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WYSIWYG programming

Blogs > Xeofreestyler
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Xeofreestyler
Profile Blog Joined June 2005
Belgium6773 Posts
March 05 2009 23:18 GMT
#1
Or well, 'programming'.

Its called FNK and I just came across it today


Fnk (pronounced fink) is an online visual programming environment that uses a dataflow approach for the analysis, processing and synthesis of image, sound and other data in real-time. It aims to be an easy and fun way to create multimedia and music presentation prototypes that interact with a number of input and output devices. It was born as an academic project, but has since then moved into a standalone one.


http://ffnnkk.org/about/about-fnk/

It looks pretty cool but my biggest worry is that it can get rreaaaally messy once it starts getting complex. Gonna have some fun playing around with this though.

here's an example:
http://ffnnkk.org/2008/11/25/camera-circles/

Graphics
exkgb
Profile Joined September 2005
United States504 Posts
March 05 2009 23:26 GMT
#2
It reminds me of labview which we use a lot in engineering labs. Needless to say, I hate labview because it takes so f***ing long to do any algorithm stuff since you need to drag and drop all those annoying nodes around and yes it gets really messing once things are more complex. I prefer text-based programming environment by far.
Xeofreestyler
Profile Blog Joined June 2005
Belgium6773 Posts
March 05 2009 23:28 GMT
#3
Well needless to say I just find it interesting because of the direct graphical output

but yeah if you wanna do any real algorithms this sucks lol
Graphics
Bockit
Profile Blog Joined November 2004
Sydney2287 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-03-06 00:03:38
March 05 2009 23:47 GMT
#4
This is very similar to a programming 'language' called Max. To someone who has learnt programming without WYSIWIG it can be at times unintuitive, however if you give it the time necessary you'll get your head around it and it can be powerful for certain things.

I've found what this style of programming is useful for is extremely rapid development. With Max it comes with two plugin products, Jitter (On the fly video editing and analysis, stuff like colour tracking, blob tracking etc etc) and MSP (Complex sound editing control) which allow you to very quickly make (I'm talking a couple of hours) reasonably complex programs.

As an example, I wrote a program where users controlled a car's brakes, acceleration and steering in a game by wearing coloured gloves and making gestures with their hands. Did it in about 2 days. This was possible because it's so simple to just 'dump' this video analysis library into your dataflow and then get the numbers that you need to do your stuff. So with this FNK a lot of its success I think will come from the libraries you can get with it.

From my experience designers tend to be attracted to WYSIWIG programming. (Not saying that's a bad thing btw, it's simply a trend I've noticed. Interestingly, the homepage of their website reminds me of http://www.processing.org , open source java graphics libraries provided with an editor that also targets designers.

EDIT: I suck didn't read the last link in your op
Their are four errors in this sentance.
prOxi.swAMi
Profile Blog Joined November 2004
Australia3091 Posts
March 05 2009 23:59 GMT
#5
Why would people avoid learning real programming? It's much more fun....
Oh no
exkgb
Profile Joined September 2005
United States504 Posts
March 06 2009 00:05 GMT
#6
I agree that this style of programming can be useful for certain kind of applications. But you have to realize that the "libraries" which you use with these visual programming environments which does complex video processing such as blob tracking are probably written in C or some other high level imperative language.

What I find interesting with this style of programming is the similarity which it shares with functional programming. Both have features such a the lack of a global state and the fact that your programs turn out like a mathematical formula where data gets massaged through a series of functions. This is unlike imperative languages such where the mindset is that there is a list of statements which manipulates a set of states.

Processing is pretty different compared to these languages, processing is just a modified version of java as far as I know.

It'll be interesting to see if these visual programming languages catches on. From my experience ( perhaps tainted by my backgroudn in traditional languages ) doing simple things like indexing arrays..etc. are such a pain that its simply not worth it.

Bockit
Profile Blog Joined November 2004
Sydney2287 Posts
March 06 2009 00:14 GMT
#7
On March 06 2009 09:05 exkgb wrote:
I agree that this style of programming can be useful for certain kind of applications. But you have to realize that the "libraries" which you use with these visual programming environments which does complex video processing such as blob tracking are probably written in C or some other high level imperative language.

What I find interesting with this style of programming is the similarity which it shares with functional programming. Both have features such a the lack of a global state and the fact that your programs turn out like a mathematical formula where data gets massaged through a series of functions. This is unlike imperative languages such where the mindset is that there is a list of statements which manipulates a set of states.

Processing is pretty different compared to these languages, processing is just a modified version of java as far as I know.

It'll be interesting to see if these visual programming languages catches on. From my experience ( perhaps tainted by my backgroudn in traditional languages ) doing simple things like indexing arrays..etc. are such a pain that its simply not worth it.



Oh definitely the libraries are written in C or w/e, it's just the ease of use, and that ease of understanding the ins and outs that do it for a lot of people.

Yeah processing is just java, I was commenting more on the site, the content and who it suggests the language is targeted to is similar to FNK's website.

And yeah, trying to do simple things in traditional languages in these visual programming ones, like storing a number for later access without resetting it, is pretty much a huge bitch. The solution that advocates for the languages state is that you shouldn't be doing traditional things with it in the first place heh.
Their are four errors in this sentance.
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