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On October 21 2013 21:41 graNite wrote:
I tried to give you another idea last time, maybe you over read it. Please respond this time :p
Screen space is always a big problem for overlays.
My suggestion: put semi-relevant information into a ticker. I dont need to know the mapname, scorecount, eventname, stage of the tournament, wins needed etc all the time. all these things could appear in one single box.
There is actually no way to animate that type of thing easily in the editor. Possibly there is a ticker option somewhere but it would drastically limit your control over the information you display. You could however have information fade in and out, replacing the information before it for a time. It is an interesting idea.
On October 21 2013 22:52 bisl wrote:
Hi GameHeart!
There was a thread floating around recently that suggesting differentiating unit effects that could get confusing in mirror matchups--specifically things like guardian shields, force fields, time warps, and fungals (and probably blinding clouds too to be honest). These seem like particularly appropriate subject matter for the STC module. Is this possible, and are effects for unit abilities any different from an implementation standpoint from buildings and units? Would this be significant/excessive scope creep?
Thanks for the great update by the way!
I did see that thread. I like the idea but I do not know if it would be possible to do it in a way that the players themselves do not see it. And anything that changes the game for players I am not a particularly huge fan of. I will attempt to create a working sample of this anyways and hopefully some players and a caster will cast a game on it so we can all get a feeling for it and whether we actually like it. But as I said I do not see a way to do it in a way that the game would look normal to the players at this time.
On October 22 2013 02:11 Darkdwarf wrote:
Concerning sponsor logos, I think one way could be to do them instead of the decals floating around the nexi, and keep the team logo out on the map, like before. That would kind of catch two flies in one smash, as it would remove an unnecessary visual already in place.
Decals around the nexus like that are not easy to do in this way. When Pro League first did their logos in this fashion a lot of people came to me and said "You should make your logos look like that!" But they did not understand that Pro League only had to manage 8 teams, so creating/retrieving special versions of each logo from the teams was not an issue. For me I have over 170 teams and it keeps growing. And at least early on in this project I considered myself pretty lucky when a team would return my email, and that was if I could even find an email for them.
I will likely ask Zolden to remove the ground decals from the nexus/hatchery/lair/hive/command center/orbital command/planetary fortress at some point anyways so that they are not competing with any other logos we choose to put in there. But I don't think I can create specialized versions of the sponsor logos that will work as that type of decal.
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Can the sponsor logo be animated to cycle through?
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On October 22 2013 02:32 dvorakftw wrote:
Can the sponsor logo be animated to cycle through?
We could switch between two or more logos periodically yes.
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On stronger team colors:
I always find the stronger team colors to be useful on certain units (mainly zergs), but rather unnecessary for other races. Take the "stronger" colossus for example, it looks a bit too strong for my taste.
Buildings also do not really require stronger colors. I know whose building is whose - stronger color usually just mean I will be seeing excessive blue/red....
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United Kingdom1381 Posts
Here's a bug report found while testing the GHTesting custom game.
When the 'STC - Observer' mode is spectated, the inital Command Centre doesn't have stronger colours (shown below). However the first Barracks built did show the correct colours, so maybe the error is only for objects created at the beginning of the game?
+ Show Spoiler +
+ Show Spoiler +
Replays:
STC - Observers
STC - Everyone
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On October 22 2013 03:25 Hikari wrote:
On stronger team colors:
I always find the stronger team colors to be useful on certain units (mainly zergs), but rather unnecessary for other races. Take the "stronger" colossus for example, it looks a bit too strong for my taste.
Buildings also do not really require stronger colors. I know whose building is whose - stronger color usually just mean I will be seeing excessive blue/red....
Agreed on the buildings and colli. If I understand it correctly, it would be something that can be switched on-off on the fly. This would mean that for a roach-vs-roach w/ fungal and infested terran (worst case scenario) battle, strong colours can be activated, and after that can be switched-off. The casters can even mention that, if necessary.
For buildings it is indeed over the top, I know who's hatchery is who's, and I haven't seen that many spine v spine battles.
I think it is mainly useful in ZvZ, in PvP and TvT I can easily see who's stalker/marine is who's...
Coloured fungals (in ZvZ), scans and timewarps would be awesome and a very good addition.
Keep up the good work, love the updates!
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Nice writeup.
On the sponsor logo's, maybe there's a way to copy the Dota2 method? They use ingame banner doodads with the teamsponsors on it, like this:
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/EWUMU.jpg)
There are many sign and neon billboard doodads in SC2, maybe you can somehow edit the textures to display the teams sponsors on those ingame? Something like this: (just a bad paint, I know nothing of the editor)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/xWBdHXj.png)
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Those are not possible with GameHeart because I do not make the maps and honestly I think they don't really work in Starcraft in general which has a wide array of tilesets and settings.
That type of thing works in DotA because it is literally just one map...played over and over and over and over again so it is easier to design an immersive sponsor system. That being said I also don't like immersive systems and I think for esports to really grow we need to move away from them. Which is part of the reason I removed the default UI for spectating in the first place.
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On October 22 2013 06:56 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:
On the sponsor logo's, maybe there's a way to copy the Dota2 method? They use ingame banner doodads with the teamsponsors on it, like this:
There are many sign and neon billboard doodads in SC2, maybe you can somehow edit the textures to display the teams sponsors on those ingame? Something like this: (just a bad paint, I know nothing of the editor)
Switching textures for doodads where you don't need to know if they exist or how many exist is technical possible and easy to do with triggers.
BUT:
- One problem would be proper textures. If the image has a bad format, that might look terrible.
- The core problem is that the players would see these texture changes, too, and it might distract them. The phasing technology where different players see different things only works with units. Doodads are no units.
So, atm, I don't think it's possible without tinkering with the maps.
edit:
- other problem: there are only a few good models for that and they only fit in a few maps. To not make maps become ugly because of that feature, we shouldn't really encourage that. Map authors try to make their maps beautiful and this feature could ruin the ascetically aspect of the map, too, if these things would be added or they would be forced to add those.
=> Placing images on the ground should be enough.
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On October 22 2013 06:56 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:Nice writeup. On the sponsor logo's, maybe there's a way to copy the Dota2 method? They use ingame banner doodads with the teamsponsors on it, like this: There are many sign and neon billboard doodads in SC2, maybe you can somehow edit the textures to display the teams sponsors on those ingame? Something like this: (just a bad paint, I know nothing of the editor)
I think this is something individual tournaments could/should consider. It's much easier for them to take maps and add a few advertisements (even if that means taking a GH map and modifying some textures or doodads). Especially in the case of something like ATC that uses the same maps for an extended period, I would think that a small investment into map editing would be worth it to them.
Overall, it just seems that few tournaments are thinking about maps - hopefully that changes.
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Maybe we could have something like in formula one where they have "Michael Schuhmacher S" or "Warsteiner Curve".
What about Razor EXPO or Monster choke? Intel tower?!
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On October 22 2013 04:10 iHirO wrote:Here's a bug report found while testing the GHTesting custom game. When the 'STC - Observer' mode is spectated, the inital Command Centre doesn't have stronger colours (shown below). However the first Barracks built did show the correct colours, so maybe the error is only for objects created at the beginning of the game? + Show Spoiler ++ Show Spoiler +Replays:STC - ObserversSTC - Everyone
I have been trying to look into this tonight and I cannot figure out why it is happening. It works fine for me but my partner Ahli is having the same problem you are. We will continue to look into it.
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United Kingdom1381 Posts
Is it possible for GameHeart to access local files on a PC?
Say for example you added a transparent 'advert texture' to a map; from the player's perspective the game looks normal. However on the PC that the tournament is being streamed from, a correctly formatted bitmap is added to a specific folder. The mod detects this and replaces the transparent texture shown in game.
This solves the problem of GameHeart having to manage vast numbers of sponsor logos, as each individual tournament would create their own. The images could also be used for transitory player profiles, nationality flags, map names, text, etc.
Is this idea feasible, or would it be worth asking Blizzard to implement something like this?
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iHiro - No that is not possible. Also it is probably unrealistic to expect tournaments to manage all of that to be honest. Some tournaments like GSL are able to manage vast amounts of player and team data because the same players and teams circulate through their tournament season after season. But it is much more complicated for open tournaments.
That is partially what makes GameHeart such an ideal solution to adding this kind of content. Managing and maintaining it all in one place so that all tournaments can make use of it. This also allows small tournaments to put on high quality productions with very low production costs.
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Can resources lost due to cancels and repairs be shown as a stat something like lost workers?
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Good job. The colossus looks ugly on that picture though.
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United Kingdom1381 Posts
GHTesting - Sponsors 1 Feedback
Issues:- Approximately a third of the textures placed on the map don't appear (e.g. only 7 textures out of 11 generated). I've tried multiple approaches to recreate the error consistently but it appears to be random.
- The list dialog doesn't update when textures are repositioned, which makes alignment difficult.
- Pressing 'Create Game' on the Arcade sometimes causes the game to hang while opening the Lobby, again this seems to be random and restarting fixes the error.
- The textures don't appear on the map in the replay, although the list dialog is updated normally.
- Decreasing a texture size by 5 large increments causes line artefacts to appear (zooming in removes this effect). Adding a minimum increment limit would prevent texture corruption.
+ Show Spoiler +
- Increasing a texture by 35 large increments causes it to be removed. The texture doesn't reappear when decreasing it's size, so a maximum increment limit may be needed.
- Textures placed on ramps only partially appear in the middle of the ramp.
+ Show Spoiler +
- The increment controls have insufficient granularity to perfectly align the textures. A solution might be to round up the texture placement position (e.g. x:10.5, y:4.0 instead of x:10.39, y:3.85).
+ Show Spoiler +
- Aligning rotated textures perfectly is difficult. Adding a rotation variable to the List dialog would help.
Questions:- Will the stronger colours be enabled for unlockable skins and Collector's Edition units? (My AM account is not levelled so I can't test how skins currently appear.)
- Would an 'Automatic' mode setting that only enables STC when mirror match ups are detected be useful? Also if the interface was extended to 2v2, would STC be binary or could it be set only for mirrored races (e.g. In a TZ vs TP, only set STC for the terrans)?
- Is it worth extending the decals to allow player flags to be shown around their base? (only one flag needed for most major tournaments
 )
- Could a texture that is locked to the player's in game colour be added (e.g. a blue circle texture), as It could be used as a background to differentiate sponsors?
- If a sponsor logo is constructed from multiple textures and needs to be repositioned, could a grouping function be added (e.g. Hold shift, select 4 textures and then move them along the x axis)? A cloning tool might also be useful.
Image Gallery:
+ Show Spoiler +[center] ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/ew4I3fe.png)
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Mad props, you are doing a great thing for Starcraft!
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Hey, just a quick note/question...
I noticed that while observing using 'V' to get a player's vision will show their opponent's current creep situation (not the most recently seen creep).
This happened first when checking if expansions had been spotted; even if the hatchery had not been seen it will appear as if the player has vision of a small patch of creep.
I assume this is a bug related to being allied...
Is there something I can do differently?
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