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Can someone instruct me on how to execute this "flash Build"? I remember hearing that flash build in Terran vs Protoss will be a good counter for a lot of things that the protoss decides to throw at you. The only problem is I don't know this mystical build order they're refering to.
I need specific details like:
9 depot
12 barrack/refinery
15 depot
22 factory
etc.
And explain where the build order diverges as well as giving perspective of the goals. I tried looking around for this but I couldn't find it. I remember a few things like FE followed by 2 factories then creating academy/amory to make 2 goliaths. These two goliaths will protect you from oncoming drops.
Again I'm a desperate fighting terran that's seeking specific knowledge for fighting the arrogant protoss. All terrans must help your fellow comrade.
Edit: Only answer if your information is correct!
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its like bisubuild, no one really knows.
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On October 04 2008 06:06 XCetron wrote:
its like bisubuild, no one really knows.
They're so mystical like the unicorns, damn those retarded ponies. They should be more like regular horses instead, graceful.
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Listen, I guess you need to get away from the idea of a fixed build-order. Flash is a progamer, he tweaks his build every game according to the informations he gets from scouting. You cannot copy him exactly, because like the Bisu-Build, the Flash-Build is highly situational.
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I cannot give you the food count details but I can give you the basic information of the "Flash build".
Basically you should use the "Flash build" on maps where you can easily take 2 expansions and turtle (Blue Storm / Othello / Andromeda). You are opening with an early expansion (either FD or siege expansion) then you are going to add a armory and immediately start the attack upgrade. You won't build an ebay but an academy for scan. You will use goliaths to defend drop harassment. (Make sure you will have range).
When your upgrade is half done you will add a port and continue with a science facility and a second armory. This should allow you to immediately upgrade the second attack and first armor grade as soon as the first attack is finished. When you got 2-1 you will move out and basically crush the protoss.
While you push you should take at least 1 expansion, 2 if possible. Also you can add a science vessel with EMP.
Hopefully I could help you.
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Thanks Naruto for explaining the situation better. I'm not sure whether you can discuss the build order into specifics but you managed to convey the most of it. I didn't consider map type played a role in the situation. the benefits don't seem to be worth the effort it seems.
If you can or someone else provide a replay of this build order maybe it'll click in me. I could just go with what you described but visually experiencing this will further help me. thanks. =D
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What are you talking about, "efforts?" It's easy. You're turtling and waiting. Of course you need an easy third base, how else are you going to sit around doing nothing til you have 2/1 if you don't have 3 bases?
The advantage is the timing on it, the 2/1 is extremely fast and +2 that fast on T metal melts protoss
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[url blocked]
Replay. My build varies a little bit because I didn't build goliaths and I used 2 armories from the beginning, but you get the idea. Also I think I used a doc to be super save (ladder game).
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Valhalla18444 Posts
"Flash Build" is a specific build order on Katrina that directly counters Stork's 12nexus reaver into carrier. Anything else is just FE, and the fast +2 has been around a shitload longer than Flash has been a pro
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Every build involving an armory is a Flash build, just like how every PvZ build in existence (2 gate and tech builds don't exist) is a Bisu build
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I will try and find you a korean replay
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On October 04 2008 07:29 Purind wrote:
Every build involving an armory is a Flash build, just like how every PvZ build in existence (2 gate and tech builds don't exist) is a Bisu build
Only if you want to abuse terminology and be ignorant to the large variation in fe builds.
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On October 04 2008 06:06 XCetron wrote:
its like bisubuild, no one really knows.
XCetron is the closest here, IMO. Both the Flash and the Bisu builds are highly dependent on scouting and reactionary builds, so they're not really "build orders" but rather "builds". There's no set in stone order.
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Valhalla18444 Posts
On October 04 2008 07:39 thunk wrote:Show nested quote +On October 04 2008 06:06 XCetron wrote:
its like bisubuild, no one really knows. XCetron is the closest here, IMO. Both the Flash and the Bisu builds are highly dependent on scouting and reactionary builds, so they're not really "build orders" but rather "builds". There's no set in stone order.
you're wrong because 1) you don't understand that the "flash build" is a specific build order and 2) you don't understand that the "flash build" is a specific build order
so you miss out by saying the "flash build" is something reactionary based on scouting, and by saying the "flash build" isn't a specific build order
0/2 oh my
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fast armory + emp vessels and sitting back while scouting = flash build.
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Valhalla18444 Posts
On October 04 2008 09:34 Raithed wrote:
fast armory + emp vessels and sitting back while scouting = flash build.
youuuu aaaaaare wroooooooong
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On October 04 2008 08:33 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:Show nested quote +On October 04 2008 07:39 thunk wrote:On October 04 2008 06:06 XCetron wrote:
its like bisubuild, no one really knows. XCetron is the closest here, IMO. Both the Flash and the Bisu builds are highly dependent on scouting and reactionary builds, so they're not really "build orders" but rather "builds". There's no set in stone order. you're wrong because 1) you don't understand that the "flash build" is a specific build order and 2) you don't understand that the "flash build" is a specific build order so you miss out by saying the "flash build" is something reactionary based on scouting, and by saying the "flash build" isn't a specific build order 0/2 oh my
rofl
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flash doesn't build he just runs and turns his arm rapidly causing a tornado.
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I think the "flash build" is just the style of getting earlier gols with the intention of nullifying money invested by the protoss into reaver harrass, while getting 2-1 upgrades and your third base. It's meant for a long macro game, with the intention being to destroy money invested into carriers much easier due to the faster upgrades and by having gols pre-mixed into your army.
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Fakesteve, i'm sorry to say this but you're wrong.
The "flash build" might not be a proper name for it though, just as the "bisu build" might not be a proper name for a famous PvZ style.
I'd rather call it the flash style, but saying that the Flash build is a build-order only intended for Katrina to counter 12 nex -> reaver > carrier is wrong. Flash's so called build is pretty viable against any opening, as long as you have the ability to take your second expansion quick enough. Which means Blue storm, Andromeda, Othello, Katrina and so on..
So far I think Narutos post explains it the best.
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On October 04 2008 09:48 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:Show nested quote +On October 04 2008 09:34 Raithed wrote:
fast armory + emp vessels and sitting back while scouting = flash build. youuuu aaaaaare wroooooooong
nou.
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no fakesteve is right, the flash build is a specific build
it isnt just upgrades and early goliaths
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Funny how similar this argument is to the "bisu build" one.
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some gsi reps were released(leaked) flash vs stork on blue storm and katrina. Both show a perfectly executed flash build. I think they might be on gosugamers or fighterreplay.
Also there were two boxer reps vs cloud in tsl where boxer does something similiar.
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To understand clearly the Flash build, you have to keep in mind that it is a litteral adaptation of the Bisu build to terran, which is itself an adaptation of the Flash build to toss.
Then everything becomes clearer, and vice versa.
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EPT
