• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 07:34
CET 12:34
KST 20:34
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Finals Preview: Sweet Victory!12[ASL22] Ro4 Preview: Mirror Mirror6[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach5[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5
Community News
Weekly Cups (October 19-25): Clem triples first in 5.0.174Evil Geniuses - shutting down20ISSL (IntoTheTV x SOOP SC2 League): Premier5Weekly Cups (October 12-18): 5.0.17 era begins1[$1250] International ShieldBattery League92
StarCraft 2
General
How do you feel about the mass reverts in the 5.0.17 PTR? Weekly Cups (October 19-25): Clem triples first in 5.0.17 Evil Geniuses - shutting down REPORT: StarCraft 2: Remastered In Development No more SC2 streamers on team liquid?
Tourneys
2026 KungFu Cup Announcement RSL goes to London! 2026 Offline Finals Nov 21-22 ScienceCraft (October 24-25) - Live Event Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament ISSL (IntoTheTV x SOOP SC2 League): Premier
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
Simple Questions/Answers [G] How to playtest arcade maps [A] Nemrods 1/4 players
External Content
Mutation # 549 Endless Sparkles The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 548 Shining Bright Mutation # 547 Temple Of Terror
Brood War
General
Starcraft player cRuZa Passed away. BW General Discussion BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Do we even care about balance? SCHNAIL now supports Remastered
Tourneys
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 4 [BSL23] RO24 Group D - Sunday 21:00 CET [$1250] International ShieldBattery League [Megathread] Daily Proleagues
Strategy
50,000-Word Terran Builds Memo 2026-10-22 Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Mobile Legends: Bang Bang Armies of Exigo - YesYes? General RTS Discussion Thread
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25!
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread The Chess Thread
Fan Clubs
Reynor Fan Club The Flash Fan Club Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
Innovate or Game Over?
TrAiDoS
ShieldBattery on Mac
Kraekkling
[ASL22] Ro4 Day1 Ticket Giv…
bITt.mAN
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 8190 users

Mechanics and Success two totally dif things

Blogs > ohokurwrong
Post a Reply
ohokurwrong
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
Brazil283 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-07 03:28:09
January 07 2012 02:51 GMT
#1
inspired from http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/f7e8j/seriously_guys_if_youre_in_platinum_or_below_your/

So basically this is more of a vent of frustration more then anything. Lately I have been watching some streams and the #1 thing i see are haters. Now haters/trolls are funny and unless someone is actually truly offended I rather enjoy reading what some of them have to say.

The #1 stream troll is "omg how are you so bad you are so and so"

this comes in all forms from calling artosis bad for stacking mins or calling a random pro terrible all the way down to the casual who happens to stream.

The #1 response from these people is "i dont have time to work on my mechanics"

I disagree with this. Anyone who learns sc2 can easily get at least low masters imo with sub 50 apm. Now 50 apm is very slow but i think what it basically allows for is your basic making of units and basic a move of units with room for bits of micro but nothing fancy. At 50 apm you can expect them to never do drops or harass and they dont react very quickly to things that might be avoidable if the reaction time of said player was only a bit faster. My proposition is simply this, I am willing to bet that I can play z or p arguably the 2 hardest races to defend as when compared to terran, (i think terran can be agreed upon as the ultimate defenders race and thus would make low apm defense easier as well as scouting easier) into masters league with 1 build per race and only macro and go tactics. I wont take fast 3rds or do crazy tech. if its zvp its going to be all roaches (hydras if he has voids) if its a pvt collosi or all chargelots and stalkers, no storms. Most important of all is that all my games will be macro

This was inspired from this guide on reddit about doing a similar style into diamond. now masters is most likely harder then this test was and i imagine protoss is the easiest race to get masters as (low masters its very hard to beat high masters gm as toss...) so i threw zerg into the mix to add to the challenge

I also think the timing of this could not be any better as recently people were giving goody shit about how he is so slow and bad at macro and still wins. By doing this I can also show the flaws in sc2 a bit. Someone who will be playing as slow as I am going to be playing, should never ever get masters.


So simply put what race do i pick?
Poll: What race

Zerg (7)
 
88%

Protoss (1)
 
13%

8 total votes

Your vote: What race

(Vote): Zerg
(Vote): Protoss



I will be using a fresh diamond account Purple 492 and hopefully proving that game knowledge alone can lead to the "highest" league a non pro should be in. It will be streamed and replays recorded


I should clarify I am already top masters this is a test not to see if I am good or anything, it's to see if bad mechanics are what is keeping you out of whatever league is your goal

*
lastshadow
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States1372 Posts
January 07 2012 02:57 GMT
#2
T/Z are the most mechanically demanding of all the races, Z if you abuse creepspread to its fullest, and T if you actually can control it's funky maneuvers that the race supports.

Having low apm isn't an excuse to accept it btw, get faster, anyway if you want to win more at your level, pick Protoss, if you actually want to get better/be a better player (for now anyway) pick Zerg.
Patience is a small price to pay for perfection.
ohokurwrong
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
Brazil283 Posts
January 07 2012 03:01 GMT
#3
i dont plan on even spreading creep actually too much apm
lastshadow
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States1372 Posts
January 07 2012 03:02 GMT
#4
that's so lazy lol my god.
Patience is a small price to pay for perfection.
ohokurwrong
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
Brazil283 Posts
January 07 2012 03:05 GMT
#5
i wana prove a point
Itsmedudeman
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States19229 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-07 03:28:54
January 07 2012 03:24 GMT
#6
I don't think you understand what mechanics mean. Mechanics =/= macro. Also, I don't understand how this is proving a point. You think you're good and that you're proving a point if you're able to get into masters? Of COURSE 1 build fits all will work up to masters on ladder. IT'S LADDER, you're playing completely different players every game. They don't know what build you're gonna do from the start or what you did the last 200 games. Let's see this work against someone actually pretty good in a bo11.

Also, MVP himself said that mechanics isn't about apm, but rather your hands being able to do what you're thinking. If you can manage to do that, then you're good to go.
ohokurwrong
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
Brazil283 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-07 03:28:47
January 07 2012 03:26 GMT
#7
all im saying is that people tell me they have bad mechanics and cannot get out of said league.

im going to never spread creep hardly scout and just macro poorly but hopefully with the right units and goals in mind and see how far that takes me
DYEAlabaster
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
Canada1009 Posts
January 07 2012 04:01 GMT
#8
So are you trying to prove that masters is a joke? That the threshold is too low? I don't quite get the point of this.

It's not about how fast you play, it's about how quickly you can do what you want to do.
ohokurwrong
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
Brazil283 Posts
January 07 2012 04:03 GMT
#9
right and since in an RTS speed matters im going to not be fast
Cyber_Cheese
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Australia3615 Posts
January 07 2012 05:11 GMT
#10
Good luck, in terms of your results, I hope you do poorly, but you have my support for trying.
The moment you lose confidence in yourself, is the moment the world loses it's confidence in you.
imjorman
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States580 Posts
January 07 2012 05:45 GMT
#11
Did you make two threads of this really?

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=301149
People who want power shouldn't have it.
sob3k
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States7572 Posts
January 07 2012 05:54 GMT
#12
This proves nothing if you just cheese, My friend easily got into master using only proxy 2gate, his average apm was about 15 for most games
In Hungry Hungry Hippos there are no such constraints—one can constantly attempt to collect marbles with one’s hippo, limited only by one’s hippo-levering capabilities.
ohokurwrong
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
Brazil283 Posts
January 07 2012 06:47 GMT
#13
On January 07 2012 14:45 imjorman wrote:
Did you make two threads of this really?

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=301149


it was a mistake to post it in blog when it was clearly strat

so ye sorry

no i wont cheese what...
Cham
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
797 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-07 08:16:01
January 07 2012 08:12 GMT
#14
From your posts I must really think that you know absolutely nothing about how this game works. If your main account is masters it truly proves that all you need is proper mechanics, because your thought process is incorrect in so many ways (from what I have learned to be the accepted "norm"). Even if it is just a test, I can't it see working.
ohokurwrong
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
Brazil283 Posts
January 07 2012 09:46 GMT
#15
On January 07 2012 17:12 Cham wrote:
From your posts I must really think that you know absolutely nothing about how this game works. If your main account is masters it truly proves that all you need is proper mechanics, because your thought process is incorrect in so many ways (from what I have learned to be the accepted "norm"). Even if it is just a test, I can't it see working.


well tell this to idra who among others feel that builds in sc2 are far more important then other aspects of the game
him and other pros are quoted with saying how hard it is to defend builds that are just designed to beat whatever you are doing instantly especially if you hide what you are doing

but furthermore its a nice test to see what apm is actually needed to be a masters player. apm and mechanics go hand in hand. you cannot have good mechanics and 40 apm you just cant
-Kaiser-
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
Canada932 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-07 11:06:06
January 07 2012 11:02 GMT
#16
On January 07 2012 18:46 ohokurwrong wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 07 2012 17:12 Cham wrote:
From your posts I must really think that you know absolutely nothing about how this game works. If your main account is masters it truly proves that all you need is proper mechanics, because your thought process is incorrect in so many ways (from what I have learned to be the accepted "norm"). Even if it is just a test, I can't it see working.


well tell this to idra who among others feel that builds in sc2 are far more important then other aspects of the game
him and other pros are quoted with saying how hard it is to defend builds that are just designed to beat whatever you are doing instantly especially if you hide what you are doing

but furthermore its a nice test to see what apm is actually needed to be a masters player. apm and mechanics go hand in hand. you cannot have good mechanics and 40 apm you just cant



Having good mechanics as zerg means having good larvae injects more than anything else. IdrA and other pros talk about builds being more important in SC2 than Brood War, but they're all playing above a certain threshold of mechanical skill.

It's like if a pilot tells you that the most important part about flying X airplane is how certain equipment behaves. He's assuming you know how to fly an airplane.

Your larvae injects with zerg are a direct translation into how many units you have. If your mechanics aren't good enough, you lose the game. At the absolute top level, you can't miss more than one inject for most of the game or you lose. It's as simple as that.

The idea that you plan to play this game with "only one build" and not do weird things like "take fast thirds" as Zerg really speaks volumes about how little you understand what you're talking about.
3 Hatch Before Cool
Nomag
Profile Joined March 2011
Sweden10 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-09 15:19:52
January 09 2012 15:15 GMT
#17
You should change the way you're thinking. Some say that you have bad mechanics and low apm and blablabla. instead of trying to get higher apm or improve your mechanics you and others just say that you can be good without them.
think they need more of a fighter or hard worker mentality.

however if you don't give a single crap about mechanics you have to make up for it with decisionmaking. For example know when to tech like crazy and when to take fast thirds like you said you wouldn't do.

I do agree with terran having the easiest time defending but terran (unless playing mech) almost NEEDS to be aggressive, with that comes the need of multitasking and good mechanics. But maybe that's off topic.

I don't really agree with your statements but i do support your way to achieve your goal
plasemeious
Profile Joined November 2009
United States244 Posts
January 09 2012 18:09 GMT
#18
I look forward to seeing you do this
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
IntoTheTV X SOOP
20:00
Premier - Group D
SHIN vs GuMiho
Clem vs Classic
IntoTheiNu 864
WardiTV381
Rex86
CranKy Ducklings65
LiquipediaDiscussion
KCM Race Survival
19:00
Season 4 Week 3
Kim Chul Min (afreeca) 1465
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
mouzHeroMarine 305
Lowko94
Rex 86
StarCraft: Brood War
Bisu 1277
Horang2 1209
actioN 968
Jaedong 916
Shuttle 779
Stork 264
Soma 257
Snow 192
FanTaSy 183
EffOrt 176
[ Show more ]
Light 161
Larva 155
Mini 121
Mind 112
Last 104
ggaemo 73
ZerO 72
Hyun 61
Barracks 60
Mong 48
910 41
ToSsGirL 40
Sexy 38
sSak 35
Sharp 35
JYJ 30
Sea.KH 28
hero 18
Sacsri 17
yabsab 17
Free 16
Terrorterran 15
Noble 14
soO 9
Dota 2
Gorgc13407
XcaliburYe142
Counter-Strike
olofmeister792
Other Games
B2W.Neo476
crisheroes286
DeMusliM223
dupreeh175
KnowMe93
ArmadaUGS47
ZerO(Twitch)9
Organizations
Counter-Strike
PGL35800
StarCraft: Brood War
lovetv 9
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• CranKy Ducklings SOOP5
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• iopq 7
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• lizZardDota2147
League of Legends
• Stunt832
Other Games
• WagamamaTV132
Upcoming Events
OSC
2h 27m
OSC
10h 27m
GSL
1d
Epic.LAN
1d 1h
Replay Cast
1d 11h
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 22h
WardiTV Invitational
2 days
Epic.LAN
2 days
AI Arena Tournament
2 days
Yamato Cup
3 days
[ Show More ]
Map Test Tournament
3 days
WardiTV Weekly
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Rogue vs Classic
Patches Events
5 days
PiGosaur Cup
5 days
Kung Fu Cup
5 days
The PondCast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-10-28
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
HCC Season 3

Ongoing

Acropolis #5
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 4
International ShieldBattery League
BSL Season 23
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026

Upcoming

IPSL Winter 2026-27
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
eXTREMESLAND 2026
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.