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Active: 33198 users

Some Protoss Gas Timings

Blogs > SC2John
Post a Reply
EsportsJohn
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
United States4883 Posts
August 02 2013 22:25 GMT
#1
Protoss gas timings are perhaps more complicated and interesting than gas timings of any other race. The key thing about protoss gas is that there are several ways to accumulate the same amount of gas with minimal to no effect on the economy of the protoss player. (Sidenote: this is primarily due to the fact that building a geyser does not sacrifice the mining time of a worker).

In most modern protoss builds, protoss players want exactly 200 gas around 3:50-4:00 in order to make a stalker, a MsC, and warp gate all at the same time when the core finishes. There are several ways to get there, let's explore:

1) gas before gate:
+ Show Spoiler +
-9 pylon
-12 gas
-13 gate
**Chronoboost x3 on nexus**
-16 pylon
-18 core
-21 pylon
~200 gas mined @4:00

Although quite rare, this is a fun way to metagame someone who isn't paying attention with their scouting probe. The key here is that you appear to only have 1 geyser and look like you're gearing up for 4-gate/fast 1-gate expand, but in actuality, you're just doing a normal build. In some ways, this build is nice against cheese because if you spot it early on you can save chronoboosts. All in all, a fun way to change things up a little in your gameplay.


2) delayed second geyser:
+ Show Spoiler +
-9 pylon
**Chonoboost x3 on nexus**
-13 gate
-14 gas
-16/17 pylon
-18 core
-19 gas
-25 pylon
~200 gas mined @4:00

Perhaps the second most common after 15 double gas, this build is very flexible and allows you to make changes on the fly if you scout cheese. You can save a chronoboost and the money you were going to spend on your second gas on an early zealot instead and be safe against things like proxy rax, proxy 2-gate, etc.


3) 16 double gas:
+ Show Spoiler +
-9 pylon
**Chronoboost x3 on nexus**
-13 gate
-16 double gas
**3 on each gas**
-17 pylon
-18 core
-25 pylon
~200 gas mined @4:00

This build is almost the same as 15 double gas except that you just delay the geysers by a little bit to consolidate your mineral income then catch up in gas by putting 3 in each geyser. Again, because you delay gases, you can respond to cheese a little bit better.


4) 15 double gas:
+ Show Spoiler +
-9 pylon
**Chronoboost x3 on nexus**
-13 gate
-15 double gas
**2 on each gas**
-17 pylon
-18 core
**Add 3 on each gas**
-25 pylon
~200 gas mined @4:00

Probably the most standard opening for protoss is 15 double gas. This build is really versatile and transitions well into anything. If you decide to go for an early expand, you can leave 2 in the geysers and get a later stalker. If you want to tech up quickly, you can add in a 3rd probe at each geyser to get the gas income you need. It's just very mutable and very flexible.





***
StrategyAllyssa Grey <3<3
Shebuha
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada1335 Posts
August 03 2013 01:15 GMT
#2
Like 2 years ago i used to do gas before gate into DT against Terran and Zerg... shit was ballinnnnnnnn'. I'd like to experiment with that again... Thanks for the info's!
FakeDouble
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Australia676 Posts
August 03 2013 05:16 GMT
#3
Thanks for this, nice and succinct, showing that many openings can funnel into a common point (200g @ 4min). I don't play P much (unless I feel like rolling random every so often), but I never felt that scouting the P main gave me any insight into what they were going to do and this is why I guess. The timing on the nat, and the gas timing at the nat seems like more useful info when scouting a P.

I guess the corollary is that regardless of which of these openings they do, they can transition to any tech choice and unit composition
Formerly known as carbonaceous
iMrising
Profile Blog Joined March 2012
United States1099 Posts
August 03 2013 05:33 GMT
#4
oo nice of you to share this
just a curious question, which one do you like/use?
$O$ | soO
EsportsJohn
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
United States4883 Posts
August 03 2013 06:34 GMT
#5
On August 03 2013 10:15 Shebuha wrote:
Like 2 years ago i used to do gas before gate into DT against Terran and Zerg... shit was ballinnnnnnnn'. I'd like to experiment with that again... Thanks for the info's!


Haha, nice! Yeah, I haven't used this opener much, but it seems like it might be a lot of fun to meta my opponents.

On August 03 2013 14:16 FakeDouble wrote:
Thanks for this, nice and succinct, showing that many openings can funnel into a common point (200g @ 4min). I don't play P much (unless I feel like rolling random every so often), but I never felt that scouting the P main gave me any insight into what they were going to do and this is why I guess. The timing on the nat, and the gas timing at the nat seems like more useful info when scouting a P.

I guess the corollary is that regardless of which of these openings they do, they can transition to any tech choice and unit composition


That's true. I think the most important things to scout against P are 1) whether or not they make a zealot, 2) how quickly their expansion is, and 3) how many pylons are in the base. An early zealot almost always means early aggression (generally a zealot/stalker/MsC poke). Also, the other very important timing for protoss is 6:30 (in PvT/PvP); this is the point where protoss tech diverges into either robo, stargate, or early gateway aggression. The gases at the natural are also really good indicators of what's coming.

On August 03 2013 14:33 iMrising wrote:
oo nice of you to share this
just a curious question, which one do you like/use?


I generally stick to 15 double gas. The reason for this is that it's just very flexible and hard to read and also prevents gas steals. In a BoX series, I believe it's best to stick with only one type of gas opening because it makes your opponent very unsure of what they're up against.
StrategyAllyssa Grey <3<3
Esoterikk
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada1256 Posts
August 03 2013 07:43 GMT
#6
I always thought with 1 gate expo you went with one geyser am I wrong? This could explain a lot of why I get dunked so early.
PandaTank
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
South Africa255 Posts
August 03 2013 07:43 GMT
#7
If you're not lazy, you can 13 gate, 14 gas, 15 gas. Which will give you a slight advantage(4-8 gas) over double 15gas without any loss.
facebook.com/PandaTank \\\ @PandaTankSC2
EsportsJohn
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
United States4883 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-03 07:53:15
August 03 2013 07:47 GMT
#8
On August 03 2013 16:43 PandaTank wrote:
If you're not lazy, you can 13 gate, 14 gas, 15 gas. Which will give you a slight advantage(4-8 gas) over double 15gas without any loss.


I see what you mean. Yeah, I generally rally to the geyser and build them one at a time instead of pooling money. But I just call it the same thing because I feel like it essentially adds up to the same thing, just a more efficient way of doing it.

On August 03 2013 16:43 Esoterikk wrote:
I always thought with 1 gate expo you went with one geyser am I wrong? This could explain a lot of why I get dunked so early.


In WoL, you wanted to only get 1 geyser because you only needed 100 gas when your core finished. In HotS, it's generally more efficient to have MsC/stalker/warpgate start early and get your nexus down just a tad bit later. That said, MsC expand is far safer and stronger than the old WoL expands like nexus on 17 and nexus first. Here's a link to another blog post I wrote about FE in PvT:

http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?id=422990
StrategyAllyssa Grey <3<3
kornetka
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
Poland129 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-03 18:38:41
August 03 2013 18:38 GMT
#9
My gas timings revolves around big ass farts when I see opponent's army.
broodwar for ever
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