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Shopping for a new mechanical keyboard, just curiously poking around, when I come across some products that a lot of people and pros here use, like the Steelseries keyboards. Now, things like switch type, price, connector type, etc are the usual criteria that come to mind when shopping for keyboards. What SHOULDN'T be a deciding factor, is the layout of the damn ENTER and BACKSPACE key. Who the heck decided to have one of these
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/VblFx.jpg)
I mean, does anyone actually LIKE having a tiny ass backspace key? Does the enter key really need to be that big, so as to dislocate the " | \ " key? I mean, if you have to have an enter key that large, how the fuck are you using the rest of the keys?
I'd love to buy a keyboard from Steelseires, but fact is, while they have great switches, are priced competitively, etc., they do NOT stock a keyboard that has this layout:
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/yqCEA.gif)
Its not because english keyboards are like that. Logitech keyboards have the desired layout. Adesso makes one with the one I like. Razer's is the right way (but more expensive). I'm just saying, Steelseries sponsors a lot of nice programers/teams and it'd be nice if I could support them. So why do they make stupid keyboards? I ask again,
Does anyone ACTUALLY LIKE having a small backspace? If not, why is steelseries making it that way?
Poll: Enter/backspace layoutRegular Enter / Long Backspace (109) 58% Oversize Enter / Long Backspace (46) 25% Oversize Enter / Small Backspace (30) 16% Regular Enter / Small Backspace (2) 1% 187 total votes Your vote: Enter/backspace layout (Vote): Oversize Enter / Long Backspace
(Vote): Oversize Enter / Small Backspace
(Vote): Regular Enter / Long Backspace
(Vote): Regular Enter / Small Backspace
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just out of curiosity... what is the advantage of a mechanical keyboard?
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my keyboard has a huge enter key and a huge backspace, wouldnt have it any other way.
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I think a lot of foreign keyboard layouts have the large enter key. If you look at that image it has several non-English characters on it, so I would wager that traditionally keyboards in those languages had that setup, and people adjusted to it and now feel most comfortable with it.
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My maurader keyboard has the regular sized enter and backspace keys, and its downright amazing! How many other keyboards can blink any color you want when your base is under attack 
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I have it worse. I just bought a gaming laptop. The bottom left most key is not ctrl, it is function, and it has an extra backslash key between alt and space. For a gaming laptop, there aren't many games I can play with it.
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get a das keyboard. excellent layout, and decently made mechanical switches
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On August 31 2011 10:42 Ingenol wrote:
I think a lot of foreign keyboard layouts have the large enter key. If you look at that image it has several non-English characters on it, so I would wager that traditionally keyboards in those languages had that setup, and people adjusted to it and now feel most comfortable with it.
I cant think of how someone could miss their enter key so bad as to necessitate that large of one. It's simply a waste of space... and not to mention the small, hard to reach, backspace key. I mess up way too often while typing for that small little thing to be effective. I'd be typing \'s all day instead of erasing mistakes.
Its not because english keyboards are like that. Logitech keyboards have the desired layout. Adesso makes one with the one I like. Razer's is the right way (but more expensive). I'm just saying, Steelseries sponsors a lot of nice programers/teams and it'd be nice if I could support them. So why do they make stupid keyboards? I ask again,
Does anyone ACTUALLY LIKE having a small backspace? If not, why is steelseries making it that way?
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Well I don't like the big enter. But I don't see the problem with a small backspace -- you only use it when you make mistakes typing or something.
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The other interesting thing is that according to the Steelseries website the 7G has the truncated backspace, but the 6GV2 and the "Shift" do not.
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On August 31 2011 10:51 asdfjh wrote:
Well I don't like the big enter. But I don't see the problem with a small backspace -- you only use it when you make mistakes typing or something.
I type at around 120 WPM and often make mistakes. And I often change my mind about what I'm writing, and I write a lot as part of my work/school/etc. So.... yeah I'd like to have a bigger backspace. And I'm used to the non-truncated one by now too, after 15 years of computer use.
On August 31 2011 10:53 Ingenol wrote:
The other interesting thing is that according to the Steelseries website the 7G has the truncated backspace, but the 6GV2 and the "Shift" do not.
But they all have the excessively large and space wasting enter key, which moves the " | \" key to where the right SHIFT would be, and makes THAT shorter instead. And I use my right shift key!!
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I sometimes hit enter instead of backspace.
*message sent* wha!?
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I never understood the concept of why anyone would want big enter--but I understand the problems associated with small shift+small backspace. Usually with the Fn/Ctrl problems there's a BIOS setting or another software fix that you can apply to remap the keys.
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6Gv2 has normal, bigger backspace. The huge enter is also fine, I actually love it
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i like big backspaces and i cannot lie.
and big ctrls. ive been stocking up since looking at the trend of kb manufacturers they seem to be focusing on how it looks ie shiny surfaces, keys that light up, lcd screens, etc (they actually charge more for making the keyboard worse). the only decent rubber dome out there is the lenovo preferred pro that cant be bought off the rack.
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i once used a keyboard that had a small right shift key (i use it over left shift for caps). drove me insane =_=;
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Katowice25012 Posts
I get hugely tilted by over-sized backspace keys, I refuse to use keyboards with that design.
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I can't deal with the small backspace key, no way.. enter key like that isn't TOO bad, but I prefer it not as well.
I have the Dell L100 keyboard, I think it's a pretty good layout:
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/1RD7n.jpg)
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be happy that you have a multitude of keyboards to choose from. it's downright impossible to find a mechanical keyboard with a belgian azerty layout and brown mx 
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On August 31 2011 11:07 cca1ss1e wrote:I can't deal with the small backspace key, no way.. enter key like that isn't TOO bad, but I prefer it not as well. I have the Dell L100 keyboard, I think it's a pretty good layout:
except for the scrunched up f-keys.
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On August 31 2011 10:55 susySquark wrote:
I type at around 120 WPM and often make mistakes. And I often change my mind about what I'm writing, and I write a lot as part of my work/school/etc. So.... yeah I'd like to have a bigger backspace. And I'm used to the non-truncated one by now too, after 15 years of computer use.
You should clearly slow down your WPM if your often making mistakes and care that much about your backspace. I like to think of WPM as Effective WPM, meaning not having to use backspace more than many 1-3 times and not looking down at your keyboard as you type.
On the keyboard itself I see no problem with a large enter key as I honestly use it more often than backspace and it makes hitting it with my Pinky that much easier.
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On August 31 2011 11:07 cca1ss1e wrote:I can't deal with the small backspace key, no way.. enter key like that isn't TOO bad, but I prefer it not as well. I have the Dell L100 keyboard, I think it's a pretty good layout:
sick keyboard, I bought one a couple months ago
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the worse thing is the really short shift keys you get on crappy keyboards why do people do that all it does is make space for a nearly useless button that could go anywhere else so easily
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GRAND OLD AMERICA16375 Posts
I got a Topre 103B Keyboard
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/bW5jq.jpg)
I see where this thread is going...
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I use a Leopold FC500R Cherry Red which is usual enter size, large backspace.
http://www.pccasegear.com/UserFiles/leopold_l(4).jpg
My wife's keyboard is a shitty old 10 dollar OEM one, and it has a small backspace key. I can't even type on it because the backspace key drives me batty Lol.
Given the price of that particular SteelSeries keyboard, it's unreasonable really. 109 for the one I linked, works a treat.
Edit: Well I know those SS ones are really pricey here in AU, not sure on US though.
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Does anyone else intentionally break keys to have them at an angle in order to access them easier? for example my left control key my z v and s are all angled in one way or another so that as i type i can hit certain key combinations quicker for starcraft. for example my s is angled down while my Z is angled to the right so when i quickly hit S Z, the Z is pushed down by the S key if i push S in 1 spot.
pretty much mechanical macros
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who puts the enter key right beside backspace anyway?
Theres been time where I am IM'ing and I send something I didn't mean to because the damn buttons are so close.
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The US version (not the one in your picture) of the 6Gv2 actually does have a fullsize backspace key. Oddly enough, it still has the ISO style enter and slash keys though.
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On August 31 2011 13:28 fasdaf wrote:
The US version (not the one in your picture) of the 6Gv2 actually does have a fullsize backspace key. Oddly enough, it still has the ISO style enter and slash keys though.
The picture is the 7g. The 6g has a shrunken shift key, which is just as annoying, if not more... since I capitalize more than I backspace.
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The Dell SK8115 and L100 have the perfect layout, seriously who's fucking idea was it to make a hugeass fucking enterkey and move |\ between question mark and a tiny ass shift, that is the same reason that I haven't boughten a steelseries keyboard yet, all my other stuff is steelseries except that becuase i jsut can't stand it.
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On August 31 2011 13:43 Zlasher wrote:
The Dell SK8115 and L100 have the perfect layout, seriously who's fucking idea was it to make a hugeass fucking enterkey and move |\ between question mark and a tiny ass shift, that is the same reason that I haven't boughten a steelseries keyboard yet, all my other stuff is steelseries except that becuase i jsut can't stand it.
Exact same with me. Do they not do market research? Where are all the people who like the weird layouts hiding?
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United States22883 Posts
On August 31 2011 11:00 FinBenton wrote:6Gv2 has normal, bigger backspace. The huge enter is also fine, I actually love it
Yeah but the 6gv2 also has the stupid \ key where / should be, and the SS key is relatively useless. There's a thousand better ways they could've implemented the media keys.
SS fucked up on the layout of the 6gv2 and 7g. For that matter, Razer fucked up on the Blackwidow's as well. I ended up popping off all the macro keys, so the keyboard would feel right.
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United States22883 Posts
On August 31 2011 15:00 susySquark wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2011 13:43 Zlasher wrote:
The Dell SK8115 and L100 have the perfect layout, seriously who's fucking idea was it to make a hugeass fucking enterkey and move |\ between question mark and a tiny ass shift, that is the same reason that I haven't boughten a steelseries keyboard yet, all my other stuff is steelseries except that becuase i jsut can't stand it. Exact same with me. Do they not do market research? Where are all the people who like the weird layouts hiding?
It's the same thing with mice and even cell phones. You could design an ideal product for most customers fairly easily and without much cost, but instead companies try to do stupid unique shit so they'll stand out, and they end up just making their product inconvenient or wasteful.
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On August 31 2011 15:00 Jibba wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2011 11:00 FinBenton wrote:6Gv2 has normal, bigger backspace. The huge enter is also fine, I actually love it Yeah but the 6gv2 also has the stupid \ key where / should be, and the SS key is relatively useless. There's a thousand better ways they could've implemented the media keys. SS fucked up on the layout of the 6gv2 and 7g. For that matter, Razer fucked up on the Blackwidow's as well. I ended up popping off all the macro keys, so the keyboard would feel right.
DUDE thats the other thing, I actually use my Windows key for shortcuts like Win+D, Win+R, Win+M, and for the start menu. Can the SS key work as a windows key?
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United Arab Emirates874 Posts
I don't know why they make the backspace key small. Maybe some people don't make spelling mistakes as much as others? Haha. I don't mind the size of the enter key though.
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I always feel like a dirty hacker from a movie when I hit the enter key on those keyboards that have the larger key. Call me crazy but I just always seem to smack the enter key on them with a purpose !! ^^
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Hong Kong9157 Posts
The real question with the steelseries keyboard in the OP is why did they move the apostrophe key to such a random place. Completely non-standard. Makes that keyboard pretty useless for actual typing.
I personally like the large enter key for coding and typing purposes. Small backspace doesn't matter, because I end up hitting backspace at that same place regardless of the key's actual length.
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It doesnt matter very much to me (: Cos I remapped my whole keyboard to Colemak and use CAPS as backspace alot more often now
![[image loading]](http://colemak.com/wiki/images/8/80/Colemak_layout_2.png)
I prefer normal enter key and oversized backspace though. I also do not like fn keys and tilde ~ not being there.
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Different countries, different layouts.
The picture you posted looks like a scandinavian, though there are probably different variations for denmark, sweden, norway, finland and whatever else country is in that region.
Take a look at this and see how many variations there are actually:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keyboard_layout
Keyboard producers will try to save costs by using the same layout for all keyboards, going by the layout that would fit their biggest customer base.
For example if 50% of the customers use layout A, 10% layout B, 20% layout C and 20 layout D, they produce a lot of layout A and adapt it to other languages by just printing different letters on the keys and changing what signal the key sends.
You can get used to any layout when you use it regularly or you can just pick a different model/vendor.
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United States22883 Posts
On August 31 2011 15:16 susySquark wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2011 15:00 Jibba wrote:On August 31 2011 11:00 FinBenton wrote:6Gv2 has normal, bigger backspace. The huge enter is also fine, I actually love it Yeah but the 6gv2 also has the stupid \ key where / should be, and the SS key is relatively useless. There's a thousand better ways they could've implemented the media keys. SS fucked up on the layout of the 6gv2 and 7g. For that matter, Razer fucked up on the Blackwidow's as well. I ended up popping off all the macro keys, so the keyboard would feel right. DUDE thats the other thing, I actually use my Windows key for shortcuts like Win+D, Win+R, Win+M, and for the start menu. Can the SS key work as a windows key?
Nope, gotta hit it on the other side of the keyboard. :/
And the only real use out if it are the media buttons, except BW has the same thing without a custom key. I've ditched my 6gv2 for a Blackwidow (with macro keys ripped off.) Das and Filco obviously make better, more intelligently designed products, but the costs are so much higher. The Blackwidow was $60 last week.
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My keyboard has a giant enter key like the OP along with a small backspace, honestly i think its just a matter or what you get used to. i touch type and never mis-hit my backspace key, also, when my right thumb rests just below spacebar my pinky all but rests just over the enter key and i dont need to really bend it or anything, i just bash it down in that general direction haha, i think if i switched keyboards it'd take quite some time before i stopped hitting the backslash key instead of enter
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I have an HP laptop and there is an extra row of keys on the left.
I had to disable the calculator one which was right beside control because it kept opening during games.
Also this makes it harder to find keys from the left edge of the keyboard and the left shift is really small.
I would love a classic keyboard
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On August 31 2011 20:05 Carnac wrote:Strictly talking about sizes of enter/backspace/shift/etc, i.e. not about the mapping of any sort of characters, I have to say I feel the EU/ISO layout is superior to the US/ANSI one. It has large enter + large backspace, but a smaller left shift. UK ISO (one of many EU ISOs): ![[image loading]](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/da/KB_United_Kingdom.svg/500px-KB_United_Kingdom.svg.png) US ANSI: ![[image loading]](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/5/51/KB_United_States-NoAltGr.svg/500px-KB_United_States-NoAltGr.svg.png) Never seen an enter key like in the OP before tbh, I can see why people think it's silly though.
The big enter and small backspace seem to be from the taiwanese/korean layout:
![[image loading]](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/1d/KB_South_Korea.svg/400px-KB_South_Korea.svg.png)
![[image loading]](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/20/Keyboard_layout_Chinese_Traditional.png/400px-Keyboard_layout_Chinese_Traditional.png)
It would make sense for a manufacturer to adapt the US layout to this layout if most of the customers are from taiwan/korea or other asian regions with the same layout.
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I would go crazy with a "normal"-sized enter key. Backspace...meh, not as important. It's somewhat hard to miss, since it's right above the oversized enter key.
Slightly offtopic: I was typing on my laptop and a girl I know leans over and says "You type in a funny way". I'm like "Wtf, no I'm not..." to which she answers: "Yes you do, you use that key above enter." Turns out, she never used that key. Ever. Delete all the way.
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Its all marketing. They want the steelseries to be your first gaming keyboard.
Then you'll get used to their way and only prefer that, hahahaha
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Taiwan619 Posts
On August 31 2011 10:44 Chairman Ray wrote:
I have it worse. I just bought a gaming laptop. The bottom left most key is not ctrl, it is function, and it has an extra backslash key between alt and space. For a gaming laptop, there aren't many games I can play with it.
same thing for me. I just remapped capslock to control lol.
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On August 31 2011 19:43 Jibba wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2011 15:16 susySquark wrote:On August 31 2011 15:00 Jibba wrote:On August 31 2011 11:00 FinBenton wrote:6Gv2 has normal, bigger backspace. The huge enter is also fine, I actually love it Yeah but the 6gv2 also has the stupid \ key where / should be, and the SS key is relatively useless. There's a thousand better ways they could've implemented the media keys. SS fucked up on the layout of the 6gv2 and 7g. For that matter, Razer fucked up on the Blackwidow's as well. I ended up popping off all the macro keys, so the keyboard would feel right. DUDE thats the other thing, I actually use my Windows key for shortcuts like Win+D, Win+R, Win+M, and for the start menu. Can the SS key work as a windows key? Nope, gotta hit it on the other side of the keyboard. :/ And the only real use out if it are the media buttons, except BW has the same thing without a custom key. I've ditched my 6gv2 for a Blackwidow (with macro keys ripped off.) Das and Filco obviously make better, more intelligently designed products, but the costs are so much higher. The Blackwidow was $60 last week.
Whelp so much for that. I guess it's going to be a filcos for me.
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The Logitech keyboard I use has large enter, backspace, and delete keys and moves insert next to print screen 8)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/rHKHF.jpg)
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EPT
