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Second semester at Japanese language school

Blogs > mooose
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mooose
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Japan200 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-07-30 00:56:23
July 26 2015 12:07 GMT
#1
Comin' at you with another blog. I'm still in Japan, still studying Japanese and still being a confused sweaty white guy. This time I also went to Seoul and stuff.

Here's my previous blogs about Japan:
1. Going to Japan to learn Japanese
2: First week at Japanese language school
3. Moose in Japan 3
4. Golden Week in Tokyo
5. Halfway through Japanese studies

My favourite thing from Seoul:

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My girlfriend brings me to art galleries and stuff sometimes, but I think this is the best sculpture I've seen in a while.
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Class 2 at language school
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In my last blog I think I talked about my end of term tests and stuff from the end of the first 3 months. We then had a 2 week holiday before starting school again. At my school, you move up a class every 3 months, unless you fail and have to redo a class or take an additional jump-up test and skip a class. I started in class one, and so I'm in class 2 now.

In the first class, I already knew most of the grammar that we covered, but I had very little speaking/listening experience so the classes didn't feel too easy. In class 2, I still know some of the grammar we've been going over, but this time I have a lot more confidence speaking and better listening comprehension, so nothing has felt particularly challenging so far.

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This is a photo from the top of a mountain I cycled up. I took this, ate an ice cream and then went back down again. You can see lake Biwa in the distance.

Also, since a lot of people enrolled in the school at the same time when I started, there were two class 1s; I was in 1B. Some of the people only stayed for a few months and have since left the school, so for class 2 they merged both 1A and 1B into a single class. Unfortunately there's still quite a lot of people. In class 1B there was only around 12 - 14 of us most of the time; in this class there's 26. This is a problem because with more people in the class, I spend less time actually doing stuff, and more time sitting around listening to other people talk.

In class 1B, it felt to me like we were mostly of a similar skill level, so the classes felt like they were going at a good pace for everyone (although I suppose my other class mates might not have had the same opinion I dunno). This time there feels like a larger range of skill levels. Some of the people seem to struggle with fairly basic stuff like reading Hiragana and Katakana; and really have a hard time saying much of anything.

The combination of a large class and wide variety of Japanese ability means that the classes seem to crawl along at a frustratingly slow pace sometimes. I know I'm not the only one who feels like this; my friend who sits in front of me always turns round and gives me a "-_- srsly?" face when some of the other people in class get basic things wrong.

I don't want to be too hard on them; I'm still bad at Japanese, and I think it's best that everyone has an environment where they feel like they can make mistakes without being judged because otherwise they'll stop improving. However it seems like some of them just don't study or practise at all; I couldn't imagine not being able to read Katakana at this point, I've been doing it every day for ages. I think everyone would be better off if they split the classes back into 2A and 2B, but maybe they don't have enough class rooms or teachers or something. The school building is fairly small and always full of people.

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This is in Seoul.

I've been considering trying to take the jump up test and get into class 3. I've been doing extra study and will soon be approaching the end of the material that we need to know for class 2. However, while I've learned a bunch of new grammar and vocab, because I've been studying it by myself, I haven't really practised using it much. I need to try to work it into my conversations with Japanese people or something. There's no point in memorizing all this grammar and passing a test if I'm not actually better at Japanese at the end of it; I want to be a fluent Japanese speaker, not someone who is good at passing written tests (I guess I would like to be both actually).

Also, one of my friends in my class took the jump-up test a couple of weeks ago and failed. She said that it was really hard and some of the stuff in the test wasn't even the same kind of things that is in the course material, which is strange. My house mate who used to study at the same school said a similar thing; he said they make the jump-up test extra hard and put weird stuff in it. I guess it's extra hassle for them to have people changing classes all the time; and they want to make sure that your level is actually good enough to be in the next class; not just barely good enough to pass a written test.

Still not sure if I'm actually going to take the test or not yet, but I've been doing a lot of extra independent study, which can't be a bad thing (although I guess it might make my classes feel even slower if I already know all the material). The speaking and listening practise in class is still useful too.

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This is also in Seoul.


Korea trip
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Not exactly busy.

In the two week holiday between school terms, I went to Seoul for a few days. I think I mentioned about it in the last blog; the plan was to go with my girlfriend, but she was having doubts because of the whole MERS thing. Personally I wasn't particularly worried about it because every news source said it was contained within some specific hospitals, but my girlfriend didn't agree. I couldn't get a refund on my flight or hotel room so I told her I was going to go anyway; with or without her. I think that helped convince her in the end, and on the day before leaving she decided she would come after all.

I don't want to sound like I'm making light of other people's suffering, but the MERS outbreak turned out to be pretty convenient for us. The majority of tourists had cancelled their flights to Korea, so there were no queues or crowds at any of the popular tourist spots. My friend had been just a few weeks before and been unable to do a few things he wanted to because of ridiculous 2 hour long queues, but we just strolled right up to wherever we wanted to go and didn't have to wait for anything.

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Seoul wasn't that busy, but it wasn't quite the zombie apocalypse that my gf was expecting either.

We also met up with a Korean friend who studied at the same university as my girlfriend and I. We had dinner with her at some really nice hotel that had a big buffet that was really good. There wasn't really any Korean food but they had loads of other good stuff, so I was happy. We ate loads of Korean food on other days anyway so it was fine.

I really like the Korean BBQ style restaurant. I like how you turn up and they load up your table with different types of free kimchi and side dishes before you've even ordered anything. Cooking the food in the middle of the table with your friends is fun too. They have basically the same thing in Japan in Yakiniku restaurants, but I think it's better, and cheaper, in Korea.

Everything is significantly cheaper in Korea than Japan actually. It was nice to be able to travel around and do things and eat in restaurants and still be spending less than I would in a normal day in Japan.

I can sort of just about read hangul; by which I mean I can slowly sound it out if I squint at it for long enough, but I don't really know any Korean except a few basic words and phrases. Since coming to Japan, I'd been feeling like I had no idea what was going on at any point, but going to Korea, that feeling was much stronger, because I really can't speak Korean. When I got back to Kansai airport I was surprised at how relieved I felt to see some Kanji and hear people speaking Japanese.

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The art style in old Korean temples and palaces and stuff is different from the ones in Japan. They also seemed to like green a lot; the guys who painted the Japanese temples seem to prefer red. + Show Spoiler +
Most of the famous buildings in Seoul seem to have a story that reads like "was burned down by the Japanese in the year X, was then captured and demolished by the Japanese again in year Y. Royal family member A was assassinated by Japanese assassins here, before the building was again burned down by the Japanese in year Z." Can kinda understand why they still don't get on with each other so well.


Up until that point I hadn't really noticed my improved Japanese that much, but comparing my complete lack of understanding of anything in Korea, I noticed that I can actually sort of read Japanese and understand what Japanese people are saying some of the time. It felt like coming back home after being abroad, even though I was still on the other side of the world in a foreign country.

The guy at customs in Kansai airport asked me in Japanese "Do you understand Japanese?" I hadn't spoken Japanese in about a week so I sort of panicked and automatically responded in Japanese "No sorry I don't really understand Japanese". He looked at me like I was retarded and then switched to English. Obviously I can understand Japanese since I understood and answered his question.

Anyway, since that, I've felt a lot more comfortable and confident with my Japanese speaking and listening. I realise that although my level is still barely conversational, I have made a lot of progress and I do sort of know what's going on around me some of the time.


Gion Matsuri
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Masturi boys out here pulling a big cart down the street like it's not the middle of a typhoon.

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Don't worry, it's only as tall as a two-storey building and loaded full of people and religious artefacts and stuff. I think if I was participating in this I'd try to get a job as a guy waving a fan around on the front of the cart rather than having to drag the thing through the streets.

Gion Matsuri is one of the most famous festivals in Japan, and takes place over the whole of July in Kyoto. There's basically a lot of different events at various temples and stuff. The main event though is a big parade through the centre of the city where people pull these enormous wooden carts around. To be honest I don't really know much about it, but it all looked pretty cool. I'm sure you can find more out about it if you google it. I might do when I have time.

In the days leading up to the parade, they close some of the main streets in central kyoto. They build these massive wooden carts up in the middle of the streets, and there's also a big night market. It was pretty fun to wander around with my friends, although I didn't buy anything.

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Walking down the middle of Shijo-dori in a horde of people. It's usually full of traffic. Most of my photos of the night market are complete bullshit; I haven't really got the hang of taking photos at night I guess. Also my camera went on some mad ting and started putting random filters on everything; I'm not sure what setting I changed.

Unfortunately, around this time of year is also typhoon season, and this year the main parade coincided with a typhoon. Me and my classmates still went down to have a look. They continued on with the parade despite the strong winds and heavy rain. It was interesting, but very slow and went on for hours. I was standing in the middle of a typhoon (still in shorts and tshirt because it was too hot) for like 3 or 4 hours watching the parade crawl by. They'd wrapped most of the stuff up in plastic to protect it from the rain. It looked a bit funny; like they'd just bought all these ancient artefacts from Ikea or something, and were carrying it home.

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The procession got held up by one of the big wagons struggling to turn a corner, so these guys just busted out the folding chairs and had a rest in the middle of the parade.

After the parade, I kinda forgot that it was still Gion Matsuri for a couple more weeks. I was walking to the supermarket a few days ago and then a big parade of people in some kind of traditional clothing marched past me. On the way home there was a dude on a horse hanging outside a ramen shop. My friend posted a picture on facebook of a guy dressed in samurai armour sitting on top of a big horse outside of a Karaoke bar. I also saw a random side street was closed off and there was a small crowd of people so I went to see what was going on. When I got closer I saw they were building one of those big cart things, and it had a big tree installed on the top of it. I quite like that I have no idea what it's all about, it makes stumbling across stuff like this more entertaining.

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This one was shaped like a pirate ship for some reason.


Teaching English
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Nara.

I've managed to find 3 regular students through a site that matches teachers with students. I only teach each of them for 1 hour a week, so it barely even counts as a part time job at this point, but it's nice to be making a little bit of money anyway. The first two that I met both have pretty good levels of English, so the classes mostly revolve around conversation with me correcting their grammar and teaching them new vocabulary and stuff.

The first student speaks reasonably good conversational English, but he said he wants to learn more formal English and some phrases for travelling. He'd already bought a travel phrase book, so we've been working through that. We read through the conversations in the book and I correct his pronunciation and stuff. I also answer his questions or explain additional things that I think need explaining.

The second is a university student. Her mum came with her to the first lesson, I guess to make sure that I wasn't some creepy gaijin, which is fair enough. The mother seemed even more enthusiastic about it than her daughter did. She kept asking me questions and talking over or interrupting her daughter. It seemed a bit like she was pressuring her daughter into studying more, but the daughter does appear to be quite well organised and motivated too.

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Seoul

Anyway, her written English is very good; she writes various paragraphs and stuff that she translates from Japanese, and I correct the grammar. Her spoken English is a bit shaky, although not bad, so I'm trying to put more emphasis on conversation than written grammar stuff. Sometimes she gives me a text of some kind. We both read it and then I explain bits that she didn't understand, and then I ask her questions about different parts of it to make sure she understood. She doesn't like being asked the "What do you think about X?" questions, which I've heard from other English teachers and Japanese people is common among Japanese students. They aren't used to being asked their opinions on things, so don't really know what to say.

The third student contacted by email in Japanese; but so did the first guy, so I wasn't too worried. I asked her what level her English is, and, like all Japanese people, she basically said "I'm a completely beginner, I have no skill whatsoever and I am ashamed of myself". Usually when people say this, they're just being unnecessarily modest, and they actually speak at least conversational English. This lady wasn't exaggerating that much though . When I met her I tried asking her a few basic questions in English but she just looked at me like I was speaking Russian or something so I had to switch back to Japanese.

It turns out that she has a reasonable grasp of written English, but not much listening comprehension. This seems to be a common feature of Japanese people too; they only study written English in school. So anyway, I had to teach her English in Japanese, which was quite a challenge for me. The format I've adopted with her is to give her some kind of role-play situation in Japanese, and try to get her to say something in English. Then I correct her grammar and we sort of build a conversation.

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Abunai!

So for example I say in Japanese "You're in a restaurant and you want to order a steak, what do you say in English?" and she will say something that's almost right and then I'll correct it and write the sentence down. Then I'll come up with another line in the roleplay situation and she'll have to respond to that, like asking "How would you like your steak cooked?". Once we've built a conversation we go through it again and she asks me some questions about bits she doesn't understand.


Cycling to Nara
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The people of Nara.

As well as visiting Korea in my 2 week holiday, I also did a few bike rides. The biggest adventure was cycling from Kyoto to Nara. Nara is about 40km from Kyoto so it took me like 3 or 4 hours to get there. It was almost completely flat, but I got lost a few times so it took longer than it might have otherwise.

I left in the morning, but by the time I got there it was already the afternoon. I took a look around one of the main tourist spots in Nara which is a park with some temples and a bunch of wild deer that wander around. The deer are pretty friendly, although one baby one was crying to its mum because it got stuck on a ledge or something, and since I was the nearest person, its mum came running over and glared at me like it was my fault somehow. It's not my fault you can't keep track of your kids, lady. The main temple there has this massive buddha statue in it. I'd seen photos of it before but when I got in there it was pretty amazing.

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There was a spare hand for the big buddha statue round the back.

After looking around there for a couple of hours I realised it was already mid-afternoon and I was going to have to leave soon if I wanted to get home before dark. About 10km into my return journey, it started pouring with rain. It didn't ease off at any point, so I did about 30km in the rain. Also I got lost at one point and cycled into Uji rather than Kyoto, which cost me an extra 30 minutes or so.

When I finally got home I got in the shower and found that I had somehow got seriously sunburned. I'm too white to live in this country; even when it's raining I get sunburned. I've got some pretty strong tan-lines on my arms and legs now; I roll up my sleeves and show them to people to start conversations sometimes.

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This statue made me really uncomfortable for some reason.


Money and future and other things
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A rainy day in Arashiyama.

My friends who I usually go to summer music festivals with went to Metaldays in Slovenia this week. I'm really jealous because I love that place, but Japan is cool too I guess. I've been feeling a real lack of metal recently. At least yesterday I got a chance to go to a BBQ and get drunk during the day, but it's not quite the same without the loud music and temporary suspension of personal hygiene.

I think in my last blog I complained about not having enough money a lot. In the end I had to take some more money from my parents. I wanted to avoid having to since they had already given me money before coming, but I hadn't managed to find much proper work, so it was either that or go back to the UK early. I guess I should focus on feeling grateful that they are able to help me than feeling bad for taking their money. I've been feeling less stressed out since, which is nice, I think I should have enough to at least pay the rent for the next couple of months anyway.

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Todaiji in Nara.

After my next term finishes, I won't be able to continue studying at the school. Ideally I'd like to stay in Japan, but that most likely depends on me being able to find a job and a work visa. My girlfriend has got a good new job in Tokyo, so I'll try to go there if I can. I've been looking at software developer jobs, but most of them seem to want someone with 'business level' Japanese (usually JLPT N2+; I could probably only pass N4 at this point; maybe N3 in a few months time, but certaintly not N2 level).

This is making it look increasingly like my best option is to get a full time English teaching job with a company that can sponsor my work visa. I don't hate this idea, but it's not really my first choice either. If I'm going to be teaching English, I'd rather be doing more of the one-to-one private tutoring style thing that I've been doing recently, rather than standing in front of a class of school children, but I guess I'll take what I can get.

Being in a long distance relationship isn't great, but we seem to be doing OK, at least as far as I can tell. If I can make it to Tokyo, or at least the Kanto area, I think it'll be a lot better for us though. If I have to go back to the UK it'll probably suck. 頑張っている as always.


***
www.teamyao.com @TeamYAO
c3rberUs
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Japan11286 Posts
July 26 2015 13:03 GMT
#2
I don't know how I'll comment on the other parts because what the fuck...
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WriterMovie, 진영화 : "StarCraft will never die".
coverpunch
Profile Joined December 2011
United States2093 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-07-26 13:32:24
July 26 2015 13:30 GMT
#3
I went to a Japanese school through class 8 so I can say a little from my own experience. The jump-up test is usually made to be basically impossible because you have to prove you're not only good enough to know everything they will teach you in class 2 but usually knee deep into class 3 just to be sure you can keep pace. Japanese teachers generally do not jump students by merit because it means their initial assessment was fundamentally wrong and they'd rather let you suffer or even quit than admit that. Jumping is reserved for students with special situations. From what I saw, it was usually Chinese people who were already fluent in Japanese but gaming the education visa and putting up with the slow pace to stay longer. They get jumped when they find a need to accelerate, like they get into a university that can carry the visa but requires a school certificate saying they're fluent.

In Japanese style though, you can end-run the rules if you get backing, in this case by passing a JLPT exam. Assuming your school is roughly the same as mine (Minna no Nihongo for class 1 and 2, J-Bridge for 3, J301 for 4/5, J501 for 5/6), the level is basically class 2 to pass JLPT 5, class 4 to pass JLPT 4, class 6 to pass JLPT 3, class 7-9 to pass JLPT 2, and you need shitloads of self-study instead of or or on top of school to pass JLPT 1...or Chinese literacy. So in your case, if you passed JLPT 4, they'd probably let you jump no matter how you did on the jump up test. There's a funny thing if you flirt with the idea of Japanese grad school that a Japanese professor's blessing is an instant pass over any paperwork and bureaucratic hurdles. You are "required" to take an entrance exam in your subject, which you will fail because Japanese schools do not prepare you in any way to pass a Japanese standardized test in a technical field (one that most native speakers fail straight up, by the way), but I know people who literally turned in the test with only their name misspelled in katakana and declared a "pass".

I will say that I'm fundamentally opposed to jumping and I would advise you strongly against it. The Japanese curriculum is very methodical and skipping a big portion of it will leave you very lost for a long time and it will be abusive to yourself to suddenly find yourself going from 90s to low 70s and likely in danger of failing class 3 and and class 4. You can start being more impatient if you're consistently averaging above 95 in your scores, but otherwise you should realize that the Japanese system is logarithmic. It's a system where it is easy to feel like you're doing okay and get scores between 70-90, which is the desired pace of learning, but it becomes quite a lot more difficult to consistently score above 90 and incredibly difficult to score above 95, much less to get perfect marks.

You should apply for developer jobs regardless of their language requirement. It's mostly a screen for people who are willing to learn and tolerate Japanese habits and sometimes a soft form of discrimination, usually against other Asians. I will note that actual programming will always be in English and you will not learn the proper words from your school. In contrast to the clear and polite way you learn to speak in school, normal Japanese people mumble a lot and use imprecise and inconsistent grammatical structures. This is much more so if you go to dinner and they talk to you while drunk. But since you seem to be desperate for money, you should just try and ideally force them to say no explicitly and to your face. One of the really nice things about Japan is if you try hard enough, someone will find work for you (whether you will like it or whether it is a good career move are considered irrelevant questions). You could send your resume to a recruiter or temp agency - they can open doors faster for you or keep you afloat until you figure out a better option.

If you REALLY like Japan and want to stay, you could go to senmon gakko or Japanese grad school. Those are ugly options in terms of income, since they could end up actually costing you money, but it does jam your foot in the door and signals your determination to stay, which will make it much more likely a Japanese company will sponsor your work visa.
coverpunch
Profile Joined December 2011
United States2093 Posts
July 26 2015 13:48 GMT
#4
I will also point out that some of the other students are probably book learners, meaning they can't read katakana because they only studied Japanese from books and usually only vocabulary and kanji. These are the kinds of people who are primed to pass the JLPT early on, since it requires no written or spoken ability and only tests comprehension, which means there's a premium on knowing vocabulary and kanji because the test philosophy is that anyone who knows such words is probably pretty fluent (to be fair, American standardized tests have the same problem). But they're not actually good at Japanese and they won't get good marks in school, although they'll know complicated kanji or advanced vocabulary at strange times.
mooose
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Japan200 Posts
July 26 2015 14:07 GMT
#5
Thanks for the help again.

I've been hesitating about taking the jump up test because if I passed then I would go from being in a comfortable position to being suddenly really far behind and having skipped a lot of practise on various grammar that I only just learned to pass the test rather than having had it drilled into my long term memory. One girl from my class did jump up to class 3, but she's from Taiwan and apparently she's married to a Japanese guy or something.

The next JLPT test is in December so it would be way to late to allow me to skip a class, but that's interesting information anyway. At the moment I usually get between 98 - 100% in all of the homework and assessments, occasionally below 95% but never below 90%. I just try to challenge myself to get 100% every time to make it interesting. Also I learn to write extra kanji that we haven't studied yet. If I do my homework and there were a few words that I could only write the hiragana for then I look the kanji up and practise writing them a bunch of times so that next time I can write them properly. I think I'm way ahead of all the non Chinese speakers in my class in terms of kanji.

Maybe I should be focusing more on my speaking though, I'm not planning to go to Japanese university or anything so being able to write 1000s of Kanji probably won't be much use, except in terms of helping me remember them. I already have an MSc already so graduate school wouldn't make much sense. I guess I could sign up for a PhD or something lol.

I found a few recruitment agencies when I was looking at the jobs posted on Gaijinpot; maybe I'll send them my CV. I'm not really sure how long the process takes in Japan (Japan seems to like paperwork so maybe a long time), but I can't really leave Kyoto for another few months and I'll be looking for jobs in the Tokyo area, so it'll be a bit awkward to go to interviews and stuff. And I'm not really sure when to start applying; I guess now.

I'd like to stay here for a while, but honestly I don't think I could do the salaryman life. My girlfriend and I have a vaguely agreed on plan to stay in Japan for a year or two then go somewhere else. She wants to work outside of Japan but struggles to get a work visa because of a lack of experience in her field. She's just got this good new job, so maybe in a couple of years time she'll be a more attractive candidate to foreign companies; assuming she doesn't get sucked into this company forever.

I don't really have any particular plan or aspirations at the moment. I like programming and that's what I'm sort of trained to do, and I'd rather be here than London so I suppose I better start sending out the applications.
www.teamyao.com @TeamYAO
mooose
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Japan200 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-07-26 14:12:01
July 26 2015 14:10 GMT
#6
On July 26 2015 22:48 coverpunch wrote:
I will also point out that some of the other students are probably book learners, meaning they can't read katakana because they only studied Japanese from books and usually only vocabulary and kanji. These are the kinds of people who are primed to pass the JLPT early on, since it requires no written or spoken ability and only tests comprehension, which means there's a premium on knowing vocabulary and kanji because the test philosophy is that anyone who knows such words is probably pretty fluent (to be fair, American standardized tests have the same problem). But they're not actually good at Japanese and they won't get good marks in school, although they'll know complicated kanji or advanced vocabulary at strange times.


I think that might be true for a few of the Taiwanese people in my class. But I think some of the European guys don't care about studying at all. They miss classes regularly and don't seem to know what's going on when they are there. Anyone who was in class 1 should have no problem reading Katakana because we spent a couple of weeks doing it every day a the start of class 1. All I can guess is that they don't do any practise outside of class so forgot it.
www.teamyao.com @TeamYAO
Souma
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
2nd Worst City in CA8938 Posts
July 26 2015 21:50 GMT
#7
What is the story behind that... piece of featured... art? T_T
Writer
mooose
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Japan200 Posts
July 26 2015 23:27 GMT
#8
No idea. It's just outside of GyeongBokGung I think. I guess The Human Centipede was pretty big over in South Korea or something.
www.teamyao.com @TeamYAO
FFGenerations
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
7088 Posts
July 27 2015 00:33 GMT
#9
nice man well done to you about getting clients
how about getting some more?
i dont know what money or lifestyle you want to aim for but don't you reckon you could become self sufficient taking on more clients? usually when you google about teaching english in japan , everyone says the dream is to go private (if you can get away with it)
i mean the aim would be being able to take multi-person "business" classes right?
if you wanna study japanese for longer before switching to a computer career it wouldnt be bad, even if you wont be self sufficient enough to stay in that school.

i literally just graduated uni myself (dunno what grade yet, either Without Honors or 2-2). im gonna take the next few weeks to do some sort of programming project to up my ability and put on my cv then apply for jobs myself.

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mooose
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Japan200 Posts
July 27 2015 01:40 GMT
#10
Congratulations!

Being able to be self-sufficient as a private English teacher would be nice I guess, but I would need a lot more students. Also since I'm planning to move from Kyoto to Tokyo, I'm going to lose all of my current students. It's been about a month and I still only have 3. I could definitely be putting in more effort to recruit a few more, but I still think it would take a few months to get enough students to be able make it a full time job. The other main problem is that there would be no one to sponsor my work visa if I was doing private lessons. This means I'd probably need a student visa again; which would limit my legal working hours and add extra fees in terms of tuition. Working for a larger company has the advantages of guaranteed hours and a work visa.

I'd like to keep studying Japanese too but I'll need to earn some more money first.
www.teamyao.com @TeamYAO
Ilikestarcraft
Profile Blog Joined November 2004
Korea (South)17726 Posts
July 27 2015 01:57 GMT
#11
On July 27 2015 06:50 Souma wrote:
What is the story behind that... piece of featured... art? T_T

Its a korean game called malttukbakgi (말뚝박기).
"Nana is a goddess. Or at very least, Nana is my goddess." - KazeHydra
mooose
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Japan200 Posts
July 27 2015 02:28 GMT
#12
Lol the last guy

www.teamyao.com @TeamYAO
Souma
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
2nd Worst City in CA8938 Posts
July 27 2015 02:35 GMT
#13
On July 27 2015 10:57 Ilikestarcraft wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 27 2015 06:50 Souma wrote:
What is the story behind that... piece of featured... art? T_T

Its a korean game called malttukbakgi (말뚝박기).

Your people are weird.

Let's play.
Writer
TameNaken
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
Australia361 Posts
July 27 2015 02:37 GMT
#14
On July 27 2015 06:50 Souma wrote:
What is the story behind that... piece of featured... art? T_T


There's a Korean game where the kids take that position. Then some other kids will jump on their backs to try and tbreak the train, the kids keep on jumping on until someone falls, the team that can handle the most people on their back wins.
Ilikestarcraft
Profile Blog Joined November 2004
Korea (South)17726 Posts
July 27 2015 05:14 GMT
#15
On July 27 2015 11:35 Souma wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 27 2015 10:57 Ilikestarcraft wrote:
On July 27 2015 06:50 Souma wrote:
What is the story behind that... piece of featured... art? T_T

Its a korean game called malttukbakgi (말뚝박기).

Your people are weird.

Let's play.

I would probably kill my back if I tried that now lol
"Nana is a goddess. Or at very least, Nana is my goddess." - KazeHydra
solidusx3
Profile Joined March 2011
United States12 Posts
July 27 2015 07:07 GMT
#16
Getting into a Japanese company full-time would do wonders for your language skills, but standard new-grad pay is extremely low compared to western standards. I did computer science and upon graduating I considered joining a Japanese company which was offering a standard 250,000 / month + bonuses. I almost accepted because I really wanted to get back to Japan as soon as possible, but I ended up staying in the US and earning more than twice that. It is a big company, so a few years later I found an internal position in the Tokyo branch and moved laterally, essentially keeping the same salary.

Japanese companies still tend to give promotions based upon seniority and not so much on performance. If you plan on being here for the rest of your life, then maybe that is OK, but also expect to work longer hours on average than a western company in Japan.

At my company's Japan branch the 1000+ staff is 90%+ Japanese, and while everyone is expected to have a decent level of English because it's a western company, essentially all of my work is conducted in Japanese. This may vary from company to company, but don't think that joining a western company here would hinder your Japanese skills at all.

If you're only looking into part-time work then maybe most of this doesn't apply, but once you make the move to full time I would strongly recommend a non-Japanese company.
coverpunch
Profile Joined December 2011
United States2093 Posts
July 27 2015 11:35 GMT
#17
On July 27 2015 16:07 solidusx3 wrote:
Getting into a Japanese company full-time would do wonders for your language skills, but standard new-grad pay is extremely low compared to western standards. I did computer science and upon graduating I considered joining a Japanese company which was offering a standard 250,000 / month + bonuses. I almost accepted because I really wanted to get back to Japan as soon as possible, but I ended up staying in the US and earning more than twice that. It is a big company, so a few years later I found an internal position in the Tokyo branch and moved laterally, essentially keeping the same salary.

Japanese companies still tend to give promotions based upon seniority and not so much on performance. If you plan on being here for the rest of your life, then maybe that is OK, but also expect to work longer hours on average than a western company in Japan.

At my company's Japan branch the 1000+ staff is 90%+ Japanese, and while everyone is expected to have a decent level of English because it's a western company, essentially all of my work is conducted in Japanese. This may vary from company to company, but don't think that joining a western company here would hinder your Japanese skills at all.

If you're only looking into part-time work then maybe most of this doesn't apply, but once you make the move to full time I would strongly recommend a non-Japanese company.

I would nuance this because simply saying "foreign > Japanese" is too simplistic because of the variation within Japan.

The top of the food chain are the foreign multinationals because they have easily recognizable names. Google, Microsoft, Goldman Sachs, etc. They offer globally competitive jobs for globally competitive pay, which enhances the prestige and their reputation for taking the most talented people anywhere in the world.

Next are the big Japanese keiretsu, starting from the major banks (Mizuho, Mitsubishi UFJ, Sumitomo Mitsui, etc.), going to the globally famous brands (Toyota, Honda, Toshiba, Sony, etc.), going to the famous domestic brands (Suntory, TEPCO, rail companies, etc.), and going to their less known subsidiaries.

In the middle are domestic Japanese companies depending on size, starting with big ones like Recruit or Softbank and going down to very small ones.

At the bottom is self-employment, physical labor, and unskilled jobs.

Note that money isn't really a big deal in Japan. It's a log curve where it's fairly easy to have a pretty decent life but nearly impossible to break out of ordinariness. Hence you might teach English full-time and not have a much lower income than someone working at Toyota, but you don't walk around with the same pride. But that is a nice way of saying Japanese pay is much lower than the equivalent position's pay in the West, especially the United States. To be fair, I don't think programmers get paid anywhere in the world as well as they do in the US.

Within these companies, the most prestige comes in "corporate strategy" or "planning" departments, which is slightly different from management and in Japan, more focused on guiding the business (as opposed to improving operations). Next would be hardware departments and classical engineering, along with designers. Japanese people basically neglect what they think are "support jobs" - accounting, IT, even legal. Those don't involve sexy work and thus are considered mediocre work for mediocre people. Software tends to fall into this category and programmers are given more code monkey jobs than tasked with putting pieces together for new technology like they would in a place like Silicon Valley.

You really want to avoid interacting with any admin departments, which will be difficult because Japanese companies tend to overpopulate their bureaucratic departments even as they are neglected professionally. It's a holdover habit from the late Meiji period to give samurai jobs with a false sense of power when they would refuse to take orders from commoners. You really want to be near engineering or planning departments, where the real movement is occurring within a company.
BigFan
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
TLADT24920 Posts
July 29 2015 22:43 GMT
#18
Thanks for the blog, very educational ^^ A little typo: Nara is about 40km from Nara. Best of luck!

On July 27 2015 11:28 mooose wrote:
Lol the last guy

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E_cmBLKyCf8

lol what's going on? This is soo weird T.T
Former BW EiC"Watch Bakemonogatari or I will kill you." -Toad, April 18th, 2017
mooose
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Japan200 Posts
July 30 2015 00:57 GMT
#19
Ah thanks; fixed. It's 40km from Kyoto, not itself.

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