-making because they don't want to accept responsibility. How about a world in which people try to avoid doing really bad or stupid things in the first place, instead of expecting to get away with everything? Of course people make mistakes, but people can easily only make far lesser mistakes. :\ If we all have certain rights but also certain moral rules we are meant to abide by, you don't have a world of "equal rights" when people abuse their rights, breach rules and then are eventually completely forgiven for it. Perhaps people should accept that if they do some things, they shouldn't expect to ever be completely forgiven. Complete forgiveness is reserved for lesser "wrongdoings", perhaps? Just another perspective, maybe. Aside from that, I agree with Chef above. | ||
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Caladbolg
2855 Posts
However, this should not limit Savior's participation in non-KesPA events. What Savior did was principally a crime against organized, competitive Starcraft. He effectively spat on the official rules of KesPA and its government-given authority, as well as the categorization of Broodwar as "e-Sports." In this instance though, the first effect is permanent (i.e., KesPA cannot maintain authority if its rules are flouted, and thus violators must be harshly punished), but the second effect (i.e., violation against fair play and sportsmanship) is not permanent, and can be cured by proper participation in other events. I don't know; match fixing is pretty much one of the worst things to do in any sport, alongside steroid use and overt cheating. Yet I cannot for the life of me think of it as some kind of "capital" crime requiring permanent punishment on ALL fronts, especially if it involves the freedom to do what you love. | ||
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purgerinho
Croatia919 Posts
On December 11 2013 11:02 Chef wrote: I am all for reintegration into society and forgiveness, and in some ways I believe things were more complicated for Savior than people would have you think, but I think there is a difference between forgiving someone and approving of this kind of action. I think a lot more people could forgive Savior in their hearts if he really stopped playing games or at least Brood War and showed true repentance. Please consider the following scarecrows :-A girlfriend or boyfriend cheats on you. You can forgive that person, but you shouldn't get back together with that person. -A pedophile teacher molests a child . You might forgive this person, but you shouldn't let them teach children or work with children again. Savior's situation is not precisely the same, but my feelings about it are. I was a person hoping for Savior to rise again all through his slump before we found out about the matchfixing, and a person who believed that he was probably partially a victim himself and fell into a very bad crowd when he was trying to make friends and be liked. But I still don't think he should play StarCraft anymore. Perhaps I take a more romantic view of repentance than you might like, but I think the romantic view lends itself to greater honesty, and it's less pitchforky without pretending wrongdoings don't matter. he is not a progamer anymore... it is like saying girlfriend/boyfriend can't be with someone else anymore.. it is like savior and bw.. pedophiles aren't best example coz i would never forget them and i would close them behind the bars for the rest of their life :D but i can understand your feelings.. i was hoping he will rise again.. his fall started with bisu rise and obviously he lost fate in his gameplay and turned to match fixing.. in that period he wasn't same player anymore (except blizzcon)... we don't know what happened in his head, he was weak in that moment, maybe greedy, who knows, maybe he is awful person in general (i doubt it).. he fked up very hard and paid for it... kespa ban is his biggest punishment + money he had to give back + he lost so many fans and instead of love he got hate from them (understandable).. he started again from zero (not really because of his legacy but you know what i want to say) and it should be "live and let live" now... banning his stream on TLnet is hypocritical but i can understand it.. so everyone has to understand all of us that still admire him coz of his gameplay back in the glory days.. my opinion is that he can give something back to BW if he would get another chance... | ||
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