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This is an important topic. Funny because I been thinking about it for a while now. I just wanted to throw in that Left/Right decisions (Choices that don't seem to matter) can be disguised as complex systems and still fail. Diablo 3 for instance, advertising hundreds of builds, but really there are only a few ideal builds. WoW's talent system was messed up when I seen it last, what's the point of variety of skills if everyone just picks the strongest cookie-cutter build anyway.
Games are interactive, choices make the experience. Or else it's not a video game, it's just a video.
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On August 30 2012 05:14 Spikeke wrote:
This is an important topic. Funny because I been thinking about it for a while now. I just wanted to throw in that Left/Right decisions (Choices that don't seem to matter) can be disguised as complex systems and still fail. Diablo 3 for instance, advertising hundreds of builds, but really there are only a few ideal builds. WoW's talent system was messed up when I seen it last, what's the point of variety of skills if everyone just picks the strongest cookie-cutter build anyway.
Games are interactive, choices make the experience. Or else it's not a video game, it's just a video.
For MoP, WoW did a major overhaul in the talents. You now have 3 specs which give most of the important, cookie-cutter abilities from before, and then about 18 talents which are fairly equivalent but different enough in their own way.
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This is pretty much the reason I only play multiplayer games like LoL and SC2. Every game is different, I can literally use any of thousands of builds, from 3 races or 100 characters and I have to react to other real people who act differently not just ai who are programmed to do the same thing no matter what.
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On August 30 2012 05:25 Luepert wrote:
This is pretty much the reason I only play multiplayer games like LoL and SC2. Every game is different, I can literally use any of thousands of builds, from 3 races or 100 characters and I have to react to other real people who act differently not just ai who are programmed to do the same thing no matter what.
That's not really true. In RTS your build is first going to be dependent on the other player. Then there are just certain builds that don't work (ex: mech against protoss sc2, or bio against protoss BW), and certain builds that have to be used in order to counter the other person's build (if a zerg goes 6 pool, you can't CC first, you can't fast expand. if they go early aggression that means you go early defense instead of anything you want). When you think about it more deeply, there are very few alterations in style of play and builds, and the choice you think you have is just an illusion.
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umm, can we get a text version by any chance?
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On August 30 2012 09:52 Cyber_Cheese wrote:
umm, can we get a text version by any chance?
Oh, I made this specifically on Video form :/. But if a lot of people would rather have me post writing I could do that in future blogs! 
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On August 30 2012 05:51 Roe wrote:Show nested quote +On August 30 2012 05:25 Luepert wrote:
This is pretty much the reason I only play multiplayer games like LoL and SC2. Every game is different, I can literally use any of thousands of builds, from 3 races or 100 characters and I have to react to other real people who act differently not just ai who are programmed to do the same thing no matter what. That's not really true. In RTS your build is first going to be dependent on the other player. Then there are just certain builds that don't work (ex: mech against protoss sc2, or bio against protoss BW), and certain builds that have to be used in order to counter the other person's build (if a zerg goes 6 pool, you can't CC first, you can't fast expand. if they go early aggression that means you go early defense instead of anything you want). When you think about it more deeply, there are very few alterations in style of play and builds, and the choice you think you have is just an illusion.
But the threat of alternate lines of play keeps you from making truly optimal plays, and once the game state departs from well-explored territory, it's all about choice as well as execution.
The most engaging games (games in general, not sc2) ride on the line between "I know what to do" and "I have no idea what to do".
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EPT
