EPTWant your replay analyzed? - Page 5
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SpiritoftheTunA
United States20903 Posts
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inReacH
Sweden1612 Posts
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SpiritoftheTunA
United States20903 Posts
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inReacH
Sweden1612 Posts
On February 07 2009 12:03 Oystein wrote: with an 8scout you can steal gas unless he takes it before rax anyway if that is what you want. The fact that you say a probe can scout early and steal a terrans gas reliably speaks volumes. *Waits for you to alter your statement* On February 07 2009 11:29 Chill wrote: I think the argument is that 2 Rax doesn't counter anything, which I'd agree with. 2 rax doesn't counter proxy in that in necessarily leaves you ahead but it is sometimes the only way to survive, if counter isn't the right word then call it an 'appropriate response' therefore you are forcing your opponent into the appropriate response I'm not saying your points contradict each other, I'm saying your choice of ways to affect your opponent is a contradiction, in that one is sacrificing resources for aggression and one is encouraging your opponent to respond appropriately. | ||
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InfeSteD
United States4658 Posts
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inReacH
Sweden1612 Posts
On February 07 2009 13:02 InfeSteD wrote: Maybe Im a nub as well.. but in the last 5 TvPs where I get my gas stealed ... the 3 times I went 2/3 rax scv rush.. I beat the Protoss easy and the 2 I tried to catch up with standard play(let it be FE or late Fac) I lost ... it was a C level btw Dude don't let the protoss steal your gas, you see probe, take a refinery like every other decent terran. | ||
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inReacH
Sweden1612 Posts
I don't recall the exact timing of everything, it could have been a mistake.. If your actually going to commit to the notion that not getting that zeal was dangerous, IIRC you carelessly lost 2 zeals and a goon and killed nothing and you completely raped his offensive anyways, care to retract? | ||
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Oystein
Norway1602 Posts
On February 07 2009 12:55 inReacH wrote: The fact that you say a probe can scout early and steal a terrans gas reliably speaks volumes. *Waits for you to alter your statement* 2 rax doesn't counter proxy in that in necessarily leaves you ahead but it is sometimes the only way to survive, if counter isn't the right word then call it an 'appropriate response' therefore you are forcing your opponent into the appropriate response I'm not saying your points contradict each other, I'm saying your choice of ways to affect your opponent is a contradiction, in that one is sacrificing resources for aggression and one is encouraging your opponent to respond appropriately. On destination it does, I guess I should have clarified that this was for this map, im not saying you can 8scout and steal gas on 4playermaps and I guess I should not have assumed you would realize I was talking about 2player maps and Destination in specific and not some random 4player map.... No if he have a wall, 2raxing is NOT the proper response, getting a factory and taking out the proxy asap is the proper response, however I forced him to make delayed tech or 2rax by letting the assim finish and both options are GOOD for me and like I said earlier until you realize this nothing I say will change your mind. When did I ever comment on losing my units on top of that ramp was smart? If I had those units I would probably have raped him with my counterattack and still you think 2rax is a good option?? This was the player http://www.iccup.com/gamingprofile/sksskek.html look at page 14 of his matchlist and you will see he was A- for some games. So I guess your right this isnt B level play, its more B+ level play. Anyway how do you know what B level play is like when you have never played on the B level... | ||
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inReacH
Sweden1612 Posts
On February 07 2009 13:30 Oystein wrote: Well let me tell you a little story about two players that I beat once... Ok that was a joke.. I'm pretty much done with this, we can agree to disagree, I will say that you can't reliably steal a good terrans gas on any map otherwise this would be done almost every time a game is played on a 2 player map because as you know it fucks them hard. It's just not appropriate when you are proxying IMO.. you can disagree that's fine. Thanks for your earlier approval, I'm sure your macro is a lot better when you aren't tired and that you are a super awesome player(not sarcasm). | ||
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InfeSteD
United States4658 Posts
On February 07 2009 13:03 inReacH wrote: Dude don't let the protoss steal your gas, you see probe, take a refinery like every other decent terran. how the fuck r u supposed to take gas in destination when the fuckin P scouts at 8 pylon? | ||
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inReacH
Sweden1612 Posts
On February 07 2009 13:41 InfeSteD wrote: how the fuck r u supposed to take gas in destination when the fuckin P scouts at 8 pylon? Umm cut an SCV for a few seconds.. Do you really think if terrans allowed gas stealing even if it was early that people wouldn't be doing this more often? You don't have to start mining from it immediately, I've even seen pro terrans start the refinery and then put their SCV back on minerals until it was time to build a refinery normally. Such dictation from the protoss in that matchup would be really powerful. | ||
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InfeSteD
United States4658 Posts
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Oystein
Norway1602 Posts
On February 07 2009 13:40 inReacH wrote: Well let me tell you a little story about two players that I beat once... Ok that was a joke.. I'm pretty much done with this, we can agree to disagree, I will say that you can't reliably steal a good terrans gas on any map otherwise this would be done almost every time a game is played on a 2 player map because as you know it fucks them hard. It's just not appropriate when you are proxying IMO.. you can disagree that's fine. Thanks for your earlier approval, I'm sure your macro is a lot better when you aren't tired and that you are a super awesome player(not sarcasm). If he makes Rax first sure you can steal it, and if you are proxying and he decides to take his gas before his rax thats even better for the P since his marines will be even more delayed, and I did not say you can steal the gas every time with 8scout, I said "with an 8scout you can steal gas unless he takes it before rax anyway if that is what you want." stop putting words in my mouth. And since you say every P would steal the gas if they had the chance speaks of how good it actually is. Since you are using Progames as examples I suggest you go watch some PvTs on destination where the P proxy and gassteals and see that they usually let it complete watch Bisu vs FBH from Clubday MSL he lets it complete, Free vs Light he steals gas and lets it complete. I guess these 2 tosses are also noobs doing a bad decision? Edit : Canceling after you see someone put up a second rax is a totally different thing, example Best vs FBH where he steals gas and cancels when FBH commits to 2 raxes. | ||
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inReacH
Sweden1612 Posts
If they come any earlier you may have to get your refinery before your racks but it only delays your racks by a few seconds. My progame example had nothing to even do with our debate, I was just adding an option for infested, I'm sure we could find beginners, amateurs and pros doing it both ways. Can we drop this? | ||
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Ganfei
Taiwan1439 Posts
It's pretty clear he only posted it to troll you, inreach, so you should shut up before you make more of a fool of yourself. | ||
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inReacH
Sweden1612 Posts
On February 07 2009 14:27 NoobsOfWrath wrote: Oystein has successfully trolled inreach. Inreach's answers are wrong, but Oystein clearly knew that they would be wrong and obviously knew he could just lean back on the fact that it was a B vs B game he was posting. It's pretty clear he only posted it to troll you, inreach, so you should shut up before you make more of a fool of yourself. Hahaha no he didn't you fucking moron. If you really can't pick up on the sincerity in his first few posts then you have a truly appalling sense of human conduct. Unless he feels like taking your ignorance as an opportunity to just try to bash me I'm sure he will correct you but anyone who has been following this thread knows the legitimacy of this conversation. Do you actually fathom that this post was made to make me look stupid in some way, if that was his intention then what would he do if I just thanked him for his compliments? + Show Spoiler + Pretty good analyzes of the game, it was my last laddergame I played yesterday after 36 hours without sleep so I knew it was full of mistakes and the reason I chose it. Tbh I just wanted to get an idea of your analyzing capabilities and all in all I think you did a great job, however a couple of things I disagree\correct on - letting the assimilator finish is pretty much standard, canceling it and letting the T take his gas is a mistake, he needs gas more than I need the extra money. - I did not have range when he moved across the bridges and I moved out and engaged him once I got it, and I did focus fire on the first few rins until their numbers was so low it didnt really matter anymore. - About the counterattack in case you did not understand it I was not trying to take out the bunker, I was trying to walk up his ramp and into his main neglecting the entire bunker but his transferring SCVs stopped me from doing it. -About the probe I didnt move it out on accident, but I was sloppy and did not realize he had an scv blocking the ramp, and normally I would have just used a mineral next to the assimilator to drill my way in but after 36hours without sleep your brain aint functioning at top speed Overall I think lots of people could use your analyzes to improve their game (at least if you do it as thorough as this one) , and its a great initiative that got awfully sidetracked. He stated on multiple occasions that he thought my opinion of the game was on point in most aspects, we just disagree on this one early game decision. | ||
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whatusername
Canada1181 Posts
Here it is hosted: http://repdepot.net/download.php?type...7530&name=Iruian vs knategeis.rep Thanks! | ||
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inReacH
Sweden1612 Posts
On February 07 2009 14:29 whatusername wrote: Hi man, I'm a D-/D Terran player, and I was hoping you could analyze my rep? Here it is hosted: http://repdepot.net/download.php?type...7530&name=Iruian vs knategeis.rep Thanks! Yeah man I will definitely get to it tomorrow! | ||
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Oystein
Norway1602 Posts
On February 07 2009 14:27 NoobsOfWrath wrote: Oystein has successfully trolled inreach. Inreach's answers are wrong, but Oystein clearly knew that they would be wrong and obviously knew he could just lean back on the fact that it was a B vs B game he was posting. It's pretty clear he only posted it to troll you, inreach, so you should shut up before you make more of a fool of yourself. Nope I did not, was sincere posts. But I do agree he is clearly wrong on a few things. | ||
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inReacH
Sweden1612 Posts
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