• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 11:23
CEST 17:23
KST 00:23
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Weekly Cups (July 13-19): Terran & Protoss rise; Zerg falters0Serral wins HomeStory Cup 2914Serral wins Maestros of the Game 243ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play3Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7
Community News
Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16)65Reynor: GSL Loss Wasn't About Preparation Format16[IPSL] Spring 2026 Grand Finals - This Weekend!18Weekly Cups (July 6 - 12): Protoss strike back12BSL Season 22 Full Overview & Conclusion8
StarCraft 2
General
Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16) How would you feel about frequent/monthly balance patches for SC2? Weekly Cups (July 13-19): Terran & Protoss rise; Zerg falters Clem: "I don't have that much hope in Blizzard" [D] Wireframe Casting Removed
Tourneys
RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) WardiTV Summer Cup 2026 GSL CK #5 Race War HomeStory Cup 29
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
New Map Maker - Looking for Advice - Love or Hate Work In Progress Melee Maps [D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3
External Content
Mutation # 535 Assembly of Vengeance The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 534 Burning Evacuation Mutation # 533 Die Together
Brood War
General
screpdb: new Starcraft reporting tool ASL22 General Discussion Animated Gateway NaDa's Body BW General Discussion
Tourneys
[IPSL] Spring 2026 Grand Finals - This Weekend! [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Escore Tournament - Season 3 Small VOD Thread 2.0
Strategy
Fighting Spirit mining rates Simple Questions, Simple Answers Creating a full chart of Zerg builds Relatively freeroll strategies
Other Games
General Games
ZeroSpace at Steam NextFest - Last free demo Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread General RTS Discussion Thread
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Power Rank NeO.D_StephenKing vs This Guy From 1 Million Dance TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread How to buy a book - shipping from Korea to Europe The Games Industry And ATVI UK Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club The HerO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books Series you have seen recently...
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023 McBoner: A hockey love story Tennis[sport]
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Simple Questions Simple Answers FPS when play League Of Legend on laptop
TL Community
Northern Ireland Global Starcraft The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Role of Gaming on Mental Hea…
TrAiDoS
ASL S22 English Commentary…
namkraft
Poker (part 2)
Nebuchad
An Exploration of th…
waywardstrategy
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 11118 users

'War is Hell' - Page 2

Blogs > Bobo_XIII
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 All
ozeake
Profile Joined September 2010
Finland48 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-26 02:20:50
December 26 2011 02:19 GMT
#21
On December 26 2011 10:15 Newbistic wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 26 2011 10:01 ozeake wrote:
On December 26 2011 09:08 Newbistic wrote:
Irony


What is, the fact that people who want to kill other people seek places where they get to do so with impunity? It's the same as politics: those who most desire power should really not have it.


No, the irony is from calling soldiers who potentially fight front-line battles cowards and being amused by "tough talk" while hiding behind his own computer doing his own "tough talk".

While your point may have some philosophical truth, it's pragmatically irrelevant. People who desire something will work to earn it. Those who work the most towards their desires will have the highest chance of obtaining what they desire. Whether or not these people "should have it" does not factor into the equation since there's no real way to determine who else is better qualified.

Also, think about the motivations of these people. They're not all insane psychopaths who just wish to kill anybody with impunity as you seem to be implying. They wish to do something for their country, and that something happens to involve killing the enemies of their country. Most accounts I've read of soldiers describe how they become transformed through the horrors of warfare and realizing how they underestimated what they signed up for. This is just their difficult path to adulthood.


I'd ask that you don't lump me in with other people's words, I did not call them "cowards" at any point. Most of them are probably not psychopaths, but that does leave some who are.
As for qualifications: not being a psychopath strikes me as a very important one. Doesn't matter how accurate you can be with a gun if your motivations for using it are not "professional" (can't think of a better fitting word for it but I hope you get what I mean). Those people should not be allowed to have anything to do with weapons.

It's like this: would you trust a surgeon who operates on people not so much because it is his profession but because he enjoys cutting people up?
Ignorance is the shield of a fool.
Newbistic
Profile Blog Joined August 2006
China2912 Posts
December 26 2011 02:43 GMT
#22
Trust has nothing to do with it. Being good at your job is really all that matters in the end. It's possible for a surgeon to be extremely good at his job when his real motivation is that he enjoys cutting people up. It is also possible for a surgeon to have a very strong desire to help people, but actually be terrible at his job.

Same with soldiers. A good soldier is only really quantified by his marksmanship, his ability to follow orders, and his ability to fight as part of his squad. If his motivations affect these qualities in any way (disobedience, shooting civilians, hostility towards fellow soldiers), then he's not a good soldier. The underlying motivations whether it be enjoying killing things or patriotism doesn't factor in unless it physically manifests itself in a tangible way.

Motivations or personal morality are more about self-growth and self-discovery. For the most part society doesn't care about how or why you get somewhere, only that you got there.
Logic is Overrated
ozeake
Profile Joined September 2010
Finland48 Posts
December 26 2011 03:01 GMT
#23
On December 26 2011 11:43 Newbistic wrote:
Same with soldiers. A good soldier is only really quantified by his marksmanship, his ability to follow orders, and his ability to fight as part of his squad. If his motivations affect these qualities in any way (disobedience, shooting civilians, hostility towards fellow soldiers), then he's not a good soldier. The underlying motivations whether it be enjoying killing things or patriotism doesn't factor in unless it physically manifests itself in a tangible way.


I think this is the point of contention here: I'm saying the motivations do show and not in minor ways either.
As an example, the whole Abu Ghraib mess. If the whole chain of command was filled with people who had the view of "being a soldier is an unpleasant but a necessary job" and not something like "I enjoy causing suffering", would it have happened in the first place?
The military has some fucked up people in it and they are not being kept on a short enough leash.
Ignorance is the shield of a fool.
Newbistic
Profile Blog Joined August 2006
China2912 Posts
December 26 2011 03:08 GMT
#24
How would you propose going about weeding out these fucked up people before they get to where they are, then?
Logic is Overrated
ozeake
Profile Joined September 2010
Finland48 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-26 03:19:31
December 26 2011 03:19 GMT
#25
Psychological testing perhaps? I don't know how thoroughly they are screened at recruiting but whatever they are doing, it is not effective enough.
Ignorance is the shield of a fool.
Prev 1 2 All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
WardiTV Weekly
11:00
WardiTV Mondays #96
WardiTV1482
IntoTheiNu 714
OGKoka 559
Rex143
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
OGKoka 559
Ryung 236
Rex 143
SHIN 114
RushiSC 39
StarCraft: Brood War
Rain 3442
Bisu 2255
Shuttle 2210
Soulkey 805
EffOrt 795
Mini 746
Soma 603
BeSt 580
firebathero 345
Light 277
[ Show more ]
Larva 248
Stork 243
ZerO 225
actioN 193
Rush 155
Snow 118
Dewaltoss 109
Hyun 99
Pusan 92
ggaemo 74
soO 42
ToSsGirL 39
Free 38
scan(afreeca) 34
910 27
Sexy 25
Terrorterran 25
JulyZerg 24
yabsab 23
HiyA 21
Hm[arnc] 19
Sacsri 17
Aegong 17
ajuk12(nOOB) 11
Noble 10
IntoTheRainbow 8
Bale 8
Dota 2
qojqva2621
syndereN408
420jenkins130
League of Legends
Trikslyr36
Counter-Strike
x6flipin329
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor189
Other Games
singsing2478
B2W.Neo964
Lowko449
crisheroes310
Liquid`VortiX220
Hui .183
KnowMe142
ToD125
QueenE43
Livibee35
ZerO(Twitch)15
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick2289
BasetradeTV252
StarCraft: Brood War
Kim Chul Min (afreeca) 8
lovetv 7
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 16 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• mYiSmile129
• Adnapsc2 6
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• blackmanpl 20
• HerbMon 13
• Michael_bg 7
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Nemesis3841
Upcoming Events
Monday Night Weeklies
37m
PiGosaur Cup
1d 8h
The PondCast
1d 18h
Kung Fu Cup
1d 19h
OSC
2 days
CrankTV Team League
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
CrankTV Team League
3 days
Korean StarCraft League
4 days
RSL Revival
4 days
Clem vs ByuN
Serral vs SHIN
[ Show More ]
Online Event
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
RSL Revival
5 days
herO vs Solar
Rogue vs Lambo
WardiTV Weekly
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

IPSL Spring 2026
HSC XXIX
Eternal Conflict S2 E3

Ongoing

Acropolis #4
CSL 2026 Summer (S21)
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3
RSL Revival: Season 6
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
SCTL 2026 Spring
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S3: W4
ASL S22 SEASON OPEN Day 2
Escore Tournament S3: W5
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
HSC XXX
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
Light Tournament 2026
Eternal Conflict S2 Finale
Stake Ranked Episode 4
Logitech G Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #5
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.