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Song of Ice and Fire blog *spoilers*

Blogs > HardlyNever
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HardlyNever
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
United States1258 Posts
June 03 2013 20:35 GMT
#1
I'm writing this blog to get down some of my ideas out about the Song of Ice and Fire series, as they currently stand. Most of this will be speculation, and I'm interested in discussion as well as just getting these thoughts down and looking back at them in X years when the series is finally over and I can see what I got right, what I got close, and what I was way off on. This will contain massive spoilers for anyone that hasn't read the books, and might even contain spoilers for people who have read everything, depending on how right I am.

A bit on my background regarding the series. I'd guess I'm the fairly "average, invested" fan. I came to the series late, having started it about a year ago now. The advantage this gave me was that I could read the entire (current) series all the way through, without stopping between books. I read the first 4 in about a series of 3ish months, took about a month break, then finished off a Dance With Dragons about a month after. I have a pretty good memory, and reading the entire series through was helpful in picking up on a lot of the minor characters and keeping the events pretty straight in my head, in terms of when they occurred. Additionally, I've spent probably too much time reading the ASoIaF wiki, so I'm pretty current on a lot of the theories etc. swirling around the series (the wiki is also great for details and brushing up on past events, and events that happen outside that series). I've also been watching the HBO tv show, and am almost caught up on that (I'm on the 2nd episode of season 3). I've been watching it for an eye as to what they change regarding the books, specifically keeping in mind that they hopefully wouldn't remove anything that would be critical to include for future plot twists. That said, most of what I'm going to say isn't really novel or break-through; more it is a synthesis of a lot of the good ideas floating around out there (on teh interwebz) with my own thoughts sprinkled in. So here is what I'm currently thinking is in the future for this series:

1. At this point, I'm pretty sure Jon Snow is the son of Lyanna and Rhaegar. I don't really like this, and kind of hope that it won't be true, but both the evidence in the book and "reading between the lines" in the show indicate this is probably true. He is possibly even Azor Ahai and The prince that was promised. He is the son of ice (stark) and fire (targaryen), and this song is primarily about him. He may or may not still be a "bastard" depending on whether Rhaegar actually married Lyanna. I think if there is a "hero" that will fight against the Others, he already needs to be well established in the series for the audience to have an attachment to him. The list of possible candidates is pretty slim, with Stannis being unlikely given that his Lightbringer doesn't appear to be the true lightbringer (doesn't give off heat). If Jon does turn out to be this person, look for craziness including "warging" into dragons, and other magic shenanigens. He may end up getting his hands on Stannis's Lightbringer and killing Daenerys with it to make it the "true" lightbringer (if this happens, it will be very near the end of the story).

2. Jaime will be responsible for the death of Cersei, possibly and hopefully, will directly kill her. This is becoming fairly obvious by the end of DwD, so this shouldn't be that surprising. Cersei is haunted by the prophecy that she received when she was a kid, of being ruined by a "younger, more beautiful queen (probably Daenerys)" and being killed by the valonqar. She thinks Tyrion is the younger brother, but it is actually Jaime, who is also her younger brother, technically. Additionally, expect either Brienne to die for Jaime, or Jaime to die for Brienne (or possibly both).

3. This isn't as much as a prediction, but more of a concern. The series contains 2 major story arcs: the fight for the Iron Throne of Westeros, and the battle against the Others. Sometimes GRRM tries to combine the two, and I think he is still trying to, but honestly the battle against the Others feels like it has been given short shrift. I'm starting to get concerned that he either won't give it the proper amount of development, or just won't finish it at all (either by decision or not being able to finish it), and leaving it for a possible future author to handle.

There are still a lot of loose ends and questions, though. Obviously, Arya is going to continue to go on some form of killing spree, but to what end in the long term I don't know. I'm pretty sure at this point Littlefinger just wants to destroy all the major houses of Westeros, especially the Starks, Tullies and Lannisters (this is more obvious in the tv show than the book). I doubt he will succeed, but he'll probably do a lot of damage before he is stopped. How the Iron Islands and that whole story fits in, I'm not sure. What is going in Oldtown with the Faceless One, and who he has to kill (and he might even be after some item of importance) I don't know. I imagine Tyrion will end up joining up with Daenerys, but to what end I don't really know. I feel like a lot of the new characters (sand snakes, the young Aegon, Jon Connington) are just distractions to be killed off by more major players, but I'm sure there is a twist or two in there among them.

On a side note, I find it pretty amusing that the last time we saw Jon Snow, he seemed to be dying, but basically no one I've talked to or read seems to think he is actually dead. There are some interesting theories regarding how he might survive, ranging from him "warging" into Ghost or maybe the giant, or just being saved by other Night's Watch brothers.

Out there, the Kid learned to fend for himself. Learned to build. Learned to break.
micronesia
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States24782 Posts
June 03 2013 21:13 GMT
#2
There is so much tension building all over the world; it is unreal. How will it all come together? Will Dany bring her army across into Westeros (if she ever gets out of her current predicaments) with Dragons in tow? Will the others invade Westeros? Will the kingdoms of Westeros all unite under one military leader? Will Bran do something useful with his new abilities? Will there be a block of 20 pages without someone dying a miserable death or being brutally tortured?

It's getting to the point where I don't even want to predict what will happen anymore... I just wanna tune it out until the next book comes out, and then read it then. I really hope GRRM finishes the series within his/our lifetimes lol
ModeratorThere are animal crackers for people and there are people crackers for animals.
Archas
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States6531 Posts
June 03 2013 21:44 GMT
#3
On June 04 2013 06:13 micronesia wrote:
Will there be a block of 20 pages without someone dying a miserable death or being brutally tortured?

Surely you jest.
The room is ripe with the stench of bitches!
TroW
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United States67 Posts
June 03 2013 21:47 GMT
#4
I've read through the whole series twice in the last 3 or 4 years and I agree with pretty much everything you've come up with here. Jon Snow still being alive *somehow* and being the son of Rhaegar seems probable to me, as does Jaime killing Cersei.

I understand your worry about the story arc with the Others being neglected to some extent, but I honestly don't think that will last much longer. I expect that a lot of presently disparate threads will be tied back into the Others and Bran's story, especially the goings on in Oldtown with Sam, in whatever way Jon Snow inevitably isn't dead, and Dany's presumed return to Westeros.

My biggest fear is that GRRM will simply drop dead before he ever finishes the story, and will then leave some poor overwhelmed bastard to try to work it all out or simply leave it unfinished altogether. The fifth book took him so long I can't imagine he will have them finished in a timely fashion. Time will tell I suppose.
"A thinker sees his own actions as experiments and questions--as attempts to find out something. Success and failure are for him answers above all." - Friedrich Nietzsche
PhoenixVoid
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
Canada32754 Posts
June 03 2013 22:02 GMT
#5
If Martin is willing to pace the story well, he should ideally finish off the politics and human infighting by TWOW, and primarily diverge his efforts into the battle against the Others in ADOS. Martin is running out of time to tell both stories simultaneously, and the Others have been barely touched in the last five books, so there has to be a resolution to Westerosi politics and a beginning to the Others.

Dany has to come into Westeros, it just has to happen, though the manner of her arrival and what kind of army she wields is a mystery. Will she arrive as the Khalasar of Khal Pono's khal, or simply her dragons and the Unsullied?

I still don't know what exactly Bran is doing with his warging powers. Is he going to do anything useful with his abilities and get involved into the wars, or lie back and expand his powers for gods know what?

As for GRRM, I'm concerned he will be either dead or incapable of finishing the story by TWOW, let alone ADOS, and that sure would infuriate and sadden the legions of fans. With his traveling schedule and work, I would be very surprised if TWOW is released by 2014, and ADOS is even further, possibly 2020. From what I've heard, GRRM does not wish for a ghost writer to finish off the series, but told the show directors and producers, so we have to watch the show to conclude the story :/
I'm afraid of demented knife-wielding escaped lunatic libertarian zombie mutants
TroW
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United States67 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-04 03:43:51
June 04 2013 03:43 GMT
#6
From what I've heard, GRRM does not wish for a ghost writer to finish off the series, but told the show directors and producers, so we have to watch the show to conclude the story :/


They are planning to tell the whole story in the show before the books are released? That seems wrong...

edit: wrong in a moral and aesthetic way, not factually
"A thinker sees his own actions as experiments and questions--as attempts to find out something. Success and failure are for him answers above all." - Friedrich Nietzsche
Talin
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Montenegro10532 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-04 22:27:24
June 04 2013 22:26 GMT
#7
I can't say I remember much of the books, having read the last one what feels like a few years ago (not even sure at this point, basically when it came out), but I've recently read a comment suggesting that Dany might end up being the actual "antagonist" of the story once she crosses over to Westeros, with her latent Targaryen nutjob genes kicking in at some point (possibly after coming in contact with the Westerosi houses and politics).

Thinking back, she does seem like a very unbalanced character so far. It's really hard to tell whether she's really as simple and idealistic as she is, or it's Martin trying to tell us that something just isn't clicking right in her head and foreshadowing her gradual transition into a tyrant as she experiences more of the world and tries to "set it straight".
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