• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 18:43
CEST 00:43
KST 07:43
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL21] Ro16 Preview Pt2: All Star10Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists16[ASL21] Ro16 Preview Pt1: Fresh Flow9[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt2: News Flash10[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt1: New Chaos0
Community News
2026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers13Maestros of the Game 2 announced62026 GSL Tour plans announced14Weekly Cups (April 6-12): herO doubles, "Villains" prevail1MaNa leaves Team Liquid24
StarCraft 2
General
Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists Maestros of the Game 2 announced MaNa leaves Team Liquid 2026 GSL Tour plans announced Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool
Tourneys
2026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers GSL CK: More events planned pending crowdfunding RSL Revival: Season 5 - Qualifiers and Main Event Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2)
Strategy
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
Mutation # 522 Flip My Base The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 521 Memorable Boss Mutation # 520 Moving Fees
Brood War
General
Data needed ASL21 General Discussion BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ ASL21 Strategy, Pimpest Plays Discussions [ASL21] Ro16 Preview Pt2: All Star
Tourneys
[ASL21] Ro16 Group D [ASL21] Ro16 Group C [ASL21] Ro16 Group B [Megathread] Daily Proleagues
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers What's the deal with APM & what's its true value Any training maps people recommend? Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
Dawn of War IV Nintendo Switch Thread Starcraft Tabletop Miniature Game General RTS Discussion Thread Battle Aces/David Kim RTS Megathread
Dota 2
The Story of Wings Gaming
League of Legends
G2 just beat GenG in First stand
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread YouTube Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books Movie Discussion!
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion McBoner: A hockey love story Cricket [SPORT]
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
[G] How to Block Livestream Ads
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Sexual Health Of Gamers
TrAiDoS
lurker extra damage testi…
StaticNine
Broowar part 2
qwaykee
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Iranian anarchists: organize…
XenOsky
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 2370 users

I love the hype of HotS, but it WONT last - Page 2

Blogs > Chiyosuke
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 All
HeavenResign
Profile Joined April 2011
United States702 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-03-20 20:11:54
March 20 2013 18:56 GMT
#21
The "meta" isn't truly changing if it's being artificially changed by constant patch changes. That's the game itself being changed. I don't think you understand what the term "meta game" actually is, Artosis tries to detail it in this blog post.

http://scdojo.tumblr.com/post/34233737871/mapping-out-the-metagame

The goal of SC2 should be no more patches and a rotating map pool. I don't know how else to put it - your last idea is flat out bad. If there are continued holes in design perhaps LotV should add new units (Blizz have mentioned that when originally conceived LotV wouldn't necessarily add new multiplayer units), but otherwise trends will develop based on common play styles, and new trends will develop in response. This is evident in BW and even SC2, it's just a lot of the strongest strategies weren't super fun to watch in WoL and I think with HotS that will change.

If you want to play other games, cool. They aren't Starcraft and what makes those other games great isn't necessarily what makes Starcraft great.

I have a feeling this blog is baiting responses based on the sensationalist title, but perhaps this won't fall on deaf ears.

Chiyosuke
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States51 Posts
March 20 2013 21:02 GMT
#22
You get +1 armor by getting an earlier gas and building an evo chamber. It's already within the game's constraints and the only thing holding you back is a lack of mechanics.


What I'm providing are examples, there are other things that can be integrated, like extra HP on units, increased movement speed, attack speed, etc, it doesn't necessarily have to be what I was stating.

You would need time to see the map and make the proper talent adjustments before going into the game, otherwise you're risking players subjecting themselves to inappropriate talent choices.


Very true, but with the map pool that has been presented within the past couple of years, the talent pool would be easily chosen once players were able to get used to it.

your last idea is flat out bad

I really hope my idea is bad; I want to be proven wrong on this. It's just I have a feeling that during the next couple of years it will be a repeat of what had happened in WoL. Game is released and there's a huge fuss around it -> Players understand the game and do the same strat -> Game starts to be boring and player base drops to something else.

this blog is baiting responses

I just want readers. If everything that I typed is wrong I'm one of the happiest people on this planet because a game that I love will continue onto further generations.

Again, I just want people to do anything that they can in order to keep this game alive. I don't care by what means. I don't give a damn if anything that I wrote down was implemented or not. I just don't want to see this game lose a large player base because of the same thing twice
Sentenal
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United States12398 Posts
March 20 2013 21:13 GMT
#23
On March 20 2013 12:41 Chiyosuke wrote:
Show nested quote +
BW was magical because even with its "static unit pool" there were moments where players would figure out something new that destroys the current trends (Bisu build, Fantasy Build, etc)


I also understand that BW was amazing, but from what I have heard the community was much much smaller than what it is today. E-sports is appealing a much wider audience now, and I just wanted to try and think of ways to appeal to as many people into the game as possible.

BW was alot smaller in the foreigner scene, but it was still active and healthy. I remember the first 2 TSLs were extremely well done, although in general, there just wasn't any money in Foreign BW. In Korea, BW was anything but small. BW was able to enjoy over 10 years of success due to constantly changing/evolving maps, and incredibly high skill ceiling, and just the depth of the game itself. Whether or not BW was some sort of cosmic accident that will be impossible to reproduce again, we may never know.
"Apparently, Sentenal is a paragon of friendship and tolerance. " - Ech0ne
Futabot
Profile Joined October 2011
United States37 Posts
March 20 2013 23:36 GMT
#24
[B]On March 21 2013 06:02 Chiyosuke wrote:
What I'm providing are examples, there are other things that can be integrated, like extra HP on units, increased movement speed, attack speed, etc, it doesn't necessarily have to be what I was stating.

Very true, but with the map pool that has been presented within the past couple of years, the talent pool would be easily chosen once players were able to get used to it.


What you're proposing are upgrades that have no actual cost in game. You're going to have to design a buff that cannot be balanced through an in-match resource cost, whether its tech, raw resources or time. It's a lot harder to balance things you can't adjust with other variables. It doesn't matter if they have an upgrade counterpart or not.

League gets away with the rune and talent system because one of them is a source of player progress and the other helps wiggle around in the limited play style changes, but I have really yet to see any large majority of players stick with League solely because of talents/runes. It sounds like a cool feature, but then it ceases to be a highlight after a while. In the end, solid play will emerge victorious over gimmicky talent-builds, and the players excited by the feature will likely realize that the feature doesn't fix their fundamental boredom with actually learning the game.

As for the maps, we're talking about ladder, not a tournament pool. You don't get to pick exactly what map you're on, so they would have to implement a secondary game lobby for each match after joining. Given the complexity of SC2, you're probably also going to have to change talents based on what race you're facing as well. We're adding at least 20 seconds onto every game join for basically nothing.

In the end, stick to upgrade design space. More isn't better, really.
One rax. One pylon.
Prev 1 2 All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 1h 17m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
PiGStarcraft150
ProTech133
SpeCial 25
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 13300
Artosis 448
Dota 2
monkeys_forever635
capcasts126
Counter-Strike
minikerr17
Super Smash Bros
PPMD62
Other Games
summit1g9528
tarik_tv4555
Grubby3744
FrodaN1026
shahzam473
C9.Mang0436
m0e_tv157
Trikslyr140
ViBE51
Mew2King26
amsayoshi14
Organizations
Other Games
BasetradeTV371
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 16 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Hupsaiya 82
• RyuSc2 51
• musti20045 32
• Adnapsc2 18
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• RayReign 31
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Other Games
• imaqtpie1310
Upcoming Events
PiGosaur Cup
1h 17m
PiGStarcraft150
RSL Revival
11h 17m
Replay Cast
1d 1h
The PondCast
1d 11h
KCM Race Survival
1d 11h
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
1d 12h
Gerald vs TBD
Clem vs TBD
ByuN vs TBD
Rogue vs MaxPax
ShoWTimE vs TBD
OSC
1d 16h
CranKy Ducklings
2 days
Escore
2 days
RSL Revival
2 days
[ Show More ]
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
3 days
Universe Titan Cup
3 days
Rogue vs Percival
Ladder Legends
3 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
3 days
BSL
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
4 days
Ladder Legends
4 days
BSL
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Wardi Open
5 days
Afreeca Starleague
5 days
Soma vs TBD
Monday Night Weeklies
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Afreeca Starleague
6 days
TBD vs YSC
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-04-20
RSL Revival: Season 4
NationLESS Cup

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
ASL Season 21
CSL 2026 SPRING (S20)
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
StarCraft2 Community Team League 2026 Spring
WardiTV TLMC #16
Nations Cup 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S2: W4
Acropolis #4
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Maestros of the Game 2
2026 GSL S2
RSL Revival: Season 5
2026 GSL S1
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.