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On April 20 2013 02:16 MaestroSC wrote:Show nested quote +On April 19 2013 23:08 Magic_Mike wrote:
In terms of races, I like to keep things simple. When there are too many options, players, especially newer players have a very hard time figuring out what they want and if they have a bunch of special min/max options to choose from they rarely make the "right" ones. My wife and I play in a group regularly that plays 3.5 and she is lower gaming experience than the rest of us. It takes her hours to make characters because the DM allows every freaking race from every freaking book and constantly feels underpowered compared to everyone else because she doesn't know how to combine things like the rest of us for maximum impact. I don't run DnD anymore because I finally got a super expensive copy of BESM 3rd edition but when I do I do the wheel of time thing. I make everyone humans and instead of giving them the bonus Feat I choose the feat for them based on what "type" of human they are. If they are from the tribe of warriors known for their skill fighting with axes, I'll give them Weapon Proficiency or if they already have it Weapon Focus. I will also give each one a bonus class skill selected from a group of three or four. An example would be that people from the above tribe could pick, Craft (Weapon Smithing), Knowledge (tactics), and Survival or something similar. I'll do this for like 6-7 tribes of people and detail them a little bit so they can feel exotic or different than a standard human then keep the demi-races as NPC's or monsters. This allows the MIn/Maxers a little bit of wiggle room without alienating the newer players by making them feel weak. It's also nowhere near as complicated as figuring out stat modifiers which can be huge. A first level character with a 16 or 18 strength is pretty tough for most 1st level monsters. The same fighter with Darkvision, free proficiency in an exotic weapon and a 20 strength makes the same character feel weak. They will be very minor bonuses, that in all honesty will have very little affect as the characters progress. Also I am making the stat system and the way its calculated much more user-friendly. I am simplifying the way the modifiers work. And for the character creation.. I wanted more options so that people will have more of a connection. When I re-write traits/perks/skills for the races... it will be generally limited to: 1 Combat Trait (Like one I have currently is an Orc trait where they gain +1 damage on their damage rolls whenever the orc is under half health called -Berserk) 1 Social Trait (Bonus or negative charisma possibly on a per-race basis) 1 Stat Trait (+1 to a stat for the most part- have also thought of a sort of tradeoff... and make it optional. Like an Orc can subtract 1 Wisdom and put that 1 into Strength, since orcs are generally more physically strong than mentally, but if he is a casting orc he can choose to not use this one)
I see. So in your new system do they get modifiers for odd numbers attributes? Otherwise a +1 stat is meaningless. I assume you do. I personally like how you've kept things simple and made the races your own instead of using the Wizards Version. My uncle created a game using the AD&D rules when we were kids that was a combination of Grim and Gritty and Skyrim where characters went up levels in individual weapons and skills rather than a single class. Instead of experience points you got proficiencies that you could spend on your skills. Lots of fun. BESM is simliar, so I guess that's why I like it so much. Let us know how your game comes along. Maybe post some rules or whatever.
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On April 20 2013 02:16 Zealos wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2013 01:52 MaestroSC wrote:
I liked the suggestion of Genasi, and Drow will def be a playable race, tho they will definitely...have a harder time interacting with townsfolk/human NPC's... tho maybe they would be able to give the party a chance to interact with some Drow npc's in a friendly way.
Also liked the Centaur suggestion... again will make their life harder when in town..because obviously you will never be welcomed into a Tavern as a Centaur... but idk it could be fun, staying in a stable outside a tavern while ur group stays inside lol.
Orc will be playable, probably only half-ogre tho as I don think villages would really care to have an Ogre walking around their village.. but maybe Why can't Centaur's go into town? It's your world bro, maybe 4 legged creatures could be the norm?
they'll be able to go into town. But generally humans will be more scared of him, also he cant go into a tavern because he would be way too big... and an innkeeper would not be prepared to house a centaur indoors.
Also for your 2nd post, I dont want the Racial traits to be too strong because I dont really want people to feel forced to play a certain race/class combination without gimping themselves.
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On April 20 2013 02:24 Magic_Mike wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2013 02:16 MaestroSC wrote:On April 19 2013 23:08 Magic_Mike wrote:
In terms of races, I like to keep things simple. When there are too many options, players, especially newer players have a very hard time figuring out what they want and if they have a bunch of special min/max options to choose from they rarely make the "right" ones. My wife and I play in a group regularly that plays 3.5 and she is lower gaming experience than the rest of us. It takes her hours to make characters because the DM allows every freaking race from every freaking book and constantly feels underpowered compared to everyone else because she doesn't know how to combine things like the rest of us for maximum impact. I don't run DnD anymore because I finally got a super expensive copy of BESM 3rd edition but when I do I do the wheel of time thing. I make everyone humans and instead of giving them the bonus Feat I choose the feat for them based on what "type" of human they are. If they are from the tribe of warriors known for their skill fighting with axes, I'll give them Weapon Proficiency or if they already have it Weapon Focus. I will also give each one a bonus class skill selected from a group of three or four. An example would be that people from the above tribe could pick, Craft (Weapon Smithing), Knowledge (tactics), and Survival or something similar. I'll do this for like 6-7 tribes of people and detail them a little bit so they can feel exotic or different than a standard human then keep the demi-races as NPC's or monsters. This allows the MIn/Maxers a little bit of wiggle room without alienating the newer players by making them feel weak. It's also nowhere near as complicated as figuring out stat modifiers which can be huge. A first level character with a 16 or 18 strength is pretty tough for most 1st level monsters. The same fighter with Darkvision, free proficiency in an exotic weapon and a 20 strength makes the same character feel weak. They will be very minor bonuses, that in all honesty will have very little affect as the characters progress. Also I am making the stat system and the way its calculated much more user-friendly. I am simplifying the way the modifiers work. And for the character creation.. I wanted more options so that people will have more of a connection. When I re-write traits/perks/skills for the races... it will be generally limited to: 1 Combat Trait (Like one I have currently is an Orc trait where they gain +1 damage on their damage rolls whenever the orc is under half health called -Berserk) 1 Social Trait (Bonus or negative charisma possibly on a per-race basis) 1 Stat Trait (+1 to a stat for the most part- have also thought of a sort of tradeoff... and make it optional. Like an Orc can subtract 1 Wisdom and put that 1 into Strength, since orcs are generally more physically strong than mentally, but if he is a casting orc he can choose to not use this one) I see. So in your new system do they get modifiers for odd numbers attributes? Otherwise a +1 stat is meaningless. I assume you do. I personally like how you've kept things simple and made the races your own instead of using the Wizards Version. My uncle created a game using the AD&D rules when we were kids that was a combination of Grim and Gritty and Skyrim where characters went up levels in individual weapons and skills rather than a single class. Instead of experience points you got proficiencies that you could spend on your skills. Lots of fun. BESM is simliar, so I guess that's why I like it so much. Let us know how your game comes along. Maybe post some rules or whatever.
I like your uncles idea.
Because right now stats are like unnecessarily complex for DnD or PF, and they dont need to be. Like people get mad at people just for not knowing some obscure formula or ruleset, and NOBODY wants to be the guy holding up the group because he cant figure out his own attack rolls. But it shouldnt need to be like that.
in my Game Stats will be Current - Base stat/5 = your modifier. (And when I say +1 i mean it will be enough to give them a +1 on their roll, not necessarily only 1 stat) (So in this scenario, an Orc player would get +5 to his Strength, rather than just +1 for being an orc)
For instance:
An Orc with 20 Strength will get a +2 roll. (20 current - 10 base = 10. 10/5 = +2 to their strength rolls)
At each level, every player will roll 6 D6, and apply them to stats as they please.
You will technically have people who are at 24 Str for instance, so they are 1 away from being a +3, but since dice rolls wont always bring you to a round number, it will encourage keeping characters more well-rounded rather than focusing too much on min-maxing.
Like if your a Str based character, if you are at 24 Str, and your Wisdom is only at 11, if you roll a 1 and a 4, you are probably going to put the 4 on the wisdom, and the 1 on the 24, to get the +1 on each, rather than putting 1 on strength, and 1 on wisdom, which will only give u the strength bonus. I think it will help encourage players to be more well-rounded.
The only stat that wont work this way will probably be the stat
Vitality.
Vitality is one of the 6 stats, and determines your health.
I am not sure how i want to change the formula for this one, but I am thinking something along the lines of
Current Stat - Base Stat / 2 or 3
or
Vitality may just be a 1 Vit = 1 health.
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On April 20 2013 02:56 MaestroSC wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2013 02:24 Magic_Mike wrote:On April 20 2013 02:16 MaestroSC wrote:On April 19 2013 23:08 Magic_Mike wrote:
In terms of races, I like to keep things simple. When there are too many options, players, especially newer players have a very hard time figuring out what they want and if they have a bunch of special min/max options to choose from they rarely make the "right" ones. My wife and I play in a group regularly that plays 3.5 and she is lower gaming experience than the rest of us. It takes her hours to make characters because the DM allows every freaking race from every freaking book and constantly feels underpowered compared to everyone else because she doesn't know how to combine things like the rest of us for maximum impact. I don't run DnD anymore because I finally got a super expensive copy of BESM 3rd edition but when I do I do the wheel of time thing. I make everyone humans and instead of giving them the bonus Feat I choose the feat for them based on what "type" of human they are. If they are from the tribe of warriors known for their skill fighting with axes, I'll give them Weapon Proficiency or if they already have it Weapon Focus. I will also give each one a bonus class skill selected from a group of three or four. An example would be that people from the above tribe could pick, Craft (Weapon Smithing), Knowledge (tactics), and Survival or something similar. I'll do this for like 6-7 tribes of people and detail them a little bit so they can feel exotic or different than a standard human then keep the demi-races as NPC's or monsters. This allows the MIn/Maxers a little bit of wiggle room without alienating the newer players by making them feel weak. It's also nowhere near as complicated as figuring out stat modifiers which can be huge. A first level character with a 16 or 18 strength is pretty tough for most 1st level monsters. The same fighter with Darkvision, free proficiency in an exotic weapon and a 20 strength makes the same character feel weak. They will be very minor bonuses, that in all honesty will have very little affect as the characters progress. Also I am making the stat system and the way its calculated much more user-friendly. I am simplifying the way the modifiers work. And for the character creation.. I wanted more options so that people will have more of a connection. When I re-write traits/perks/skills for the races... it will be generally limited to: 1 Combat Trait (Like one I have currently is an Orc trait where they gain +1 damage on their damage rolls whenever the orc is under half health called -Berserk) 1 Social Trait (Bonus or negative charisma possibly on a per-race basis) 1 Stat Trait (+1 to a stat for the most part- have also thought of a sort of tradeoff... and make it optional. Like an Orc can subtract 1 Wisdom and put that 1 into Strength, since orcs are generally more physically strong than mentally, but if he is a casting orc he can choose to not use this one) I see. So in your new system do they get modifiers for odd numbers attributes? Otherwise a +1 stat is meaningless. I assume you do. I personally like how you've kept things simple and made the races your own instead of using the Wizards Version. My uncle created a game using the AD&D rules when we were kids that was a combination of Grim and Gritty and Skyrim where characters went up levels in individual weapons and skills rather than a single class. Instead of experience points you got proficiencies that you could spend on your skills. Lots of fun. BESM is simliar, so I guess that's why I like it so much. Let us know how your game comes along. Maybe post some rules or whatever. I like your uncles idea. Because right now stats are like unnecessarily complex for DnD or PF, and they dont need to be. Like people get mad at people just for not knowing some obscure formula or ruleset, and NOBODY wants to be the guy holding up the group because he cant figure out his own attack rolls. But it shouldnt need to be like that. in my Game Stats will be Current - Base stat/5 = your modifier. (And when I say +1 i mean it will be enough to give them a +1 on their roll, not necessarily only 1 stat) (So in this scenario, an Orc player would get +5 to his Strength, rather than just +1 for being an orc) For instance: An Orc with 20 Strength will get a +2 roll. (20 current - 10 base = 10. 10/5 = +2 to their strength rolls) At each level, every player will roll 6 D6, and apply them to stats as they please. You will technically have people who are at 24 Str for instance, so they are 1 away from being a +3, but since dice rolls wont always bring you to a round number, it will encourage keeping characters more well-rounded rather than focusing too much on min-maxing. Like if your a Str based character, if you are at 24 Str, and your Wisdom is only at 11, if you roll a 1 and a 4, you are probably going to put the 4 on the wisdom, and the 1 on the 24, to get the +1 on each, rather than putting 1 on strength, and 1 on wisdom, which will only give u the strength bonus. I think it will help encourage players to be more well-rounded. The only stat that wont work this way will probably be the stat Vitality. Vitality is one of the 6 stats, and determines your health. I am not sure how i want to change the formula for this one, but I am thinking something along the lines of Current Stat - Base Stat / 2 or 3
It really depends on how you view the concept of hitpoints and vitality. If it is a combination of dodging and physical health other stats besides just vitality should add to it. Dex for example, should add to hit points as well as possibly Intelligence. If you think of it more along the lines of simply physical ability to withstand damage and have some way for characters to actually dodge attacks just Vit is fine but in order to keep the concept you will have to have an alternate means to determine armor other than just AC, damage reduction for example. That combined with what type of game you want to run (gritty or heroic) will determine the scaling of hitpoints can make it very tricky.
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On April 20 2013 02:33 MaestroSC wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2013 02:16 Zealos wrote:On April 20 2013 01:52 MaestroSC wrote:
I liked the suggestion of Genasi, and Drow will def be a playable race, tho they will definitely...have a harder time interacting with townsfolk/human NPC's... tho maybe they would be able to give the party a chance to interact with some Drow npc's in a friendly way.
Also liked the Centaur suggestion... again will make their life harder when in town..because obviously you will never be welcomed into a Tavern as a Centaur... but idk it could be fun, staying in a stable outside a tavern while ur group stays inside lol.
Orc will be playable, probably only half-ogre tho as I don think villages would really care to have an Ogre walking around their village.. but maybe Why can't Centaur's go into town? It's your world bro, maybe 4 legged creatures could be the norm? they'll be able to go into town. But generally humans will be more scared of him, also he cant go into a tavern because he would be way too big... and an innkeeper would not be prepared to house a centaur indoors.
But why?
It seems like you're making assumptions based on human life and the world we live it. Obviously it's your choice if you want to run it like that, but there is no reason necessarily that humans would be scared of centaurs.
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On April 20 2013 03:22 Zealos wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2013 02:33 MaestroSC wrote:On April 20 2013 02:16 Zealos wrote:On April 20 2013 01:52 MaestroSC wrote:
I liked the suggestion of Genasi, and Drow will def be a playable race, tho they will definitely...have a harder time interacting with townsfolk/human NPC's... tho maybe they would be able to give the party a chance to interact with some Drow npc's in a friendly way.
Also liked the Centaur suggestion... again will make their life harder when in town..because obviously you will never be welcomed into a Tavern as a Centaur... but idk it could be fun, staying in a stable outside a tavern while ur group stays inside lol.
Orc will be playable, probably only half-ogre tho as I don think villages would really care to have an Ogre walking around their village.. but maybe Why can't Centaur's go into town? It's your world bro, maybe 4 legged creatures could be the norm? they'll be able to go into town. But generally humans will be more scared of him, also he cant go into a tavern because he would be way too big... and an innkeeper would not be prepared to house a centaur indoors. But why? It seems like you're making assumptions based on human life and the world we live it. Obviously it's your choice if you want to run it like that, but there is no reason necessarily that humans would be scared of centaurs.
well generally, people are pretty much afraid of anything different. (this is true for people in general... its why racism/sexism/religionism -?? maybe- Exists. People fear that which is different
also if they are visiting a human village, there is no reason they would build a human village to the needs of centaur...
however if they visited a centaur village, I am sure the centaur would be very well accomodated, and the rest would be uncomfortable without their usual beds/rooms/etc.
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Nothing stopping you abiding to the shitty rules of human nature. Change it! : D
Gl with the game, whatever way you go though, just DMing a game is quite enough for me, making a whole new rules set is a cool idea, and I wish you the best of luck : D
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On April 20 2013 03:19 Magic_Mike wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2013 02:56 MaestroSC wrote:On April 20 2013 02:24 Magic_Mike wrote:On April 20 2013 02:16 MaestroSC wrote:On April 19 2013 23:08 Magic_Mike wrote:
In terms of races, I like to keep things simple. When there are too many options, players, especially newer players have a very hard time figuring out what they want and if they have a bunch of special min/max options to choose from they rarely make the "right" ones. My wife and I play in a group regularly that plays 3.5 and she is lower gaming experience than the rest of us. It takes her hours to make characters because the DM allows every freaking race from every freaking book and constantly feels underpowered compared to everyone else because she doesn't know how to combine things like the rest of us for maximum impact. I don't run DnD anymore because I finally got a super expensive copy of BESM 3rd edition but when I do I do the wheel of time thing. I make everyone humans and instead of giving them the bonus Feat I choose the feat for them based on what "type" of human they are. If they are from the tribe of warriors known for their skill fighting with axes, I'll give them Weapon Proficiency or if they already have it Weapon Focus. I will also give each one a bonus class skill selected from a group of three or four. An example would be that people from the above tribe could pick, Craft (Weapon Smithing), Knowledge (tactics), and Survival or something similar. I'll do this for like 6-7 tribes of people and detail them a little bit so they can feel exotic or different than a standard human then keep the demi-races as NPC's or monsters. This allows the MIn/Maxers a little bit of wiggle room without alienating the newer players by making them feel weak. It's also nowhere near as complicated as figuring out stat modifiers which can be huge. A first level character with a 16 or 18 strength is pretty tough for most 1st level monsters. The same fighter with Darkvision, free proficiency in an exotic weapon and a 20 strength makes the same character feel weak. They will be very minor bonuses, that in all honesty will have very little affect as the characters progress. Also I am making the stat system and the way its calculated much more user-friendly. I am simplifying the way the modifiers work. And for the character creation.. I wanted more options so that people will have more of a connection. When I re-write traits/perks/skills for the races... it will be generally limited to: 1 Combat Trait (Like one I have currently is an Orc trait where they gain +1 damage on their damage rolls whenever the orc is under half health called -Berserk) 1 Social Trait (Bonus or negative charisma possibly on a per-race basis) 1 Stat Trait (+1 to a stat for the most part- have also thought of a sort of tradeoff... and make it optional. Like an Orc can subtract 1 Wisdom and put that 1 into Strength, since orcs are generally more physically strong than mentally, but if he is a casting orc he can choose to not use this one) I see. So in your new system do they get modifiers for odd numbers attributes? Otherwise a +1 stat is meaningless. I assume you do. I personally like how you've kept things simple and made the races your own instead of using the Wizards Version. My uncle created a game using the AD&D rules when we were kids that was a combination of Grim and Gritty and Skyrim where characters went up levels in individual weapons and skills rather than a single class. Instead of experience points you got proficiencies that you could spend on your skills. Lots of fun. BESM is simliar, so I guess that's why I like it so much. Let us know how your game comes along. Maybe post some rules or whatever. I like your uncles idea. Because right now stats are like unnecessarily complex for DnD or PF, and they dont need to be. Like people get mad at people just for not knowing some obscure formula or ruleset, and NOBODY wants to be the guy holding up the group because he cant figure out his own attack rolls. But it shouldnt need to be like that. in my Game Stats will be Current - Base stat/5 = your modifier. (And when I say +1 i mean it will be enough to give them a +1 on their roll, not necessarily only 1 stat) (So in this scenario, an Orc player would get +5 to his Strength, rather than just +1 for being an orc) For instance: An Orc with 20 Strength will get a +2 roll. (20 current - 10 base = 10. 10/5 = +2 to their strength rolls) At each level, every player will roll 6 D6, and apply them to stats as they please. You will technically have people who are at 24 Str for instance, so they are 1 away from being a +3, but since dice rolls wont always bring you to a round number, it will encourage keeping characters more well-rounded rather than focusing too much on min-maxing. Like if your a Str based character, if you are at 24 Str, and your Wisdom is only at 11, if you roll a 1 and a 4, you are probably going to put the 4 on the wisdom, and the 1 on the 24, to get the +1 on each, rather than putting 1 on strength, and 1 on wisdom, which will only give u the strength bonus. I think it will help encourage players to be more well-rounded. The only stat that wont work this way will probably be the stat Vitality. Vitality is one of the 6 stats, and determines your health. I am not sure how i want to change the formula for this one, but I am thinking something along the lines of Current Stat - Base Stat / 2 or 3 It really depends on how you view the concept of hitpoints and vitality. If it is a combination of dodging and physical health other stats besides just vitality should add to it. Dex for example, should add to hit points as well as possibly Intelligence. If you think of it more along the lines of simply physical ability to withstand damage and have some way for characters to actually dodge attacks just Vit is fine but in order to keep the concept you will have to have an alternate means to determine armor other than just AC, damage reduction for example. That combined with what type of game you want to run (gritty or heroic) will determine the scaling of hitpoints can make it very tricky.
Dex will increase your AC, because it gives you a chance to dodge.
For instance if you have 20 Dex, and an AC of 10, you will now have AC12.
Also There are going to be certain class bonuses/spells to help balance their Armor.
IE Mage/wizard classes will get "Mage armor. Mage armor = +5 AC)
Thief/Rogue Classes will get "Quick Reflexes" = +5 AC - or some modifier based on their Dex in addition to regular dex bonus AC)
Warrior-ish type classes will just wear better armor, and still get the +AC from dex modifier, and will naturally have higher AC's.
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EPT
