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On March 12 2014 22:29 Hds wrote:FUCK THIS FLUFF go fucking lead this team, there is nothing to lose now, there was a time I was watching every Liquid games because of GOOD games, I didn't even know about anyone of you, nothing, but then I made my homeworks, and I even more appreciated you all. Now I find myself laughing at Liquid's match, I shouldn't, but that's how I feel when I watch your games, last throw at the Monster's drove me crazy against EG. Something needs to change, I want to be proud of TL, I want to be proud of my TL pennant, I want Tl to makes me fall in love with you again #nohomo, please, deserve your TI invitation, FLUFF, Bulba, Way2sexy, Qoqjva, and TC, I want to believe in you like I did, like less than a year ago. Show nested quote +On March 12 2014 21:58 SiZ.FaNtAsY wrote:
This is attention-whoring at its finest. Really? So he should shut his mouth and let TL stuck in the shit they are? 5 months until TI4, you can do it
I don't think Fluff is the leader material he wants to be. Plus he seems to place too much importance on drafts and "leadership" and not enough on the actual hard parts of the game, like training teamwork, game sense, tactical thinking. None of those appear magically just because you have a strong leader. I do not think Liquid has anyone that can fill the leadership role. Either they will manage to train the hard skills without a strong leader (as many teams seem to do) and resolve their internal issues or they will need to get someone who has those skills or they can acknowledge that the team is just not working.
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I don't follow the Dota scene, like at all, but that was a very insightful read. Thank you for posting this.
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On March 12 2014 22:10 CruelZeratul wrote:
What I absolutely don't get is this drafting thin. I would think that chosing a drafter is a pure formality and that the 5 guys in TS talk every decision through until they find a solution. I find it very strange that just one person does his own thing and the others have to stfu.
You are time-constrained in a draft. If the drafter is trying to think and the 4 others are shouting different suggestions at him it becomes really hard to keep the overall picture. One 'main' drafter and a second guy who pays attention and is able to offer suggestions seems like a good method to me. Of course it requires excellent knowledge of the 3 other players but that should not be a problem.
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On March 12 2014 22:29 Hds wrote:FUCK THIS FLUFF go fucking lead this team, there is nothing to lose now, there was a time I was watching every Liquid games because of GOOD games, I didn't even know about anyone of you, nothing, but then I made my homeworks, and I even more appreciated you all. Now I find myself laughing at Liquid's match, I shouldn't, but that's how I feel when I watch your games, last throw at the Monster's drove me crazy against EG. Something needs to change, I want to be proud of TL, I want to be proud of my TL pennant, I want Tl to makes me fall in love with you again #nohomo, please, deserve your TI invitation, FLUFF, Bulba, Way2sexy, Qoqjva, and TC, I want to believe in you like I did, like less than a year ago. Show nested quote +On March 12 2014 21:58 SiZ.FaNtAsY wrote:
This is attention-whoring at its finest. Really? So he should shut his mouth and let TL stuck in the shit they are? 5 months until TI4, you can do it
He should say it to his team and only his team. I see no benefit and see this as detrimental to the team making this public.
Edit: Might as well kick Fluff and add 1437 to Liquid. You can see from Behind the Horse TC was never comfortable being the leader cause of Fluff always wanting to dictate stuff. I'd rather have 1437 play the 4 role and have TC properly captain for the first time.
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On March 12 2014 22:40 joker101 wrote:Needed to be reposted: "Blog basically says: - I should of been leader, not you, this is why we lose. - Team doesn't like me  . I have good ideas but I am too quiet to speak up. I should be leader doe. - Whinge, teenage angstiness - Team shouldn't get an invite to TI (LOL). Thanks sponsors for your commitment! - I write 9000 words bios on why I should be captain. THIS DISPLAYS GOOD LEADERSHIP. I'm unable to position myself correctly within a small team to lead them to victory doe. - I don't have respect of my team, but I should be leader. - Whinge whinge whinge - Team doesn't communicate properly, but I think I can fix it by being the leader. I'll do this through my astounding communications skills. Introverts make the best leaders. - To show my amazing leadership skills, I'll write a blog and air the whole teams dirty laundry instead of discussing it in meeting. This will inspire confidence and grow trust/friendships within the team. - Veiled threats to leave if it doesn't get fixed. - Significant round-a-bout delegation of blame. - Admits to basically throwing in tournaments and wanting to lose. THAT WILL HELP THE TEAM. But, I am trying to help them bros. Let's endure losses during tournaments, that will teach you a lesson and help us grow. - More whinging. Kid I don't even think you could manage the counter at McDonalds. Leadership is for the strong willed, not introverted little boys who write tumblr-esk diatribe on their teams official page. How embarrassing." Well then.
Vouch. This whole thing rubs me the wrong way. Time for a major shift at Liquid DotA.
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intrigue
Washington, D.C9934 Posts
can you imagine a leader you'd respect posting something like this publicly?
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there may be different ways of leadership, but all In know is this: A Leader will lead and show his leadership publicly.
Good Luck solving your issues.
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Good luck Fluff, but I don't think you can do it. You keep writing, and that's simply not enough. I don't think the problem is with the team, I think it's mainly with you. Yes, you are taking some of the blame with you, but I think you need to take a step back and look objectively at what you bring to the team. I can't tell you, cause I don't know everything that's going on, but it sounds like you'll realize, that it's not a lot.
The world has never been about what you can do, it's about what you do. I'm not gonna put my faith in your leadership, because I simply don't think you'll change. But I hope you do.
Good luck with everything.
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On March 12 2014 23:00 intrigue wrote:
can you imagine a leader you'd respect posting something like this publicly?
my thoughts also.
this catharsis will probably be the saving grace or the end for current liquid team.
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On March 12 2014 22:34 Kabras wrote:
Liquid has bigger and more obvious problems than who's drafting, who's the leader and other stuff that doesn't show on the big screen. Fix your coordination and most importantly land your goddamn spells, then worry about deeper shit. it's really embarrassing (or should be at least) to write a huge wall of text about everything but individual play when you miss 3 arrows with a disruption setup in the span of a few minutes. that's just an example, someone screws up easy shit every game. Wake the hell up, right now Bulba and Qojqva are the only players on Liquid that can compete with euro and chinese players.
While that is a valid concern you have to take into account that a team's atmosphere and people personal issues affect their play. I can imagine it being hard to play to your full potential when you feel constant pressure and helplessness. I'm much like Fluff in terms of being introverted yet competetive, striving for the best, constant self-consciousness and thought. I have a hard time handling my parents' expectations, let alone having to hold TL's banners in a super competetive (judgmental) environment AND one's own relentless expectation.
I'd really love to see an actual team. Despite Liquid having a teddybear status in esports, with the nature of online gaming and the people it attracts, even their family isn't that much of a team. Being physically remote from another makes it really hard to bond and online culture isn't very well suited to sharing actual thoughts. When there's no cohestion or common purpose there's too much room for small annoyances to grow and interfere with the simplest of things.
Whenever a new team is formed the members should really be thrown out in the forest together for a week to figure it out themselves. As it is though, I believe there's no ways to fund such a thing besides donations, which creates unwanted pressure.
@Fluff
I think there's much to be positive about, it's impressive you'd care so much that you write such a vulnerable piece. That non-bullshit modus is very key to getting what you want I think.
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Brunei Darussalam566 Posts
On March 12 2014 23:04 zul wrote:
there may be different ways of leadership, but all In know is this: A Leader will lead and show his leadership publicly.
Good Luck solving your issues.
Do you think this blog post is an acceptable way of "showing" his leadership publicly?
It accomplishes nothing aside from exposing an already fragilized team structure. In professional sports, players and staff have been benched, suspended or even outright fired for public statements much less incendiary in tone. A blog post such as this should only have been made after the fact, i.e., exposing the problem and the solution after it has been dealt with internally.
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I can't imagine any organization would keep a person with your mindset on the roster, and it's even more unimaginable that you expect teammates to follow you after posting some of the shit you've posted here.
Negativity and apprehension will kill every hope and dream you have ever had and unfortunately every word you wrote here sounds like you have been negative and hesitant from day 1.
Winners don't go into tournaments hoping to learn and grow. They don't "expect to fail" or "want to fail" when shit goes south.
If you don't want to be labeled as emo I suggest you go back and read what you've posted here and give us a reason to think otherwise. This post is absolutely ridiculous and it honestly sounds like the problem right from the beginning has been you.
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On March 12 2014 23:00 intrigue wrote:
can you imagine a leader you'd respect posting something like this publicly?
Yeah, pretty absurd in my eyes. Should have been discussed with team and management. Certainly not in this format.
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No offense, but after reading it I had to find out how old Liquid Fluff is. I feel sorry that he isn't feeling well, but this blog is incredibly immature and childish.
I don't want to judge, but I feel like Fluff doesn't have the slightest idea about how real life with a team oriented job works. All I see in this blog post is some sort of emo self pity, "I am a great leader but no one understands me....".
From the blog ; "I'm a strong person, but I'm also someone who demands respect and trust".
There lies the problem, in real life you never demand respect and trust, you fucking EARN IT.
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To me it seems like you dont deserve to be the leader, you can't force people to trust you and if they don't, there's a reason for it.
The parts that annoy me the most are the fact that you interfered with TC's draft when the team become better just to satisfy your ego, which led to poorer results. That's not what a so-called leader do, a true leader wants and does what's best for his team, not satisfying his own needs before his mates.
Bye Fluff, i don't think you deserve the TL tag anymore.
ps : sorry for poor english, im french :^p
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On March 12 2014 23:20 Darpa wrote:Show nested quote +On March 12 2014 23:00 intrigue wrote:
can you imagine a leader you'd respect posting something like this publicly? Yeah, pretty absurd in my eyes. Should have been discussed with team and management. Certainly not in this format.
Why? That's such political bullshit, I'm glad to know there's actual people on Liquid.
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YES! Fluff I am not on your team and you don't know me but this is great and I hope that Liquid falls under your leadership and starts playing like a team and friends. You guys can do it and I will always root for you!
Here's to hope!
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I think TL is quite good individually, bot most of the games, you just fail drafting. With such quality players, you should just not get outdrafted every single game.
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On March 12 2014 23:21 ArhK wrote:
No offense, but after reading it I had to find out how old Liquid Fluff is. I feel sorry that he isn't feeling well, but this blog is incredibly immature and childish.
I don't want to judge, but I feel like Fluff doesn't have the slightest idea about how real life with a team oriented job works. All I see in this blog post is some sort of emo self pity, "I am a great leader but no one understands me....".
From the blog ; "I'm a strong person, but I'm also someone who demands respect and trust".
There lies the problem, in real life you never demand respect and trust, you fucking EARN IT.
And as the captain of the amazing Fire as well as a fantastic support during TI3 he hasnt I suppose?
Anyway this is obviously a vent/rant intentionally made public so thr team can wake up and either boot fluff or make drastic changes. I grt the impression he'd be fine with either.
To those who say leadership and drafting arent important, I'd like to submit that even when NaVis individual skill fails during some tournaments it's Puppey's leadership and drafting that get them through (Im not ignorant of the individual skill on NaVi but sometimes theyre too throw-y).
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United States33584 Posts
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EPT
