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Active: 5913 users

Diamond is Cheese and Annoying Non-standard Play - Page 2

Blogs > Reithan
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 Next All
Probe1
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States17920 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-28 01:15:46
August 28 2011 01:12 GMT
#21
koth is obvious king of the hill
cw is clan war (usually the start of my friday night)

Give us the links to the games where you're getting cheesed and I at least will watch them and look for what could have helped.

l(Whats up with all the engineering bay blocks.)

>>15 hatch on XNC. You KNOW he's going to bunker rush.
우정호 KT_VIOLET 1988 - 2012 While we are postponing, life speeds by
Vlare
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
748 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-28 01:15:40
August 28 2011 01:14 GMT
#22
On August 28 2011 10:08 avilo wrote:
Just wait till you get to grandmasters...


Says the most boring player to play against ever.

On a serious note, there's always more little things you can do, especially at diamond like control towers, better OL positioning etc. Run your lings around the map actively.
Mass zerglings doesnt fail
Reithan
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States360 Posts
August 28 2011 01:18 GMT
#23
On August 28 2011 10:12 Probe1 wrote:
cw is clan war (usually the start of my friday night)

Give us the links to the games where you're getting cheesed and I at least will watch them and look for what could have helped.

l(Whats up with all the engineering bay blocks.)

>>15 hatch on XNC. You KNOW he's going to bunker rush.

Already posted the link, but here it is again.

As for clan war, I'm not in a clan, and every time I get try to find a practice partner, they play like 3 games, then never log on again. rofl. No clan, also. Dunno anything about cw, really. And koth's always empty.

I have no idea what's up with all the eng bay blocks, but like EVERY Game tonight is eng bay blocks, pylon blocks, cannon rushes...I'd kill for a standard bunker rush - I know how to deal with that.
http://www.teamliquid.net/blog/Xanthus730 ***** http://www.twitch.tv/reithan
Probe1
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States17920 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-28 01:26:15
August 28 2011 01:24 GMT
#24
Dude I have no idea which games you were cheesed in. Post the individual replay link -_-
I entered a clan recruitment tournament cos I disliked playing three games with practice partners. And koths are never empty for dia+
우정호 KT_VIOLET 1988 - 2012 While we are postponing, life speeds by
Reithan
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States360 Posts
August 28 2011 01:27 GMT
#25
Loss - opponent on Shakuras went 7-pool and dropped a spine on my creep while I was microing my drones to kill his lings.
http://www.teamliquid.net/blog/Xanthus730 ***** http://www.twitch.tv/reithan
Reithan
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States360 Posts
August 28 2011 01:29 GMT
#26
On August 28 2011 10:24 Probe1 wrote:
Dude I have no idea which games you were cheesed in. Post the individual replay link -_-
I entered a clan recruitment tournament cos I disliked playing three games with practice partners. And koths are never empty for dia+

Pretty much all of them. I think Artful dodger didn't JuiceLayerII didn't.
http://www.teamliquid.net/blog/Xanthus730 ***** http://www.twitch.tv/reithan
Reithan
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States360 Posts
August 28 2011 01:31 GMT
#27
On August 28 2011 10:24 Probe1 wrote:And koths are never empty for dia+

What do you mean? If I hit 'join' on the koth map - no one's in there. Ever.

If I join the koth or icjug channel - it's empty most of the time.

That's what I mean.
http://www.teamliquid.net/blog/Xanthus730 ***** http://www.twitch.tv/reithan
Reithan
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States360 Posts
August 28 2011 01:33 GMT
#28
The original ZvT
http://www.sc-replay.com/replay/27-08-11/190803-CirrusDake-VS-Xanthus.html
This was the toss air one I think.
http://www.sc-replay.com/replay/27-08-11/190852-Xanthus-VS-BONTA.html
Eng bay block to triple bunker at ramp:
http://www.sc-replay.com/replay/27-08-11/190944-Xanthus-VS-Sourdee.html
7 pool (I think, didn't watch the replay, but it was an early pool to ling/spine rush, but he had a queen and gas, may have been 10 pool)
http://www.sc-replay.com/replay/27-08-11/190957-Xanthus-VS-Monkeybalzac.html
http://www.teamliquid.net/blog/Xanthus730 ***** http://www.twitch.tv/reithan
avilo
Profile Blog Joined November 2007
United States4100 Posts
August 28 2011 01:59 GMT
#29
On August 28 2011 10:14 Vlare wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 28 2011 10:08 avilo wrote:
Just wait till you get to grandmasters...


Says the most boring player to play against ever.

On a serious note, there's always more little things you can do, especially at diamond like control towers, better OL positioning etc. Run your lings around the map actively.


Nice random hate...

My point was that if you think there's "cheese" at just diamond level, wait till you hit grandmasters. It's just about the same if not worse for people doing all-ins on ladder.
Sup
Vlare
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
748 Posts
August 28 2011 02:03 GMT
#30
On August 28 2011 10:59 avilo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 28 2011 10:14 Vlare wrote:
On August 28 2011 10:08 avilo wrote:
Just wait till you get to grandmasters...


Says the most boring player to play against ever.

On a serious note, there's always more little things you can do, especially at diamond like control towers, better OL positioning etc. Run your lings around the map actively.


Nice random hate...

My point was that if you think there's "cheese" at just diamond level, wait till you hit grandmasters. It's just about the same if not worse for people doing all-ins on ladder.


It's not random hate. I think you're a very good player. Just every time I see you play you do this brutally boring mech style that is simply un-enjoyably

And yes, GM cheese/higher level cheese is probably much worse than diamond cheese.
Mass zerglings doesnt fail
Probe1
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States17920 Posts
August 28 2011 02:21 GMT
#31
lol what do you mean 'probably'. anyway i'm going to have a look at a few of the replays.
우정호 KT_VIOLET 1988 - 2012 While we are postponing, life speeds by
Vlare
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
748 Posts
August 28 2011 02:33 GMT
#32
On August 28 2011 11:21 Probe1 wrote:
lol what do you mean 'probably'. anyway i'm going to have a look at a few of the replays.


Well, I haven't been in diamond since diamond was the highest league. So I am in no position to claim what's going on there. And I don't get cheesed THAT much on ladder, so I say probably because I am not 100% certain. What I am certain of is that the high level cheese is much stronger and more refined for sure.
Mass zerglings doesnt fail
Probe1
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States17920 Posts
August 28 2011 02:42 GMT
#33
Definitely agree ^_^
Especially the refined part. Gold cheese is just happenstance meh. Combatex cheese has a planned transition LOL
우정호 KT_VIOLET 1988 - 2012 While we are postponing, life speeds by
Reithan
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States360 Posts
August 28 2011 02:52 GMT
#34
LiquidTyler in the MLG is pulling a mass phoenix vs Zerg right now, as I speak.
http://www.teamliquid.net/blog/Xanthus730 ***** http://www.twitch.tv/reithan
Probe1
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States17920 Posts
August 28 2011 02:58 GMT
#35
Replay 1: + Show Spoiler +
Yes blocking your natural with an eng bay is annoying. I thought you were referring to walling off the bottom of your ramp with a eng/bunker. That's much more annoying to me.

I just ignore it and expand at the gold or closest mineral line if there isn't one. Terran already put themselves behind wasting resources on the bay so you can pretty much take the gold and afford to drone AND make an army to defend it.

You dropped a baneling nest and roach warren at the same time :S I'd only do that if I were completely uncertain of what Terran was doing and was scared of an all in. Considering your expo was delayed- it put you really behind to get both techs at the same time. Send overlords close to his base so you can scout it. A line of OLs would have also helped you spot the drop and prevent it from doing damage. Remember- lings underneath medivacs Queen right clicked on medivacs. Killing the marines faster is okay but killing the medivac is the best.

Anyway, you had no spire and no way to catch up, gg.
Fun fact: I get my baneling nest when my lair is 1/8th complete.


Replay 2:+ Show Spoiler +
I see a probe. I put a drone on a probe. Every time. Always. No exceptions. If I don't I deserve to lose. That's the end of the story. If you scout forge first, patrol another drone at the bottom of your ramp. If you're forced to expand at 7 minutes you need to double expand or all in. Then expand again at 12 minutes. Hydras and spore crawlers were the correct choice. Corruptors suck shit against micro'd phoenixes, even if its a gold player. Also scout way way way more often. Send a ling to die to try and see his composition all the time. Sac overlords. Changelings, whatever you can do to know whats going on. Or else, surprise 12 phoenixes. Roach Hydra is also pretty good at breaking a cannon wall. Too bad they're not good against anything else.
Here's a replay with a few general ideas on how to respond to being caught unaware by forge fe when you've opened pool first. http://bit.ly/rt2JEi


Replay 3: + Show Spoiler +
See a worker attack a worker. No exceptions for scvs or drones. The minute someone builds some shit in your house then pull 4 drones to kill it (pylon/cannon) or 2 to kill the scv and 1 to patrol close by to see if reinforcements are coming
.
Replay 4: + Show Spoiler +

...
It was the worst 10 pool I've ever seen, it was only one spine crawler and you could see the drone just sitting there. You should always attack a drone near your creep anyway. For exactly that reason. You could have held it off if you hadn't laid down in the snow and died though. Next time:
1. Don't make two spines. Make zerglings.
2. Don't let your morphing spines die. You lost 150 minerals (the drone cost added in) twice which means his early aggression gambit already broke even if you held it off perfectly.
3. You got the surround on the lings which was good but then you just sat there. Not good. Every second counts. Did you notice my apm in the replay? It's like 80 but I don't have the same problems you do. I focus on what I need to do (as much as I can for a casual player ). I let myself be angry or frustrated after I lose. Which usually involves lighting a cigarette, slamming my fist into my desk or angrily watching the replay. I'm not perfect but I try my best during the game.

우정호 KT_VIOLET 1988 - 2012 While we are postponing, life speeds by
Probe1
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States17920 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-28 03:03:14
August 28 2011 02:59 GMT
#36
Tyler was one of the Protoss that popularized it. It fell out of popularity around the time MorroW was showing exactly how dumb it is. Just mass drone/ling/spore and right click your overlords on top of your hatcheries.
우정호 KT_VIOLET 1988 - 2012 While we are postponing, life speeds by
Vlare
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
748 Posts
August 28 2011 03:01 GMT
#37
On August 28 2011 11:52 Reithan wrote:
LiquidTyler in the MLG is pulling a mass phoenix vs Zerg right now, as I speak.


yeah, and we all see how that turned out. lolsup
Mass zerglings doesnt fail
Probe1
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States17920 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-28 03:04:22
August 28 2011 03:03 GMT
#38
haypro is sc2 bonjwa
+ Show Spoiler +
lolololololol


No seriously, if Tyler can't make it work then some random gold player shouldn't either. Learn from Haypro.
우정호 KT_VIOLET 1988 - 2012 While we are postponing, life speeds by
Reithan
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States360 Posts
August 28 2011 03:19 GMT
#39
That was actually very informative.

Speaking of which, I know a couple of you offered to practice a bit - I'm in game still now, if you're up for any of that

Xanthus.730
http://www.teamliquid.net/blog/Xanthus730 ***** http://www.twitch.tv/reithan
Probe1
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States17920 Posts
August 28 2011 03:25 GMT
#40
Next time try a bit of analysis of a replay, post it in strategy with a [H] header and you'll get people better than me doing the same thing ^_^
gl hf
우정호 KT_VIOLET 1988 - 2012 While we are postponing, life speeds by
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