• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 13:06
CEST 19:06
KST 02:06
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Siren's Call7[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Summer's End9Serral wins HomeStory Cup 2915Serral wins Maestros of the Game 244ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play3
Community News
New 3v3 BGH Ladder (and more) on ShieldBattery!26Weekly Cups (August 17-23): Zerg dominate the week4Weekly Cups (August 10-16): SHIN doubles2GSTL Returns in 2026!45Weekly Cups (Aug 3-9): Protoss get shut out7
StarCraft 2
General
Weekly Cups (August 17-23): Zerg dominate the week Starcraft2 player guess game is Coming~! SC4ALL II: SC2 Player Announcement 6/8 - Maru How would you feel about frequent/monthly balance patches for SC2? PhD study /w SC2 - help with a survey!
Tourneys
2026 GSTL Announcement IntoTheTV X SOOP SC2 League : Weekly & Monthly PIG STY FESTIVAL 8.0! (13 - 23 August) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament WORTEX 2026 - Hungarian SC2 Finals Budapest
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
Nexus Wars 2021 GUIDE [M] (2) Industrial Park
External Content
Mutation # 540 Dodge This The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 539 Thunder Dome Mutation # 538 Media Blackout
Brood War
General
New 3v3 BGH Ladder (and more) on ShieldBattery! Farewell Beloved Starcraft (Youtube Videos) BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ BW General Discussion Ziemie's Starcraft 1 Prequel Campaign
Tourneys
[ASL22] Ro24 Group F [ASL22] Ro24 Group D Small VOD Thread 2.0 Brood War in Budapest ! WORTEX 2026 BW Finals
Strategy
Game Theory for Starcraft Replay Review Process - What do you do? Odyssey Mineral Stack Saturation Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread General RTS Discussion Thread Anyone here play Quakeworld back in the day? Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread EVE Corporation
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish TSM pausing esports and CLG Dead
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Power Rank TL Mafia Community Thread NeO.D_StephenKing vs This Guy From 1 Million Dance
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Artificial Intelligence Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread Dating: How's your luck?
Fan Clubs
The Creator Fan Club MarineLorD Fan Club The ShoWTimE Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023 NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Northern Ireland Global Starcraft
Blogs
Young Players Exit Esports E…
TrAiDoS
LOCKPICKING NOOB
LUCKY_NOOB
Cathedral Of CS And NY pizza a…
FuDDx
Please support my new stand…
Peanutsc
Hello guys!
LIN1s
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 3909 users

SC2 Spell casting

Blogs > milikan
Post a Reply
milikan
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States67 Posts
March 20 2011 04:36 GMT
#1
Preface: I remember reading an article here on TL about the effects of the new micro systems in place in SC2, like autosurround, but I don't remember any article specifically addressing the change in casting delay from BW to SC2. The search function didn't get me anything good, so here I am.

Spellcasting is disgustingly easy in SC2, compared to BW. Blanketing the opposing army in perfect storms, EMPs, or fungals is so easy that it's expected of every Master league player. This is because of two fundamental changes from BW: smartcasting and casting delay.

Smartcasting is great. It makes it mechanically 10x less demanding to cast spells in SC2; I may hate a ton of the changes in SC2, but smartcasting is so sexy I just can't help but love it. What smartcasting does, though, is hide a huge, massive change that Blizzard made to the casting mechanics: the removal of casting delay.

In SC1, spellcasters would take a half second to cast the spell after you issued the command. This is sometimes called the animation delay, because the unit goes through the casting animation during this period. This split-second delay is immensely important; it adds another dimension to the game, and one that I very much enjoy watching. Because of this split second delay, you have to predict where the other guy is gonna move his units - is he gonna scoot forwards or backwards? This is akin to football goalies for penalty kicks - they have to predict whether the kicker is going to go for the left or the right side of the goal, and they have that split second before the kick to "read" the kicker.

The "reading" element is one that is common in many different games, and is only possible with that half-second casting delay.. SC2 is mainly a strategy game, where you out-think your opponent - but I really like having this sort of "reading" element in place. It allows the players to fight on a dimension other than pure strategy; you can't prepare for awesome storm dodges by watching an opponent's replays, you have to get better at reading and predicting players in that split second.

In BW, spells feel much more powerful than in SC2, even though they do about the same amount of damage; storm melts marines, and EMP's still rock spellcasting units. But the uncertainty of their effective was what really made them stand out. You never knew if the player was going to throw out an epic storm, dismembering half an army, or one that would wiff and catch nothin' but air. And so, during epic clashes, the audience would lean forward, eyes hungry for storms that could make or break the game.

Now? In SC2, spells are a certainty, and as such can be planned on, and integrated into strategy to a much higher degree of certainty. You know they're going to hit, and you know exactly what is going to happen 3 days before a match when you're going over their replays. You know there's no dodging them, or him messing up; they're just too easy to throw out. "PLAAAAGGGUUUUUU" just ain't gonna happen, 'cause that fungal growth is always going to be perfect.

With that said, spellcasting is still fun to watch in SC2. Watching a bio army get blanketed in storms and end up a big gooey red mess is still cool, but it just lacks the intensity Jangi's or Bisu's perfect storms. And if for some reason Blizzard decided to add back in the casting delay? Well, then, I'd...


****
Squirrel
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States1102 Posts
March 20 2011 04:39 GMT
#2
I really hate to be the one to say it, but it's been discussed to death during the beta.

At the end of the day, SC2 != SC1
Turgid
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States1623 Posts
March 20 2011 04:51 GMT
#3
The SC2 vs BW threads definitely feel like deja vu... I'm sure you put a lot of thought into this analysis but man have I(we?) heard it a lot.
(╬ ಠ益ಠ)
pyaar
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States423 Posts
March 20 2011 04:55 GMT
#4
I learned how to play SC2 at a high Master's level as my first competitive RTS but I have been learning to play BW on iCCup and LAN with my friends. I really think that although SC2's casting system makes the game much more enjoyable for the vast majority of players, BW's casting (and pathing, for that matter) system makes high level play so much more challenging and thus enjoyable, both for the player and the spectator like the OP said. Cloning, and very technical micro in general, is pretty much nonexistent in SC2.

It'll be a cold day in hell when BW casting or pathing is implemented in SC2, but hey, we can dream
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States46302 Posts
March 20 2011 05:08 GMT
#5
I completely agree with you that SC2 is easier mechanically, and all that jazz. However, they're not the same game. I want to play SC2, not SC1 with better graphics.
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
Roe
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
Canada6002 Posts
March 20 2011 05:10 GMT
#6
On March 20 2011 13:36 milikan wrote:



Now? In SC2, spells are a certainty, and as such can be planned on, and integrated into strategy to a much higher degree of certainty. You know they're going to hit, and you know exactly what is going to happen 3 days before a match when you're going over their replays. You know there's no dodging them, or him messing up; they're just too easy to throw out. "PLAAAAGGGUUUUUU" just ain't gonna happen, 'cause that fungal growth is always going to be perfect.

I have to flat out disagree with this. There's nothing that makes it different except perhaps the terrible pathing in BW(that sure is exciting wondering what path the ai will choose to take?). How is fungal growth always going to be perfect if there's lag in sc2 and not in bw? I just don't see your argument in this area. It seems like you're just bored and projecting or rationalizing your dislike of sc2.
palanq
Profile Blog Joined December 2004
United States761 Posts
March 20 2011 05:43 GMT
#7
adding casting animations or projectile spells raises skill cap to use spells and adds more opportunity to micro vs them. seems like a good idea if you can balance it.
time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana
Essbee
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
Canada2371 Posts
March 20 2011 06:31 GMT
#8
I personally really enjoy trying to predict someone's next move in a video game. I can give WoW in example: If you played BC when all pvp rogues were shadow step build, there was a neat trick where you predicted when an enemy warrior was going to intercept you and then you casted shadow step at the exact same time and it kind of "glitched" and made you appear behind the initial position of the warrior. It gave you a huge advantage because the warrior couldn't hit you, and if the warrior was able to do so, you were eating a ton of damage. I remember all the excitement I had while watching pro wow players videos when they were doing these kind of tricks. All the prediction thing in video games add another important dimension and you explained it perfectly.

And this is another reason why SC:BW is the best game ever.
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Patches Events
16:00
The Patches Monthly #1
RotterdaM551
TKL 207
IndyStarCraft 175
EnkiAlexander 30
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RotterdaM 510
ByuN 296
TKL 178
IndyStarCraft 175
JuggernautJason53
BRAT_OK 39
MindelVK 10
Trap 8
EnDerr 5
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 35040
Shuttle 1469
Soulkey 986
Dewaltoss 149
Rush 138
Yoon 116
Killer 115
Bonyth 88
hero 74
Hyun 50
[ Show more ]
Liquid`Ret 45
Pusan 44
Snow 34
Hm[arnc] 29
soO 27
Aegong 24
JYJ 20
SilentControl 11
Terrorterran 5
firebathero 0
Dota 2
qojqva4970
Dendi2174
LuMiX1
Counter-Strike
fl0m5079
ScreaM666
pashabiceps51
Other Games
Gorgc3721
Grubby1551
FrodaN600
Beastyqt449
ceh9438
crisheroes397
DeMusliM227
ArmadaUGS165
KnowMe161
C9.Mang069
Trikslyr45
[ Show 17 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 74
• mYiSmile137
• HeavenSC 13
• IndyKCrew
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Migwel
• intothetv
• Kozan
StarCraft: Brood War
• Michael_bg 3
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV709
League of Legends
• Nemesis1947
• TFBlade685
Other Games
• Shiphtur295
• imaqtpie174
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
6h 54m
The PondCast
16h 54m
Replay Cast
1d 6h
Escore
1d 16h
IntoTheTV X SOOP
1d 17h
Korean StarCraft League
2 days
GSL
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
WardiTV Weekly
3 days
[ Show More ]
Afreeca Starleague
4 days
GSL
5 days
PiGosaur Cup
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL Season 22: Qualifier 1
PiG Sty Festival 8.0
META DYMY #4

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3
K-JUNGMAN
ASL Season 22
Super Anchor Qualifying S3
CSL Season 22: Qualifier 2
RSL Revival: Season 6
Light Tournament 2026
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
Esports World Cup 2026: LCQ
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026

Upcoming

BSL 2026 LAN: Kraków
CSL 2026 AUTUMN (S22)
Acropolis #5
Acropolis #5 - TRS
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Acropolis #5 - GSA
Acropolis #5 - GSB
HSC XXX
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
Calamity Invitational
Big Dog Cup 2026 Div 1
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.