• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 00:17
CEST 06:17
KST 13:17
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play0Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection7Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO8 Preview8
Community News
[TLMC] Summer 2026 Ladder Map Rotation05.0.16 patch for SC2 goes live (8 worker start)61ZeroSpace at Steam NextFest - Last free demo28Weekly Cups (June 8-14): Clem and Solar double, PTR tested0RSL: S6 Finals played at BlizzCon 202611
StarCraft 2
General
Enough with this crap patch: boring and suck! Possible bug in the new patch? Map Pool Suggestion For 1v1 HackErIsTop take on Patch 5.0.16 5.0.16 patch for SC2 goes live (8 worker start)
Tourneys
Douyu Cup 2026: $20,000 Legends Event (June 26-28) INu's Battles#17 <BO.9> RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament GSL CK #4 20-21th June
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
New Map Maker - Looking for Advice - Love or Hate Work In Progress Melee Maps [D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 531 Experimental Artillery Mutation # 530 One For All Mutation # 529 Opportunities Unleashed
Brood War
General
ASL 22 Proposed Map Pool [BSL22] Non-Korean Championship from 13 to 28 June BSL Season 22 BW General Discussion STARCRAFT MOVIE - Last Night at the Command center
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL22] GosuLeague Casts - Tue & Thu 22:00 CEST CSLAN 4 is Coming! Small VOD Thread 2.0
Strategy
Why doesn't anyone use restoration? Simple Questions, Simple Answers Relatively freeroll strategies Creating a full chart of Zerg builds
Other Games
General Games
ZeroSpace at Steam NextFest - Last free demo Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Games for Kids Nintendo Switch Thread The Perfect Game
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread [H]Internet/Gaming Cafe Tips and Tricks
Fan Clubs
The HerO Fan Club! The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Series you have seen recently... [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [TV/BOOK] *SPOILERS* Game of Thrones Discussion
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 McBoner: A hockey love story Formula 1 Discussion Cricket [SPORT]
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Facing Challenges in Mobile App Development
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
How To Predict Tilt in Espor…
TrAiDoS
An Exploration of th…
waywardstrategy
I'm an arrogant trash talke…
FlaShFTW
Gauntlet SC2: A Retrospectiv…
Ctone23
Why RTS gamers make better f…
gosubay
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 13008 users

'War is Hell' - Page 2

Blogs > Bobo_XIII
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 All
ozeake
Profile Joined September 2010
Finland48 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-26 02:20:50
December 26 2011 02:19 GMT
#21
On December 26 2011 10:15 Newbistic wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 26 2011 10:01 ozeake wrote:
On December 26 2011 09:08 Newbistic wrote:
Irony


What is, the fact that people who want to kill other people seek places where they get to do so with impunity? It's the same as politics: those who most desire power should really not have it.


No, the irony is from calling soldiers who potentially fight front-line battles cowards and being amused by "tough talk" while hiding behind his own computer doing his own "tough talk".

While your point may have some philosophical truth, it's pragmatically irrelevant. People who desire something will work to earn it. Those who work the most towards their desires will have the highest chance of obtaining what they desire. Whether or not these people "should have it" does not factor into the equation since there's no real way to determine who else is better qualified.

Also, think about the motivations of these people. They're not all insane psychopaths who just wish to kill anybody with impunity as you seem to be implying. They wish to do something for their country, and that something happens to involve killing the enemies of their country. Most accounts I've read of soldiers describe how they become transformed through the horrors of warfare and realizing how they underestimated what they signed up for. This is just their difficult path to adulthood.


I'd ask that you don't lump me in with other people's words, I did not call them "cowards" at any point. Most of them are probably not psychopaths, but that does leave some who are.
As for qualifications: not being a psychopath strikes me as a very important one. Doesn't matter how accurate you can be with a gun if your motivations for using it are not "professional" (can't think of a better fitting word for it but I hope you get what I mean). Those people should not be allowed to have anything to do with weapons.

It's like this: would you trust a surgeon who operates on people not so much because it is his profession but because he enjoys cutting people up?
Ignorance is the shield of a fool.
Newbistic
Profile Blog Joined August 2006
China2912 Posts
December 26 2011 02:43 GMT
#22
Trust has nothing to do with it. Being good at your job is really all that matters in the end. It's possible for a surgeon to be extremely good at his job when his real motivation is that he enjoys cutting people up. It is also possible for a surgeon to have a very strong desire to help people, but actually be terrible at his job.

Same with soldiers. A good soldier is only really quantified by his marksmanship, his ability to follow orders, and his ability to fight as part of his squad. If his motivations affect these qualities in any way (disobedience, shooting civilians, hostility towards fellow soldiers), then he's not a good soldier. The underlying motivations whether it be enjoying killing things or patriotism doesn't factor in unless it physically manifests itself in a tangible way.

Motivations or personal morality are more about self-growth and self-discovery. For the most part society doesn't care about how or why you get somewhere, only that you got there.
Logic is Overrated
ozeake
Profile Joined September 2010
Finland48 Posts
December 26 2011 03:01 GMT
#23
On December 26 2011 11:43 Newbistic wrote:
Same with soldiers. A good soldier is only really quantified by his marksmanship, his ability to follow orders, and his ability to fight as part of his squad. If his motivations affect these qualities in any way (disobedience, shooting civilians, hostility towards fellow soldiers), then he's not a good soldier. The underlying motivations whether it be enjoying killing things or patriotism doesn't factor in unless it physically manifests itself in a tangible way.


I think this is the point of contention here: I'm saying the motivations do show and not in minor ways either.
As an example, the whole Abu Ghraib mess. If the whole chain of command was filled with people who had the view of "being a soldier is an unpleasant but a necessary job" and not something like "I enjoy causing suffering", would it have happened in the first place?
The military has some fucked up people in it and they are not being kept on a short enough leash.
Ignorance is the shield of a fool.
Newbistic
Profile Blog Joined August 2006
China2912 Posts
December 26 2011 03:08 GMT
#24
How would you propose going about weeding out these fucked up people before they get to where they are, then?
Logic is Overrated
ozeake
Profile Joined September 2010
Finland48 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-26 03:19:31
December 26 2011 03:19 GMT
#25
Psychological testing perhaps? I don't know how thoroughly they are screened at recruiting but whatever they are doing, it is not effective enough.
Ignorance is the shield of a fool.
Prev 1 2 All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 43m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
PiGStarcraft726
WinterStarcraft507
RuFF_SC2 192
NeuroSwarm 151
ViBE116
StarCraft: Brood War
GuemChi 2768
Rain 2449
Shuttle 634
Mind 200
Leta 180
ZergMaN 24
Bale 21
Icarus 6
yabsab 6
Terrorterran 5
League of Legends
JimRising 699
Counter-Strike
summit1g9157
m0e_tv504
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox1110
Mew2King90
Other Games
C9.Mang0245
Maynarde92
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1165
BasetradeTV288
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 16 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Hupsaiya 99
• practicex 26
• OhrlRock 1
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Rush1166
• Lourlo1106
• Stunt441
Upcoming Events
Douyu Cup 2020
43m
Oliveira vs Trap
Jieshi vs XY
soO vs FanTaSy
TY vs Coffee
OSC
11h 43m
Douyu Cup 2020
1d
Neeb vs Impact
MacSed vs Cyan
Scarlett vs Kelazhur
INnoVation vs Dear
Douyu Cup 2020
2 days
Maestros of the Game
2 days
herO vs Classic
Maru vs Serral
BSL22 NKC (BSL vs China)
2 days
Douyu Cup 2020
3 days
BSL22 NKC (BSL vs China)
3 days
Online Event
3 days
RSL Revival
3 days
[ Show More ]
WardiTV Weekly
4 days
RSL Revival
5 days
RSL Revival
5 days
Kung Fu Cup
6 days
OSC
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-06-24
WardiTV Spring 2026
Heroes Pulsing #2

Ongoing

IPSL Spring 2026
Acropolis #4
CSCL: Masked Kings S4
YSL S3
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSL Season 21: Qualifier 1
CSL Season 21: Qualifier 2
SCTL 2026 Spring
Douyu Cup 2026
Maestros of the Game 2
Murky Cup 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026

Upcoming

CSL 2026 Summer (S21)
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Revival: Season 6
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
HSC XXIX
BCC 2026
Light Tournament 2026
Eternal Conflict S2 Finale
Eternal Conflict S2 E1
Heroes Pulsing #3
FISSURE Playground #5
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.