Since the Voting for NASL started, people wonder: Who is this Avilo?
Out of nowhere a player arrived, who by today has 23.305 votes (2800 votes more than LiquidTLO, and 3500 votes more than LiquidHuK). 8008 supporters voted for Avilo on NASL with an average of 2,91 votes per supporter.
I wondered: Who is this guy I have never heard of? He is clanless but just a look at his replays on http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays?filter-hidden-top-player-name=avilo show, that he is playing among the international foreigner pro-scene, and therefore must have a high hidden ranking.
When you read the comments on NASL.tv about Avilo, you will see, that he gets hated a lot, people call him an All-Inner, people think he is a joke. Other people hype him into the sky.
So my question is: Who is this Avilo? Is he a legit player? Is he good? Does he go all-in every game?
Because Avilo said on his application video for NASL ( ) that he is a MECH playing Terran, I think it is fair, that in Part1 of "Who is this Avilo?" we start by analyzing a TvT from Avilo against ESC.Goody.
ESC.Goody ( http://www.escgaming.de/goody ) is known in Europe for his MECH style and his oppenents are scared of his turteling-skill. Goody knows how to hold a tankline for hours if he wants to. Lets see, what Avilo can do against this Tank-Beast.
Avilo starts furious, he must be flipping his fingers like a mad man. APM 390 as a Terran, this makes Goody look slow with his 150 APM in the beginning.
On LT with spawning Positions 12 (Goody) and 3 (Avilo) there is no need for early pressure. Avilo starts an 1-1-1 build.
Facts: CC done at 3:13 1-1-1 done at 5:28 2 Vikings done at 6:26 (Reactor from Fax) 1. Tank done at 6:51 New CC gets build at 8:11 CC is done at 10:28 (13 scvs are pulled from main)
These facts and timings are interesting, because there was hardly any distraction from ESC.Goody.
Avilo uses his vikings to patrol between his base and Goody's, but misses on one Dropship with 4 blueflames in it. Avilo realises the dropship only when the blueflames hit his economy. A good buildingplacement limits Goodys possibilities to move free in the base, nevertheless Avilo's army is covering his natural, therefore it takes him too long to prevent serious damage. He lost 19 scvs. OUCH!
Avilo now seems to give up the game. He just got blueflamed, everybody knows one good drop like this one from Goody can make you loose the game. So Avilo fills all his medivacs and starts a DOOMDROP par excellence at 14:55. Goody King of all Turtles is prepared, and I ask myself why Avilo flies directly over some missile turrets, and even after the drop, allows the turrets to shoot down all his vikings and medivacs.
At 17:22 Goody cleaned up the drop. Goody lost some workers, had to lift the CC in his main, lost some buildings, but Avilo lost almost 50 supply. I doubt that this drop was worth it.
If Avilo had microed this better (for example find a better fly-route) he could have done a lot better.
The game goes on for another 30 minutes. Avilo is behind economically and with his supply. He is able to defend 2 big pushes from Goody, but Goody has mapcontrol during the whole game. After Goody cleaned a huge tankline from Avilo twice, by dropping mules on the tanks, just before attacking with Thors, Tanks and CATTLEBRUISERS, Avilo is forced to GG.
Summary of Part1: Avilo plays a Mech against the European Mech-King and doesn't look bad. He still has to work a lot, he has to accuire more experience (don't kill yourself by overcommitting -> Doomdrop), he has to train the actual behaviour in a tankline-battle (react to mules being dropped on top of your tanks -> min. 40 and min. 44). He needs to control the map more.
The important News: Avilo is, by no means an All-Inner, this game lasted 47:40 mins. Avilo seems to be worth watching.
I mostly remember him for constant BM and a habit of building planetary fortresses everywhere and then accusing his opponents of turtling. Those are the main things I've noticed in the streamed games and replays I've seen of him. Adds some flavour to the mix if he ends up in NASL I guess.
I love Avilo. He's awesome, and probably the smartest Terran player on ladder.
The thing about Avilo though, is that a lot of pro players hate how he exploits Terran's power. Edit: These replays will explain how he gets BM from a lot of pros. Pretty sad how child-like these high level players are against Avilo.
For instance, he builds tons of bunkers, he plays extremely slow, he doesn't mind playing 40+ minutes games and his defense is impregnable.
A lot of players BM him, but I don't remember him specifically BMing players. The only time I see BM from Avilo is when he is getting BMd himself.
He also made a really great TvP mech guide ghost/mech back in Beta. His stream says he will be trying to redefine it again so it's viable on ladder.
I was going to make a fanclub for Avilo, but so many players hate him because he plays a different style. I don't know, personally I like watching his replays as everything he does is very careful and planned. You should PM me if you want to collaborate a fan club for him. I would love to do it, he's probably my favorite Terran player as everyone that plays him hates him lol.
He is active on TL and posts in blogs, so he probably will show his face in this thread.
avilo is a real whiner is all i remember, with his awesome "use nydus worms" advice in patch 1.0 and then whining about lategame zvt from day 1 until now
On March 11 2011 19:00 Hellhammer wrote: He also made a really great TvP mech guide ghost/mech back in Beta. His stream says he will be trying to redefine it again so it's viable on ladder.
This would certainly be a positive for him. It's always good to see more dedicated mech players in competitions.
On March 11 2011 19:00 Hellhammer wrote: Pretty sad how child-like these high level players are against Avilo.
Dude, have you seen his attitude and BM towards others?
Yeah I don't know him that well, but from the posts I've seen on TL he seems unnecessarily arrogant and whiny. Kind of like IdrA except without the skill to back it up.
On March 11 2011 19:00 Hellhammer wrote: I love Avilo. He's awesome, and probably the smartest Terran player on ladder.
The thing about Avilo though, is that a lot of pro players hate how he exploits Terran's power. Edit: These replays will explain how he gets BM from a lot of pros. Pretty sad how child-like these high level players are against Avilo.
For instance, he builds tons of bunkers, he plays extremely slow, he doesn't mind playing 40+ minutes games and his defense is impregnable.
A lot of players BM him, but I don't remember him specifically BMing players. The only time I see BM from Avilo is when he is getting BMd himself.
He also made a really great TvP mech guide ghost/mech back in Beta. His stream says he will be trying to redefine it again so it's viable on ladder.
I was going to make a fanclub for Avilo, but so many players hate him because he plays a different style. I don't know, personally I like watching his replays as everything he does is very careful and planned. You should PM me if you want to collaborate a fan club for him. I would love to do it, he's probably my favorite Terran player as everyone that plays him hates him lol.
He is active on TL and posts in blogs, so he probably will show his face in this thread.
The people who hate him hate him for his detatchment from reality of how things work. He was so guilty of claiming anything that beat him was imbalanced and how weak terran was vs everything and how zerg was horribly overpowered (this during the beginning of the 5 rax reaper sensation as well as the beginning of mech terran's unbeatableness) he was constantly reled upon to whine at every terran nerf during and immediately following beta, so much so he became the butt of many many jokes on TL. He's since cleaned up his act (outwardly) but keeps alot of his same attitudes, though actually tries to work through any issues he has, though still puts off an attitude that he is just superior to everyone whether it's intentional or not.
they don't hate him for playing a resource game, or people would hate the majority of zerg players (that are winning)
Since the Voting for NASL started, people wonder: Who is this Avilo?
Out of nowhere a player arrived, who by today has 23.305 votes (2800 votes more than LiquidTLO, and 3500 votes more than LiquidHuK). 8008 supporters voted for Avilo on NASL with an average of 2,91 votes per supporter.
Wasn't that done by AtheneWins (or his supporters) to make it so the names in order A from avilo, T from TLO, etc spells out his name in the poll. Not really sure on his skill, but I am fairly certain avilo doesn't have the popularity or general notoriety to be anywhere near fan favorites like HuK and TLO.
Since the Voting for NASL started, people wonder: Who is this Avilo?
Out of nowhere a player arrived, who by today has 23.305 votes (2800 votes more than LiquidTLO, and 3500 votes more than LiquidHuK). 8008 supporters voted for Avilo on NASL with an average of 2,91 votes per supporter.
Wasn't that does by AtheneWins (or his supporters) to make it so the names in order A from avilo, T from TLO, etc spells out his name in the poll. Not really sure on his skill, but I am fairly certain avilo doesn't have the popularity or general notoriety to be anywhere near fan favorites like HuK and TLO.
L_Master the reason why I made this blog, is not to talk about WHY he got those votes, I want to show what his style is all about. I am neither "fan" nor "hater", I try to find myself an opinion.
This said, dear commentators, I appreciate your interest, and your opinions, I will watch his stream and I will watch the BM replays. I will also try to find the "abusing" and whatever he is critizised for. Please don't turn this into a CLASH between his fans and haters. Please back up your points, and please put a content filter on what you say.
On March 11 2011 19:00 Hellhammer wrote: I love Avilo. He's awesome, and probably the smartest Terran player on ladder.
The thing about Avilo though, is that a lot of pro players hate how he exploits Terran's power. Edit: These replays will explain how he gets BM from a lot of pros. Pretty sad how child-like these high level players are against Avilo.
For instance, he builds tons of bunkers, he plays extremely slow, he doesn't mind playing 40+ minutes games and his defense is impregnable.
A lot of players BM him, but I don't remember him specifically BMing players. The only time I see BM from Avilo is when he is getting BMd himself.
He also made a really great TvP mech guide ghost/mech back in Beta. His stream says he will be trying to redefine it again so it's viable on ladder.
I was going to make a fanclub for Avilo, but so many players hate him because he plays a different style. I don't know, personally I like watching his replays as everything he does is very careful and planned. You should PM me if you want to collaborate a fan club for him. I would love to do it, he's probably my favorite Terran player as everyone that plays him hates him lol.
He is active on TL and posts in blogs, so he probably will show his face in this thread.
The people who hate him hate him for his detatchment from reality of how things work. He was so guilty of claiming anything that beat him was imbalanced and how weak terran was vs everything and how zerg was horribly overpowered (this during the beginning of the 5 rax reaper sensation as well as the beginning of mech terran's unbeatableness) he was constantly reled upon to whine at every terran nerf during and immediately following beta, so much so he became the butt of many many jokes on TL. He's since cleaned up his act (outwardly) but keeps alot of his same attitudes, though actually tries to work through any issues he has, though still puts off an attitude that he is just superior to everyone whether it's intentional or not.
they don't hate him for playing a resource game, or people would hate the majority of zerg players (that are winning)
Lol. I would hate to see you define Idra x.x But hey, that's your opinion and you are entitled to it!
this is why people dislike avilo as seen in craftcup vs beastyqt plus i have to admit that from his NASL application video he doesnt look very likeable for me.
Since the Voting for NASL started, people wonder: Who is this Avilo?
Out of nowhere a player arrived, who by today has 23.305 votes (2800 votes more than LiquidTLO, and 3500 votes more than LiquidHuK). 8008 supporters voted for Avilo on NASL with an average of 2,91 votes per supporter.
Wasn't that does by AtheneWins (or his supporters) to make it so the names in order A from avilo, T from TLO, etc spells out his name in the poll. Not really sure on his skill, but I am fairly certain avilo doesn't have the popularity or general notoriety to be anywhere near fan favorites like HuK and TLO.
L_Master the reason why I made this blog, is not to talk about WHY he got those votes, I want to show what his style is all about. I am neither "fan" nor "hater", I try to find myself an opinion.
This said, dear commentators, I appreciate your interest, and your opinions, I will watch his stream and I will watch the BM replays. I will also try to find the "abusing" and whatever he is critizised for. Please don't turn this into a CLASH between his fans and haters. Please back up your points, and please put a content filter on what you say.
Thanks
schi2ler
It kind of deserves a mention that those votes were (almost certainly) mostly not legitimate.
Since the Voting for NASL started, people wonder: Who is this Avilo?
Out of nowhere a player arrived, who by today has 23.305 votes (2800 votes more than LiquidTLO, and 3500 votes more than LiquidHuK). 8008 supporters voted for Avilo on NASL with an average of 2,91 votes per supporter.
Wasn't that done by AtheneWins (or his supporters) to make it so the names in order A from avilo, T from TLO, etc spells out his name in the poll. Not really sure on his skill, but I am fairly certain avilo doesn't have the popularity or general notoriety to be anywhere near fan favorites like HuK and TLO.
L_Master the reason why I made this blog, is not to talk about WHY he got those votes, I want to show what his style is all about. I am neither "fan" nor "hater", I try to find myself an opinion.
Indeed. I was just curious if he had actually arrived as it states in the OP. The entire basis for him having arrived seems to be on a votes, which makes this a relevant question.
He's a TL streamer who is currently not featured (afaik) and he always qqs about zerg and protoss. Him winning or losing doesn't change that fact. He qqs every single game given that he plays a non-mirror matchup. He also has a thanksgiving rant which is pretty popular (depending on your definition of popularity) and... He never stops qq'ing.
EDIT: I voted for him because I want him to whine about zerg in streamed games. "Look, i am zerg, i can morph infinitely many banelings, i can switch from broods to ultras in a second without doing shit, oh yeah".
This reminds me of a topic I made about a certain cheesy protoss player, but avilo is actually somewhat well known :X
I believe Avilo got a lot of his votes on NASL due to this weird thing Athene did to get players names on the list to line up to spell AtheneWins, but not positive.
Whats funny about this whole voting drama is that it makes me want to see him in a big tournament even more, so i can see if he actually has something to show us. If there hadn't been all this furor around it, I wouldn't give a shit one way or the other if turtle terran #27 gets in NASL or not.
On March 11 2011 19:00 Hellhammer wrote: I love Avilo. He's awesome, and probably the smartest Terran player on ladder.
I know you're some avilo fanboy but smartest? Watch this ladder BO5 I had vs Avilo a few days ago and pay attention to the games he wins and how he does it, also the games I win and how he lets easy victories slip because he isn't smart nor good at the game.
Avilo, has won almost every DC LAN and I see him in many tournaments but he is clanless and uses ladder to practice. The problem with this is if you have a problem with a certain type of play, you can't easily practice against it. If you are weak against a style of play, you can have an impressive ranking but not streak/consistency. To get to the Bo3 rounds in tournaments you need to win atleast 5 Bo1 games in a row, which can be tough.
Claims of Avilo all in's are generally against Zerg as his TvZ is highly aggressive compared to his TvT which is most possibly the most passive play you will ever see. Generally he gets 200/200 with a bunch of ravens and uses seeker missles. It's great to watch the end of his TvT but the 45 minutes it takes to get there can be painful. A lot of Terrans will BM him for this as they just get frustrated at his solid defense and not attacking even at 200/200.
Great player overall, very passionate and will post rants here from time to time about his frustrations.
On March 11 2011 18:25 schI2ler wrote: The important News: Avilo is, by no means an All-Inner, this game lasted 47:40 mins. Avilo seems to be worth watching.
He's no all-inner but he doesn't leave games. I'll be up 5 bases to 2 and the guy will still camp with a few tanks and thors while I have to attack from five angles because of how a map is designed.
You wonder why he takes so long to play games? He doesn't know when to leave. Then when he leaves, he'll either pause the game and leave, or he'll complain about imbalance and talk about how shitty of a player you are then leave.
Avilo is very well known for his BM and super super heavy turtle style. Sure, he wins a lot of games and is competent player, but an event like NASL and SC2 in general is a spectator sport.
Starcraft thrives off its rabid fan base who love to watch games just as much as love to play them. Turtle styles may be fun to play to some, but mostly is very boring to watch! I accept that it's a extremely viable playstyle, but if you want to compete in a high viewer environment, you need to be able to mix things up to keep viewers interested.
On March 11 2011 23:46 Synystyr wrote: Avilo is very well known for his BM and super super heavy turtle style. Sure, he wins a lot of games and is competent player, but an event like NASL and SC2 in general is a spectator sport.
Starcraft thrives off its rabid fan base who love to watch games just as much as love to play them. Turtle styles may be fun to play to some, but mostly is very boring to watch! I accept that it's a extremely viable playstyle, but if you want to compete in a high viewer environment, you need to be able to mix things up to keep viewers interested.
If you pick players based on style to cater to the audience you're setting up showmatches or at best invitationals, not hosting legitimate tournaments (which is why tournaments should have qualifiers or some very tangible reasoning behind rankings (such as calculated from some specific, as well as 'fair' quotient of previous tournament results)). If a boring style is overly viable then you have to fix the game with rules or changes for the tournament or game it self*.
Kind of funny how avilo is "all-in" as well as an "extreme turtler" at the same time :D, guess it stems from the fact that, from what I've seen that his vZs start out mostly with bunker rushes while his vP/vTs are very passive.
*btw if turtling is boring then what is pvp, couldn't we just get it over with and do an actual coinflip and be spared the 5-20 (depending on series length) minutes of it's starcraft equivalent? I've managed to finish watching like 10 pvps and half of them were in beta when people didn't know how silly this mu was.
i would love to see avilo in NASL purely to see him get raped ;D hes an awful player and probably wont even get invited even though he rigged the votes
theres a reason hes clanless and its not just cuz hes a bm whiner :d
I beat avilo TvT in beta with tank/viking pressure when he did reactor viking expand back in beta, and he raged on me for like 10 minutes. pretty sad stuff.
The only thing I know avilo from was the Craftcup drama where the organizers got sick of his defend + starve play and told him and whoever he was playing to rematch and no one could play terran (lol)
On March 12 2011 04:23 Thorantham wrote: Could some other people also please reference their experiences BACK IN BETA...
haha, that's about all anyone can do. Little do people realize a BETA is about giving balance feedback...not trying to get your own race buffed over and over...*facepalms*
I was part of the vocal minority that when the Zergs were QQing every single day in beta about how underpowered they were (even while roaches were 1 supply...yes...they QQ'd then, it's true lol) I'd be the guy trying to balance out the forum posts instead of simply bandwagoning with the Zerg players, so that drew a lot of flak from people.
So since my opinion ran contrary to lots of popular former "brood war player" opinions, random forum noobies were like "ahahha you dunno wtf u talkin bout, AND you play Terran!" Obviously Terran was OP at some points too, but beta was all about bandwagon QQ and Zerg players ran amok with that pretty hard so I spoke up on the opposite end for Terran players and people would get on me about it.
If people want to see how I play, they're free to check out a replay pack I recently posted that has a ton of games versus a lot of very good players, the games speak for themselves.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=195223 I do also find it sorta funny how random people will say i cheese, and then other random people will say I turtle and macro for an hour...lol make up your minds. Ipp pretty much described why that is I think.
And since I do mainly use ladder for practice right now, I do end up experimenting and trying a lot a lot of builds, strategies and timings and such. A lot of times lately i'll do a build around 50-100 times straight on ladder even if the opponent knows im going to do it, just so i can practice it and the execution and see the different paths i can take with it so I can learn it.
When I was learning two barracks tvz I started to do it really hyper aggressive, because my style is usually turtly and passive, so I practiced almost pure bunker rushing for about 200 games to force myself to be aggressive to get out of my comfort zone. Most people don't realize people use the ladder to practice...it is nice to beat good players with things like that though !
On March 11 2011 21:15 Synystyr wrote: Avilo is only on that list because Athene wanted him to be, and Avilo complained enough that NASL kept his fake votes.
On March 11 2011 22:31 Ipp wrote: Avilo, has won almost every DC LAN and I see him in many tournaments but he is clanless and uses ladder to practice. The problem with this is if you have a problem with a certain type of play, you can't easily practice against it. If you are weak against a style of play, you can have an impressive ranking but not streak/consistency. To get to the Bo3 rounds in tournaments you need to win atleast 5 Bo1 games in a row, which can be tough.
Claims of Avilo all in's are generally against Zerg as his TvZ is highly aggressive compared to his TvT which is most possibly the most passive play you will ever see. Generally he gets 200/200 with a bunch of ravens and uses seeker missles. It's great to watch the end of his TvT but the 45 minutes it takes to get there can be painful. A lot of Terrans will BM him for this as they just get frustrated at his solid defense and not attacking even at 200/200.
Great player overall, very passionate and will post rants here from time to time about his frustrations.
Bingo! Rants about HIS frustrations!
Interesting and impartial blog, schl2ler. Hope in your effort to find out who the character avilo is as a gamer, you get to know who the man behind the character is, as well. It would probably amaze many people.
EPT
plus i have to admit that from his NASL application video he doesnt look very likeable for me.![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/oR4Wj.jpg)
!
