• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 00:37
CEST 06:37
KST 13:37
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Power Rank - Esports World Cup 202561RSL Season 1 - Final Week9[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall15HomeStory Cup 27 - Info & Preview18Classic wins Code S Season 2 (2025)16
Community News
BSL Team Wars - Bonyth, Dewalt, Hawk & Sziky teams10Weekly Cups (July 14-20): Final Check-up0Esports World Cup 2025 - Brackets Revealed19Weekly Cups (July 7-13): Classic continues to roll8Team TLMC #5 - Submission re-extension5
StarCraft 2
General
#1: Maru - Greatest Players of All Time Server Blocker Team TLMC #5 - Submission re-extension Greatest Players of All Time: 2025 Update The StarCraft 2 GOAT - An in-depth analysis
Tourneys
Esports World Cup 2025 FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $8000 live event Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond)
Strategy
How did i lose this ZvP, whats the proper response
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation #239 Bad Weather Mutation # 483 Kill Bot Wars Mutation # 482 Wheel of Misfortune Mutation # 481 Fear and Lava
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Ginuda's JaeDong Interview Series [Update] ShieldBattery: 2025 Redesign BW General Discussion Dewalt's Show Matches in China
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL20] Non-Korean Championship 4x BSL + 4x China CSL Xiamen International Invitational [CSLPRO] It's CSLAN Season! - Last Chance
Strategy
[G] Mineral Boosting Does 1 second matter in StarCraft? Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Total Annihilation Server - TAForever Nintendo Switch Thread [MMORPG] Tree of Savior (Successor of Ragnarok) Path of Exile
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
Stop Killing Games - European Citizens Initiative Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread US Politics Mega-thread Post Pic of your Favorite Food!
Fan Clubs
INnoVation Fan Club SKT1 Classic Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[\m/] Heavy Metal Thread Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Korean Music Discussion
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion 2024 - 2025 Football Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Installation of Windows 10 suck at "just a moment" Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
TeamLiquid Team Shirt On Sale The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Ping To Win? Pings And Their…
TrAiDoS
momentary artworks from des…
tankgirl
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Socialism Anyone?
GreenHorizons
Eight Anniversary as a TL…
Mizenhauer
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 656 users

Fastest

Blogs > TrueZerG
Post a Reply
TrueZerG
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
43 Posts
October 09 2011 21:46 GMT
#1
Didnt really think that this was noteworthy enough to go onto Broodwar section, But Ive been playing sc since about 2004, mostly interacting with the Pro Scene, not doing any hard core gaming but enjoying watching the games. Recently however ive begun playing some fastest maps just to pass the time, and ive been wondering: Why is it that noone plays Fastest on Broodwar?

-Is it just simply to hard to find a balanced metagame with Broodwar in there? I know protoss is slightly OP to begin with in original, but I figure that if you were to include Lurker hold tactics, medics, Corsair reaver on Fastest, Games would be a LOT more interesting to watch and play. However people these days only play fastest maps on Original. Does anybody have any ideas concerning this? also throwing out some fastest possible map ideas would be interesting? :D

Ive noticed sunken busts are usually just mass marines, why dont they incorporate firebats into the play too?
I just need a break from the pro scene until some body who can actually compete with Flash comes around XD so just something to pass the time ~

^lol reading this it makes barely any sense just skipping from idea to idea. Kk thanks I look forward to your replies

*
Savior: Quite the Irony there <3 all the same
marttorn
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Norway5211 Posts
October 09 2011 22:16 GMT
#2
Goddamnit, why do I get these thoughts in my head when I see the titles "Fastest" "Sucking Dick" and "The Happiest girl in the world" at the top of the blog section?

-_-;;
memes are a dish best served dank
JodoYodo
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Canada1772 Posts
October 09 2011 22:16 GMT
#3
I don't know about you, but when I play Fastest it's in BW
Dance dance dance 'till we run this town!
krndandaman
Profile Joined August 2009
Mozambique16569 Posts
October 09 2011 22:30 GMT
#4
--- Nuked ---
eNtitY~
Profile Joined January 2007
United States1293 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-09 22:35:18
October 09 2011 22:34 GMT
#5
The competitive fastest scene has always belonged to vanilla SC, I'm not sure why but SCD / VGT tried running BW FMP leagues and they were never as popular as vanilla. I think it was a lot more balanced on vanilla too


On October 10 2011 07:30 krndandaman wrote:
there was a pretty big fastest community but it seems to have pretty much nearly died.

there is still a korean fastest community though on fish server. they are pretty good...


Were still around. Currently Starcraftz.net is running a pretty successful ladder and SCD might be bringing one back as well.
http://www.starcraftdream.com
TrueZerG
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
43 Posts
October 09 2011 23:47 GMT
#6
marttorn Norway. October 10 2011 07:16. Posts 2416 PM Profile Blog Quote #
Goddamnit, why do I get these thoughts in my head when I see the titles "Fastest" "Sucking Dick" and "The Happiest girl in the world" at the top of the blog section?

-_-;;


wat O.o

Lol well I just started watching some of the older fastest players too, and they always competed on original.. ie" Mafia Hash. HydraVCK?
Savior: Quite the Irony there <3 all the same
shuttledance
Profile Joined December 2010
Canada18 Posts
October 10 2011 02:12 GMT
#7
one big reason is lurker/swarm hold at a ramp, on fastest theres no map control besides center contain but no need to expo so it doesn't matter. I used to play competitively and that was the #1 reason, lurkers and swarm.
shall we dance?
PH
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
United States6173 Posts
October 10 2011 02:24 GMT
#8
Fastest is fun to mess around in...but like shuttledance said, lurker+swarm just makes things pretty dumb pretty fast if you're not Protoss. Without Reavers, and even with Reavers, it's nearly impossible to break.
Hello
eNtitY~
Profile Joined January 2007
United States1293 Posts
October 10 2011 05:15 GMT
#9
Was anyone else here involved in SCD, VGT, FGt?
http://www.starcraftdream.com
ArvickHero
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
10387 Posts
October 10 2011 05:39 GMT
#10
lol Zergs always died or were crippled before they could even get to the lurker/swarm stage when played by competent fastest players. Whenever I played Fastest it was with BW, and Protoss is fucking strong (3Protoss = GG).
Writerptrk
Headlines
Profile Blog Joined April 2007
United States482 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-10 06:00:11
October 10 2011 05:59 GMT
#11
I played in the VGT for a bit. As most low money players would think, I too came into the scene thinking I'd wreck the entire tournament with my amazing C rank ICCup skills. Hahaha! I still have fond memories of how many times I got destroyed. I was pleasantly surprised at the micro/macro multitasking of the upper-tier players.

A lot of players complain about how powerful Protoss is. They are very powerful, but definitely not unbeatable in fastest. Most of their early rushes can be defended with good macro from a Terran and building placement for Zergs. But I'd say their drops are probably the hardest to intercept, which is why they're so good. Probably the best PPvsPP I've played consisted of constant storm/reaver drops, countering those same drops on my mineral lines, fighting for control of middle, and macroing off 30+ gates at the same time.

You'd think fastest games took hours, but this isn't zero clutter nr20! Most of my games were averaging around 15-20 minutes with longest being over an hour where I 1vs2 with two bases filled with factories. Let me tell you something, macroing from 50 factories hurts your wrist so much, hahaha!

As OP wanted to know, sunken breaking depends on when the opposition decides to attack the Zerg. Most times, I'd rush a Zerg with mass marines off four barracks while my partner made either zealots, zerglings, or more marines to help out. Four barracks before academy should have enough harassing power to prevent the Zerg from droning up. I could be wrong on the timing and count of barracks... I haven't played SC in a very long time. All these early pushes against the Zerg base is to delay their mining. You get a Zerg partner into mid-game with efficient mining and you might as well sit back and tech up while he/she does all the work. Mid-game Zerg > Protoss\Terran.

There are, however, quite a few drawbacks to the game. Cannon rushing is not a cheese and it's really powerful (sad face). You really have no idea what your opponent will do since the increase in gas/minerals means they can do anything they want sooner. And from my experience, most players are bad mannered. In my entire time playing in VGT, I befriended just two players... And the fastest channel on east (forgot the name) was similar to X-17 crap except their bm weren't funny.

Hope I answered something...



krndandaman
Profile Joined August 2009
Mozambique16569 Posts
October 10 2011 06:58 GMT
#12
--- Nuked ---
infinity2k9
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United Kingdom2397 Posts
October 10 2011 11:23 GMT
#13
Although games you see on youtube and ladders were on Vanilla, most people still play on BW anyway... personally i think the complaints are somewhat valid, MnM completely destroys everything in 1v1 Fastest. Lurker and swarm isn't that good, it's just fastest players don't use things like storms as much as low money players. So while they are throwing units at Zerg off 50 gateways it's no surprise they don't break it. Besides you should always be trying to kill Zerg off early as possible and avoid going into the choke if you don't need to; just kill their eco with storms and reaver push the front if needed.

And yeah shouldn't underestimate the best fastest players they are very good, the APMs look low but it's mostly valid actions there's no time to spam. What people don't pay enough attention to is their simcity, especially with Terran. Protoss feels easiest because of macro while Terran i'd say is probably actually strongest but who can keep up macro from 50 barracks?

I would like to keep playing but BWHF last i checked isn't running their hacker database anymore and i have no interest in the frustration of trying to play against people with MBS and maphacks. The Korean scene has the hacking problem too and personally, i just don't like the maps they use with the strange gas and mineral layout... VGT maps are what i have worked out all my simcities on and the design of Korean makes them all totally useless and harder to make good early game simcities, other than just walling off your choke totally which is bad in team games.

Also just a last comment but i think it's funny a lot of people see BGH as 'better' than fastest and play it a lot more. Personally i think fastest rewards good multitasking and macro a lot more... in BGH micro is rewarded more and you can just get annoyingly overwhelmed by bad players if your teammates are not good.
eNtitY~
Profile Joined January 2007
United States1293 Posts
October 10 2011 16:40 GMT
#14
On October 10 2011 20:23 infinity2k9 wrote:
Although games you see on youtube and ladders were on Vanilla, most people still play on BW anyway... personally i think the complaints are somewhat valid, MnM completely destroys everything in 1v1 Fastest. Lurker and swarm isn't that good, it's just fastest players don't use things like storms as much as low money players. So while they are throwing units at Zerg off 50 gateways it's no surprise they don't break it. Besides you should always be trying to kill Zerg off early as possible and avoid going into the choke if you don't need to; just kill their eco with storms and reaver push the front if needed.

And yeah shouldn't underestimate the best fastest players they are very good, the APMs look low but it's mostly valid actions there's no time to spam. What people don't pay enough attention to is their simcity, especially with Terran. Protoss feels easiest because of macro while Terran i'd say is probably actually strongest but who can keep up macro from 50 barracks?

I would like to keep playing but BWHF last i checked isn't running their hacker database anymore and i have no interest in the frustration of trying to play against people with MBS and maphacks. The Korean scene has the hacking problem too and personally, i just don't like the maps they use with the strange gas and mineral layout... VGT maps are what i have worked out all my simcities on and the design of Korean makes them all totally useless and harder to make good early game simcities, other than just walling off your choke totally which is bad in team games.

Also just a last comment but i think it's funny a lot of people see BGH as 'better' than fastest and play it a lot more. Personally i think fastest rewards good multitasking and macro a lot more... in BGH micro is rewarded more and you can just get annoyingly overwhelmed by bad players if your teammates are not good.


Swarm Lurkers were so good not just by themselves but also with Guardians, mass sunkens etc it was really hard to bust a SCD/VGT type choke. Temps weren't all that effective there. Thats why the competitive scene was almost completely vanilla.

On October 10 2011 14:59 Headlines wrote:
I played in the VGT for a bit. As most low money players would think, I too came into the scene thinking I'd wreck the entire tournament with my amazing C rank ICCup skills. Hahaha! I still have fond memories of how many times I got destroyed. I was pleasantly surprised at the micro/macro multitasking of the upper-tier players.

A lot of players complain about how powerful Protoss is. They are very powerful, but definitely not unbeatable in fastest. Most of their early rushes can be defended with good macro from a Terran and building placement for Zergs. But I'd say their drops are probably the hardest to intercept, which is why they're so good. Probably the best PPvsPP I've played consisted of constant storm/reaver drops, countering those same drops on my mineral lines, fighting for control of middle, and macroing off 30+ gates at the same time.

You'd think fastest games took hours, but this isn't zero clutter nr20! Most of my games were averaging around 15-20 minutes with longest being over an hour where I 1vs2 with two bases filled with factories. Let me tell you something, macroing from 50 factories hurts your wrist so much, hahaha!

As OP wanted to know, sunken breaking depends on when the opposition decides to attack the Zerg. Most times, I'd rush a Zerg with mass marines off four barracks while my partner made either zealots, zerglings, or more marines to help out. Four barracks before academy should have enough harassing power to prevent the Zerg from droning up. I could be wrong on the timing and count of barracks... I haven't played SC in a very long time. All these early pushes against the Zerg base is to delay their mining. You get a Zerg partner into mid-game with efficient mining and you might as well sit back and tech up while he/she does all the work. Mid-game Zerg > Protoss\Terran.

There are, however, quite a few drawbacks to the game. Cannon rushing is not a cheese and it's really powerful (sad face). You really have no idea what your opponent will do since the increase in gas/minerals means they can do anything they want sooner. And from my experience, most players are bad mannered. In my entire time playing in VGT, I befriended just two players... And the fastest channel on east (forgot the name) was similar to X-17 crap except their bm weren't funny.

Hope I answered something...





Cristal
http://www.starcraftdream.com
NeVeR
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
1352 Posts
October 11 2011 16:57 GMT
#15
I used to troll fastest players for fun back in the day. I was able to beat many of their best protoss users with my mech build, though against the very best of the scene mech is practically impossible to pull off. The top level players have pretty good macro, though macro is easier since all of your buildings are in one place. Their micro, on the other hand, is generally pretty poor. Micro doesn't really matter that much though, since all it takes it one storm/reaver drop to win you the game. It's absolutely ridiculous how all of your workers are stacked on one mineral patch. This makes it really hard for you to play aggressively before late game against good players, since you have to constantly worry about defending your workers. Fastest is pretty silly.
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 5h 23m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
WinterStarcraft544
Nina 227
StarCraft: Brood War
Sea 4431
Sexy 53
League of Legends
JimRising 653
Counter-Strike
Stewie2K1095
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor61
Other Games
summit1g8183
shahzam1055
ViBE207
C9.Mang0194
NotJumperer1
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1415
BasetradeTV30
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 18 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH207
• practicex 34
• IndyKCrew
• sooper7s
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Migwel
• intothetv
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Kozan
StarCraft: Brood War
• Diggity6
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• lizZardDota221
League of Legends
• Doublelift4593
• Lourlo1268
• Stunt384
Other Games
• Scarra903
Upcoming Events
CranKy Ducklings
5h 23m
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
9h 23m
CSO Cup
11h 23m
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
13h 23m
Bonyth vs Sziky
Dewalt vs Hawk
Hawk vs QiaoGege
Sziky vs Dewalt
Mihu vs Bonyth
Zhanhun vs QiaoGege
QiaoGege vs Fengzi
FEL
1d 4h
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
1d 9h
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
1d 13h
Bonyth vs Zhanhun
Dewalt vs Mihu
Hawk vs Sziky
Sziky vs QiaoGege
Mihu vs Hawk
Zhanhun vs Dewalt
Fengzi vs Bonyth
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
Online Event
3 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
4 days
[ Show More ]
The PondCast
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Korean StarCraft League
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL Xiamen Invitational
Esports World Cup 2025
Murky Cup #2

Ongoing

Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
BSL20 Non-Korean Championship
BSL Team Wars
CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CC Div. A S7
Underdog Cup #2
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25

Upcoming

ASL Season 20: Qualifier #1
ASL Season 20: Qualifier #2
ASL Season 20
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
BSL Season 21
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
SEL Season 2 Championship
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
FEL Cracov 2025
HCC Europe
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.