• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 21:09
CEST 03:09
KST 10:09
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Serral wins HomeStory Cup 2914Serral wins Maestros of the Game 243ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play3Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12
Community News
Weekly Cups (July 27-Aug 2): SHIN's big week0SC4ALL II: Brood War - $2500 - Dec 5-69SC4ALL II announced - $10,000 prize pool, Dec 5-64PIG STY FESTIVAL 8.0! (13 - 23 August)14Neeb returns to progaming; rejoins ONSYDE18
StarCraft 2
General
StarCraft 2 at SC4ALL II Invite #4/8 - Percival Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16) Protoss AoE skill expression 5.0.16 patch for SC2 goes live (8 worker start) StarCraft 2 at SC4ALL II Invite #3/8 - Clem
Tourneys
Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament PIG STY FESTIVAL 8.0! (13 - 23 August) Tasteless Time Warp: SC Evo Showmatch (May 25) SC4ALL II announced - $10,000 prize pool, Dec 5-6 RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
Nexus Wars 2021 GUIDE [M] (2) Industrial Park
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 537 Hostile Territory Mutation # 536 Railroad Switch Mutation # 535 Assembly of Vengeance
Brood War
General
ASL 22 Proposed Map Pool Recent recommended BW games Making an Online Broodwar Manager Game ASL22 General Discussion [Personal Project Share] Terran Defense v0.60
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues Escore Tournament - Season 3 KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3 SC4ALL II: Brood War - $2500 - Dec 5-6
Strategy
Odyssey Mineral Stack Saturation Any training maps people recommend? Fighting Spirit mining rates Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread General RTS Discussion Thread Nintendo Switch Thread ZeroSpace Early Access is Now Live! Beyond All Reason
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish TSM pausing esports and CLG Dead
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Power Rank TL Mafia Community Thread NeO.D_StephenKing vs This Guy From 1 Million Dance
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread The Games Industry And ATVI Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Artificial Intelligence Thread
Fan Clubs
The Clem Fan Club INnoVation Fan Club The Scarlett Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! Series you have seen recently... [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books
Sports
NBA General Discussion Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Simple Questions Simple Answers FPS when play League Of Legend on laptop
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Northern Ireland Global Starcraft
Blogs
Please support my new stand…
Peanutsc
What is a Gamer?
TrAiDoS
Hello guys!
LIN1s
ASL S22 English Commentary…
namkraft
Poker (part 2)
Nebuchad
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 5192 users

SC2 UPDATE

Blogs > aLt)nirvana
Post a Reply
aLt)nirvana
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
Singapore846 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-03-14 06:55:50
March 14 2010 06:54 GMT
#1
been playing a bunch, trying out new stuff and not doing too well on ladder. But learning alot

pvz is so broken its not even funny
im like 0-7 vs glade now, lost to mass muta close to all the time. granted he is very good and a better player then me but when you know its coming, and you make the "hardcounter" of 2 stargates and still lose its hilarious. also saw his match history and looks like smuft loses 70% vs him

funny how phoenixs lost the corsair splash, mutas still have the glaive splash, and protoss have absolutely no chance in an air to air battle once both unit counts go above 12.

Not to mention at anypoint he feels he might lose an air battle(almost impossible) he can switch to mass hydras and u have 20 pheonixs which do jackshit

nirvanavsglade PVZ retarded shit

anyway since im uploading games here are some other decent replays

nirvanavsglade2.SC2Replay

nirvana vs sid.SC2Replay

nirvanavscruncher.SC2Replay

nirvanavsxiphiusart.SC2Replay

old patch

nirvanavscowgomoo.SC2Replay

nirvanavsidra.SC2Replay


sc2sea.com - The SEA / ANZ community
TheAntZ
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Israel6248 Posts
March 14 2010 07:23 GMT
#2
This blog will soon enough be filled with angry zerg players telling you that mutas are fine and pvz is fine and that you're bad
thanks for the replays, checking them out!
43084 | Honeybadger: "So july, you're in the GSL finals. How do you feel?!" ~ July: "HUNGRY."
StorrZerg
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
United States13921 Posts
March 14 2010 08:53 GMT
#3
On March 14 2010 16:23 TheAntZ wrote:
This blog will soon enough be filled with angry zerg players telling you that mutas are fine and pvz is fine and that you're bad
thanks for the replays, checking them out!


or angry toss saying hes right
Hwaseung Oz fan for life. Swing out, always swing out.
Exteray
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
United States1094 Posts
March 14 2010 08:53 GMT
#4
I play zerg and mutas are fine and pvz is fine and you're bad!!!!!
InToTheWannaB
Profile Joined September 2002
United States4770 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-03-14 08:57:29
March 14 2010 08:56 GMT
#5
I said this like 5 times in other threads but i think they should give stalkers bonus damage to light targets. That will help alot I think with PvP and vs zerg with muta. If they do that and stalkers can hold off zealots a littil better. Then you can decrease the warp gate time near where it was orginally. That should help PvZ too.
When the spirit is not altogether slain, great loss teaches men and women to desire greatly, both for themselves and for others.
Wretched
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Australia121 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-03-14 09:24:48
March 14 2010 09:15 GMT
#6
2 stargates is a terrible idea. Even if phoenixes could beat muta, zerg could just make corruptors instead. Then you are left with 2 useless stargates, and corruptos infesting any other buildings that might allow you to make a come back.

edit: you even pointed out yourself that a hydra switch would beat 2 stargate
iNcontroL *
Profile Blog Joined July 2004
USA29055 Posts
March 14 2010 09:46 GMT
#7
pvz is insanely hard atm.. I feel like I win with gimmicky builds but if the Z has any kind of a brain I die

Dunno if it is a broken mu atm but the patch certainly changed how we (P) have to play and it seems we don't got it figured out yet.
TheAntZ
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Israel6248 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-03-14 10:09:41
March 14 2010 10:08 GMT
#8
On March 14 2010 18:15 Wretched wrote:
2 stargates is a terrible idea. Even if phoenixes could beat muta, zerg could just make corruptors instead. Then you are left with 2 useless stargates, and corruptos infesting any other buildings that might allow you to make a come back.

edit: you even pointed out yourself that a hydra switch would beat 2 stargate

What is a good way to counter the mobility of the muta then? cannons dont cut it, a flock of muta take down anything less than 5-6 cannons jammed in one spot, and if they see that they just fly to another part of the base
In BW the same problem would exist, except corsairs demolished all Z air, so after a certain point muta could be fought off with enough corsairs, while early on, mutas > corsairs (before the P gets like 6)
atm it seems like the opposite, in low numbers phoenix counter muta, but large number of muta > large number of phoenix, cirrupters >>>> phoenix, hydra switch rapes you if you tech to and make phoenixes.
This isnt 'pvz imba lol' rage, more like a question, IS there actually an answer to muta? A feasible, viable way to fight them off without expending resources into something that will be absolutely useless and get you killed if they do hydra switch?
43084 | Honeybadger: "So july, you're in the GSL finals. How do you feel?!" ~ July: "HUNGRY."
aLt)nirvana
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
Singapore846 Posts
March 14 2010 17:04 GMT
#9
yea antz exactly. and wretched if 2 stargates is a terrible idea what else will beat muta? you have to play very good zergs till you realise that sairs give u the most fighting chance. if u dont let him get another gas expansion u do have a chance to win.

The only other thing i could think of would be a timing rush with mass sentry zelot stalker but thats practically an all in build
sc2sea.com - The SEA / ANZ community
TheAntZ
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Israel6248 Posts
March 14 2010 18:22 GMT
#10
On March 15 2010 02:04 aLt)nirvana wrote:
yea antz exactly. and wretched if 2 stargates is a terrible idea what else will beat muta? you have to play very good zergs till you realise that sairs give u the most fighting chance. if u dont let him get another gas expansion u do have a chance to win.

The only other thing i could think of would be a timing rush with mass sentry zelot stalker but thats practically an all in build

it IS an allin thats the point
and it doesnt even work because mutaling rapes it senseless
ok seriously if a zerg makes mutalisks, and uses them to harass your base, what do you do?
You cant make a tight base because you NEED the wall at the front in case of ling runby/roach rush
You cant make stargate because explained above. Really, the zerg can always scout it and break the shit out of your ramp with roach or defend easily and mass hydra to kill you since you have nothing that beats hydra
If you make a zeal sentry army, you are simply contained in your base because muta/ling eats it alive EXTREMELY cost effectively (no, no fucking amount of force field micro saves you unless the opponent does NO micro at all, or just hasnt made any units and is just plain terrible)
getting cannons effectively means that what little chance you had of doing some kind of allin push to kill him before enough muta come out is gone

so seriously
what is the answer here? How the fuck is ANYBODY able to beat a zerg who uses his mutas to just constantly fly around your base while laughing at how pathetic your sentries speed is, and how pathetic stalkers damage is?
Has anyone actually beat a zerg who has done effective harass like this (not some zerg who tries to harass, and immediately flies away after taking a single hit from a sentry, one that actually flies the muta around and constantly dicks the base)?
If so, please, post with replays how exactly its possible to beat this
43084 | Honeybadger: "So july, you're in the GSL finals. How do you feel?!" ~ July: "HUNGRY."
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Replay Cast
00:00
SEL Masters #7
CranKy Ducklings66
Liquipedia
PSISTORM Gaming Misc
23:00
FSL s11 code B championship
Freeedom34
Liquipedia
The PiG Daily
22:00
Best Games of SC
Rogue vs ByuN
Serral vs Clem
Classic vs TBD
PiGStarcraft577
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
PiGStarcraft577
ProTech73
CosmosSc2 51
RuFF_SC2 4
StarCraft: Brood War
Bale 20
Dota 2
420jenkins431
NeuroSwarm144
League of Legends
Doublelift6021
JimRising 238
Counter-Strike
summit1g6199
tarik_tv2695
minikerr40
taco 1
Super Smash Bros
C9.Mang0347
Other Games
gofns16996
XaKoH 146
JuggernautJason140
Mew2King123
ViBE120
Nathanias37
SteadfastSC21
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick870
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Hupsaiya 82
• CranKy Ducklings SOOP6
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• RayReign 8
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota22293
Other Games
• imaqtpie1221
Upcoming Events
RSL Revival
7h 51m
herO vs SHIN
Clem vs Solar
Serral vs Rogue
Ladder Legends
16h 51m
Ladder Legends
18h 51m
RSL Revival
1d 7h
OSC
1d 11h
OSC
1d 22h
WardiTV Weekly
2 days
The Patches Monday
2 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
PiG Sty Festival
3 days
[ Show More ]
PiGosaur Cup
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Kung Fu Cup
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
The PondCast
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S3: W6
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
Eternal Conflict S2 Finale

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3
K-JUNGMAN
Acropolis #5
RSL Revival: Season 6
Esports World Cup 2026: LCQ
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S3: W7
CSLAN 4
ASL Season 22
Escore Tournament S3: W8
Acropolis #5 - TRS
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Acropolis #5 - GSA
HSC XXX
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
PiG Sty Festival 8.0
Big Dog Cup 2026 Div 1
Thunderpick World Champ.
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
Logitech G Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #5
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.