• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 11:14
CET 17:14
KST 01:14
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Rongyi Cup S3 - Preview & Info3herO wins SC2 All-Star Invitational14SC2 All-Star Invitational: Tournament Preview5RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview8RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview0
Community News
Weekly Cups (Jan 19-25): Bunny, Trigger, MaxPax win1Weekly Cups (Jan 12-18): herO, MaxPax, Solar win0BSL Season 2025 - Full Overview and Conclusion8Weekly Cups (Jan 5-11): Clem wins big offline, Trigger upsets4$21,000 Rongyi Cup Season 3 announced (Jan 22-Feb 7)30
StarCraft 2
General
StarCraft 2 not at the Esports World Cup 2026 Oliveira Would Have Returned If EWC Continued Weekly Cups (Jan 19-25): Bunny, Trigger, MaxPax win herO wins SC2 All-Star Invitational PhD study /w SC2 - help with a survey!
Tourneys
$21,000 Rongyi Cup Season 3 announced (Jan 22-Feb 7) OSC Season 13 World Championship $70 Prize Pool Ladder Legends Academy Weekly Open! SC2 All-Star Invitational: Jan 17-18 Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
Simple Questions Simple Answers
Custom Maps
[A] Starcraft Sound Mod
External Content
Mutation # 510 Safety Violation Mutation # 509 Doomsday Report Mutation # 508 Violent Night Mutation # 507 Well Trained
Brood War
General
[ASL21] Potential Map Candidates BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Which foreign pros are considered the best? Gypsy to Korea Fantasy's Q&A video
Tourneys
Small VOD Thread 2.0 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Azhi's Colosseum - Season 2 [BSL21] Non-Korean Championship - Starts Jan 10
Strategy
Current Meta Simple Questions, Simple Answers Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2 Game Theory for Starcraft
Other Games
General Games
Mobile Legends: Bang Bang Nintendo Switch Thread Beyond All Reason Battle Aces/David Kim RTS Megathread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread YouTube Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club! The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Understand The Significa…
leoparker22
How Esports Advertising Shap…
TrAiDoS
My 2025 Magic: The Gathering…
DARKING
Life Update and thoughts.
FuDDx
How do archons sleep?
8882
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1687 users

"My god, this Toss is everywhere!"

Blogs > twoxmachine
Post a Reply
twoxmachine
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States50 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-12-09 17:01:42
December 09 2010 12:32 GMT
#1
[edit]: Due to some confusion, it should be stated that the concept of Harass and Micro in Protoss play was covered in the OP by NearPerfection. However, many other topics received the same treatment. A proper reply would address the rest of the issues brought up. This post is meant to cover the specific mindset that some players have that Protoss race is less suited to Harass and Micro, and only that specific mindset. (i.e. the concept deserves its own special love!)

[edit #2]: Due to further confusion, the most important points will be highlighted in bold! Scroll down to speed read.

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=175466
Above is the link to the original post by NearPerfection, a self-proclaimed Top 200 (unaware of which server) Protoss, which is called "Is it too late to switch races?".

While I don't agree with many points, the OP is very clear in describing a style of play that benefits from:

1) Micro, by way of making comparisons between the stutter-step of Marines in SC2 and Archers in WC3.

2) Harassment, in detailing his frustrations with his experiences as Protoss.

Terrans have indeed exhibited play utilizing these two factors to defeat opponents. To list one, MMM drop play against an aggressively expanding opponent can often catch less-mobile armies out of position and attack similar vulnerabilities. Should NearPerfection's opponent allow himself these vulnerabilities, many of NearPerfection's abilities will come to to fore.

One issue that will come up is that not all of his opponents will be using a strategy that allows for this type of play. Of course, NearPerfection describes his issues with this, and the fact that he does not feel that the army compositions utilized as Protoss in those cases does not appeal to either Micro or Harassment. However, he also felt strongly against the composition utilized in the TvT matchup when playing Terran. Some games do not allow for micro-focused/harass play to be the most effective stratagem.

The reason that that much of this was described in sweeping strokes was to remove concepts of race balance and community input. What we are looking for here is the look of the game that NearPerfection prefers with regards to changing races: Micro and Harassment. Is switching to Terran or Zerg required to appeal to those two facets of play?

What does high-micro harass-heavy Protoss look like? In one case, perhaps Void Rays with Flux Vanes (ignoring the PTR) may fit the bill. Instances of superior Void Ray control have been really notable at major tournaments; charging up on targetable doodads and maintaining the charge across distances and on enemies lights up the battlefield.

As always, this will not be optimal unit choice and strategy in every circumstance, but can certainly fulfill the stutter-step micro and harass being searched for by NearPerfection in the case of Protoss.

Here is a series of Protoss major unit and tech transitions with ONLY Harass, and to a lesser extent, Micro in mind.
This is by no means, set in stone. Stalkers---> Blink ---> Robobay----> Warp Prism---> Warp Prism Harass----> High Templar Archives/Dark Shrine----> Warped Unit Harass----> Stargate----> Void Ray----> Fleet Beacon----> Flux Vanes.

Some Protoss play does not highlight a player's Micro or ability to abuse positioning vulnerabilities, but that is also true of every other Race. Is the Protoss really race as a whole unable to take advantage of those circumstances?

If you have replays or stories showcasing Protoss Micro and Harass, please reply below or send them to: enemieshugsc2@gmail.com .

*
"...if while you're playing Halo, you do some genius move and then you realize that the microwave is about to go off in two seconds so you have that perfect timing, then at the same time you, like, figure out how to do the..." ~Tyler "NonY" Wasieleski
Flaunt
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
New Zealand784 Posts
December 09 2010 12:36 GMT
#2
Looking back at the archer in wc3 I don't think that it was ever used to stutter step >.>. Maybe you're confused with a grunt, agi hero or huntress ;o.
What? You seek something? You wish to multiply yourself tenfold, a hundredfold? You seek followers? Seek zeros!
Black[CAT]
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Malaysia2589 Posts
December 09 2010 12:44 GMT
#3
Wow, you made this account just to post this?
You mean ESPORTS isnt a synonym for SC2? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ -Proud owner of a Filco Majestouch 2 with Cherry Blue Switches- BW or SC2? Why not both?
Navane
Profile Blog Joined February 2007
Netherlands2749 Posts
December 09 2010 14:06 GMT
#4
You know you can reply in threads?
Chill
Profile Blog Joined January 2005
Calgary25991 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-12-09 16:53:24
December 09 2010 16:22 GMT
#5
Edit: Thread gets to live. I think there's a lot of harassment opportunities for Protoss if you want to play them that way...
Moderator
GoldenH
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
1115 Posts
December 31 2010 00:14 GMT
#6
I'm interested in seeing ways to open up harassing with protoss that isn't an autolose to the early pushes that are so common these days. But every way I've tried has just sent me on a losing streak and back to the drawing board.
"(Dudes are) not going to say "Buy this game — I cried at the end". (...) I suppose the secret is to find a game that makes you shoot eight million fuckin' dudes and then cry about how awesome it is to shoot eight million fuckin' dudes." - Tim Rogers
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 8h 46m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
ProTech148
MindelVK 14
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 4075
Rain 3031
GuemChi 1823
Shuttle 1490
Larva 935
Horang2 929
Mini 543
Stork 426
EffOrt 399
Soma 389
[ Show more ]
Light 349
Snow 304
firebathero 252
BeSt 252
ggaemo 192
hero 174
Hyun 114
Mong 106
Dewaltoss 99
Rush 98
sorry 62
Sea.KH 56
[sc1f]eonzerg 50
Free 39
soO 32
Hm[arnc] 30
Yoon 26
Rock 23
Terrorterran 19
SilentControl 16
Dota 2
qojqva2304
singsing2154
Dendi655
syndereN319
Fuzer 146
Counter-Strike
fl0m1186
byalli712
markeloff277
kRYSTAL_40
ptr_tv21
Other Games
B2W.Neo1240
hiko1047
crisheroes355
DeMusliM328
FrodaN260
Hui .178
Mew2King89
QueenE87
ArmadaUGS71
gofns0
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 12 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• poizon28 35
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• TFBlade939
Upcoming Events
PiGosaur Cup
8h 46m
Replay Cast
16h 46m
RongYI Cup
18h 46m
herO vs Solar
TriGGeR vs Maru
WardiTV Invitational
21h 46m
The PondCast
1d 16h
HomeStory Cup
2 days
Korean StarCraft League
3 days
HomeStory Cup
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
HomeStory Cup
4 days
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Wardi Open
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-01-26
OSC Championship Season 13
Underdog Cup #3

Ongoing

CSL 2025 WINTER (S19)
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 1
Acropolis #4 - TS4
Rongyi Cup S3
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
eXTREMESLAND 2025
SL Budapest Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S1: W6
Escore Tournament S1: W7
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
LiuLi Cup: 2025 Grand Finals
HSC XXVIII
Nations Cup 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League Season 23
ESL Pro League Season 23
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.