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[Contest] Map Design Contest! - Page 16

Forum Index > BW General
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dyren
Profile Joined December 2009
United States260 Posts
January 24 2010 23:18 GMT
#301
On January 25 2010 05:37 mmp wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
On January 24 2010 21:18 dyren wrote:
incoming wall of text... proceed at own risk...
edit: you can find replays here: http://www.panschk.de/mappage/comments.php?mapid=4003


+ Show Spoiler [Center Expo???] +
[image loading]

or this!
[image loading]

or this?
[image loading]

Muessoloc III
[image loading]


So while playtesting I had a range of different people giving me feedback on Muessoloc III and I made a lot of necessary little changes like fixing misplaced doodads, geyser placement, mineral count at natural matches colo (6 patches), small but important stuff like that.

But I had one stubborn but helpful tester who really attacked this map in his analysis causing me to have to really think about and defend some of the decisions I've made. So I would like to just take a second to talk about how I see my map and the balance on it. Needless to say I've largely based it off the map Colosseum II which in my opinion is both a great map and pretty unique. It features a low ground main, protected natural, and close third with a wide ramp near the main choke and small back door ramp. There's a neutral sunken at the choke providing creep for a sunken rush or defense and it creates a smaller choke. Colosseum features an open flat middle with 4 compound walls forming an oval around a central expansion. I really think this map has a lot going for it. It promotes fast expansion builds with the in-base natural and that opens up the possibility of fast aggression to punish a greedy fast expander. Also, building placement is critically important in this map to prevent run-bys and being sieged from the high ground above your choke. The presence of this high ground is clearly deliberate and creates the need for Protoss to have good map control early in PvT.

My keen tester was adamant that protoss fast expand was not viable on Muessoloc because he ran lings by some noob protoss in one game. He insisted there was something wrong with the map because he was able to run lings in and harass the natural and main. I had to explain that the layout of the choke and the short-medium length rush distances mean building placement is critically important as well as constantly scouting your opponent (a feature I like very much in a map.) So as usual if your opponent isn't scouting you well you have the opportunity to surprise him ... this is even more deadly on a map like Muessoloc.

It was brought to my attention that T imbalance might exist due to cliffs (what a surprise,) I tried to make the center such that if T is slow pushing through the middle there are other ways to move your army and counter or surround him. As far as siege tanks at the third, well I think you shouldn't let him get tanks up there! This means map control and scouting.

Another imbalance that was brought forward was Guardians. Someone pointed out that the 2 and 5 o clock bases are extremely succeptable to guardian rape. While I agree that they are vulnerable, and besides the fact that the 9 o clock base does not suffer from the same vulnerability (this sucks,) I think the answer is SCOUT and have something prepared. If you see your enemy muta harassing and then his mutas fly over the dead zone and don't reappear, suspect guardians (also scout his base) and if T get your wraiths up asap, if P sairs which you should have anyway and guards are dumb in this match up. There have been two games recently where flash has had several wraiths prepared when or before guards pop.

Someone pointed out that the naturals are small. Yes. Should I make them larger? I didn't think it was necessary but I am interested in hearing other people's opinion.

I've had two people out of like 40 tell me to change the checkerboard pattern on the naturals. Yes? No?

Some people are telling me to put an expo in the center of the map. Anyone have thoughts on this? I'm inclined not to however I have seen many games finish with no one using the center. However in the one decent TvT it was used a lot. I think having a mineral rich expo in the center would force a certain amount of awareness on both players and create movement through the middle. However I just don't feel like the map needs another expo.

So, in short, the layout and features of Muessoloc III create the need for 1) keen and proactive scouting. 2) near perfect building placement. 3) map control. This map punishes 1) noobs who don't scout. 2) bad mechanics (BO loss/win.) 3) bad building placement!

If you would like to see my map I'll be on ICCUP as much as possible and would love to chat about sc and the contest with any and all of you. Username: dyren




You "forgot" to include the replay(s) of me kicking your ass. :p

Forgot... did I??? LOL
(╬ ಠ益ಠ)
Ronald_McD
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Canada807 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-01-25 00:03:15
January 25 2010 00:00 GMT
#302
I'm not a huge fan of the themes because they promote a lot of neutral building usage, which is already over-used in most fan made maps these days. But nonetheless...


Here's my entry:

Name: Reclusion 1.0
Players: 2
Creator: Ronald_McD
Theme: Found Temples

Image:
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


Download Link:
http://rapidshare.com/files/340578803/Reclusion.scx

Map Features:

-Easy to defend main and natural expansion.
-3rd and 4th bases are long distance, but relatively defend-able.
-Temples at ramps near natural expansions can be destroyed to widen ramps.
-Temples in the middle can be destroyed to gain access to mineral-only expansions
-Xel'Naga temples in the middle can be destroyed to create another, quicker passage for units to move through.
-Actual use of the "High Raised Jungle" terrain (lol)

P.S. This is my first melee map ever made.
FUCKING GAY LAGS
the-Undermind
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
Canada106 Posts
January 25 2010 00:22 GMT
#303
On January 25 2010 09:00 Ronald_McD wrote:

-Actual use of the "High Raised Jungle" terrain (lol)



This was win
Shawn [the-Undermind] Williams
Husky
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States3362 Posts
January 25 2010 00:39 GMT
#304
On January 25 2010 09:00 Ronald_McD wrote:
I'm not a huge fan of the themes because they promote a lot of neutral building usage, which is already over-used in most fan made maps these days. But nonetheless...


Here's my entry:

Name: Reclusion 1.0
Players: 2
Creator: Ronald_McD
Theme: Found Temples

Image:
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


Download Link:
http://rapidshare.com/files/340578803/Reclusion.scx

Map Features:

-Easy to defend main and natural expansion.
-3rd and 4th bases are long distance, but relatively defend-able.
-Temples at ramps near natural expansions can be destroyed to widen ramps.
-Temples in the middle can be destroyed to gain access to mineral-only expansions
-Xel'Naga temples in the middle can be destroyed to create another, quicker passage for units to move through.
-Actual use of the "High Raised Jungle" terrain (lol)

P.S. This is my first melee map ever made.



Haha nice, I lol'd at the last list item XD

I just want to note, I chose the themes specifically because I have always loved neutral buildings. Just a personal preferance I guess, but none the less thank you for submitting your map!
Commentaries: youtube.com/HuskyStarcraft
sTYleZerG-eX
Profile Joined January 2010
Mexico473 Posts
January 25 2010 01:14 GMT
#305
Husky, I did consider doing that when doing the map, and you are right it makes symmetrical sense, but I put it there for a reason. The reason is that in the way its positioned right now:
- Its easier to do a split on.
- Workers can be a pain to grab and send to the minerals when they come out in that position (Specially when theres + than 9)
- It makes both mains + equal, think about it If I positioned it how you suggest, in the 6 o'clock position workers when they pop out will take a shorter amount of time to get to the mineral patch (similar problem with zerg larva).
- And its really not that positional imbalanced at all, there if + that enough turret room, and troop's room 2 defend comfortably.
- It also has been done in pro maps Be4 and it works.
10%
Geeko
Profile Joined January 2010
New Zealand17 Posts
January 25 2010 01:27 GMT
#306
Split End

Theme - Zerg Invasion
This is my last map.

[image loading]


Melee
Nub4ever
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Canada1981 Posts
January 25 2010 01:49 GMT
#307
Split End reminds me of Blue Storm with spawn at top left and bot right O.O
Dota 3hard5me
T.n.T
Profile Joined January 2010
United States20 Posts
January 25 2010 03:47 GMT
#308
I've been playing Muessoloc III on IcCup. It is a pretty fun map to play because of non-standard natural, but one major flaw is that the 2 o'clock gas is tankable, and its replacement to under the start location will lead to imbalanced mining.
"If you're good at anticipating the human mind, it leaves nothing to chance." -Saw V <---Therefore, all fanboys who cry build order when their favorite player loses deserve to be put in deathtraps to fight for their lives
TriniMasta
Profile Joined December 2009
United States1323 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-01-25 06:23:29
January 25 2010 06:21 GMT
#309
On January 25 2010 08:05 TriniMasta[wD] wrote:
[image loading]

Olympia 1.1

It says Olympia 1.1 under the picture. Guess I should make it bigger! The theme are found temples, I will add them to the map before 2-4! Gl with contest Husky
2 Player map top right and top left. 128x128
정명훈 FIGHTING!!! Play both T and P.
dyren
Profile Joined December 2009
United States260 Posts
January 25 2010 07:37 GMT
#310
I like Olympia except the weird tiling on the "ovie" spots. The rest looks good though despite being a little limited on options for movement. But it is a (2) map so.. good job!
(╬ ಠ益ಠ)
Impervious
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Canada4218 Posts
January 25 2010 16:03 GMT
#311
Husky, you forgot to update the pic of mine in the OP.

On January 22 2010 11:57 lMPERVlOUS wrote:
Update on mine - I will probably still work on it some more however.

Order 227 + Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


EDIT - Better image.


Link to BWM
~ \(ˌ)im-ˈpər-vē-əs\ : not capable of being damaged or harmed.
Husky
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States3362 Posts
January 25 2010 20:29 GMT
#312
I will be updating this later in the day.

I'll make sure to add your update in there IMPERVIOUS, as well as add the most recent maps posted.
Commentaries: youtube.com/HuskyStarcraft
tv-dooke
Profile Joined January 2010
United States7 Posts
January 25 2010 21:24 GMT
#313
On January 24 2010 09:23 tv-dooke wrote:
OK I revised (2)Yao Floss. This is the one i want entered in the contest, I think.

DOWNLOAD HERE>> http://yogware.bluegillstudios.com/shpib/?l=544

THINGS I CHANGED>>
---Random 2nd gas on the left sides' main base was removed
---There's a stack of 30 mineral patches set to 0 in the middle corridor blocking the path(instead of a stack of 10 temples).
---The 12 o clock entrances with temples have been removed and left open.
---There is now a new path above the middle corridor and the upper plateau for a small group of forces.
---The right side now has a wider ramp to the middle corridor to match lefts.
---The ramps have been widened in the top corner expansions making them harder to secure.
---A recall animation was added to simulate your workers being warped in at the beginning of the game ;-)
---Touch ups around the map to make it look more pretty =]


I still want to make a version of this map with a wider choke at the middle corridor with the stack of 10 temples as well as temple blocks at the top entrances to the main(like i had in the original version).

Also, can someone post a preview of this new version for me? I'm a noob and don't know how to do that.


hey husky this is the updated version of Yao Floss. idk how to post previews sry can someone help me out?
alexpnd
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Canada1857 Posts
January 25 2010 21:45 GMT
#314
So many good maps here! My fave so far is blood red skyes.
www.brainyweb.ca //web stuff!
Husky
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States3362 Posts
January 25 2010 22:27 GMT
#315
If someone could post a screenshot of Yao Floss that would be great. I am working on updating the OP right now.
Commentaries: youtube.com/HuskyStarcraft
Husky
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States3362 Posts
January 25 2010 22:42 GMT
#316
Split end is really good . The only thing I would suggest is having another entrance near the wall behind the natural. A couple of tanks on the high ground at the only choke on this map would be so annoying T_T.

Great overall feel for a lot of these maps though. Up to 32 now...

Speaking of which, I believe all of them are updated. Updating any screenshots for new versions right now.
Commentaries: youtube.com/HuskyStarcraft
Superouman
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
France2195 Posts
January 26 2010 00:34 GMT
#317
Update with (2)Tarsonis Invasion:
removed bunker from 9h
added doodads
[image loading]

power generators aren't useless imo, if they are down, it will be a pain to defend your nat
Search "[SO]" on B.net to find all my maps ||| Cloud Kingdom / Turbo Cruise '84 / Bone Temple / Eternal Empire / Zen / Purity and Industry / Golden Wall / Fortitude / Beckett Industries / Waterfall
Husky
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States3362 Posts
January 26 2010 00:38 GMT
#318
I dont think they are worthless either. It is similar to Andromeda IMO where you can sneak stuff over there and then bust them down. Or vice versa, break them down and then get a flank on the nat.
Commentaries: youtube.com/HuskyStarcraft
the-Undermind
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
Canada106 Posts
January 26 2010 00:53 GMT
#319
I think it would make more sense if they actually lead into your main/nat (similar to andromeda) or if there was a expansion there.
Shawn [the-Undermind] Williams
tv-dooke
Profile Joined January 2010
United States7 Posts
January 26 2010 01:18 GMT
#320
On January 24 2010 09:23 tv-dooke wrote:
OK I revised (2)Yao Floss. This is the one i want entered in the contest, I think.

DOWNLOAD HERE>> http://yogware.bluegillstudios.com/shpib/?l=544

THINGS I CHANGED>>
---Random 2nd gas on the left sides' main base was removed
---There's a stack of 30 mineral patches set to 0 in the middle corridor blocking the path(instead of a stack of 10 temples).
---The 12 o clock entrances with temples have been removed and left open.
---There is now a new path above the middle corridor and the upper plateau for a small group of forces.
---The right side now has a wider ramp to the middle corridor to match lefts.
---The ramps have been widened in the top corner expansions making them harder to secure.
---A recall animation was added to simulate your workers being warped in at the beginning of the game ;-)
---Touch ups around the map to make it look more pretty =]


I still want to make a version of this map with a wider choke at the middle corridor with the stack of 10 temples as well as temple blocks at the top entrances to the main(like i had in the original version).


[image loading]
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